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(Twitter)   The Guardian goes full Thanos, says Genghis Khan was actually good for the planet   (twitter.com) divider line
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2107 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Apr 2021 at 12:38 PM (3 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-04-17 9:43:02 AM  
Original Tweet:

 
2021-04-17 9:49:13 AM  
I mean, Hitler did that too but let's not talk about him.
 
2021-04-17 9:54:30 AM  
Khan being really rapey adding about 7% to the current world population, so in total khan was and is horrible for the earth
 
2021-04-17 10:13:14 AM  
If the Star Lord had a celestial father, then Genghis could have been Thanos' son, just sayin'.
 
2021-04-17 10:15:20 AM  
Accidental Eco-Warrior is the name of my Ghenghis Tron / Chaka Khan mashup cover band.
 
2021-04-17 10:17:12 AM  
Bullets don't kill people; they conserve valuable oxygen.
 
2021-04-17 10:26:55 AM  
He was also really into wealth redistribution.  You never saw such a wealth redistributor in your life.
 
2021-04-17 10:42:50 AM  
Oh, snap!
 
2021-04-17 10:43:35 AM  
i.kym-cdn.comView Full Size
 
2021-04-17 10:44:09 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-17 10:54:34 AM  
I mean that's why they called him Genghis Khan, and not Genghis Khannot
 
2021-04-17 11:00:12 AM  
That's not even one Canada. And the world didn't need carbon sequestration much at the time. The whole human race collectively numbered less* than one billion, perhaps fewer* than half a billion individuals.

We could use a bit of re-forestation now, but nobody has to die to accomplish that. Properly managed forests make jobs, they don't take jobs. You need lots of good foresters and selective burning to make meadows, culling of dead wood, planting of the right sort of trees, and so forth. It could maintain a bigger workforce than agriculture, which is largely done by machines and artificial pesticides and fertilizers that wreck havoc in the environment.

*How's my grammaring?
 
2021-04-17 11:10:54 AM  
Pol Pot was good for this planet. Him forcing every single person out to the countryside to slave away really helped keep down carbon dioxide emissions.
 
2021-04-17 11:23:29 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-17 11:35:55 AM  
Genghis was a dick, but his wife Chaka made some good albums.
 
2021-04-17 11:59:04 AM  
Thanos wanted to kill half the population of the planets he visited to bring "order to the universe".

Sounds pretty Republican to me.
 
2021-04-17 12:41:15 PM  
This is the second apologetics-for-genghis-khan article I've seen in the last year.
 
2021-04-17 12:42:13 PM  
He didn't have the best genes, so he was definitely a scourge of the gene pool.
 
2021-04-17 12:43:13 PM  
News doesn't sell.  Clicks sell.  Thanks for playing (again).
 
2021-04-17 12:45:41 PM  
If i am to understand the implications of this article's POV:

Step right up and do your part opt help the earth. Start your Eco Warrior journey today, taking all your future carbon emissions with you.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-17 12:47:07 PM  

Original: Original Tweet: robkhenderson: "Genghis Khan, in fact, may have been not just the greatest warrior but the greatest eco-warrior of all time...the 13th-century Mongol leader's bloody advance, wiping out entire civilisations, may have scrubbed 700m tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere"


Climate.gov:

The amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere (raspberry line) has increased along with human emissions (blue line) since the start of the Industrial Revolution in 1750. Emissions rose slowly to about 5 billion tons a year in the mid-20th century before skyrocketing to more than 35 billion tons per year by the end of the century.

Genghis Khan, according to these nitwits: "I'm helping!"
 
2021-04-17 12:47:48 PM  

The Googles Do Nothing: I mean, Hitler did that too but let's not talk about him.


I often get into heated discussions with short-sighted types who come out with the old 'If I had a time machine, I'd go back & kill Hitler' crap.

No you wouldn't, you probably couldn't even if you did . For one thing, if the poor people Hitler slaughtered were suddenly brought back to life the planet would be in a poorer state with regards to resouce availibility, as well as there being rather large global population expansion.

Secondly, both world wars, but WW2 especially brought some of the smartest minds to the fore and technology advanced by leaps and bounds during, and after the war. If that massive global conflict hadn;t happened, we'd probably be 40 years behidn where we are now, and the tech to creats a time machine more than likely wouldn't exist (hypothetically. Time travel will never be possible, or we would have found out about it by now).

If you're going to kill hitelr, do it DURING the war, or up to 5 years after. You can't wait 70 years and expect everything to be the same when you get back.
 
2021-04-17 12:48:50 PM  
"Overpopulation" is usually just the accepted way of saying, "just enough of me, too many of you".

/If you're really that worried about the problem, remember that the solution starts with you.
 
2021-04-17 12:49:32 PM  
Using a similar hyper focus, the Black Death would have had a similar, if temporary effect.

/raised wages too
 
2021-04-17 12:49:53 PM  

The Googles Do Nothing: I mean, Hitler did that too but let's not talk about him.


his legacy pretty much went up in smoke.
 
2021-04-17 12:53:21 PM  
I recommend the Dan Carlin podcast on War of the Khans. It is like 8 hours of stuff about the Mongols. He reads a lot of good stuff from historians and primary sources as part of lecture. I listened to the whole thing over a couple of days while playing Civ on marathon speed as the Mongols.

Fun Fact: On the recently cancelled CBS Twilight Zone revival, the plane episode changes the gremlin for a history podcast that narrates how the plane the supposed crazed guy is traveling is gonna crash. He starts to freak out as the podcast accurately describes his present situation. The voice of the podcast is Dan Carlin.
 
2021-04-17 12:56:35 PM  
There is an interesting Crash Course video on the Mongols that I recommend.
 
2021-04-17 12:58:36 PM  
So, we should start requiring government issued breeding permits, and only produce the required number of offspring needed each year.  And not breeding all willy nilly, and creating carbon users just because it feels so good getting a steaming cream pie in the baby maker.

Obviously the government will also determine the make up of each years cohort so that not only is the absolute number correct, but the amount alphas, and betas, and epsilons are correct.  Otherwise there will be extra carbon used without the desired effects.

And yes.  I am serious.  If we want to combat climate change we need to have government control of reproduction.  Ideally all the way down to the genetic level.  And including cybernetic implants so the epsilons are stronger but also more compliant.
 
2021-04-17 12:59:15 PM  
A retweet of a 10 year old article. Wow.
 
2021-04-17 1:00:56 PM  
"according to a study by the Carnegie Institution's Department of Global Energy"

So actually the Guardian not suggesting this. Is subby a troll, or merely stupid?
 
2021-04-17 1:03:23 PM  

Burchill: "according to a study by the Carnegie Institution's Department of Global Energy"

So actually the Guardian not suggesting this. Is subby a troll, or merely stupid?


Come on subby! Identify yourself! Are you just playing us, or are you a dribbling moron?
 
2021-04-17 1:07:10 PM  

thealgorerhythm: A retweet of a 10 year old article. Wow.


*algorithmic slapping noises*
 
2021-04-17 1:09:48 PM  
Why the twatter post and not the original article? The article itself seems to be a somewhat tongue in cheek blerb about a  part of this study.

https://carnegiescience.edu/news/war-​p​lague-no-match-deforestation-driving-c​o2-buildup

It's just lazy, not at least getting the articleor is Fark getting kickback from twatter?
 
2021-04-17 1:13:43 PM  
I don't want to imply I'm advocating it, but let's face it.  The human race is not going to regulate or manage carbon output in any meaningful degree before its too late.  It's fate is sealed: either we avoid climate disaster because some massive catastrophe wipes out the majority of humans first, or humanity warms the planet until there is a climate disaster that wipes out the majority of humans.  The only difference is when and how it happens.
 
2021-04-17 1:14:45 PM  
gilgigamesh: It's Its,dammit
 
2021-04-17 1:16:51 PM  

37dragonfly: There is an interesting Crash Course video on the Mongols that I recommend.


They are the exception.
 
2021-04-17 1:19:22 PM  

37dragonfly: There is an interesting Crash Course video on the Mongols that I recommend.


Just to make it easier for folks.
Wait For It...The Mongols!: Crash Course World History #17
Youtube szxPar0BcMo
 
2021-04-17 1:24:01 PM  

eurotrader: Khan being really rapey adding about 7% to the current world population, so in total khan was and is horrible for the earth


Be careful, you're talking about my great-great- great- great- great- great- great- great- great- great- grandfather. Probably yours, too.
 
2021-04-17 1:26:48 PM  
That makes no farking sense.  Humans simply existing are not causing climate change.  Humans existing in large numbers isn't causing climate change.  Humans burning fossil fuels at a prodigious rate for the last two hundred years has caused climate change.  Now, the large number of human probably goes hand in hand with the use of fossil fuels, especially as agricultural run-off farks up systems that might have partially mitigated the fossil fuel burning.  But if we were able to become carbon-neutral or even carbon-negative, the number of idiots walking around wouldn't matter.  And they certainly were not using coal or petroleum as major fuel sources in the 1200s, so GK did about fark and all for the carbon footprint of humanity.  Not burning it then doesn't count against what we burn now.

Also, take the numbers for the Mongol's dearth tolls with a grain of salt.  Most were recorded by non-Mongols who had been hit.  These could be anti-Mongol or pro-Mongol (if the Mongols are offering you money to write about how great they were, you will quite happily write for them for the filthy lucre).  Anti-Mongol polemics played up how destructive they were.  And the pro- ones did too - goosing the numbers up for some guy who likes to be known for his big swinging manhood is a sure-fire way to get a bonus for you story.  Either way, the numbers are sketchy at best, almost always in an upward direction.  Some historians have looked at reasonably reliable numbers for Central Asian population before 1200.  Unless the Mongols killed every last person in Central Asia (spoiler, they didn't), learned necromancy to raise them all from the dead (no), and had at them a couple more times, there is no way the post-1250 writers can hit their numbers.  A lot of army and population numbers from history are about on par with a 13yo writing 40K fanfic.

What is actually interesting is that the Mongols did kill enough people to disrupt Central Asian irrigation infrastructure.  That infrastructure had been created and expanded incrementally for centuries, if not a couple millennia.  And it was persnickety as hell because there were not not enough water sources to just throw infinite water at the problem.  With so many dying so close together, there simply were not the people to maintain all the moving parts.  While population numbers did eventually rebound to pre-1200 numbers, the carrying capacity of Central Asia's agricultural sector was diminished greatly.  If you look at how many people Central Asia could support at theoretical maximum historically, it was well below what that historical maximum would have grown to assuming the Mongols didn't happen because of the irrigation setbacks.  It wasn't until the Soviet Era that heavy industrialization of agriculture got those numbers back in synch - with a commiserate amount of pollution and overuse of scarce water.  Ironically, the post-Mongol writers' numbers might work if you count the number of theoretical people never born because of that lag.
 
2021-04-17 1:27:06 PM  

AmbassadorBooze: So, we should start requiring government issued breeding permits, and only produce the required number of offspring needed each year.  And not breeding all willy nilly, and creating carbon users just because it feels so good getting a steaming cream pie in the baby maker.

Obviously the government will also determine the make up of each years cohort so that not only is the absolute number correct, but the amount alphas, and betas, and epsilons are correct.  Otherwise there will be extra carbon used without the desired effects.

And yes.  I am serious.  If we want to combat climate change we need to have government control of reproduction.  Ideally all the way down to the genetic level.  And including cybernetic implants so the epsilons are stronger but also more compliant.


Dude, we get it. You're evil.
 
2021-04-17 1:27:17 PM  

The Googles Do Nothing: I mean, Hitler did that too but let's not talk about him.


This what national socialists wants us to believe
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-17 1:28:29 PM  

Spectrum: Accidental Eco-Warrior is the name of my Ghenghis Tron / Chaka Khan mashup cover band.


The Fast Show - Dave Angel Eco Warrior
Youtube u_IxbKeM-HY
 
2021-04-17 1:30:04 PM  

Chthonic Echoes: This is the second apologetics-for-genghis-khan article I've seen in the last year.


People want mass murder, just so long as they're not the ones to be culled. Everyone seems to believe they're special and won't be the ones to get culled. Those are exactly the kind of people who ultimately are next in line against the wall or being marched to the trains.
 
2021-04-17 1:31:02 PM  

Chthonic Echoes: This is the second apologetics-for-genghis-khan article I've seen in the last year.


Read it again. Slowly...
 
2021-04-17 1:32:41 PM  

thespindrifter: Chthonic Echoes: This is the second apologetics-for-genghis-khan article I've seen in the last year.

People want mass murder, just so long as they're not the ones to be culled. Everyone seems to believe they're special and won't be the ones to get culled. Those are exactly the kind of people who ultimately are next in line against the wall or being marched to the trains.


Come on! It's a very short article, try to engage with what it's saying rather than what you imagine it's saying.
 
2021-04-17 1:34:41 PM  
Genghis Khan, is an absolutely fascinating figure.  His life reads like an action movie. 

While he's best known for mass slaughter, rape and pillage, there is a lot more to his story.  He was remarkably progressive in some ways.

Dan Carlin did a 5 part hardcore history on him.  It used to be free, but even with a $10 price tag this is worth a listen.
https://www.dancarlin.com/product/har​d​core-history-wrath-of-the-khans-series​/
 
2021-04-17 1:36:35 PM  

Burchill: thespindrifter: Chthonic Echoes: This is the second apologetics-for-genghis-khan article I've seen in the last year.

People want mass murder, just so long as they're not the ones to be culled. Everyone seems to believe they're special and won't be the ones to get culled. Those are exactly the kind of people who ultimately are next in line against the wall or being marched to the trains.

Come on! It's a very short article, try to engage with what it's saying rather than what you imagine it's saying.


Try engaging with the quote and not the article. Or maybe read a freaking history book. Start with the source material for "Kill All The Brutes", not that it matters because the history of desiring to "destroy the other", the us-versus-them ideology is as old as the 6,000 year old recorded history of mankind.

Human beings are intrinsically violently competitive, divisive, and homicidal. The wheel turns and the story repeats ad infinitum.
 
2021-04-17 1:38:25 PM  

Lord Bear: Genghis Khan, is an absolutely fascinating figure.  His life reads like an action movie. 

While he's best known for mass slaughter, rape and pillage, there is a lot more to his story.  He was remarkably progressive in some ways.

Dan Carlin did a 5 part hardcore history on him.  It used to be free, but even with a $10 price tag this is worth a listen.
https://www.dancarlin.com/product/hard​core-history-wrath-of-the-khans-series​/


I was always fond of how he put the usual pretentious idiots who were usually running the show on the front line of the March to Death with his soldiers pushing from behind while leaving behind the actually competent and talented people to run the show after he left. It improved Eastern Europe for at least a generation.
 
2021-04-17 1:39:51 PM  
I'm watching Space Seed right now so I'm really getting a kick...
 
2021-04-17 1:42:16 PM  

thespindrifter: Burchill: thespindrifter: Chthonic Echoes: This is the second apologetics-for-genghis-khan article I've seen in the last year.

People want mass murder, just so long as they're not the ones to be culled. Everyone seems to believe they're special and won't be the ones to get culled. Those are exactly the kind of people who ultimately are next in line against the wall or being marched to the trains.

Come on! It's a very short article, try to engage with what it's saying rather than what you imagine it's saying.

Try engaging with the quote and not the article. Or maybe read a freaking history book. Start with the source material for "Kill All The Brutes", not that it matters because the history of desiring to "destroy the other", the us-versus-them ideology is as old as the 6,000 year old recorded history of mankind.

Human beings are intrinsically violently competitive, divisive, and homicidal. The wheel turns and the story repeats ad infinitum.


You are assuming that the Guardian journalist thinks this, that is not what the article says. It's an eye-rolling dismissal of a ludicrous idea. If you wish to take issue with the Carnegie Institution's Department of Global Energy, that's fine. But that's not what you're doing. Also, this mocking very short article was published over ten years ago. But fine, ,if you want, get as riled as your average twitter user.
 
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