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(Crosscut)   WA State looking to make drugs illegal again, but not too illegal   (crosscut.com) divider line
    More: Stupid, Supreme Court of the United States, Washington, Misdemeanor, Seattle, United States, Seattle City Councilmember Andrew Lewis, Lawyer, United States Congress  
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1674 clicks; posted to Politics » on 20 Apr 2021 at 10:45 PM (2 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



45 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-04-20 10:47:27 PM  
F*ck this.

Legalize all of it
 
2021-04-20 10:49:54 PM  
JFC why would you do this.
 
2021-04-20 10:51:52 PM  
The question is one of jurisdiction. In Seattle, most misdemeanors are handled by the City Attorney's Office, while felonies are picked up by the King County Prosecuting Attorney's Office. Were the state to turn drug possession from a felony  into a gross misdemeanor, Lewis is worried it could create some expectation that Seattle or other cities get in the business of drug enforcement - which Seattle is unlikely to do.

Has a very "The state legislature made their decision, now let them enforce it" type vibe.
 
2021-04-20 10:52:34 PM  
Besides which (sorry, second thought) you know what prevents drug abuse?

People not having sh*tty lives. Studies now show that people who don't have financial troubles or mental illness generally don't abuse drugs.

Punishment doesn't do squat. It just allows police to abuse people.

If we can ever eliminate conservatives and have UBI, a sane energy policy, and universal health care, it would go a LONG way to reducing ball crime, including drug abuse.

Besides which, criminalizing drugs hasn't done a damn thing. We had a war on drugs and the drugs won. And the biggest drug issue right now is the opioid epidemic which is prescription anyway.

The problem is moralizing Christian asschokes who just want to abuse people, partially because they think that's the way to clean up society and partially I am convinced because they are sadistic pieces of excrement who enjoy hurting other people.
 
2021-04-20 10:52:44 PM  
The February Blake decision from the Washington Supreme Court struck down the law criminalizing drug possession as unconstitutional because it did not require prosecutors to prove intent. The ruling landed hard on police, courts, attorneys and lawmakers at a time when the pandemic had already upended what was considered normal.

Oh for f*ck's sake. Thoughts and prayers, assholes.
 
2021-04-20 10:52:57 PM  
WTF is wrong with these totalitarian sons of biatches?

And its democrats doing this? Cant the national democratic party kick them out of the party or something?
 
2021-04-20 10:53:22 PM  
This is the most weirdest 420 ever.
 
2021-04-20 10:53:55 PM  

Summoner101: The question is one of jurisdiction. In Seattle, most misdemeanors are handled by the City Attorney's Office, while felonies are picked up by the King County Prosecuting Attorney's Office. Were the state to turn drug possession from a felony  into a gross misdemeanor, Lewis is worried it could create some expectation that Seattle or other cities get in the business of drug enforcement - which Seattle is unlikely to do.

Has a very "The state legislature made their decision, now let them enforce it" type vibe.


Actually that might not be too bad. If all of it is a misdemeanor then at least everything is effectively decriminalized in Seattle.
 
2021-04-20 10:57:06 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Besides which (sorry, second thought) you know what prevents drug abuse?

People not having sh*tty lives. Studies now show that people who don't have financial troubles or mental illness generally don't abuse drugs.

Punishment doesn't do squat. It just allows police to abuse people.

If we can ever eliminate conservatives and have UBI, a sane energy policy, and universal health care, it would go a LONG way to reducing ball crime, including drug abuse.

Besides which, criminalizing drugs hasn't done a damn thing. We had a war on drugs and the drugs won. And the biggest drug issue right now is the opioid epidemic which is prescription anyway.

The problem is moralizing Christian asschokes who just want to abuse people, partially because they think that's the way to clean up society and partially I am convinced because they are sadistic pieces of excrement who enjoy hurting other people.


Just "partially convinced"?
 
2021-04-20 11:00:44 PM  

austerity101: JFC why would you do this.


Racism. Not knowing that drug addiction and use social and medicals problem instead of a moral or legal ones. Having police unions and religious groups lobby legislators to do it for dubious reasons.

It being rushed since the session is ending is why it is so broken, even if they say they plan to revisit it and pass a well crafted law instead of this abortion. The governor should refuse to sign it, but he won't.
 
2021-04-20 11:00:59 PM  

Mrtraveler01: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Besides which (sorry, second thought) you know what prevents drug abuse?

People not having sh*tty lives. Studies now show that people who don't have financial troubles or mental illness generally don't abuse drugs.

Punishment doesn't do squat. It just allows police to abuse people.

If we can ever eliminate conservatives and have UBI, a sane energy policy, and universal health care, it would go a LONG way to reducing ball crime, including drug abuse.

Besides which, criminalizing drugs hasn't done a damn thing. We had a war on drugs and the drugs won. And the biggest drug issue right now is the opioid epidemic which is prescription anyway.

The problem is moralizing Christian asschokes who just want to abuse people, partially because they think that's the way to clean up society and partially I am convinced because they are sadistic pieces of excrement who enjoy hurting other people.

Just "partially convinced"?


I was stuck on ball crime. Which is definitely something Christians oppose, no matter what it actually is.

But also, partially, I don't think it means what you think it does.
 
2021-04-20 11:03:59 PM  

gozar_the_destroyer: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Racism. Not knowing that drug addiction and use social and medicals problem instead of a moral or legal ones. Having police unions and religious groups lobby legislators to do it for dubious reasons.

It being rushed since the session is ending is why it is so broken, even if they say they plan to revisit it and pass a well crafted law instead of this abortion. The governor should refuse to sign it, but he won't.


It's so weird. When I think "drug use in Washington," I don't think "Blacks."
 
2021-04-20 11:07:17 PM  

austerity101: JFC why would you do this.


Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.
 
2021-04-20 11:10:22 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: F*ck this.

Legalize all of it


We just did here in OR.  You guys need to catch up not go the other direction.
 
2021-04-20 11:26:09 PM  

Mrtraveler01: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Besides which (sorry, second thought) you know what prevents drug abuse?

People not having sh*tty lives. Studies now show that people who don't have financial troubles or mental illness generally don't abuse drugs.

Punishment doesn't do squat. It just allows police to abuse people.

If we can ever eliminate conservatives and have UBI, a sane energy policy, and universal health care, it would go a LONG way to reducing ball crime, including drug abuse.

Besides which, criminalizing drugs hasn't done a damn thing. We had a war on drugs and the drugs won. And the biggest drug issue right now is the opioid epidemic which is prescription anyway.

The problem is moralizing Christian asschokes who just want to abuse people, partially because they think that's the way to clean up society and partially I am convinced because they are sadistic pieces of excrement who enjoy hurting other people.

Just "partially convinced"?


No on second thought I am 100% convinced these people get off on the suffering of others.

The cruelty is the point.
 
2021-04-20 11:27:01 PM  

Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.


You know you're an asshole, right?
 
2021-04-20 11:29:28 PM  

lolmao500: WTF is wrong with these totalitarian sons of biatches?

And its democrats doing this? Cant the national democratic party kick them out of the party or something?


Joe Biden fired his staffers for admitting to smoking pot in states where it is legal, so don't hold your breath.
 
2021-04-20 11:47:54 PM  
*laughs Oregonianly*
 
2021-04-20 11:51:40 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.

You know you're an asshole, right?


What do you expect from a person who calls us a rageaholic mob, but still inexplicably continues to post here.
 
2021-04-20 11:54:51 PM  
Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.
 
2021-04-21 12:00:10 AM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.

You know you're an asshole, right?


Totally.

But that doesn't change the fact that leaving the addicted and mentally ill to their own self-destructive devices is more cruel to them than anyone else. When its tied to purely performative virtue signaling, it makes you an even bigger asshole than I am.
 
2021-04-21 12:32:31 AM  

gozar_the_destroyer: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Racism. Not knowing that drug addiction and use social and medicals problem instead of a moral or legal ones. Having police unions and religious groups lobby legislators to do it for dubious reasons.

It being rushed since the session is ending is why it is so broken, even if they say they plan to revisit it and pass a well crafted law instead of this abortion. The governor should refuse to sign it, but he won't.


If you automatically think "minority" when you think about drugs and white-as-fark Washington State of all places, I think the problem is more with you than anything else.
 
2021-04-21 12:34:09 AM  

paulleah: Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.


I dont know anything about the situation there, but do you have a link you could cite?
 
2021-04-21 12:35:45 AM  

imaconnect4guy: paulleah: Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.

I dont know anything about the situation there, but do you have a link you could cite?


It's kind of predictable.
 
2021-04-21 12:36:08 AM  

Magnanimous_J: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.

You know you're an asshole, right?

Totally.

But that doesn't change the fact that leaving the addicted and mentally ill to their own self-destructive devices is more cruel to them than anyone else. When its tied to purely performative virtue signaling, it makes you an even bigger asshole than I am.


Maybe if we had universal health care and people like you would actually vote for politicians who were for that instead of being assholes.
 
2021-04-21 12:37:03 AM  

paulleah: Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.


I'll take things that only happened in your head for $200, Alex. Every nation that has decriminalized has had fewer overdoses.
 
2021-04-21 12:38:34 AM  

paulleah: Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.


Oh and a big F*CK YOU for this:

Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

That's not what police did and not what they do. They take you to a hospital where they pump you full of more drugs, strap you to a gurney, and then have idiots come lecture you about the dangers of alcohol and drugs and give you xeroxed copies of where to attend AA or NA meetings and then kick you out and bill you for the hospital stay.
 
2021-04-21 12:39:42 AM  

Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.


Also, the fact that you want to arrest people who haven't committed a crime speaks volumes about your authoritarianism.
 
2021-04-21 12:47:00 AM  
WTF? Where did this come from?
 
2021-04-21 2:13:20 AM  

Kazan: WTF? Where did this come from?


State law was found unconstitutional on drug possession. Thus, drug possession was decriminalized. The legislature is trying to put it back because... Drugs are bad, kids? Honestly, I don't know why except that people somehow believe it should be illegal.

Yes, this is tiresome. Yes, putting people through the "justice" system generally just makes their lives worse. But since we don't want to give people meaningful help it's somehow like this.
 
2021-04-21 2:38:10 AM  

Magnanimous_J: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.

You know you're an asshole, right?

Totally.

But that doesn't change the fact that leaving the addicted and mentally ill to their own self-destructive devices is more cruel to them than anyone else. When its tied to purely performative virtue signaling, it makes you an even bigger asshole than I am.


You don't get to pretend you're the parent of other adults. They own their bodies and their lives. Making them criminals on top of addicts doesn't help them in the slightest. You are either ignorant or a shiatty person.
 
2021-04-21 5:40:25 AM  

Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.


Please stop telling lies
 
2021-04-21 7:59:40 AM  

gozar_the_destroyer: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Racism. Not knowing that drug addiction and use social and medicals problem instead of a moral or legal ones. Having police unions and religious groups lobby legislators to do it for dubious reasons.

It being rushed since the session is ending is why it is so broken, even if they say they plan to revisit it and pass a well crafted law instead of this abortion. The governor should refuse to sign it, but he won't.


You couldn't be more wrong. It's not racism, it's money. The same exact reason Washington government does everything.  misdemeanor=fines=more money for the government.  Just like we'll be paying the highest gas prices in the country soon.
 
2021-04-21 8:00:47 AM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: Besides which (sorry, second thought) you know what prevents drug abuse?

People not having sh*tty lives. Studies now show that people who don't have financial troubles or mental illness generally don't abuse drugs.

Punishment doesn't do squat. It just allows police to abuse people.

If we can ever eliminate conservatives and have UBI, a sane energy policy, and universal health care, it would go a LONG way to reducing ball crime, including drug abuse.

Besides which, criminalizing drugs hasn't done a damn thing. We had a war on drugs and the drugs won. And the biggest drug issue right now is the opioid epidemic which is prescription anyway.

The problem is moralizing Christian asschokes who just want to abuse people, partially because they think that's the way to clean up society and partially I am convinced because they are sadistic pieces of excrement who enjoy hurting other people.


This sums it up quite nicely.
 
2021-04-21 8:04:59 AM  

Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.


Sooooo, suffering from addiction is something you believe should be punished, at taxpayer expense, which leads to more drug dependency, leading to more punishment and thus more dependency..ad-infinitum
How has that been workin' out?
 
2021-04-21 8:35:29 AM  
Why waste any time and resources on drug possession?

Cops know who the dealers and distributors are -- but they have the resources to pay the police, etc al, so....
 
2021-04-21 8:42:18 AM  

aleister_greynight: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: F*ck this.

Legalize all of it

We just did here in OR.  You guys need to catch up not go the other direction.


Still illegal to trade in it there, I believe.

imaconnect4guy: paulleah: Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.

I dont know anything about the situation there, but do you have a link you could cite?


The court decision came down late this past February.  The relevant figures don't seem to be out yet.

Bandito King:

You don't get to pretend you're the parent of other adults. They own their bodies and their lives. Making them criminals on top of addicts doesn't help them in the slightest.

If an adult comes to the point where their drug habit has them lying in the street unable even to manage living in an apartment, that adult is going to affect other people, starting with the people who are obliged to walk around them.  They may not be criminals, but I don't think that the rest of us gain anything by simply leaving them lying there.
 
2021-04-21 12:03:04 PM  

Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.


Probably against safe injection sites, too.
 
2021-04-21 1:34:07 PM  

tirob: aleister_greynight: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: F*ck this.

Legalize all of it

We just did here in OR.  You guys need to catch up not go the other direction.

Still illegal to trade in it there, I believe.

imaconnect4guy: paulleah: Since the courts decriminalized drugs, overdoses have been skyrocketing. Police could intervene before and get people into treatment.

Now people are free to die.

I'm seriously conflicted.

I dont know anything about the situation there, but do you have a link you could cite?

The court decision came down late this past February.  The relevant figures don't seem to be out yet.

Bandito King:

You don't get to pretend you're the parent of other adults. They own their bodies and their lives. Making them criminals on top of addicts doesn't help them in the slightest.

If an adult comes to the point where their drug habit has them lying in the street unable even to manage living in an apartment, that adult is going to affect other people, starting with the people who are obliged to walk around them.  They may not be criminals, but I don't think that the rest of us gain anything by simply leaving them lying there.


You're really kicking the shiat out of that straw man you built there.

The rest of us want it treated as a health crisis, with medical and psychiatric care. You just want to let cops fark with people. Quit trying to dress it up as something noble. You're not at Thanksgiving with your idiot relatives, the people here can see right through you.
 
2021-04-21 1:58:00 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.

Probably against safe injection sites, too.


I support them, decriminalization too. You Pavlov outrage monkeys have zero ability to see situations in anything except binary.

Seattle's awful leadership has led to a situation where being an addict decriminalizes OTHER crimes as well, like theft, shiatting and dropping needles in the street, disturbing the peace, etc.
 
2021-04-21 3:21:44 PM  

Bandito King: tirob:  Bandito King:

You don't get to pretend you're the parent of other adults. They own their bodies and their lives. Making them criminals on top of addicts doesn't help them in the slightest.

If an adult comes to the point where their drug habit has them lying in the street unable even to manage living in an apartment, that adult is going to affect other people, starting with the people who are obliged to walk around them.  They may not be criminals, but I don't think that the rest of us gain anything by simply leaving them lying there.

You're really kicking the shiat out of that straw man you built there.

The rest of us want it treated as a health crisis, with medical and psychiatric care. You just want to let cops fark with people.


I didn't say anything about cops intervening.  If you put words in my mouth, you'll always win an argument because you're arguing with yourself.

Want to try actually to respond to my point now?
 
2021-04-21 4:14:59 PM  
The WA state supreme court ruling that vacated felony possession of controlled substances (State V. Blake) in the state has opened a gigantic can of worms: it affects any possession charges going back to 1971 (50 years) and is bound to lead to a TON of lawsuits from people trying to reclaim fines, penalties, etc. that resulted from this over the past half a century, as well as $$$ lawsuits over "lost opportunity" from people who ended up with criminal records over this and thereby becoming ineligible for many better paying jobs.

They're trying to cram the cat somewhat back in the bag and limit damages by re-criminalizing it now.
 
2021-04-21 5:56:10 PM  

Magnanimous_J: You Pavlov outrage monkeys


I made an assumption based on my experience but I don't think I'm a drooling outrage monkey for it.  I will apologize for the assumption.  I'm sorry.  You seem cool.  Let's hang out some time.

Magnanimous_J: Seattle's awful leadership has led to a situation where being an addict decriminalizes OTHER crimes as well, like theft, shiatting and dropping needles in the street, disturbing the peace, etc.


I don't think that's really true.  A lot of the homeless aren't addicted to heroin, crack or speed.  I know three from recovery that used to be homeless alcoholics but nobody ever tried to make them having booze illegal.  Drug possession charges aren't the answer to society's problems.

I think the council should do more.  I think Durkin is in the way a lot.  I think the state and fed could do more.
 
2021-04-21 7:46:03 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Magnanimous_J: You Pavlov outrage monkeys

I made an assumption based on my experience but I don't think I'm a drooling outrage monkey for it.  I will apologize for the assumption.  I'm sorry.  You seem cool.  Let's hang out some time.

Magnanimous_J: Seattle's awful leadership has led to a situation where being an addict decriminalizes OTHER crimes as well, like theft, shiatting and dropping needles in the street, disturbing the peace, etc.

I don't think that's really true.  A lot of the homeless aren't addicted to heroin, crack or speed.  I know three from recovery that used to be homeless alcoholics but nobody ever tried to make them having booze illegal. Drug possession charges aren't the answer to society's problems.


Sure they did, it's just been a while now:
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-21 8:53:32 PM  

Magnanimous_J: Soup4Bonnie: Magnanimous_J: austerity101: JFC why would you do this.

Seattleite here. The decriminalization policy, while good intended, has lead to a situation where its virtually impossible to arrest someone if they are also a junkie.

I'm almost impressed with a city government so inept that having 10 bucks of heroin on you is actually a get-out-of-jail-free card.

Probably against safe injection sites, too.

I support them, decriminalization too. You Pavlov outrage monkeys have zero ability to see situations in anything except binary.

Seattle's awful leadership has led to a situation where being an addict decriminalizes OTHER crimes as well, like theft, shiatting and dropping needles in the street, disturbing the peace, etc.


Fark you no it doesn't. Those are all crimes on the books. What happens is someone is assaulted or a robbery happens and SPD doesn't do squat about it.

That happened long before any decriminalization you assparrot.
 
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