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(NPR)   Stalled bill for nearly 30 years is expected to get a committee vote in the House of Representatives for paying reparations to Black Americans today. Maybe get kicked down the road for another 30 years   (npr.org) divider line
    More: Interesting, Democratic Party, African American, Republican Party, former Democratic Rep. John Conyers, John Conyers, Racism, Black people, Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee  
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457 clicks; posted to Politics » on 14 Apr 2021 at 7:03 PM (3 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-04-14 1:50:45 PM  
 
2021-04-14 3:13:57 PM  
"I don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago, for whom none of us currently living are responsible, is a good idea," McConnell said then.


Fair enough. Then how about reparations for redlining, which happened within McConnell's lifetime? Would that be a good idea?

https://www.npr.org/2017/05/03/526655​8​31/a-forgotten-history-of-how-the-u-s-​government-segregated-america
 
2021-04-14 4:52:33 PM  
Chappelle's Show - Reparations 2003 Follow-Up
Youtube FRZN7IzvCVs

Obligatory
 
2021-04-14 7:07:58 PM  

Somacandra: [Fark user image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.


See the difference?
 
2021-04-14 7:09:26 PM  
"I don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago, for whom none of us currently living are responsible, is a good idea," McConnell said then.

What about reparations for something that the a lot of the south is still proud of 150 years later?

You wave a confederate flag at a protest? You get a $5000 reparation fine. Your state has pro-confederate statues or portraits? You pay a billion in reparation.

If the stinking rednecks want to be proud of slavery they can pay for it.
 
2021-04-14 7:12:02 PM  

Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.


Devil's advocate, it was much easier to identify the victims of that policy than the victims of slavery and the victims or their direct descendants were still mostly alive when it was signed.

Today though, how can we reliably determine eligibility for slavery reparations when we can't reliably determine if someone's heritage includes slavery.

I think general welfare is a much more effective policy than reparations which will inevitably satisfy almost no one involved
 
2021-04-14 7:13:09 PM  
How about reparations for what you are doing to black people NOW you coonts.
 
2021-04-14 7:15:08 PM  
How would this work? I had a black coworker who brought this up. Both of his parents emigrated here from Jamaica. Shouldn't he be looking to England for his reparations?

I'm not against the idea, but the devil's in the details. Do you need to show that you have at least one ancestor who was a slave in America or will we simply apply the color stick from Family Guy?
 
2021-04-14 7:21:09 PM  
The more it gets kicked down the curb, the more it will cost, and the more people will live a lesser life along the way. Hell, just look at redlining if you want an example of something that's had lasting effects. While whites were able to build wealth on credit and pass that along to future generations, sometimes building some of the financial empires we see today, well hell, just look at a list of US billionaires if you want to see the picture that painted.

Even now, if you have a city in mind with some decaying sections that always seem to get overlooked for roadwork, sidewalks, bike trails, hospitals, and maybe even bus routes, I bet that if you can find an old residential security map, a lot of that's going to line right up.

Then you got things like highways that cut straight through black communities, as a way of partitioning them, destroying property values, and sparing white neighborhoods. People are slowly putting in the effort to right some of these wrongs, but a lot of us know what many of these wrongs are, and at the end of the day, it is incumbent for our government to step in and admit that they farked up and need to take part in fixing the systems that their forebears created and helped sustain both actively and through indifference.

And no, it doesn't stop there, it's not a matter of just throwing out some money and a mea culpa. We need prolonged cultural shifting, and sustained active effort to flatten a historically skewed playing field. But this is a start, and the sooner, the better.
 
2021-04-14 7:23:23 PM  

gaspode: How about reparations for what you are doing to black people NOW you coonts.


...and pretty much everybody that works for a living.
 
2021-04-14 7:27:26 PM  

lolmao500: "I don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago, for whom none of us currently living are responsible, is a good idea," McConnell said then.

What about reparations for something that the a lot of the south is still proud of 150 years later?

You wave a confederate flag at a protest? You get a $5000 reparation fine. Your state has pro-confederate statues or portraits? You pay a billion in reparation.

If the stinking rednecks want to be proud of slavery they can pay for it.


Getting awful close to clamping down on freedom of expression there
 
2021-04-14 7:31:14 PM  

Spass_Taschen: How would this work? I had a black coworker who brought this up. Both of his parents emigrated here from Jamaica. Shouldn't he be looking to England for his reparations?

I'm not against the idea, but the devil's in the details. Do you need to show that you have at least one ancestor who was a slave in America or will we simply apply the color stick from Family Guy?


It would have to be a lump donation to the United Negro College Fund or similar.

Now what they'd do with all that acreage and all those mules I have no idea
 
2021-04-14 7:35:02 PM  

GoldSpider: Somacandra: [Fark user image 610×315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

See the difference?

It's not just for slavery. It's for Jim Crow, too, and that kept going for another couple decades after the Internment camps ended. How many survivors of that do you think are still around?
 
2021-04-14 7:35:51 PM  

COMALite J: GoldSpider: Somacandra: [Fark user image 610×315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

See the difference?
It's not just for slavery. It's for Jim Crow, too, and that kept going for another couple decades after the Internment camps ended. How many survivors of that do you think are still around?


Well, let's start with the population of Georgia....
 
2021-04-14 7:36:39 PM  

Spass_Taschen: How would this work? I had a black coworker who brought this up. Both of his parents emigrated here from Jamaica. Shouldn't he be looking to England for his reparations?

I'm not against the idea, but the devil's in the details. Do you need to show that you have at least one ancestor who was a slave in America or will we simply apply the color stick from Family Guy?


I want reparations from france for Louis 14ths depredations against the Huguenots .
 
2021-04-14 7:37:00 PM  
I predict this thread will be a thoughtful and productive discussion.
 
2021-04-14 7:37:25 PM  
 
2021-04-14 7:39:37 PM  

I Browse: "I don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago, for whom none of us currently living are responsible, is a good idea," McConnell said then.


Fair enough. Then how about reparations for redlining, which happened within McConnell's lifetime? Would that be a good idea?

https://www.npr.org/2017/05/03/5266558​31/a-forgotten-history-of-how-the-u-s-​government-segregated-america


The only way you're getting a Republican to vote for reparations is to base it on stigginit,* and even then, I suspect a handful of Democrats in the Senate will wimp out on voting yes.

*By stigginit, they will craft a bill that states "The Democrat Party is 100% responsible for the crime of slavery and must make full restitutions to the ancestors of slaves."
 
2021-04-14 7:39:39 PM  

Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.


Notice that they're still alive and in that picture.
 
2021-04-14 7:40:46 PM  
How to lose the swing popular vote in one easy congressional vote....
 
2021-04-14 7:42:57 PM  
Why not free healthcare & college/university education for all descendants of slaves?
 
2021-04-14 7:43:35 PM  
As long as they try to take an objective approach to figuring out who owes who what, and try to bring about some resolution.

/hey, stop laughing
 
2021-04-14 7:44:38 PM  

Meatsim1: Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

Devil's advocate, it was much easier to identify the victims of that policy than the victims of slavery and the victims or their direct descendants were still mostly alive when it was signed.

Today though, how can we reliably determine eligibility for slavery reparations when we can't reliably determine if someone's heritage includes slavery.

I think general welfare is a much more effective policy than reparations which will inevitably satisfy almost no one involved


Sadly, this.  I like the idea and understand the desire, but I have no idea how it's supposed to work

I have two adopted sons, both multiracial.  We know nothing at all about their Black heritage- no family names, etc.  Were their great-greats here as slaves?  Probably, but we cannot ever know.  They could have been tourists from Nigeria.

Even for Black folks who do know, one of the insidious things about slavery is the destruction of any family records of slaves.  A family might know that their great-great-great-grandpappy was a slave on a plantation in South Carolina, but they won't have a birth certificate or any death notice, or any indication he was ever alive except stories passed down from generation to generation.  If they're lucky they might know where his grave is, but probably not.

So how do you decide who gets reparations and how much?
 
2021-04-14 7:46:04 PM  

I Browse: Fair enough. Then how about reparations for redlining, which happened within McConnell's lifetime? Would that be a good idea?


Getting warmer.  The benefits of that program is incredibly random, but at least there's an effort.
 
2021-04-14 7:48:23 PM  

mistahtom: Why not free healthcare & college/university education for all descendants of slaves?


And everyone else.
 
2021-04-14 7:49:53 PM  

Spass_Taschen: How would this work? I had a black coworker who brought this up. Both of his parents emigrated here from Jamaica. Shouldn't he be looking to England for his reparations?

I'm not against the idea, but the devil's in the details. Do you need to show that you have at least one ancestor who was a slave in America or will we simply apply the color stick from Family Guy?


I reflexively reported every post I saw that contained the color stick from Family Guy for a few months during the Floyd riots.
 
2021-04-14 7:51:51 PM  
We do need to address the baked-in racism and other problems that disproportionately affect the lowest on the income ladder, but I wish they would find a less loaded word than 'Reparations' to describe that effort.

If any bill called reparations gets signed into law, expect the right to argue for the end of all things currently being done to try to correct for the last hundred-plus years of discrimination (and the courts will side with them).
 
2021-04-14 7:51:55 PM  
It had to happen at the time. It didn't. Now it's impossible. And while I agree with the sentiment "years of jim crow" etc, as soon as you make the condition something other than "ancestors were slaves in america", it opens the door to a wide range of grievences and who owes whom. So outside of a general donation to the NAACP or the Negro College Fund, it won't happen.
 
2021-04-14 7:52:53 PM  

mistahtom: Why not free healthcare & college/university education for all descendants of slaves?


FTFY
 
2021-04-14 7:57:28 PM  

Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.


Yeah, but did he sign them for the descendants over 150 years after the internment ended? It's not a "precedent" if it's a different situation. If there were still people alive, then it's not the same as reparations for people 4+ generations removed.
 
2021-04-14 8:02:57 PM  

JAGChem82: The only way you're getting a Republican to vote for reparations is to base it on stigginit,* and even then, I suspect a handful of Democrats in the Senate will wimp out on voting yes.


Oh trust me...I know that reparations are never going to happen. And to be honest, it's too late anyway. The damage has already been done. Even with the example I cited (redlining) there's no way to undo it now. Black people were deliberately kept from participating in the biggest opportunity for wealth creation of the 20th century.

All I really want is for this country to tell the truth about it. Not an apology, but just an acknowledgement. The reason things are the way they are was very much by design.
 
2021-04-14 8:08:29 PM  

Mikey1969: Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

Yeah, but did he sign them for the descendants over 150 years after the internment ended? It's not a "precedent" if it's a different situation. If there were still people alive, then it's not the same as reparations for people 4+ generations removed.


It is not just slavery.  The committee is also supposed to address systemic racism and racial inequality that has occurred more recently.  People are alive today who lived through segregation, Jim Crow laws, and redlining.  Hell, while we don't like to call it segregation, there is a reason why the poorest and worst run public schools in my district are 90% minority.
 
2021-04-14 8:21:39 PM  

WalkingSedgwick: How to lose the swing popular vote in one easy congressional vote....


Anyone who is a "swing voter" has already shown they are completely willing to turn a blind eye to racism.
 
2021-04-14 8:24:41 PM  

Meatsim1: Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

Devil's advocate, it was much easier to identify the victims of that policy than the victims of slavery and the victims or their direct descendants were still mostly alive when it was signed.

Today though, how can we reliably determine eligibility for slavery reparations when we can't reliably determine if someone's heritage includes slavery.

I think general welfare is a much more effective policy than reparations which will inevitably satisfy almost no one involved


How is reparations welfare?
 
2021-04-14 8:32:00 PM  
imho reparations is something that needs to happen, but will need to be directed at addressing the myriad of problems created by many generations of enslavement, oppression, and marginalization. My concern is that it would end up being something like some one time check that's a symbolic "we good now", then everything goes back to the racist norm with the racist feeling even more justified in being scumbags. Also the right answer won't be cheap, but it'll pay off a hell of a lot better than any war we've had in my lifetime.
 
2021-04-14 8:35:05 PM  

Meatsim1: Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

Devil's advocate, it was much easier to identify the victims of that policy than the victims of slavery and the victims or their direct descendants were still mostly alive when it was signed.

Today though, how can we reliably determine eligibility for slavery reparations when we can't reliably determine if someone's heritage includes slavery.

I think general welfare is a much more effective policy than reparations which will inevitably satisfy almost no one involved


I think we can safely pay reparations to all Black people in the US. All of them have suffered under America's racism in one way or another.
 
2021-04-14 8:35:56 PM  

BlazeTrailer: lolmao500: "I don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago, for whom none of us currently living are responsible, is a good idea," McConnell said then.

What about reparations for something that the a lot of the south is still proud of 150 years later?

You wave a confederate flag at a protest? You get a $5000 reparation fine. Your state has pro-confederate statues or portraits? You pay a billion in reparation.

If the stinking rednecks want to be proud of slavery they can pay for it.

Getting awful close to clamping down on freedom of expression there


Racism should not be protected speech.
 
2021-04-14 8:38:29 PM  
You ever thought about asking Black people how reparations would work? I'm betting they have some ideas that they've been working on.

Can we just stop pretending that no one can possibly have any idea how to do this? People are working on these problems, and they have been, for decades and generations. Whether it's reparations, or abolishing the police, or a universal basic income, or universal healthcare, there are people out there with good ideas on how to make them happen. Maybe we can listen to them instead of openly asking questions they've almost certainly already answered.
 
2021-04-14 8:41:25 PM  
I would almost settle for just stop shooting people, NOW. And properly fund schools in lower income neighborhoods. And the SBA, HUD, etc. Arguments on who qualifies for reparations will never be settled, and the status quo sucks. Fix the things that can have tangible and lasting results. Reducing poverty, improving education, and improving opportunities in the business world can do that. Small steps are a lot better than no steps.
 
2021-04-14 8:43:26 PM  

Al Tsheimers: I would almost settle for just stop shooting people, NOW. And properly fund schools in lower income neighborhoods. And the SBA, HUD, etc. Arguments on who qualifies for reparations will never be settled, and the status quo sucks. Fix the things that can have tangible and lasting results. Reducing poverty, improving education, and improving opportunities in the business world can do that. Small steps are a lot better than no steps.


We should do all of those things, and pay people reparations. There's no reason we can't do both! Other than racism, that is.
 
2021-04-14 8:43:41 PM  

I Browse: "I don't think reparations for something that happened 150 years ago, for whom none of us currently living are responsible, is a good idea," McConnell said then.


Fair enough. Then how about reparations for redlining, which happened within McConnell's lifetime? Would that be a good idea?

https://www.npr.org/2017/05/03/5266558​31/a-forgotten-history-of-how-the-u-s-​government-segregated-america


Yeah it's not just "something that happened 150 years ago" it's a pattern. Redlining, along with the Equal Credit Opportunity Act and Fair Housing Act, need to be taught about in schools. I never learned about those topics until I took some real estate classes a few years ago. I was never taught about the redlining that occurred in my hometown. It was shocking to learn that the ECOA and FHA were both passed in the 1970s, before I was born but still within the same decade.
 
2021-04-14 8:44:01 PM  
We could always enslave all the white people for 200 years and level the playing field. Destroy their heritage, their history, mutilate and oppress them and earn fortunes off of their labor.
 
2021-04-14 8:45:49 PM  

omnimancer28: Mikey1969: Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

Yeah, but did he sign them for the descendants over 150 years after the internment ended? It's not a "precedent" if it's a different situation. If there were still people alive, then it's not the same as reparations for people 4+ generations removed.

It is not just slavery.  The committee is also supposed to address systemic racism and racial inequality that has occurred more recently.  People are alive today who lived through segregation, Jim Crow laws, and redlining.  Hell, while we don't like to call it segregation, there is a reason why the poorest and worst run public schools in my district are 90% minority.


There should be a Venn diagram showing racial segregation, and financial segregation, and educational segregation, and I bet it has quite a bit of overlap.
 
2021-04-14 8:47:03 PM  
I don't think reparations could work as a logical policy but frankly the arguement that the harm done to black americans was isolated to the institution of slavery and ended with the civil war and everything since has been fair and equal is idiotic. I mean there are people alive that lived through the civil rights movements in the 60s and 70s... I'm not prepared to even say that we've got the point of equality at present time, still an awful lot of baked in institutional racism to stamp out... Hell I don't think we've even managed to reach a consensus in this country that racism is bad or that black americans are real citizens, seems like we still have a hell of a lot of our population that would disagree with those two concepts...
 
2021-04-14 8:54:53 PM  
It's a dumb idea that won't make any difference. Stop being so goddamn racist. That's the starting point. If you don't get past that, nothing else matters.
 
2021-04-14 8:58:48 PM  

cefm: It's a dumb idea that won't make any difference. Stop being so goddamn racist. That's the starting point. If you don't get past that, nothing else matters.


OK well that's not happening any time soon, so are you arguing we should do nothing else in the meantime?
 
2021-04-14 8:58:49 PM  

mistahtom: Why not free healthcare & college/university education for all descendants of slaves?


Great idea until a white descendent of slaves gets a single penny.
 
2021-04-14 9:00:46 PM  
There's one big problem with the whole idea of reparations: however it's implemented, once it happens every racist in the GOP is going to say racism is settled. Anytime afterwards that anyone brings up any problem related to race, they will be able to say, "shut up, you got paid."
 
2021-04-14 9:04:08 PM  

SiriusClown: We could always enslave all the white people for 200 years and level the playing field. Destroy their heritage, their history, mutilate and oppress them and earn fortunes off of their labor.


That seems a bit...harsh.

Believe it or not, most black people (me included) don't want revenge. I'd be cool with not being stereotyped, not being harassed and killed by police, not being harassed by random Karens, and unlimited drink refills. Let's start with that.
 
2021-04-14 9:06:04 PM  

omnimancer28: Mikey1969: Somacandra: [Fark user image image 610x315]

Reagan signed reparations for WWII internment camp survivors in 1988. There are precedents.

Yeah, but did he sign them for the descendants over 150 years after the internment ended? It's not a "precedent" if it's a different situation. If there were still people alive, then it's not the same as reparations for people 4+ generations removed.

It is not just slavery.  The committee is also supposed to address systemic racism and racial inequality that has occurred more recently.  People are alive today who lived through segregation, Jim Crow laws, and redlining.  Hell, while we don't like to call it segregation, there is a reason why the poorest and worst run public schools in my district are 90% minority.


Fixing the issues is what needs to be done, not handing out checks. I would love to see run down inner city areas and other minority neighborhoods get revitalized without gentrification taking over. That would definitely help.
 
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