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(Jerusalem Post)   Lebanon is on the verge of economic collapse, and terrorist group Hezbollah is the only group that can get food, medicine, and fuel to the people   (jpost.com) divider line
    More: Scary, Lebanon, Syria, Lebanon's Hezbollah, Ration stamp, Iran, 2006 Lebanon War, ration cards, Hezbollah's plans  
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679 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Apr 2021 at 1:20 PM (3 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-04-16 12:34:03 PM  
Could that be related?


Naaaaaaah.
 
2021-04-16 12:39:13 PM  
 Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?
 
2021-04-16 12:40:25 PM  
This is why the Middle East is more complicated than "OMG! Terrorism!"

Sinn Fein in northern Ireland had military and political wings. (The military wing would plant bombs, and the political wing would run for office and negotiate with the UK government.) Well, something similar happens here.

Hamas in the Gaza Strip has two wings. One commits terrorism against Israel -- including Israeli civilians. But the other runs hospitals and other public services while the other Palestinian political party -- Yasir Arafat's Fatah -- just siphons international aid to the Palestinian Authority into their bank accounts and does little to help the people. And the world wonders why Hamas won the last Palestinian election many years ago.

Same thing in Lebanon. When the government cannot keep everything running, Hezbollah steps in to help the people (while also threatening Israel). And that's why they are a significant power in the country -- if not the group that actually runs the government in reality.

/ subby
 
2021-04-16 12:58:47 PM  

bostonguy: This is why the Middle East is more complicated than "OMG! Terrorism!"

Sinn Fein in northern Ireland had military and political wings. (The military wing would plant bombs, and the political wing would run for office and negotiate with the UK government.) Well, something similar happens here.

Hamas in the Gaza Strip has two wings. One commits terrorism against Israel -- including Israeli civilians. But the other runs hospitals and other public services while the other Palestinian political party -- Yasir Arafat's Fatah -- just siphons international aid to the Palestinian Authority into their bank accounts and does little to help the people. And the world wonders why Hamas won the last Palestinian election many years ago.

Same thing in Lebanon. When the government cannot keep everything running, Hezbollah steps in to help the people (while also threatening Israel). And that's why they are a significant power in the country -- if not the group that actually runs the government in reality.

/ subby


So what you're saying is that GOP needs to open up a chain of Truck Nutz repair shops?
 
2021-04-16 1:00:25 PM  

yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?


Pakistan?
 
2021-04-16 1:14:56 PM  
And that is what happens when your neighbors Syria, Israel and Iran decide to spend all their time making sure you don't have a functioning government.
 
2021-04-16 1:20:52 PM  
This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.
 
2021-04-16 1:22:40 PM  
BUT WHAT OF THE BOLOGNA?!?!
 
2021-04-16 1:23:26 PM  

yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?


Hezbollah is IN the Lebanese government.  12 seats I believe.
 
2021-04-16 1:25:52 PM  

Somacandra: And that is what happens when your neighbors Syria, Israel and Iran decide to spend all their time making sure you don't have a functioning government.


Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.


I'll just copy/paste from the previous thread where someone else said this stupid shiat:

Oh look at you, parroting a bullshiat talking point that not even the Lebanese ruling class is making.
The Lebanese know exactly who ran their economy and infrastructure into the ground, and it's not some external country. That's why they keep protesting the shiat out of their own government.
 
2021-04-16 1:26:24 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.


Oh do fark off. Israel only bombs Hezbollah targets when they launch missiles at us first.

Leave us alone, and we'll leave you alone.
 
2021-04-16 1:28:27 PM  

yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?


Israel
 
2021-04-16 1:30:19 PM  

bostonguy: Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.

Oh do fark off. Israel only bombs Hezbollah targets when they launch missiles at us first.

Leave us alone, and we'll leave you alone.


The only reason Hezbollah still exists is that they defeated Israel after Israel had illegally OCCUPIED Lebanon for 15 years.  Remember that?  They were the self-styled "Heroes of the Lebanese People" who kicked out the Israelis and they still claim to be the saviors and the only thing that keeps Israel at bay.

So if you don't want to create resistance groups maybe don't invade and occupy your neighbours, Israel.
 
2021-04-16 1:30:23 PM  

yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?


This. If you are the only group capable of performing government functions, you are the government.

Maybe we should be dealing with them accordingly.
 
d23 [OhFark]
2021-04-16 1:31:02 PM  
If you ever been there you'd realize that Lebanon, In is a shiathole.
 
2021-04-16 1:31:12 PM  

lolmao500: yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?

Pakistan?


The correct answer is "all of them"
 
2021-04-16 1:33:00 PM  

Rambino: yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?

This. If you are the only group capable of performing government functions, you are the government.

Maybe we should be dealing with them accordingly.


But we don't like terrorists because. And reasons!
 
2021-04-16 1:34:51 PM  
bostonguy:

That's because of the narodniks.

Back in the day, they thought that people would overlook their violent rise to power once they got into power and were doing good things for the people.

So after that, the "armed" wing of the party is set up so it can be disavowed at any moment.
 
2021-04-16 1:36:15 PM  
I know calling the situation complicated would be a slight understatement, but that sounds like one government basically bubbling up through another. I mean, that's often how things go. A terrorist organization, revolutionary force, whatever label we throw at it, usually doesn't fit that mold forever if it sticks around for long. They have goals in the end, after all.
 
2021-04-16 1:36:27 PM  

Subtonic: BUT WHAT OF THE BOLOGNA?!?!


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-16 1:36:49 PM  
 
2021-04-16 1:37:20 PM  
One of the big reasons Hezbollah has clout in that part of the world is Hezbollah is far less corrupt than essentially every other agency.
 
2021-04-16 1:37:38 PM  
I thought Jared Kushner was supposed to solve all of this.
 
2021-04-16 1:37:53 PM  
I don't know this particular situation, but typically groups like this are "the only ones that can distribute necessary supplies" is because they have inserted themselves into the distribution network by force and coercion to make sure no one else is able to provide aid to the people that need it. It allows them to say "See? We are the only ones that care about the people!" When, really, they aren't the only ones that can help, they're just the ones that made sure no one else can help.
 
2021-04-16 1:39:32 PM  

yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?


The US
 
2021-04-16 1:40:07 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.


But Israel makes up for that with pictures of 18-19 year old female soldiers carrying weapons. So its a trade off.
 
2021-04-16 1:40:12 PM  

bostonguy: This is why the Middle East is more complicated than "OMG! Terrorism!"

Sinn Fein in northern Ireland had military and political wings. (The military wing would plant bombs, and the political wing would run for office and negotiate with the UK government.) Well, something similar happens here.

Hamas in the Gaza Strip has two wings. One commits terrorism against Israel -- including Israeli civilians. But the other runs hospitals and other public services while the other Palestinian political party -- Yasir Arafat's Fatah -- just siphons international aid to the Palestinian Authority into their bank accounts and does little to help the people. And the world wonders why Hamas won the last Palestinian election many years ago.

Same thing in Lebanon. When the government cannot keep everything running, Hezbollah steps in to help the people (while also threatening Israel). And that's why they are a significant power in the country -- if not the group that actually runs the government in reality.

/ subby


Same with the Mafia in Italy. At one point, the Friends were essentially the government, to the point where the US military collaborated with them to keep the peace after the Allies kicked the Germans out of North Africa and they started up the Boot.

We even saw this in America. Go to Chicago during the Depression, and you had Capone-run soup kitchens. That's goodwill that is priceless.
 
2021-04-16 1:40:36 PM  

Promo Sapien: I thought Jared Kushner was supposed to solve all of this.


I'm waiting for Biden to move the embassy back.
 
2021-04-16 1:41:01 PM  

Nullav: I know calling the situation complicated would be a slight understatement, but that sounds like one government basically bubbling up through another. I mean, that's often how things go. A terrorist organization, revolutionary force, whatever label we throw at it, usually doesn't fit that mold forever if it sticks around for long. They have goals in the end, after all.


Also, don't forget, the Lebanese government is a farking NIGHTMARE.  So complicated and so many rules it would seriously take a university-level course to fully understand it.

First line of the wiki:

"Lebanon is a parliamentary democratic republic within the overall framework of confessionalism, a form of consociationalism in which the highest offices are proportionately reserved for representatives from certain religious communities"

That word you probably just saw for the first time (I know I did):

Consociationalism is a form of power sharing in a democracy.[1] Political scientists define a consociational state as one which has major internal divisions along ethnic, religious, or linguistic lines, with none of the divisions large enough to form a majority group, but which remains stable due to consultation among the elites of these groups. Consociational states are often contrasted with states with majoritarian electoral systems.
 
2021-04-16 1:41:09 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.


No, like all authoritarians, war with foreigners begins when public support is waning before an election year.
 
2021-04-16 1:41:23 PM  
Is this different than any other day?  Hamas and Hezbollah have been doing this sort of things for years, which is probably why they're still around.
 
2021-04-16 1:42:50 PM  

yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?


the united states of america ? or does the school of the americas not count ?
 
2021-04-16 1:43:17 PM  

Promo Sapien: I thought Jared Kushner was supposed to solve all of this.


Jared Kushner couldn't solve getting a fleck of penis skin caught in his zipper.
 
2021-04-16 1:43:50 PM  
What about the militant arm of the Salvation Army?
 
2021-04-16 1:44:04 PM  

Sword and Shield: Same with the Mafia in Italy. At one point, the Friends were essentially the government, to the point where the US military collaborated with them to keep the peace after the Allies kicked the Germans out of North Africa and they started up the Boot.

We even saw this in America. Go to Chicago during the Depression, and you had Capone-run soup kitchens. That's goodwill that is priceless.


Exactly. They may be terrorists or criminals -- but they're not dumb.

Westerners make a mistake when they assume that terrorist organizations are all crazy, apocalyptic nutcases. There is almost always a real politik reason for everything. The terrorism is just a means to an end.
 
2021-04-16 1:45:02 PM  

Nadie_AZ: yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?

The US


That looks like the US' signature but the US doesn't remember signing it.
 
2021-04-16 1:45:52 PM  

Nadie_AZ: Promo Sapien: I thought Jared Kushner was supposed to solve all of this.

I'm waiting for Biden to move the embassy back.


I'm pretty sure the administration said it's staying.

And although one item on my bucket list is to piss on Trump's eventual grave, I will give him one thing: A country's embassy in another country should be in the city where that country has its capital.

Not that I'm biased.
 
2021-04-16 1:46:47 PM  
One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
 
2021-04-16 1:46:56 PM  

kindms: yohohogreengiant: Um. Terrorism is a tactic.  If that is what you are doing to basically govern (feed) your population, you are still pretty much the government.

What other government do I know that trains and supports terrorists?

the united states of america ? or does the school of the americas not count ?


Yeah. That's exactly what I was thinking about
 
2021-04-16 1:50:05 PM  

bostonguy: Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.

Oh do fark off. Israel only bombs Hezbollah targets when they launch missiles at us first.

Leave us alone, and we'll leave you alone.


LOL. so when the Israelis were secretly posing as Islamic terrorists on a bombing campaign in Lebanon and Syria leaving people alone ?

They even had a US ambassador declared mentally unfit for accusing them after they tried to kill him
 
2021-04-16 1:51:13 PM  

kindms: LOL. so when the Israelis were secretly posing as Islamic terrorists on a bombing campaign in Lebanon and Syria leaving people alone ?

They even had a US ambassador declared mentally unfit for accusing them after they tried to kill him


What the fark are you talking about?
 
2021-04-16 1:51:35 PM  
Seems like the solution to stopping terrorists from endearing themselves to citizens is to provide for those citizens even better. You can complain about Hamas or Hezbollah all you want but if no one is stepping up to help people more than they are, this is what happens. Desperate, needy people will take help from anyone. They're just tying to survive.
 
2021-04-16 1:52:27 PM  

bostonguy: Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: This is usually when Israel starts bombing the fark out of them for no reason.

Oh do fark off. Israel only bombs Hezbollah targets when they launch missiles at us first.

Leave us alone, and we'll leave you alone.


The entirety of the history of Israel is built on not leaving people alone.
 
2021-04-16 1:52:47 PM  
Organized criminal groups will frequently support the needs of people when governments fall short. It's a common strategy to win hearts and minds.
 
2021-04-16 1:54:10 PM  

bostonguy: kindms: LOL. so when the Israelis were secretly posing as Islamic terrorists on a bombing campaign in Lebanon and Syria leaving people alone ?

They even had a US ambassador declared mentally unfit for accusing them after they tried to kill him

What the fark are you talking about?


https://medium.com/@djadan/israeli-jo​u​rnalist-ronen-bergman-reveals-his-coun​trys-terrorist-bombing-campaign-in-leb​anon-8a5d9ff7a2f2

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronen_B​e​rgman
 
2021-04-16 1:57:40 PM  
They weren't doing great beforehand, but I'm sure having Beirut explode late last year didn't help.
Beirut Explosion
Most of their economy went through that port. With it (and large chunks of the city) destroyed, their economy had little chance of survival.
 
2021-04-16 2:01:11 PM  

austerity101: The entirety of the history of Israel is built on not leaving people alone.


What happened when Israel declared independence in 1948? Literally almost every surrounding Arab country invaded us and tried to exterminate us.

We won.

All Israel wants is not to have any external existential threats. Let us live in peace, and there will be peace. Israel has no interest in invading and occupying and attacking other countries unless we are forced to do so in self-defense.

Full stop.
 
2021-04-16 2:02:39 PM  

bostonguy: Sword and Shield: Same with the Mafia in Italy. At one point, the Friends were essentially the government, to the point where the US military collaborated with them to keep the peace after the Allies kicked the Germans out of North Africa and they started up the Boot.

We even saw this in America. Go to Chicago during the Depression, and you had Capone-run soup kitchens. That's goodwill that is priceless.

Exactly. They may be terrorists or criminals -- but they're not dumb.

Westerners make a mistake when they assume that terrorist organizations are all crazy, apocalyptic nutcases. There is almost always a real politik reason for everything. The terrorism is just a means to an end.


Terrorists run just enough politics to have safety on a local level. They tend to fark everything up once the world goes tits up, as is the point of this article.
 
2021-04-16 2:05:34 PM  

bostonguy: austerity101: The entirety of the history of Israel is built on not leaving people alone.

What happened when Israel declared independence in 1948? Literally almost every surrounding Arab country invaded us and tried to exterminate us.

We won.

All Israel wants is not to have any external existential threats. Let us live in peace, and there will be peace. Israel has no interest in invading and occupying and attacking other countries unless we are forced to do so in self-defense.

Full stop.


Unless they're innocent people on the Gaza strip. Or distant farmers in neighboring countries. They sure have to defend themselves against a lot of hospitals and unarmed children.
 
2021-04-16 2:05:50 PM  

bostonguy: austerity101: The entirety of the history of Israel is built on not leaving people alone.

What happened when Israel declared independence in 1948? Literally almost every surrounding Arab country invaded us and tried to exterminate us.

We won.

All Israel wants is not to have any external existential threats. Let us live in peace, and there will be peace. Israel has no interest in invading and occupying and attacking other countries unless we are forced to do so in self-defense.

Full stop.


No interest in occupation? That's news to me. Fark your settlements.
 
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