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(CBS Boston)   Baseball Hall Of Fame: "Hey Curt: thanks for asking to be removed from the ballot, but we'd rather keep twisting the knife in your side every year"   (boston.cbslocal.com) divider line
    More: Cool, Boston Red Sox, Curt Schilling, Red Sox, Baseball Hall of Fame, Tom Glavine, Craig Biggio, board of directors, Ken Griffey Jr.  
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719 clicks; posted to Sports » on 29 Jul 2021 at 10:10 PM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



47 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-07-29 8:06:53 PM  
Hey, let's put Kevin Millar and Dave Roberts in the Hall in his place.
 
2021-07-29 10:37:46 PM  
He's such a garbage human being, only slightly less toxic and horrid than you know who.
 
2021-07-29 10:40:48 PM  
Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..
 
2021-07-29 11:05:42 PM  
Curt Flood damn well should be in the Hall-

Checks earpiece

Oh...nevermind
 
2021-07-29 11:08:33 PM  

TheManofPA: Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..


Howard, Lincecum and Fielder would be lucky to get the 5% of the votes needed to make it to a second ballot. Rollins should get a bit more support than that but won't be too close to getting in. I admit I have no idea how the A-Rod/Ortiz thing will go down.
 
2021-07-29 11:23:11 PM  

TheManofPA: Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..


He hit 70% in balloting taken before he praised the 1/6 insurrection.  Quite a few HOF voters who'd voted ofr him prior to 1/6 petitioned the HOF to let them take their votes back.  He's not getting in.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybro​w​n/2021/01/21/after-curt-schilling-supp​orts-capitol-insurrection-numerous-vot​ers-ask-to-amend-hall-of-fame-ballot/
 
2021-07-29 11:31:12 PM  

Super Chronic: TheManofPA: Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..

Howard, Lincecum and Fielder would be lucky to get the 5% of the votes needed to make it to a second ballot. Rollins should get a bit more support than that but won't be too close to getting in. I admit I have no idea how the A-Rod/Ortiz thing will go down.


I thought 2 CYs was an almost lock for the hall, but looking at a major awards article, it shows that of the 2-time winners, 4 are in, 3 are out so it isn't like winning two MVPs. The 3 out mimic Big Time Timmy Jim's career too. That one kind of surprised me there.

I wonder how much of the leadup will be pumping out Big Papi "Just admit the steroids" vs. "A hero of Boston" articles to set the tone. Also, did A-rod suck up enough when he did the commentary side to get a whiff or not.
 
2021-07-29 11:33:09 PM  

jake_lex: TheManofPA: Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..

He hit 70% in balloting taken before he praised the 1/6 insurrection.  Quite a few HOF voters who'd voted ofr him prior to 1/6 petitioned the HOF to let them take their votes back.  He's not getting in.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/maurybrow​n/2021/01/21/after-curt-schilling-supp​orts-capitol-insurrection-numerous-vot​ers-ask-to-amend-hall-of-fame-ballot/


I just figured it was because of his previous awful comments that he was being all butthurt about not getting in. I didn't know he upped the ante of awful there too. Talk about the fall of a childhood favorite. Maybe he took too many Phanatic t-shirt cannon shots to the head.
 
2021-07-29 11:39:58 PM  
Poor Kirk.
 
2021-07-29 11:46:15 PM  

Super Chronic: TheManofPA: Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..

Howard, Lincecum and Fielder would be lucky to get the 5% of the votes needed to make it to a second ballot. Rollins should get a bit more support than that but won't be too close to getting in. I admit I have no idea how the A-Rod/Ortiz thing will go down.


i loved watching lincecum pitch.
 
2021-07-29 11:51:02 PM  
I hate to say it, but he should be in the Hall. It's not the Hall of Great People. Put him in and put a large plaque or something under his bust explaining what a piece of shiat he is
 
2021-07-29 11:52:35 PM  

TDWCom29: I hate to say it, but he should be in the Hall. It's not the Hall of Great People. Put him in and put a large plaque or something under his bust explaining what a piece of shiat he is


Eh, just leave him out. No one will miss him.
 
2021-07-29 11:59:31 PM  

king of vegas: He's such a garbage human being, only slightly less toxic and horrid than you know who.


Fark user imageView Full Size
?
 
2021-07-30 12:03:44 AM  
When he gets voted in and refuses to attend the induction, we should do a GoFundMe to get Rob Schneider to do it in character.
 
2021-07-30 12:29:30 AM  
Low key, Kingdoms of Amalur wasn't a bad game.
 
2021-07-30 12:47:39 AM  

American-Irish eyes: Low key, Kingdoms of Amalur wasn't a bad game.


I thought it was okay-ish, but not worth bankrupting Rhode Island.
 
2021-07-30 12:49:10 AM  
Curt Schilling should have been a first ballot guy. No I don't agree with him. Yes he holds some pretty vile opinions. Yes he took a horrid dump on the state of Rhode Island.

But he was one of the best pitchers of a generation. He was the ace of three World Series teams (1993 Phillies, 2001 Diamondbacks, 2004 Red Sox). He delivered when everything mattered the most. You can't tell the story of baseball during the timeframe mentioned without talking about him.

He's absolutely a HOFer. He's also a terrible person. Both things can be true.
 
2021-07-30 12:58:06 AM  
If they would have honored his request and took him off the ballot, in a few months he would be playing the victim card and screaming about how MLB is trying to silence him and erase him from history by removing him from the ballot. MLB knows this.
 
2021-07-30 7:06:23 AM  

king of vegas: He's such a garbage human being, only slightly less toxic and horrid than you know who.


Ty Cobb?
 
2021-07-30 7:29:36 AM  

TheManofPA: But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee


It's interesting the role public perception plays in this. Especially if you happen to dislike a particular team or player. It will certainly come as a surprise to you that David Ortiz WAS NOT mentioned, or referred to, in the Mitchell Report: https://files.mlb.com/mitchrp​t.pdf

A lot of people find this shocking because they were convinced he was. So where did all this come from? The complete evidence against Ortiz was the New York Times claiming that an unidentified lawyer mentioned his name as being part of a list of players who had failed tests, referring to a document which was neither identified nor provided to the Times.

Really! It was never corroborated or supported in any other fashion, by any other source. In fact, all the players on that supposed list were said to be contacted the MLBPA and informed. Oddly, the MLBPA (and Ortiz) said he was never contacted. But when in the middle of a huge story like Steroids were in the 2000s, completely unsupported hearsay gains traction. Until a few minutes ago, you KNEW that he was in the Mitchell Report, right?

A-Rod, on the other hand, was suspended, personally admitted to, and was otherwise publicly documented in official records as having used PEDs. So how does he have a TV deal? I guess people like him.

So no, your comparison isn't interesting at all. And people don't excuse Papi because "they like him," but rather because they understand the huge gulf that separates guilt and baseless allegation during hysteria.
 
2021-07-30 7:58:22 AM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: Curt Schilling should have been a first ballot guy. No I don't agree with him. Yes he holds some pretty vile opinions. Yes he took a horrid dump on the state of Rhode Island.

But he was one of the best pitchers of a generation. He was the ace of three World Series teams (1993 Phillies, 2001 Diamondbacks, 2004 Red Sox). He delivered when everything mattered the most. You can't tell the story of baseball during the timeframe mentioned without talking about him.

He's absolutely a HOFer. He's also a terrible person. Both things can be true.


Sure you can.

You lead with Roberts' steal, Ortiz and Ramirez for 2004 Boston; you correctly mention that Randy Johnson was the ace of the Diamondbacks (Schilling was a 1B to Johnson's 1A) and that series' story is easily told without him, and who the f*ck cares about a non-Series winning '93 Phillies?

Weirdly, Schilling's two biggest postseason series wins really were the two times Mariano Rivera famously failed in the postseason and Schilling had nothing to do with that part of things.
 
2021-07-30 8:40:36 AM  
If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.
 
2021-07-30 8:56:27 AM  

The Drawing Board: If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.


Would you put David Cone and Kevin Brown in the Hall with him? All three are very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone is the only one of the three to win a Cy.
 
2021-07-30 8:58:36 AM  

The Drawing Board: a thousand sons


Jeez, keep it in your pants.
 
2021-07-30 9:14:13 AM  
Shouldn't that be twisting the Sharpie?
 
2021-07-30 9:34:28 AM  
Bud Selig is in the hall of fame, you don't get to complain about steroids and the hall of fame any more
 
2021-07-30 9:44:51 AM  

TDWCom29: I hate to say it, but he should be in the Hall. It's not the Hall of Great People. Put him in and put a large plaque or something under his bust explaining what a piece of shiat he is


Now do Pete Rose

.

Straight Outta Wells Branch: Curt Schilling should have been a first ballot guy. No I don't agree with him. Yes he holds some pretty vile opinions. Yes he took a horrid dump on the state of Rhode Island.

But he was one of the best pitchers of a generation. He was the ace of three World Series teams (1993 Phillies, 2001 Diamondbacks, 2004 Red Sox). He delivered when everything mattered the most. You can't tell the story of baseball during the timeframe mentioned without talking about him.

He's absolutely a HOFer. He's also a terrible person. Both things can be true.


You too.
 
2021-07-30 10:06:02 AM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: You can't tell the story of baseball during the timeframe mentioned without talking about him.


I'll ask you essentially the same question I asked someone else above: would you put David Cone in the Hall with him? They're very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone won a Cy (and 5 World Series.) He's not in the Hall. So why should Curt be?
 
2021-07-30 10:08:03 AM  
Curt Schilling was a Hall of Very Good pitcher who was always going to rely on a narrative case to put him over the top. The fact that he's a grade A douchebag can easily negate the goodwill that would be necessary to get him in.
 
2021-07-30 10:17:31 AM  

Groupon boob job: The Drawing Board: If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.

Would you put David Cone and Kevin Brown in the Hall with him? All three are very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone is the only one of the three to win a Cy.


I would not.

Schilling's elite postseason numbers separates him from both players.
 
2021-07-30 10:17:48 AM  

The Smails Kid: The Drawing Board: a thousand sons

Jeez, keep it in your pants.


Lol!
 
2021-07-30 10:21:36 AM  

Groupon boob job: The Drawing Board: If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.

Would you put David Cone and Kevin Brown in the Hall with him? All three are very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone is the only one of the three to win a Cy.


Cone, probably not. But maybe.

Brown, absolutely yes. Brown should have been a lock. But he was bad for the Yankees at ages 39 and 40, so that's all people remember.
 
2021-07-30 10:23:14 AM  

TheManofPA: Given he hit 70 percent next year, I hope this doesn't end up being a move that gets him in. Next year has some tough calls. Personally, I think Jimmy Rollins gets in (maybe not first year) as the Phillies leader over Howard who started strong but never really recovered from injury.

But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

Then you even have the Prince and Big Time Timmy Jim votes to debate..


Jimmy Rollins isn't getting into the Hall of Fame. Neither is Ryan Howard.

The Phillie who should get in is Chase Utley, who was much better than those two. But he was hurt a bunch, and he falls into the category of cursed by walking too much.
 
2021-07-30 11:33:37 AM  
miro.medium.comView Full Size
 
2021-07-30 11:39:40 AM  

BigSquibowski: TDWCom29: I hate to say it, but he should be in the Hall. It's not the Hall of Great People. Put him in and put a large plaque or something under his bust explaining what a piece of shiat he is

Now do Pete Rose


"Don't cheer on the storming of the Capitol" isn't literally the number one rule of baseball. Put Pete in when he's dead. It's only a lifetime ban
 
2021-07-30 11:57:57 AM  
Just because the HOF has included shiatty people in the past, doesn't mean it has to keep doing so.

The HOF lists character among its criteria.
 
2021-07-30 12:17:53 PM  
He knows he's not getting voted in, so he wants to take the ball and go home. The idea that he gets to dictate who is and isn't on the ballot--"you're not snubbing me, I'm snubbing YOU"--is pretty much exactly why isn't getting in. Rules are for other people.
 
2021-07-30 12:57:39 PM  
Pete is not eligible when he's dead, either. The ban is permanent, not lifetime
 
2021-07-30 1:35:46 PM  

The Drawing Board: Groupon boob job: The Drawing Board: If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.

Would you put David Cone and Kevin Brown in the Hall with him? All three are very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone is the only one of the three to win a Cy.

I would not.

Schilling's elite postseason numbers separates him from both players.



He definitely has the better post-season stats. But basing the HoF decision on that seems like a weak argument. What you're saying is that all three pitchers are pretty much equal, and none of the three deserve to be in the HoF based on the regular season stats. But because one of them had some of his better games during a specific month, that's enough to push him over the edge and into the Hall. David Cone wasn't bad in the post-season. So how good did he need to be?  Just a little bit better? Half a run on his ERA better? You're essentially reducing the HoF decision down to razor thin margins involving 20 or fewer games over the course of a career.

To me, HoF is the entire body of work. It should take an emphatic yes to get in, not quibbling about someone who barely squeaks over an arbitrary blurry line based on specifically curated data points.
 
2021-07-30 3:20:22 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: He's absolutely a HOFer. He's also a terrible person. Both things can be true.


We can choose to not glorify terrible people. This is true even if they did sports good.
 
2021-07-30 3:34:28 PM  

Groupon boob job: He definitely has the better post-season stats. But basing the HoF decision on that seems like a weak argument.


Different sport and different HOF, but that (besides his name) is the only reason Manning the lesser will get in, likely on the first ballot.
 
2021-07-30 3:55:26 PM  

Groupon boob job: The Drawing Board: If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.

Would you put David Cone and Kevin Brown in the Hall with him? All three are very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone is the only one of the three to win a Cy.


To me, the rule of thumb is you need about 60 fWAR to be a real HOF candidate and become a near-lock around 70-75 fWAR. Cone wound up with 56. Brown probably would have had more support had it not been for steroids and all of his contemporaries thinking he was an asshole.

I don't take issue at all with the proposition that Schilling's performance was HOF-worthy. It's his complete lack of character that keeps him out.
 
2021-07-30 4:17:07 PM  

ElwoodCuse: Pete is not eligible when he's dead, either. The ban is permanent, not lifetime


Well,in that case them's the breaks I suppose! Shoulda thought of that before he bet on games and lied about it for decades
 
2021-07-30 5:52:05 PM  

Super Chronic: Groupon boob job: The Drawing Board: If Curt wasn't such a gaping asshole, he'd be in the Hall already.

I farking hate the guy with the heat of a thousand sons, but I can still objectively say his accomplishments on the field are Hall of Fame worthy.

Would you put David Cone and Kevin Brown in the Hall with him? All three are very, very close stat-wise, played in the exact same time frame, and David Cone is the only one of the three to win a Cy.

To me, the rule of thumb is you need about 60 fWAR to be a real HOF candidate and become a near-lock around 70-75 fWAR. Cone wound up with 56. Brown probably would have had more support had it not been for steroids and all of his contemporaries thinking he was an asshole.

I don't take issue at all with the proposition that Schilling's performance was HOF-worthy. It's his complete lack of character that keeps him out.


Yeah, IMO he's borderline and if you're a borderline case, maybe try being likeable if you want people to celebrate you.
 
2021-07-30 9:06:58 PM  

mjbok: Different sport and different HOF, but that (besides his name) is the only reason Manning the lesser will get in, likely on the first ballot.


Ugh, don't get me riled up on THAT.

Super Chronic: To me, the rule of thumb is you need about 60 fWAR to be a real HOF candidate and become a near-lock around 70-75 fWAR.


Yeah, I mean, in principal having a formula that gives a yes or no is PRACTICAL, but does it account for some intangibles? Do those intangibles matter? I'm too tipsy to formulate a cogent response. Ima think on this.

IAmRight: Yeah, IMO he's borderline and if you're a borderline case, maybe try being likeable if you want people to celebrate you.


Now THAT distills it pretty clearly. If you're an asshole, you ain't winning the popularity contest. That's what this comes down to.
 
2021-07-30 10:08:28 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: Curt Schilling should have been a first ballot guy. No I don't agree with him. Yes he holds some pretty vile opinions. Yes he took a horrid dump on the state of Rhode Island.

But he was one of the best pitchers of a generation. He was the ace of three World Series teams (1993 Phillies, 2001 Diamondbacks, 2004 Red Sox). He delivered when everything mattered the most. You can't tell the story of baseball during the timeframe mentioned without talking about him.

He's absolutely a HOFer. He's also a terrible person. Both things can be true.


I hate to say I agree with this but I totally do. What he did in 2004 was amazing enough.

What he's done since is beyond deplorable

But he should be in, on 2004 alone. IMHO.
 
2021-07-30 11:37:37 PM  

Groupon boob job: TheManofPA: But the most interesting: A-Rod vs. Big Papi. Do they put Big Papi in and leave A-Rod out since everyone seems to excuse Papi for the steroid use in the Mitchell Report just because they like him? You let Papi in, and that's got to be the floodgates for everyone else to get in through the Vets Committee

It's interesting the role public perception plays in this. Especially if you happen to dislike a particular team or player. It will certainly come as a surprise to you that David Ortiz WAS NOT mentioned, or referred to, in the Mitchell Report: https://files.mlb.com/mitchrpt​.pdf

A lot of people find this shocking because they were convinced he was. So where did all this come from? The complete evidence against Ortiz was the New York Times claiming that an unidentified lawyer mentioned his name as being part of a list of players who had failed tests, referring to a document which was neither identified nor provided to the Times.

Really! It was never corroborated or supported in any other fashion, by any other source. In fact, all the players on that supposed list were said to be contacted the MLBPA and informed. Oddly, the MLBPA (and Ortiz) said he was never contacted. But when in the middle of a huge story like Steroids were in the 2000s, completely unsupported hearsay gains traction. Until a few minutes ago, you KNEW that he was in the Mitchell Report, right?

A-Rod, on the other hand, was suspended, personally admitted to, and was otherwise publicly documented in official records as having used PEDs. So how does he have a TV deal? I guess people like him.

So no, your comparison isn't interesting at all. And people don't excuse Papi because "they like him," but rather because they understand the huge gulf that separates guilt and baseless allegation during hysteria.


I don't have a horse in the Boston vs. New York race, but the reason I mentioned is the multiple reports over the years about why Manny and him were missing and that Papi did the OJ "I'll find out what it was and totally tell you how that happened thing" : Link. Even the comments from Francona made him sound dirty and it was a shame it was leaked:
"Nobody condones the use of performance-enhancing drugs ... the testing procedure was confidential. I don't know how you can go back on that now," he said.

I mean no one is going to sit back and make the argument for A-Rod, but it does seem like Papi is going to slide in because he wasn't dumb like Manny to get popped later (and because he's likable which matters for the Hall and A-Rod is like the stuff you find on your shoes)
 
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