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(The Hill)   Aaaaaaannnnnd...here comes the drought   (thehill.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Climate, Colorado, longer fire seasons, Precipitation, Recent years, Arizona, Drought, Seasons  
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4349 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Apr 2021 at 4:05 PM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-04-12 3:45:44 PM  
quotefancy.comView Full Size
 
2021-04-12 4:04:05 PM  
Fire Season will be fun this year....
 
2021-04-12 4:06:04 PM  
Residents, please do your part to conserve water so that massive agribusiness corporations can still blast their fields with water to grow and harvest precious, life-giving, obscenely water-hungry crops such as pistachios and almonds during this difficult time.
 
2021-04-12 4:06:42 PM  
oh my fark. if fires take out my gold operation this year after floods and covid did last year i will declare war on mother earth.
 
2021-04-12 4:08:02 PM  
The dead 🌵 out front should have been your first clue.
 
2021-04-12 4:08:24 PM  

SumoJeb: i will declare war on mother earth.


Sorry, humanity beat you to it.
 
2021-04-12 4:09:16 PM  

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....


What's left to burn after last year?
 
2021-04-12 4:10:17 PM  
Unfortunately, not surprised. Weeee
 
2021-04-12 4:10:45 PM  
Western drought follows La Nina.  We've been in La Nina conditions since the last half of last year, and we're going to continue at least until the start of summer.

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....


On the bright side, after two years of pretty good rain, we didn't have a lot this past winter so there won't be as much vegetation to burn in areas dominated by chaparral and brush
 
2021-04-12 4:11:12 PM  
HOPE YOU ALL ENJOYED THAT ALMOND MILK.
 
2021-04-12 4:14:42 PM  

ImOscar: HOPE YOU ALL ENJOYED THAT ALMOND MILK.


And that cotton we're growing IN THE MIDDLE OF GODDAMMED ARIZONA!!!!

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-12 4:16:04 PM  
There was a blizzard in Houston like 6 weeks ago.
 
2021-04-12 4:16:24 PM  

bhcompy: Western drought follows La Nina.  We've been in La Nina conditions since the last half of last year, and we're going to continue at least until the start of summer.

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....

On the bright side, after two years of pretty good rain, we didn't have a lot this past winter so there won't be as much vegetation to burn in areas dominated by chaparral and brush


Even good years haven't been good enough to keep us out of drought for much of the past 20 years.

Fark user imageView Full Size


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-12 4:17:07 PM  

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....


I started working wildfires in 2012 and Incident Management Teams in the southwest used to be available from May-August. We're now available from April-September and I worked into late October last year and I got called to assist with several other incidents through November that I had to turn down. It's not a season anymore.

/funnied you but it's not really funny
 
2021-04-12 4:17:43 PM  
We're slowly getting there...

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-04-12 4:18:03 PM  
I thought it meant a drought of sexual activity. Phew!
 
2021-04-12 4:18:26 PM  

hammettman: Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....

What's left to burn after last year?


The chapparel in California seems to be able to burn every 7 years
 
2021-04-12 4:19:32 PM  
On a more serious note, perhaps we can finally drain useless Lake Powell, and dump that water down into Lake Mead for better storage.
 
amb
2021-04-12 4:23:27 PM  
My family wants us to visit in Wyoming for the 4th this year. All the adults in the family will have been vaccinated by then. If it is a dry year, then probably will not have the normal crazy fireworks. If it a wet year for WY (really just not dried out by July), then the scenery will be glorious. If things stay green until July, it usually means a huge bloom of wildflowers.

Still haven't decided, but if all of the West is in drought, and fire season pretty bad, not a great year to visit if there a lot of smoke in the air. I have to decide in the next week or so. I was supposed to get shot 2 on Saturday, but the vaccine center had to close due to a plumbing leak in the building. Rescheduled for tomorrow.

Water is such a huge issue in the West. In the 70s/80s, they wanted to build a coal slurry pipeline from Wyoming. It got turned down in part because Wyoming wanted the water used for the slurry to be returned. The water in the slurry was just as valuable as the coal it would transport. People have killed over who has the rights to the water. You can own a lot of land for a ranch or farm, but if you didn't get rights to surface water, can't touch a river or creek running through the property.
 
2021-04-12 4:40:03 PM  
I am so tired of all this doom and gloom on climate change. I'd love to hear some good news for a change, or that there is some effort by those who can, to make a big difference.
 
2021-04-12 4:42:38 PM  
Just have Joe write a 2 Trillion dollar check for water and fill those reservoirs back up.
 
2021-04-12 4:51:14 PM  
Well it's cost we must bear so people living in a desert can have lawns and golf courses like Mother Nature intended.
 
2021-04-12 4:55:48 PM  

ifky: Well it's cost we must bear so people living in a desert can have lawns and golf courses like Mother Nature intended.


Yep. Outlaw golf courses and non-native species in yards.
Then start looking hard at where and how crops are grown.
 
2021-04-12 4:59:28 PM  
When does it stop being a drought and become the new normal?
 
2021-04-12 5:00:07 PM  

bhcompy: Western drought follows La Nina.  We've been in La Nina conditions since the last half of last year, and we're going to continue at least until the start of summer.

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....

On the bright side, after two years of pretty good rain, we didn't have a lot this past winter so there won't be as much vegetation to burn in areas dominated by chaparral and brush


Not really bright unless you're counting on the glow of the wildfire:
'This has never happened': California's only wildfire research center makes scary discovery (msn.com)
 
2021-04-12 5:02:48 PM  
Is that one fat out loudmouth guy going to help "rake" all of the forests in the drought zone?
 
2021-04-12 5:03:26 PM  

SpectroBoy: [quotefancy.com image 850x478]


Ukraine cutting off water to Crimea is just about to become hot.

Droughts in Arizona?  Color me shocked!
 
2021-04-12 5:06:25 PM  

Claude Ballse: ImOscar: HOPE YOU ALL ENJOYED THAT ALMOND MILK.

And that cotton we're growing IN THE MIDDLE OF GODDAMMED ARIZONA!!!!

[Fark user image image 850x445]


Yeah, at least nuts are a cash crop, and trees that represent some sunk cost. I've driven past the cotton bales in Arizona. Pure insanity.
 
2021-04-12 5:08:03 PM  

awruk!: We're slowly getting there...

[Fark user image image 226x346]


Eh that book was so-so. I found Cadillac desert, the book it called out so often, a lot more interesting, and a lot more fantastical. Which was surreal since it was the nonfiction book of the pair.

/it was part of my "becoming a westerner" education
 
2021-04-12 5:21:58 PM  
For Salem, OR a wet day is one with at least 0.04 inches of liquid and 45-40% of the days in April are wet.

We've had 2.02 mm (0.07 in) so far this month.
 
2021-04-12 5:31:59 PM  
If I water my lawn I'm an asshole.  If I go two weeks without showering I'm an asshole. I just can't make you people happy!
 
2021-04-12 5:33:04 PM  

TheGreatGazoo: Droughts in Arizona?  Color me shocked!


You know that drought is more than "it doesn't rain much", right?

It's a relative measure, based on deviation from historical averages.
 
2021-04-12 5:44:52 PM  
Remember this from our last drought?
"If it's yellow, let it mellow,
If it's brown, flush it down."


// Or heel it down.
 
2021-04-12 5:46:09 PM  

Mindlock: bhcompy: Western drought follows La Nina.  We've been in La Nina conditions since the last half of last year, and we're going to continue at least until the start of summer.

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....

On the bright side, after two years of pretty good rain, we didn't have a lot this past winter so there won't be as much vegetation to burn in areas dominated by chaparral and brush

Not really bright unless you're counting on the glow of the wildfire:
'This has never happened': California's only wildfire research center makes scary discovery (msn.com)


Also means there will be less growth to burn, which was my point.  Dry seasons following rainy reasons cause the worst conditions.  Now we're in a dry season following a dry winter.
 
2021-04-12 5:54:44 PM  
 
2021-04-12 6:29:17 PM  

Muzzleloader: ifky: Well it's cost we must bear so people living in a desert can have lawns and golf courses like Mother Nature intended.

Yep. Outlaw golf courses and non-native species in yards.
Then start looking hard at where and how crops are grown.


As much as I enjoy bagging on golf, I live in Cal and my city is sending treated waste (toilet) water back to golf courses and industrial areas. Water treatment plants get penalized if they release too much treated fresh water into the SF bay. Affects salinity. So they're motivated to get customers for that water. They also pay you to replace your lawn with less thirsty plants and they pay you to switch to low flow toilets.

If you live here long enough, you treat every year like a drought year. Conserving water is something you do every day. Because so many people conserve here, water companies have had to jack up their prices, which is also motivating.

We have among the most expensive utilities (water, power, natural gas, gasoline) in the world, but I can't imagine living anywhere else. I'd rather live like a pauper here than live like a king anywhere else.
 
2021-04-12 6:54:28 PM  

JesseL: bhcompy: Western drought follows La Nina.  We've been in La Nina conditions since the last half of last year, and we're going to continue at least until the start of summer.

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....

On the bright side, after two years of pretty good rain, we didn't have a lot this past winter so there won't be as much vegetation to burn in areas dominated by chaparral and brush

Even good years haven't been good enough to keep us out of drought for much of the past 20 years.

[Fark user image image 850x457]

[Fark user image image 850x457]


Our droughts are from over exploitation of the rivers and liberal pumping of groundwater.

As climate change worsens, those in power will and are seeking to get rid of rules to allow for more pumping not less.

We are experiencing aridification. Permanent desertification and it is self inflicted.
 
2021-04-12 6:55:18 PM  

Qellaqan: Claude Ballse: ImOscar: HOPE YOU ALL ENJOYED THAT ALMOND MILK.

And that cotton we're growing IN THE MIDDLE OF GODDAMMED ARIZONA!!!!

[Fark user image image 850x445]

Yeah, at least nuts are a cash crop, and trees that represent some sunk cost. I've driven past the cotton bales in Arizona. Pure insanity.


I think we should all wear less othes in order to take off the strain of cotton and wool production.
 
2021-04-12 7:00:14 PM  

Nadie_AZ: JesseL: bhcompy: Western drought follows La Nina.  We've been in La Nina conditions since the last half of last year, and we're going to continue at least until the start of summer.

Circusdog320: Fire Season will be fun this year....

On the bright side, after two years of pretty good rain, we didn't have a lot this past winter so there won't be as much vegetation to burn in areas dominated by chaparral and brush

Even good years haven't been good enough to keep us out of drought for much of the past 20 years.

[Fark user image image 850x457]

[Fark user image image 850x457]

Our droughts are from over exploitation of the rivers and liberal pumping of groundwater.

As climate change worsens, those in power will and are seeking to get rid of rules to allow for more pumping not less.

We are experiencing aridification. Permanent desertification and it is self inflicted.


Droughts are literally defined by having less precipitation than usual.

We're over-pumping groundwater and over-exploiting all the rivers too, but that's not causing the drought.

The forests in northern Arizona aren't tinderboxes due to the fact that the Salt River is watering cotton and flood irrigated lawn in central Phoenix.
 
2021-04-12 7:01:26 PM  

Vtimlin: Just have Joe write a 2 Trillion dollar check for water and fill those reservoirs back up.


Trolls should at least be interesting.
 
2021-04-12 7:07:25 PM  

Claude Ballse: ImOscar: HOPE YOU ALL ENJOYED THAT ALMOND MILK.

And that cotton we're growing IN THE MIDDLE OF GODDAMMED ARIZONA!!!!

[Fark user image 850x445]


Cotton is only the second most water intensive crop widely grown in Arizona.  Alfalfa is the worst.

What is maddening is that much of Arizona has almost no groundwater pumping regulations.  If it is under your property and you can dig a well deep enough to pump it, it is yours.  Most of the state lacks reporting requirements, so nobody really knows how many acre-feet of water industrial farms are pumping annually.  Some groups and state agencies have asked the legislature for mandatory reporting of groundwater pumping volumes, but the legislature keeps shooting it down.

Not only do you have the usual sort of anti-government types, but these huge vulture agriculture companies throwing tons of money around.  Paying a few legislators off to keep state regulators powerless is money well spent.  And in a few decades when the aquifers go dry, the real fun will start.
 
2021-04-12 7:20:30 PM  

Dodo David: Then there is this from ABC News:
"One of the worst droughts in memory in a massive agricultural region straddling the California-Oregon border could mean steep cuts to irrigation water for hundreds of farmers this summer to sustain endangered fish species critical to local tribes."


This bears repeating.  The tribes have become more aggressive in recent years exercising treaty rights regarding fishery health and management.  So if push comes to shove, the tribes are going to lean on the EPA, who in turn are going to lean on water districts, to ensure that there is enough water in the rivers to keep water temperatures within a tolerable range for endangered fish.
 
2021-04-12 7:36:48 PM  
Can't we just order more from Nestle?
 
2021-04-12 8:34:07 PM  
Whatever we do, we shouldn't build water desalination plants and pipelines to carry the water where needed.
There's no oil in it.
 
2021-04-12 8:36:54 PM  
Nor should we build large underground cisterns to collect and store runoff water from when it rains.

No oil there either.
 
2021-04-12 8:51:38 PM  

Trik: Whatever we do, we shouldn't build water desalination plants and pipelines to carry the water where needed.
There's no oil in it.


Going inland from the coast tends to be uphill. Water is heavy, and it is very expensive to pump it uphill in the kind of volumes that would be needed. The desalination plants are also very energy intensive, so unless we want to build a whole bunch of new nuclear power plants, that just doesn't work.
 
2021-04-12 8:56:07 PM  

JesseL: Droughts are literally defined by having less precipitation than usual.

We're over-pumping groundwater and over-exploiting all the rivers too, but that's not causing the drought.

The forests in northern Arizona aren't tinderboxes due to the fact that the Salt River is watering cotton and flood irrigated lawn in central Phoenix.


The forests are tinderboxes due to the long running drought, yes, as well as the beetle infestation that is killing them as well- and the 2 are related.

As the climate warms, the soil warms and refuses to hold as much snow or water. This has been happening at the headwaters of the Colorado River, which is 40% of Arizona water. I don't have numbers on the headwaters of the Salt, but I can't imagine they won't be too far behind.

Groundwater in a lot of places is replenished by runoff that settles into the ground. Water law in the West counts groundwater and running water as separate, though they are scientifically proven to be related. The whole system is related and our current situation is the full clusterf*ck of exploitation that is also causing the precipitation that falls to not remain in the ground or run off into streams and rivers.
 
2021-04-12 9:43:24 PM  

revrendjim: Trik: Whatever we do, we shouldn't build water desalination plants and pipelines to carry the water where needed.
There's no oil in it.

Going inland from the coast tends to be uphill. Water is heavy, and it is very expensive to pump it uphill in the kind of volumes that would be needed. The desalination plants are also very energy intensive, so unless we want to build a whole bunch of new nuclear power plants, that just doesn't work.


If only there was some way to make a passage underground to carry water.
Plants don't have to run at 100 percent 100 percent of the time.
Wind and solar for the desalination plants.
Move the water gradually to cisterns.

But we should start building for tomorrow today instead of the day after tomorrow and be trying to play catch up into next week.
 
2021-04-12 11:30:08 PM  

Trik: Wind and solar for the desalination plants.
Move the water gradually to cisterns.


As a concept, it's fine, until you look at the actual amount of water you would need to desalinate ad move. Then it falls apart.
 
2021-04-12 11:31:54 PM  
So over the last 20 years the worst two were... How about going back 5000 years and licking the worst two.

It's almost like the earth isn't a static place.
 
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