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(The New York Times)   Health officials warn that pausing the J&J vaccine and highlighting the clotting heightens vaccine hesitancy, helps conspiracy theorists, and will ultimately sicken and even kill more people than it saves   (nytimes.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, Thrombus, Vaccine, Vaccination, Coagulation, Johnson coronavirus vaccine, wrong situation, federal health officials, Public health  
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703 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 14 Apr 2021 at 9:48 PM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-04-14 6:42:05 PM  
No shiat
 
2021-04-14 8:09:32 PM  
Millions of J&J shots have been given. Maybe 6-7 reports of clotting so far.

This delay is just to "do due diligence" and it is unfortunate.
 
2021-04-14 8:46:01 PM  
People are more likely to get blood clots from birth control pills than this vaccine.
 
2021-04-14 9:47:37 PM  

WTFDYW: No shiat


Exactly, the blood clot thing is less than one in a million.
 
2021-04-14 9:50:05 PM  
friend of mine has to get the jj vaccine, because of the glycol in the others.  shes really frustrated about this.
 
2021-04-14 9:50:30 PM  
A basic lack of math and science education leads to.... well... the USA
 
2021-04-14 9:51:16 PM  
I'm not worried about clotting, just about mulitple johnsons in me.
 
2021-04-14 9:52:21 PM  
6/6 million complications, with known conditions (low platelet count).  But this will be used as "VACCINES ARE NOT SAFE" ammunition for decades.
 
2021-04-14 9:52:23 PM  

OkieDookie: I'm not worried about clotting, just about mulitple johnsons in me.


You're in luck!  You only need one Johnson as opposed to two Moderna or Pfizer.

/Not sure what part of me is the Pfizer.
 
2021-04-14 9:52:37 PM  

Earguy: WTFDYW: No shiat

Exactly, the blood clot thing is less than one in a million.


MATH IS HARD
 
2021-04-14 9:52:54 PM  

OkieDookie: I'm not worried about clotting, just about mulitple johnsons in me.


This is why I refuse to eat at Five Guys.

My mouth only has so much room.
 
2021-04-14 9:54:01 PM  
and people still play the powerball.  hope (and ignorance of science/statistics) springs eternal
 
2021-04-14 9:54:30 PM  

Leader O'Cola: A basic lack of math and science education leads to.... well... the USA


Yes, because the people making these recommendations lack in math and science education

media3.giphy.comView Full Size
 
2021-04-14 9:54:52 PM  
Anyone currently listening to conspiracies instead of doctors is always going to find an excuse to not take the vaccine, and some likely don't have an excuse at all other than 'I dun wanna'.

The halt gives these morons something to point at, but it's not changing the amount that are taking the vaccine. The same idiots are still not getting the vaccine, they just have a new talking point.
 
2021-04-14 9:54:52 PM  

Glockenspiel Hero: OkieDookie: I'm not worried about clotting, just about mulitple johnsons in me.

You're in luck!  You only need one Johnson as opposed to two Moderna or Pfizer.

/Not sure what part of me is the Pfizer.


If the COVID-19 Vaccines Interviewed for a Job
Youtube u9Op3RVXtD0
 
2021-04-14 9:54:59 PM  

divgradcurl: and people still play the powerball.  hope (and ignorance of science/statistics) springs eternal


Nah, Doom is eternal, too
 
jlt
2021-04-14 9:55:09 PM  
I got the J&J 8 days ago. I'm a 44 y/o female.

I would get it again too, even with this new information.  All medications have some degree of risk involved.
 
2021-04-14 9:57:28 PM  
The tag is correct, and echoes my doctor wife's sentiments.
 
2021-04-14 9:57:47 PM  

Leader O'Cola: A basic lack of math and science education leads to.... well... the USA


Health officials need to lede with statistics on getting hit by lightening, bit by sharks, etc., and then point out that this has been one in a million, and that there has yet to be shown a causal relationship.

But they are going to be preaching to people that buy lottery tickets and go to Las Vegas. And won't wear a facemask.
 
2021-04-14 9:58:07 PM  
I was scheduled to get the J&J one on Friday. They just updated me today that I'm now getting the Maderna. I'm willing to take that small chance with the problems over having to get a second shot.
 
2021-04-14 9:58:43 PM  
The damage to their reputation is already done and un-pausing isn't going to fix it. Might as well just have the FDA "recall" it, wait a month or so, then re-introduce it under a new name with no connection to the J&J/Janssen name (assuming the investigations don't turn up anything worse).
 
2021-04-14 9:59:46 PM  
Point of Order - We don't know if it is only 6 people.

For example, my cousin got the AZ vaccine and a blod clot in her leg a week and a half ago. She is not the Canadian that the news reported as having an AZ blood clot. The doctors caught it before long term damage was done. The doctors told her it acaully looked like a vaccine induced clot.

The history of Covid is that we read all kinds of symptoms, and we only catch a few examples. For instance: reinfection, the Covid in the eye, Cvoid in the brain, Covid in the pancreas, Covid in the blood stream, were all dismissed as just a few peple. But even now, we can say about the brain damage: it affects all age group at the same rate - youth and health are no protection; brain damage sets in for 1 out of 3 infected people. As for the other organ damge, we know it's so bad that 1 in 9 (iirc) patients released from hospita as "resolved" die within 6 months.

Pausing a vaccine at only 6 coinfirmed cases is compeltely correct. Going by the evidence of Covid and also iatrogenic medicine, pausing is not an over-reaction.

As usual, I expect the SETM brigade to come shiat on me, but I knwo the history and anthropology of science (and law) well enough to know who epidemiology during a pandemic works. And the STEM brigade here on Fark still, after a year, hasn't learned a thing about the difference between pandemics and normal presence of disease with routine vectors of infection.

We are winning and we are safe - but only if we stay home and pause vaccines when a few iatrogenic cases pop up.
 
2021-04-14 10:00:00 PM  
Seems like a better idea would have been to pause it for women in the age group that was at risk, but continue allowing men to take it.
 
2021-04-14 10:00:48 PM  
Canada has now re-approved the AstraZeneca vaccine for everyone (was temporarily restricted to age 55-65), with an extra warning about the clotting issue.

We haven't received any of the J&J yet, but it will probably get the same treatment.
 
2021-04-14 10:01:03 PM  
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Just think of the outcry when word leaked that there was this possible correlation with blood clots and the FDA, CDC et al. hadn't said anything about it.

Stupid people will take any excuse not to get vaccinated. I'm honestly not sure what the solution is.
 
2021-04-14 10:02:18 PM  
It'll be good to review the data to see if there is a sub-population that should not be taking this and the Astra Zeneca vaccine.

That said, the EU is not renewing their contracts with J&J and AZ.  They are dropping viralvector vaccines and focusing on mRNA vaccines.

Continue to mask and socially distance and you'll be fine.
 
2021-04-14 10:03:15 PM  
Did Spotlighting a Rare Potential Vaccine Side Effect Put More at Risk?

Fark user imageView Full Size
'

But informing the public wasn't the wrong thing to do.  A strong negative outcome will be the fault of antivaxxers and morons; but I repeat myself.
 
2021-04-14 10:03:45 PM  

phedex: friend of mine has to get the jj vaccine, because of the glycol in the others.  shes really frustrated about this.


Probability is on her side.  Unless she's had clotting issues before she has a better chance of getting struck by lightning.
 
2021-04-14 10:04:56 PM  
56 hours out since my J&J shot now. Maybe felt something approaching a headache this morning, and vague arm soreness that lasted all of a day. That's been about it. I'd get it again if they'd let me. Hope they check whatever boxes they need to check and get that shiat back out there ASAP.
 
2021-04-14 10:05:19 PM  

dkulprit: phedex: friend of mine has to get the jj vaccine, because of the glycol in the others.  shes really frustrated about this.

Probability is on her side.  Unless she's had clotting issues before she has a better chance of getting struck by lightning.


That's a Moderna side effect.

https://metro.co.uk/2020/12/18/covid-​v​accine-volunteer-struck-by-lightning-a​fter-moderna-injection-13774498/
 
2021-04-14 10:05:34 PM  
What does this mean for the Sputnik, Novavax and Sinopharm vaccines that are also viralvector?
 
2021-04-14 10:05:34 PM  
Water is wet I'm told, but it's really a deep state lie.
 
2021-04-14 10:06:47 PM  
The Pfizer shot is the gold standard.  It's what the government and rich people got.
 
2021-04-14 10:07:18 PM  

jlt: I got the J&J 8 days ago. I'm a 44 y/o female.

I would get it again too, even with this new information.  All medications have some degree of risk involved.


I got the J&J this past Friday.

Had a crappy night sleep on Friday night, but no other side effects.
 
2021-04-14 10:07:32 PM  
Good God..

In Malawi, people are asking doctors how to flush the AstraZeneca vaccine from their bodies. In South Africa, health officials have stopped giving the Johnson & Johnson shot, two months after dropping the AstraZeneca vaccine. And in the Democratic Republic of Congo, 1.7 million AstraZeneca doses have gone unused.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/14/wo​r​ld/europe/western-vaccines-africa-hesi​tancy.html
 
2021-04-14 10:08:05 PM  
I blame Trump
 
2021-04-14 10:08:43 PM  

Earguy: WTFDYW: No shiat

Exactly, the blood clot thing is less than one in a million.


I'm getting 8.8 x 10^-7. So if I count my zeroes right... a 9 ten thousandths of 1 percent chance of a blood clot?

What are the normal f*cking odds?!?
 
2021-04-14 10:11:00 PM  

MIRV888: Water is wet I'm told, but it's really a deep state lie.


Disinformation put out by the Sponge People of Cladorhizidae V!
 
2021-04-14 10:11:04 PM  
This is the email I recieved from King county about it:

Use of the J&J COVID-19 vaccine has been paused in Washington State as the CDC reviews reports of a rare type of blood clot, reported in 6 people in the U.S. out of nearly 7 million people who have received the J&J vaccine in the U.S. to date.
The 6 cases occurred between 6-13 days after vaccination. People who received the J&J vaccine more than 3 weeks ago are at very low risk.
If you received the J&J vaccine within the past 3 weeks your risk of a blood clot is still very low. However, if you develop severe headache, abdominal pain, leg pain, or shortness of breath, contact your healthcare provider, go to urgent care or an Emergency Room, or call 206-477-3977 (8am-7pm).
The Moderna and Pfizer vaccines are not affected by the CDC review and will continue to be used. Severe side effects to any vaccines are extremely rare
 
2021-04-14 10:13:56 PM  
these are just the ones they let you know about....
 
2021-04-14 10:15:17 PM  

YakBoy42: Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Just think of the outcry when word leaked that there was this possible correlation with blood clots and the FDA, CDC et al. hadn't said anything about it.

Stupid people will take any excuse not to get vaccinated. I'm honestly not sure what the solution is.


This.

Essentially you either get this or the Boeing fiasko 2.0 vaccine boogaloo. You don't fark around with this sort of thing, it's better to pause and gather information than it is to chalk it up as insignificant and ignore it. They tried ignoring the auto crash feature of the Boeing planes until everyone else grounded the damn planes and as a result the FAA took a massive hit to their own reputation as well (well deserved). They won't repeat that, especially when they have other vaccines online still. It would be different if J&J was the only game in town but they aren't. Besides, if it's really as rare as it is, I imagine it'll give J&J time to catch up on their supply. It's not like these doses will be wasted unless something is actually wrong with the vaccine. They may just not go into an arm until next week/month.
 
2021-04-14 10:16:40 PM  

WTP 2: these are just the ones they let you know about....


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-14 10:17:35 PM  

Ivo Shandor: Canada has now re-approved the AstraZeneca vaccine for everyone (was temporarily restricted to age 55-65), with an extra warning about the clotting issue.


The risk of catching COVID-19 is so high in Canada, in comparison to the available vaccine supply (thanks, Biden), that continuing to provide vaccines that have iffy safety profiles is an acceptable tradeoff. The vaccine will save more lives than it will take, but this is entirely a situation that Canada has been forced into by American destruction of our domestic pharmaceutical capacity and the American vaccine embargo.

It would not make as much sense to provide the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine in places like Australia, where the risk of contracting COVID-19 is extremely low.

Whether issuing Oxford-AstraZeneca and/or J&J is ethically responsible will depend on conditions in any given area.
 
2021-04-14 10:17:39 PM  

AllCatsAreBeautiful: What does this mean for the Sputnik, Novavax and Sinopharm vaccines that are also viralvector?


Novavax is a direct injection of the spike protein + an adjuvant. It's unlikely to have this problem, given that Spike alone (as produced by the mRNA vaccines) doesn't seem to trigger the clotting.

Sinopharm is an inactivated version of the actual coronavirus, not a vector. I don't know if it would have a similar issue.

Sputnik does use adenovirus vectors so it's the most likely to have the problem. Whether the Russians are looking for it, or would tell the world if they found it, is another matter.
 
2021-04-14 10:19:04 PM  

johnny_vegas: Leader O'Cola: A basic lack of math and science education leads to.... well... the USA

Yes, because the people making these recommendations lack in math and science education

[media3.giphy.com image 400x300]


Yes, that's who the comment was about
 
jlt
2021-04-14 10:20:00 PM  

Doc Daneeka: jlt: I got the J&J 8 days ago. I'm a 44 y/o female.

I would get it again too, even with this new information.  All medications have some degree of risk involved.

I got the J&J this past Friday.

Had a crappy night sleep on Friday night, but no other side effects.


Oh, it kicked my ass the next day. Headache, fever, bones hurt, muscle pain, exhaustion and digestive issues.
And then, about 24 hours after I got the shot, it was like someone flipped a switch and I was 100% fine.
 
2021-04-14 10:20:13 PM  

Wireless Joe: 6/6 million complications, with known conditions (low platelet count).  But this will be used as "VACCINES ARE NOT SAFE" ammunition for decades.


Nothing will dissuade the Antivaxxers with their "Vaccines kill people" rhetoric, even when you try to explain that 1 in 1 million had the clotting issue, while 2000 out of 1 million people infected with COVID have died.
 
2021-04-14 10:20:26 PM  
I get my second on Friday and can't wait to hit the auctions next year. Eye's on a cheap RV, boat, and maybe a old school car.
/Getting my Southern tang just right
// will clean up at $40K
 
2021-04-14 10:20:37 PM  
I talked to my hardcore Trumper Dad yesterday and he said that with all the "disturbing problems" with the J&J vaccine and the death rate from Covid at "~1%", he's not going to get vaccinated at all. He's 86.

I'm gonna miss him.
 
2021-04-14 10:20:43 PM  

OkieDookie: I'm not worried about clotting, just about mulitple johnsons in me.


If one Johnson is good, then two must be better?
 
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