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(Reuters)   While still thriving, Bitcoins and other cryptos drop on life's other certainty   (reuters.com) divider line
    More: Followup, Tax, Taxation in the United States, Joe Biden, Taxation, U.S. President Joe Biden's plan, Investment, capital gains taxes, Finance  
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657 clicks; posted to Business » on 23 Apr 2021 at 11:35 AM (2 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



35 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-04-23 10:49:01 AM  
Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.
 
2021-04-23 11:52:56 AM  

AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.


Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.
 
2021-04-23 11:54:16 AM  

b2theory: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.


Why hold cash? It's utility is in buying goods and services.

/has many uses
 
2021-04-23 11:56:36 AM  

AsparagusFTW: b2theory: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.

Why hold cash? It's utility is in buying goods and services.

/has many uses


The opposite of holding cash (I am assuming you mean hard currency as well as checking and savings accounts) is being broke.
 
2021-04-23 11:57:42 AM  
Won't someone please think about the bitcoin millionaires?
 
2021-04-23 12:04:50 PM  

b2theory: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.


Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.
 
2021-04-23 12:05:00 PM  

AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.


Yes, don't sell the "currency"
 
2021-04-23 12:09:41 PM  

KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.


It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.
 
2021-04-23 12:12:53 PM  

trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.


Ah, that's why the Bitcoin cult wants it to be a currency so bad. Makes sense now...kind of
 
2021-04-23 12:15:54 PM  

trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.


I think that the way it works is if  you trade your bitcoin for say a Tesla, the IRS considers that to be a "barter" situation which happens all the time with businesses. You are supposed to declare the value of the item you get in the barter as income, so Tesla has to declare the value of the bitcoin and you have to pay taxes on the value of the Tesla.
 
2021-04-23 12:18:56 PM  

TDWCom29: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Yes, don't sell the "currency"


Trillions a day are bought and sold on foreign exchange markets.
 
2021-04-23 12:19:17 PM  

KarmicDisaster: b2theory: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.

Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.


I'm well aware. I am joking about people telling me it's a currency while using it as an object for wild speculative gambling. The IRS can largely trace every dollar-to-crypto transaction to SSN/Tax IDs or business fillings. The only legal and untraceable conversion is a direct person to person cash for crypto exchange. All other conversions are subject to the exact same financial transparency and anti-money laundering laws as regular banks.
 
2021-04-23 12:26:41 PM  

KarmicDisaster: trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.

I think that the way it works is if  you trade your bitcoin for say a Tesla, the IRS considers that to be a "barter" situation which happens all the time with businesses. You are supposed to declare the value of the item you get in the barter as income, so Tesla has to declare the value of the bitcoin and you have to pay taxes on the value of the Tesla.


You have to track the cost basis of your crypto. If it appreciated you owe taxes. If it loses value you can declare a loss. Where people get killed, tax-wise, is when the bulk of the appreciation happens in one tax year and the loses happen in another. You have to pay the taxes from the previous year with less money.
 
2021-04-23 12:38:10 PM  

b2theory: KarmicDisaster: trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.

I think that the way it works is if  you trade your bitcoin for say a Tesla, the IRS considers that to be a "barter" situation which happens all the time with businesses. You are supposed to declare the value of the item you get in the barter as income, so Tesla has to declare the value of the bitcoin and you have to pay taxes on the value of the Tesla.

You have to track the cost basis of your crypto. If it appreciated you owe taxes. If it loses value you can declare a loss. Where people get killed, tax-wise, is when the bulk of the appreciation happens in one tax year and the loses happen in another. You have to pay the taxes from the previous year with less money.


Yeah, you are definitely going to want to itemize, and probably you should file as a business if you want to do bitcoins so you can more easily expense your costs. I tell people that the bitcoin is like a 57 Chevy. Maybe you found it in a barn (mined it) and paid very little for it (cost of electricity to mine it). Maybe you bought it. Maybe you spent money fixing it up. Now you are selling or trading it, and you will have to track all of your costs or pay taxes on the whole thing. The problem for people is that if they "got" a bitcoin and didn't declare it (stole someone's 57 Chevy? Under the table transaction, unreported trade), suddenly it is hard to prove expenses when the coin suddenly appears and you want to trade or sell it.
 
2021-04-23 1:10:06 PM  

b2theory: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.


For bitcoin

For Ethereum that is not true
 
2021-04-23 1:10:54 PM  

AsparagusFTW: b2theory: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Why would you "sell"? It is a currency, right? It's utility is the everyday buying of goods and services.

Why hold cash? It's utility is in buying goods and services.

/has many uses


Ouch

Heard the bone snap with that one
 
2021-04-23 1:13:17 PM  

TDWCom29: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Yes, don't sell the "currency"


Ethereum is much more than a currency.

Bitcoin is a currency
 
2021-04-23 1:17:09 PM  

trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.


Once enough people use and trust bitcoin as a currency it will become a currency.

Rocks were used as currency at one time
 
2021-04-23 1:17:33 PM  

TDWCom29: trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

Ah, that's why the Bitcoin cult wants it to be a currency so bad. Makes sense now...kind of


See above
 
2021-04-23 1:58:41 PM  

b2theory: KarmicDisaster: trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.

I think that the way it works is if  you trade your bitcoin for say a Tesla, the IRS considers that to be a "barter" situation which happens all the time with businesses. You are supposed to declare the value of the item you get in the barter as income, so Tesla has to declare the value of the bitcoin and you have to pay taxes on the value of the Tesla.

You have to track the cost basis of your crypto. If it appreciated you owe taxes. If it loses value you can declare a loss. Where people get killed, tax-wise, is when the bulk of the appreciation happens in one tax year and the loses happen in another. You have to pay the taxes from the previous year with less money.


The IRS views it like stock capital gains
 
2021-04-23 2:01:38 PM  

Catlenfell: Won't someone please think about the bitcoin millionaires?


They clearly arent thinking abt the 1% who has most of their Precious stored in overseas tax shelters.
 
2021-04-23 2:14:33 PM  

Linux_Yes: TDWCom29: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Yes, don't sell the "currency"

Ethereum is much more than a currency.

Bitcoin is a currency


Listen to the new Stephan Liveria podcast. He interviews Mallers and his Strike/Lightning layer. That is going to be nuts.
 
2021-04-23 2:18:24 PM  
If Bitcoin is a currency, why can't I purchase a Tesla with it?
 
2021-04-23 2:18:53 PM  

Linux_Yes: TDWCom29: AsparagusFTW: Dont sell. Dont pay the tax. Easy peasy.

Yes, don't sell the "currency"

Ethereum is much more than a currency.


Haha! Okay

Washes cars too?
 
2021-04-23 2:50:38 PM  
It's an asset.  What's the prob?
 
2021-04-23 3:05:51 PM  

SirEattonHogg: It's an asset.  What's the prob?


Fear of change.
 
2021-04-23 3:11:05 PM  

AsparagusFTW: SirEattonHogg: It's an asset.  What's the prob?

Fear of change.


I try to preach and spread the gospel of crypto but only face scorn on Fark.

I can only say so much to the non-believers.
 
2021-04-23 5:43:13 PM  
I don't doubt crypto is here to stay but regulation is coming.  Soon the SEC will create a crypto division and the FBI will be all over it.

It'll always have utility, but it's dominance/value in the future is questionable.
 
2021-04-23 6:05:54 PM  

SirEattonHogg: AsparagusFTW: SirEattonHogg: It's an asset.  What's the prob?

Fear of change.

I try to preach and spread the gospel of crypto but only face scorn on Fark.

I can only say so much to the non-believers.


What are you preaching about crypto? If it's "Bitcoin and other cryptos are good investments" okay that's fair. But if it's "Bitcoin or some other crypto will be the world's currency in the next few decades", well.....that's where the difference in opinion comes from
 
2021-04-23 6:49:58 PM  
Love how super duper not-fake concerned we are about the environment in this thread 👍
 
2021-04-23 11:38:04 PM  
Scrubs. Just average up and wait for a Dot Com-level event. If you time it just right, you can get in on that sweet capital loss money.
 
2021-04-24 3:01:57 AM  

trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.


I think that is correct. We have things such as "like kind exchange", but I don't think this qualifies.
 
2021-04-24 3:04:45 AM  

KarmicDisaster: trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.

I think that the way it works is if  you trade your bitcoin for say a Tesla, the IRS considers that to be a "barter" situation which happens all the time with businesses. You are supposed to declare the value of the item you get in the barter as income, so Tesla has to declare the value of the bitcoin and you have to pay taxes on the value of the Tesla.


Not really. You will have to pay capital gains on the bitcoin if you bought it for less than the value of the Tesla. At least in theory.
 
2021-04-24 3:06:37 AM  

b2theory: KarmicDisaster: trialpha: KarmicDisaster: Coins have been declared to be an "asset" in the US, not a currency, so when you sell them you have to pay taxes. That is why the IRS is very keen to know who owns cryptos.

It's worse than that. You're buying something with bitcoin, so you're not selling them right? Haha... nope. To the government, you just sold your bitcoin for USD, and have to pay taxes on it.

I don't know if the US is the same as Canada, but Canada doesn't even bother with the asset/currency distinction. If it's not CAD, you have to do the above.

I think that the way it works is if  you trade your bitcoin for say a Tesla, the IRS considers that to be a "barter" situation which happens all the time with businesses. You are supposed to declare the value of the item you get in the barter as income, so Tesla has to declare the value of the bitcoin and you have to pay taxes on the value of the Tesla.

You have to track the cost basis of your crypto. If it appreciated you owe taxes. If it loses value you can declare a loss. Where people get killed, tax-wise, is when the bulk of the appreciation happens in one tax year and the loses happen in another. You have to pay the taxes from the previous year with less money.


And oddly, there are limits on how much loss one can declare per annum, but it can be spread over several years.
 
2021-04-24 3:09:19 AM  

scotchcrotch: I don't doubt crypto is here to stay but regulation is coming.  Soon the SEC will create a crypto division and the FBI will be all over it.

It'll always have utility, but it's dominance/value in the future is questionable.


It's kind of the antithesis of utility.
 
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