Skip to content
 
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(KTLA Los Angeles)   States pass laws to force packaging producers to include the cost of disposal and recycling. Producers fight to stop such laws. Consumers pay for it all anyway, including dealing with the goddamn mess, so quit fighting and just ADD THE DAMN COST IN   (ktla.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, Recycling, Waste management, Waste, producers of packaging, new state fund, proposed recycling laws, first state, similar bill  
•       •       •

748 clicks; posted to Politics » on 31 Jul 2021 at 8:25 PM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



38 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-07-31 5:56:33 PM  
Plastics: Last Week Tonight with John Oliver (HBO)
Youtube Fiu9GSOmt8E
 
2021-07-31 8:28:24 PM  
Are you trying to put Santa in the poorhouse? Because that's how you put Santa in the poorhouse.
 
2021-07-31 8:30:02 PM  
Then who's gonna do my recycling if the homeless dumpster divers won't? And is anyone free for brunch tomorrow?
 
2021-07-31 8:31:36 PM  
Anything that leads to less crap being produced is good.
 
2021-07-31 8:37:36 PM  
We need to transition to recyclable materials, especially for single use items. But, that would require change
 
2021-07-31 8:37:54 PM  
Since when do we deal with the mess? If we actually did, this would end, like today.

Fark user imageView Full Size


But that there is a trashcan. We put it in that trashcan, and we expect it to go away.  When it doesn't, do we look at it and say, "I should really change my eating habits, or we should make dining out much more responsible."
No, we complain because someone else, some other servant, didn't do his goddamn JOB and come clean up after us.

Sounds like a personal problem to me. And by the way, if some electronics corporation would like to have the 500 pounds of electronic waste that I've acquired over the years, that would be great.  If it was up to me, I'd make electronics endlessly recyclable, but nobody asked me.
 
2021-07-31 8:42:28 PM  
It's perfectly reasonable to price the entire product life cycle into the original purchase.  No hidden costs to surprise the consumer after the vendor picks your pocket.

As long as the rule is applied equally to all producers, this can only result in more rational consumer behavior (because they have no choice but to do the right thing rather than the cheap thing) and a better future for all save those whose business models depend on externalizing costs and pushing them on future generations.

We don't need people who think like that.  Let their companies fail.
 
2021-07-31 8:43:44 PM  
Consumers SHOULD be paying for it.
 
2021-07-31 8:48:20 PM  

Unsung_Hero: It's perfectly reasonable to price the entire product life cycle into the original purchase.  No hidden costs to surprise the consumer after the vendor picks your pocket.

As long as the rule is applied equally to all producers, this can only result in more rational consumer behavior (because they have no choice but to do the right thing rather than the cheap thing) and a better future for all save those whose business models depend on externalizing costs and pushing them on future generations.

We don't need people who think like that.  Let their companies fail.


This is also keeps the cost of clean-up between the producer and consumer. If you don't price it into the product, the entire society pays for it, which isn't right. If you want to buy yet another bottle of water, pay for its disposal yourself or have the company do it.
 
2021-07-31 8:48:26 PM  
It will be passed thru to the poor who will get the full brunt of this given their spending is heavy consumables.
 
2021-07-31 8:54:48 PM  
There have been MANY advancements using grown, non toxic, fully bio degradable and durable packing materials. Various bio plankton, moss, whatever that needs next to nothing to grow, easily scooped, processed and molded. No need for tree death and NO NEED FOR ANY PLASTICS or styro bullsh*t.

The fact we now are FULLY aware of the effects plastics are causing it's time to eradicate them outside of materials that will remain in place for a long time and not just immediately get dumped (like plumbing or car parts or whatever).

Also all the glossy ink sh*t is brutal too. It's poisons he soil. I don't give a f*ck about your slick box designs.

Organic packing and natural inks telling the consumer/retailer what is inside. Put out a display model or a f*cking picture next to them.

It's time to be better, folks.

Micro plastics are now affecting YOUR health too so yanno... maybe a little more hustle now that it's not just stories of sea turtles and marine life getting strangled by the sh*t.

"Oh that is so sad." whilst you sip away on your Boba in a plastic cup via a plastic straw looking at your plastic phone that you replace every year..

*SLAPPITY SLAP SLAP SLAP*
 
2021-07-31 8:56:07 PM  
If you want to understand exactly how duplicitous and disingenuous the packaging, beverage, chemical, plastics, etc. companies are, and how long their bad faith has been going on, read up on how the famous "Crying Indian" (now Native American) anti-pollution ad campaign came to be.

In the 1960's, there was a growing movement to hold manufacturers responsible for their products from cradle to grave (manufacture to disposal).  The largest packaging companies (and lots of other industries) introduced the Keep America Beautiful campaign that brilliantly pointed the finger at consumers for any and all pollution - just dispose of your trash correctly and everything will be alright.  The campaign shifted the discussion and public view of waste disposal from "these companies who create the packaging should do something about it" to "the individual people who consume the products should do something about it."  It worked too - it was up to you and you and you and you to do your part to Keep America Beautiful, but there were no serious cries to reduce packaging or waste.  Instead, the burden was solidly placed on the individual, the cog least effective in reducing any meaningful amount of pollution.

But wait - there's more!!  The "Crying Indian" campaign wasn't the first go-round for these folks.  In the mid-50's, Keep America Beautiful was founded by the American Can Company and Owens-Illinois Glass Company (and joined by Dixie Cup and Coke) to promote "Susan Spotless" a little girl in a bright white dress who chastised her parents for dropping litter.

The point of these campaigns was to shift the public mindset and discussion from a focus on industry (who are perfectly positioned to reduce waste from the outset) to the final consumer (who can only control the items they purchase and have to deal with whatever waste comes with that on a one-package-at-a-time basis).

Truly sinister stuff.  And it worked.  It's still working.  Admirable really, if you don't mind the sheer evilness of it.
 
2021-07-31 9:00:34 PM  

Unemployedingreenland: If you want to understand exactly how duplicitous and disingenuous the packaging, beverage, chemical, plastics, etc. companies are, and how long their bad faith has been going on, read up on how the famous "Crying Indian" (now Native American) anti-pollution ad campaign came to be.

In the 1960's, there was a growing movement to hold manufacturers responsible for their products from cradle to grave (manufacture to disposal).  The largest packaging companies (and lots of other industries) introduced the Keep America Beautiful campaign that brilliantly pointed the finger at consumers for any and all pollution - just dispose of your trash correctly and everything will be alright.  The campaign shifted the discussion and public view of waste disposal from "these companies who create the packaging should do something about it" to "the individual people who consume the products should do something about it."  It worked too - it was up to you and you and you and you to do your part to Keep America Beautiful, but there were no serious cries to reduce packaging or waste.  Instead, the burden was solidly placed on the individual, the cog least effective in reducing any meaningful amount of pollution.

But wait - there's more!!  The "Crying Indian" campaign wasn't the first go-round for these folks.  In the mid-50's, Keep America Beautiful was founded by the American Can Company and Owens-Illinois Glass Company (and joined by Dixie Cup and Coke) to promote "Susan Spotless" a little girl in a bright white dress who chastised her parents for dropping litter.

The point of these campaigns was to shift the public mindset and discussion from a focus on industry (who are perfectly positioned to reduce waste from the outset) to the final consumer (who can only control the items they purchase and have to deal with whatever waste comes with that on a one-package-at-a-time basis).

Truly sinister stuff.  And it worked.  It's still working.  Admirable really, if you don't mind the sheer ...


Yup.

The recycling push has pissed me off too. People all around the world spending valuable time diligently sorting and disposing of their waste and then finding out after twenty years they are just dumping most of the sh*t anyway.

F*cking infuriating.
 
2021-07-31 9:01:16 PM  
"New recycling obligations could cause companies to pull out of those states or pass on costs to consumers, industry members say."

I would hope so.  That's the whole point - to make products with stupid packaging less competitive.
 
2021-07-31 9:09:22 PM  

Surrender your boo-tah: Consumers SHOULD be paying for it.


Well, not really.  Consumers will pay what they're willing to pay.  If you bill the producers, they'll streamline their processes to provide a product that meets requirements at the price consumers are willing to pay.

Economies are driven by demand, not supply.
 
2021-07-31 9:18:45 PM  
Every summer we spend a week or so picking all the trash out of the ditches around my folks land.

Every year at least 80% of the trash we pick up comes from the same 2 companies... McDonalds and Budweiser.
 
2021-07-31 9:32:21 PM  
The problem is the stupid consumers
 
2021-07-31 9:35:28 PM  
As long as the companies actually recycle the shiat they say they're recycling, instead of shipping it to China or otherwise just throwing it out somewhere else.
 
2021-07-31 9:47:31 PM  
Oh... and what are all those recycling bins made of?

lulz

Recycle of course, the effort is worth it but everyone seems to forget the "REDUCE" and "REUSE" parts of the equation... conveniently.

Hold the recycling industry to account as WELL as the plastics companies. They are likely going to see lawsuits (or should) like the tobacco, oil and more recently pharma industries.

F*ck all those dicks.
 
2021-07-31 10:01:41 PM  
good
 
2021-07-31 10:18:52 PM  

here to help: Also all the glossy ink sh*t is brutal too. It's poisons he soil. I don't give a f*ck about your slick box designs.


Yea that shiat is nasty and there's so much it's, what, 1/4 of the entire thickness of the material? Yuck, you can feel how nasty it is by touch. Metalized printing needs to end too, looking at you Reynolds. You can't recycle that crap!

Speaking of ink, I'm deep in a company working on nano-scale embossing to completely do away with it. Same nanostructure principle that beetles and butterflies use for color. Also working on transparent antennas and nanoscale lighting for phones that will drastically reduce part counts, cost, and use of rare earths. And if you don't want 5G radiation coming through your windows they got a product to block that too!
 
2021-07-31 10:21:29 PM  

TheDarkSaintOfGin: Are you trying to put Santa in the poorhouse? Because that's how you put Santa in the poorhouse.


Nobody puts Santa in a poor house

/Road House
 
2021-07-31 10:37:46 PM  
We have a recycling bin the size of our Kia* and a similar (different color) one for "Mixed Organics".  Those are automatic with the waste management contract. You can, however chose your trash bin size.

*The interior space only.

Mixed Organics is full every week, oak trees are a PITA. We're near the end of the "self-pruning of leaves and small branches" and the acorns have started dropping.  #3 mutt can't generalize from one really bitter round thing to every other one in the yard.  Of course, he brings them into the house.
 
2021-07-31 11:10:23 PM  

Stibium: Speaking of ink, I'm deep in a company working on nano-scale embossing to completely do away with it. Same nanostructure principle that beetles and butterflies use for color. Also working on transparent antennas and nanoscale lighting for phones that will drastically reduce part counts, cost, and use of rare earths. And if you don't want 5G radiation coming through your windows they got a product to block that too!


That's really cool.

Good jerb.

*science fistuckles*
 
2021-07-31 11:37:41 PM  

here to help: Stibium: Speaking of ink, I'm deep in a company working on nano-scale embossing to completely do away with it. Same nanostructure principle that beetles and butterflies use for color. Also working on transparent antennas and nanoscale lighting for phones that will drastically reduce part counts, cost, and use of rare earths. And if you don't want 5G radiation coming through your windows they got a product to block that too!

That's really cool.

Good jerb.

*science fistuckles*


Check it out: https://metamaterial.com/products/nan​o​web/

Semiconductor fabs will be integrating this into the workflow in the coming years for silkscreening transistors. Lower costs, fewer harmful chemicals involved, less rare-earths; it's game-changing tech and if you're into stocks I highly recommend them (stock ticker MMAT). Samsung will be announcing their new folding phone with the tech in the upcoming weeks so grab some while it's cheap!

They've got a bunch of top leaders in the metamaterial field working for them, most recently Google's Glass project leader. Facebook is announcing a new AR headset soon as well, likely using their optical tech. Another game-changer to watch out for is their GlucoWise and MammoWise products. No more finger-sticks for testing glucose, and mammogram machines made for her. I read an interview from their medical imaging leader and one of the things mentioned was stroke detection using the through-the-skin radio imaging tech.

The future applications for cheap metamaterials cannot be understated, this tech is as big a breakthrough as industrial steel production.
 
2021-07-31 11:40:14 PM  
Stibium:

Forgot to mention cheap MRI film that allows older machines to have equivalent resolution to newer and more advanced equipment. And it's faster too!
 
2021-08-01 1:25:31 AM  

Stibium: Check it out: https://metamaterial.com/products/nano​web/


I definitely will and likely talk to others about it.

Solutions are my jam... not this endless bickering and obfuscation we seem to be chained to for the sake of the "shareholders".

Again... good jerb.

You must have heard of the sh*t I was referring too earlier. They also suck toxins out of water and generate O2 very efficiently.

aaaand then there are the bio fuel properties being realized with those projects.

SCIENCE!!!

F*ck ya!
 
2021-08-01 1:34:38 AM  
Now all you scientists... if you ever encounter some anti science corporochristofascist sh*twheel blathering on about fossil fuels and possible enviro solutions and all their heinous take on it...

The Bible pretty much states that His creation can provide for all.

They take that to mean "Do what you want because it doesn't matter. God's got our back!" when it really means look for the answers in nature and they will provide what you need.

Wind, geothermal, solar, micro organism wackiness, tide generators... and so much beyond all that.

Yet the obstinance.

HE wants that sh*t... by your OWN freaking holy book. Hell, much of it is threats against those who disrespect his creation.

I am not into that sh*t myself but hot damn does that level of ignorance chafe my butthole.
 
2021-08-01 2:06:47 AM  
d.ibtimes.co.ukView Full Size
 
2021-08-01 2:21:06 AM  

TheDarkSaintOfGin: Are you trying to put Santa in the poorhouse? Because that's how you put Santa in the poorhouse.


At Christmas time
Prices shouldn't be so high
You're saving a bundle and here's the reason why
Santa gets his labor overseas

MADtv Santa's Real Workshop
Youtube gut6DfVHs-k


And when we're tired of our Xmas gifts, we dispose of them overseas.

If we try to make people pay to dispose of their e-waste when they dispose of it expect an increase in illegal dumping.
 
2021-08-01 2:46:40 AM  

Stibium: Check it out: https://metamaterial.com/products/nano​web/


k... so I was poking around that site for a bit.

Cool stuff but I must warn you... you may end up visited by reprogrammed TX units.

Come with me if you want to live!

-;-)
 
2021-08-01 2:51:55 AM  
My rental unit in San Diego is in an East Coast style building with interior halls, erc... It also has garbage chutes. Build in the pre recycling days, we've found the most cost effective system is a Vietnamese family who come daily, take our trash & sort through it. The only caveat are putting human & animal waste (diapers, old & young, medical waste, etc) in specially colored bags before dropping down the chutes. The last few years, they've thanked the residents for compliance. Our garbage is cheaper than some HOAs & they make a profit buy selling off the recyclables. Win-Nguyen!
 
2021-08-01 3:13:21 AM  

cryinoutloud: Since when do we deal with the mess? If we actually did, this would end, like today.

[Fark user image image 518x312]

But that there is a trashcan. We put it in that trashcan, and we expect it to go away.  When it doesn't, do we look at it and say, "I should really change my eating habits, or we should make dining out much more responsible."
No, we complain because someone else, some other servant, didn't do his goddamn JOB and come clean up after us.

Sounds like a personal problem to me. And by the way, if some electronics corporation would like to have the 500 pounds of electronic waste that I've acquired over the years, that would be great.  If it was up to me, I'd make electronics endlessly recyclable, but nobody asked me.


Yes, we have started to really make an effort to just not buy anything that produces more trash.  We are working under the assumption that nothing gets recycled other than maybe glass and aluminium.  It's the best place to start.  Just don't fill up the trash cans to begin with.
 
2021-08-01 4:07:39 AM  
my maid's on vacation
 
2021-08-01 6:48:36 AM  

Surrender your boo-tah: Consumers SHOULD be paying for it.


Yes.
And another thing...all those "donations" to charities these big corporations are lauded for..?
THAT should go to the consumer as well. Or at least the shareholder.

Corporate taxation is the only equitable way of managing charitable distribution. There are a lot of charities that could use a boost, and it should not be decided by 0% tax corporations.
 
2021-08-01 7:10:45 AM  

Unemployedingreenland: If you want to understand exactly how duplicitous and disingenuous the packaging, beverage, chemical, plastics, etc. companies are, and how long their bad faith has been going on, read up on how the famous "Crying Indian" (now Native American) anti-pollution ad campaign came to be.

In the 1960's, there was a growing movement to hold manufacturers responsible for their products from cradle to grave (manufacture to disposal).  The largest packaging companies (and lots of other industries) introduced the Keep America Beautiful campaign that brilliantly pointed the finger at consumers for any and all pollution - just dispose of your trash correctly and everything will be alright.  The campaign shifted the discussion and public view of waste disposal from "these companies who create the packaging should do something about it" to "the individual people who consume the products should do something about it."  It worked too - it was up to you and you and you and you to do your part to Keep America Beautiful, but there were no serious cries to reduce packaging or waste.  Instead, the burden was solidly placed on the individual, the cog least effective in reducing any meaningful amount of pollution.

But wait - there's more!!  The "Crying Indian" campaign wasn't the first go-round for these folks.  In the mid-50's, Keep America Beautiful was founded by the American Can Company and Owens-Illinois Glass Company (and joined by Dixie Cup and Coke) to promote "Susan Spotless" a little girl in a bright white dress who chastised her parents for dropping litter.

The point of these campaigns was to shift the public mindset and discussion from a focus on industry (who are perfectly positioned to reduce waste from the outset) to the final consumer (who can only control the items they purchase and have to deal with whatever waste comes with that on a one-package-at-a-time basis).

Truly sinister stuff.  And it worked.  It's still working.  Admirable really, if you don't mind the sheer evilness of it.


Breweries used a standard size, extra thick bottle for generations. They could be washed, delabeled, relabeled by any brewer, refilled with their product, and sent back to market hundreds of times before they were worn out.
Venue owners loved it, both the case and all the bottles left after the event.

But then they stopped making them. Too expensive.
Now they are using thinner glass/plastic bottles that are single use and create disposal issues for venues. The money they save on cheaper product goes right back into higher trash hauling bills.

This way, breweries can get rid of route drivers, cleaning chemicals, brewery workers,  packaging employees, etc.
Saves money.

If every decision is always made in the interest of saving money, then there is no such thing as corporate responsibility

If every decision is made in an effort to protect the planet/consumer then the expense must be borne by the consumer.

What corporations have done is convince consumers to save money as opposed to protect their own best interest.

What consumers have done is to make megalithic corporations wealthy by betraying their better interests.

Greed. Marketing. Greed.
Ya get what ya pay for.
 
2021-08-01 8:35:19 AM  

TheDarkSaintOfGin: Are you trying to put Santa in the poorhouse? Because that's how you put Santa in the poorhouse.


Santa is already in the farking poorhouse, which is about to burn down, fall over, and sink into the swamp.

Consumers cannot stand the price increases we're seeing now.  Get ready for 20-mile lines of cars at food pantries again.

Here's a radical suggestion:  perhaps the holding companies of these producers could, I dunno, be satisfied with merely tens of millions in profit instead of several billion, per quarter at least, as a starting point?  Maybe?  I mean, if they're going to keep just about all the money between what they charge and what they don't pay people, then the costs pretty much have to come out of their end.

That's the downside of having slaves, wage- or otherwise.  You can't hit them up for money when you're in trouble.
 
2021-08-01 10:37:22 AM  
Haven't they had laws like this in Germany for the past 20 years or so? 

But this is murica, only greed and bottom lines win.
 
Displayed 38 of 38 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking




On Twitter


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.