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(NBC News)   Skipper of the Ghost Ship gets nine years in the brig   (nbcnews.com) divider line
    More: News, San Francisco, Manslaughter, San Francisco Bay Area, Guilt, Lawyer, San Francisco Bay, Derick Almena, Judge  
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5035 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Mar 2021 at 5:30 AM (5 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-03-09 5:33:14 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size


/Inconsolable
 
2021-03-09 5:39:19 AM  
I am the captain of the Ghost Ship... it's a very decent pint.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-09 5:46:00 AM  
man, he reminds me of someone...
ca-times.brightspotcdn.comView Full Size

encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.comView Full Size

something about the eyes...
 
2021-03-09 5:49:49 AM  

Trik: man, he reminds me of someone...
[ca-times.brightspotcdn.com image 840x407]
[encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com image 389x129]
something about the eyes...


I was thinking maybe Dr. Strange had methed-up a cousin from Florida.
 
2021-03-09 5:51:04 AM  

Tom Marvolo Bombadil: Trik: man, he reminds me of someone...
[ca-times.brightspotcdn.com image 840x407]
[encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com image 389x129]
something about the eyes...

I was thinking maybe Dr. Strange had methed-up a cousin from Florida.


have to see the teef to make that comparison...
 
2021-03-09 5:55:23 AM  
Alameda District Attorney Nancy O'Malley's office said in a statement that Derick Almena, the master tenant of the Ghost Ship warehouse in Oakland, California, can serve the remainder of his prison term at home with a GPS monitor.

Fark denizens:

i.imgur.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-09 6:06:28 AM  
How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.
 
2021-03-09 6:12:33 AM  
Jesus. My cousin was convicted of a single murder (DNA now shows he didn't do it) and he got 60 years.
 
2021-03-09 6:19:03 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.


I recall more than one article claiming places like the Ghost Ship were actually a good thing because openly flouting any and all building and fire codes made housing cheaper.

I'm all for more affordable housing, but safety standards are written in blood
 
2021-03-09 6:20:38 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me


what?
 
2021-03-09 6:43:40 AM  
Picture of when he was caught

s3.amazonaws.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-09 6:48:37 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.


That's right. This guy should be in jail just like the government employees that managed the levees in New Orleans.
 
2021-03-09 6:54:47 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.


The leopard is kept in a disused lavatory, and unless you're trying to access the bottom of a locked filing cabinet, I don't see how it's a problem.  Plus, there is a sign.
 
2021-03-09 6:57:23 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.


You need empathy to see something wrong with trageties like this.
 
2021-03-09 6:57:55 AM  
can serve the remainder of his prison term at home with a GPS monitor.

That doesn't seem like the brig.
Plus 3 years supervised release? What does some guy follow him around and make sure he doesn't buy anymore warehouses?
 
2021-03-09 7:03:11 AM  
He should have got a lot more time for the deaths of all these people.
Ghost Ship - MY LITTLE BOX
Youtube XsGuGyNNCzU
 
2021-03-09 7:04:19 AM  

SirDigbyChickenCaesar: Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me

what?


FTFM. I need more coffee and to not bother with rewording my posts so much (was going to say 'be aware' then changed it).
 
2021-03-09 7:22:46 AM  

MythDragon: Plus 3 years supervised release? What does some guy follow him around and make sure he doesn't buy anymore warehouses?


They set all kinds of rules (no alcohol, no drugs, curfew, etc.) for the purpose of continually farking with people so they can yo-yo them back into jail for violations. Then, the supervision is extended to keep doing it.

Look at Meek Mill for a good example of how someone is kept on probation/parole for over a decade to keep farking with them.
 
2021-03-09 7:32:31 AM  

reprobate1125: Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.

That's right. This guy should be in jail just like the government employees that managed the levees in New Orleans.


You mean the United States Army Corps of Engineers?
 
2021-03-09 7:38:17 AM  

holdmybones: reprobate1125: Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.

That's right. This guy should be in jail just like the government employees that managed the levees in New Orleans.

You mean the United States Army Corps of Engineers?


Responsibility of maintenance belongs to the local levee boards. Billions of dollars disappeared into Democrat control and the levees failed because ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
2021-03-09 7:41:18 AM  

mrmopar5287: holdmybones: reprobate1125: Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.

That's right. This guy should be in jail just like the government employees that managed the levees in New Orleans.

You mean the United States Army Corps of Engineers?

Responsibility of maintenance belongs to the local levee boards. Billions of dollars disappeared into Democrat control and the levees failed because ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


You literally copied and pasted that from Wikipedia.

At least you learned something today.
 
2021-03-09 7:50:26 AM  

mrmopar5287: Jesus. My cousin was convicted of a single murder (DNA now shows he didn't do it) and he got 60 years.


One single murder? Of course he got time. One is 'murder', a few dozen is a 'tragedy', when you scale up into the hundreds of thousands, it eventually just becomes 'good politics'
Gonna murder people, you really need to commit to it.
 
2021-03-09 7:51:22 AM  

holdmybones: mrmopar5287: holdmybones: reprobate1125: Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.

That's right. This guy should be in jail just like the government employees that managed the levees in New Orleans.

You mean the United States Army Corps of Engineers?

Responsibility of maintenance belongs to the local levee boards. Billions of dollars disappeared into Democrat control and the levees failed because ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

You literally copied and pasted that from Wikipedia.

At least you learned something today.


It was known since Katrina. This was the issue 16 years ago: "We gave you [insert obscene amount of money] for maintenance of levees. Where did that money go?"
 
2021-03-09 7:55:38 AM  
Article is a bit confusing. They say that he rented the space, then subletted it, before saying he didn't have a sprinkler system in place. While the dude does deserve to be held accountable for not providing clear access to a fire exit, wouldn't the burden of responsibility fall on the actual owner of the building for not having a fire suppression system in place?
Truthfully it's a horrible event no matter who was culpable. It's sad so many perished in a truly horrifying manner.
 
2021-03-09 8:00:53 AM  

Farkin Charlie: wouldn't the burden of responsibility fall on the actual owner of the building for not having a fire suppression system in place?


I don't think the building owner knew people were living there, or that there were events being held there.

No fire suppression system is required if the building isn't being used for housing. It was illegal housing, though.
 
2021-03-09 8:01:29 AM  
Why is the tenant liable instead of the building owner?...unless he's the one who tampered with the safety equipment.
 
2021-03-09 8:05:51 AM  

Gooch: Why is the tenant liable instead of the building owner?...unless he's the one who tampered with the safety equipment.


Owner leased the building to one tenant for use that did not include anyone living there because it was not zoned for or suitable for living.

Tenant illegally lived there with his family and illegally sublet space for others to live there. Tenant also illegally allowed some party for a record label and those in attendance died in the fire.
 
2021-03-09 8:06:03 AM  

Gooch: Why is the tenant liable instead of the building owner?...unless he's the one who tampered with the safety equipment.


He sublet the space in violation of lease terms. It was leased as a warehouse not a living or entertainment venue. Fire codes are different for a warehouse.
 
2021-03-09 8:10:17 AM  

Gooch: safety equipment


Also: What safety equipment?!
 
2021-03-09 8:25:57 AM  
Authorities said Derick Almena can serve the remainder of the sentence at home with a GPS monitor.


So his "punishment" is to live like the rest of us during the pandemic?!?!?!? For murder?!?!?
 
2021-03-09 8:30:17 AM  
After reading this thread: "He's woke. He can't be held accountable".
 
2021-03-09 8:40:44 AM  

Trik: After reading this thread: "He's woke. He can't be held accountable".


He was touching his face.
 
2021-03-09 8:41:25 AM  
"People like Derek take a warehouse and get people out of the gutter and put a roof over their head and don't have the money to furnish it according to the laws of Oakland," the lawyer, Brian Getz, said. "And that's why this happened."

I guess unblocked fire exits and proper storage of flammable items is privilege???

At some point people need to realize that their guilt is being used as a weapon against them. 9 years for the death of 36 farking people. California's justice system is dead... it's the wrist slappers union now.
 
2021-03-09 8:42:11 AM  

SpectroBoy: So his "punishment" is to live like the rest of us during the pandemic?!?!?!? For murder?!?!?


Yeah, my governor was commuting life sentences to get people out of prison during this pandemic.
 
2021-03-09 8:46:04 AM  

holdmybones: Trik: After reading this thread: "He's woke. He can't be held accountable".

He was touching his face.


I love that song.
 
2021-03-09 8:52:52 AM  
tvinsider.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-09 9:02:02 AM  

mrmopar5287: Jesus. My cousin was convicted of a single murder (DNA now shows he didn't do it) and he got 60 years.


best of luck to your cousin getting their conviction overturned. I live in hope that one day every law student will have to donate time to Project Innocence.
 
2021-03-09 9:08:08 AM  

tuxq: "People like Derek take a warehouse and get people out of the gutter and put a roof over their head and don't have the money to furnish it according to the laws of Oakland," the lawyer, Brian Getz, said. "And that's why this happened."


Or as we used to call that, "A Slumlord"
 
2021-03-09 9:09:35 AM  

Farkin Charlie: Article is a bit confusing. They say that he rented the space, then subletted it, before saying he didn't have a sprinkler system in place. While the dude does deserve to be held accountable for not providing clear access to a fire exit, wouldn't the burden of responsibility fall on the actual owner of the building for not having a fire suppression system in place?
Truthfully it's a horrible event no matter who was culpable. It's sad so many perished in a truly horrifying manner.


There are different fire protection rules that are triggered by types of occupancy. Capacity is something like 500 sf per person for warehouses but drops down to somewhere around 50 sf per person for shops or vocational space.  That means a warehouse is supposed to have very few people, and a fire sprinkler system probably wasn't required.  When you change the occupancy type (add more people) the safety is upgraded appropriately, which obviously did not happen in this case.
 
2021-03-09 9:11:36 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.


Government overregulation!  Personal responsibility when it's some other asshole!  Lock them up but I just made a mistake jeez!

/don't happen to them or people they give a fark about?
//then it don't happen - or alternatively it only happens to the stupid/<slurs>/incompetent/evil/whatev​erthefark
///it's the party for people that never grew the fark up yet like to use a smokescreen to pretend they did
////republican party is for people that never grew up, don't farking care, and fark you woooooo Lord of the Flies biatches!
 
2021-03-09 9:14:40 AM  

sinko swimo: best of luck to your cousin getting their conviction overturned


It was overturned, but the overturning was overturned on appeal. Now it has to go to the state supreme court, and that's probably going to take a few more years.

He's up for parole in May (will have served 50% of his sentence and that's eligible for parole because he was sentenced prior to 1995), but they will never parole him. You have to admit guilt for parole. They absolutely refuse to parole innocent people.
 
2021-03-09 9:22:35 AM  

Dryad: tuxq: "People like Derek take a warehouse and get people out of the gutter and put a roof over their head and don't have the money to furnish it according to the laws of Oakland," the lawyer, Brian Getz, said. "And that's why this happened."

Or as we used to call that, "A Slumlord"


To be a slumlord you actually have to own or control property that is zoned for living and let it deteriorate. This wasn't even that, so probably doesn't count.
 
2021-03-09 10:18:55 AM  

Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.


A libertarian will claim the guests knew it was an illegal party at a warehouse that had illegal living spaces.  A reasonable person that stepped one foot in the building would have turned around and left.  A reasonable person would also know that leopards eat faces and would act accordingly
 
2021-03-09 10:31:35 AM  
This particular fire is the one that really shook me into reading about fires at small shows and musical venues. It led me down a rabbit hole that has resulted in my hyper awareness of exits in public spaces. It's horrifying what happens when a fire breaks out and people panic.
 
2021-03-09 10:52:20 AM  

Smoking GNU: Befuddled: How libertarians can be learn of preventable tragedies like this and remain libertarians is beyond me. I guess for many until the leopard eats their face, they don't see any problem with the Leopards Eating Faces Party.

You need empathy to see something wrong with trageties like this.


Not all Republicans are bible toting gun nuts.  Not all Democrats want socialized health care.  The notion that all Libertarians are the same is preposterous.  Some Libertarians simply think the answer to some of our country's problems is fewer well-written laws, not more laws stacked on top of more laws.
 
2021-03-09 10:53:20 AM  

jakewastaken: This particular fire is the one that really shook me into reading about fires at small shows and musical venues. It led me down a rabbit hole that has resulted in my hyper awareness of exits in public spaces. It's horrifying what happens when a fire breaks out and people panic.


Great White show in Rhode Island freaked me the fark out.
 
2021-03-09 10:54:24 AM  
Fire kills 36 people and he only gets 9 years?    3 months per victim?
 
2021-03-09 11:20:05 AM  

mrmopar5287: Jesus. My cousin was convicted of a single murder (DNA now shows he didn't do it) and he got 60 years.


Murder =/= manslaughter.

Larry Mahoney killed 26 in a DUI (on the wrong side of a highway, head-on into a bus full of kids), served 11 years, and is out.  No intent to kill, so no murder charges.
 
2021-03-09 12:02:59 PM  

Farkin Charlie: Article is a bit confusing. They say that he rented the space, then subletted it, before saying he didn't have a sprinkler system in place. While the dude does deserve to be held accountable for not providing clear access to a fire exit, wouldn't the burden of responsibility fall on the actual owner of the building for not having a fire suppression system in place?
Truthfully it's a horrible event no matter who was culpable. It's sad so many perished in a truly horrifying manner.



No, the owner rented the building out for purse A (not for living in but as a work only space), which did not require as many marked fire exist or a sprinkler system.
They then acted as a "master lease holder" and sub leased out partitioned off spaces in the ware house.
However instead of work only spaces they rented out actual living space to people, as well they hosted "events."


All three of those uses
work space
living space
event space
fall under very different rules/restrictions for their use, based on how big the space is and how many people are expected to be in it under normal use conditions.

Had they kept to the work only space for sub leasing, and adhered to the rules about how many people at once for how ling under what conditions. Then they might have done no wrong even if a fire had happened and people had died.

but once they stared renting out living space and hosting events, they were out of line in their position as "master lease holder" that's not on the building owner.


Also FYI, most of laws about land/property ownership only saddle the owner with any significant responsibility/liability burdens, if they are not leasing it out.
But a lease, on a commercial property is going to be the TrippleNet Lease, in which the land owner gets paid rent, but transfers all costs, liability and responsibility for the property to the renter.

So in most places in the US we're totally backing the slum lords by allowing them to own and reap the benefits while having absolutely no responsibility or even ownership costs of any kind, once they can claim ownership and get someone else into a lease on it.


I highly suspect the tripplenet lease is directly responsible for the failure of many a small business, by placing too much cost burden on the renter, as the lease will include for all retail spaces that the rent is X flat amount OR X% of the business take, whichever is higher.
AND the lease also stipulates that the business is expected to have a minimum consistent increase in business year over year attached to the rent increases. So that the property owner is not increasing the X% of the take taken in rent, but that taking X% of that take is expected to result in more money because the lease required your business to either increase their take year over year OR keep paying the increasing flat rate rent, which is itself calculated as a % of the X% of the take.


So basiaclly if your business is doping just fine and can sustain jobs and putting some money the land owners pocket is not good enough.
And in the end this is the land owner basiaclly telling all the rest of us, that if we do not go out and eat X% more year over year at that local restaurant, they are just threatening all of us, that they will put them out of the lase for not making as much monye as the land owner demanded for doing noting useful for anyone but waving a piece of paper at us that makes claims about owning the land and that the govt thugs will come put in the big house if you don;t act like you owe them something for doing nothing.
 
2021-03-09 1:09:49 PM  

tuxq: "People like Derek take a warehouse and get people out of the gutter and put a roof over their head and don't have the money to furnish it according to the laws of Oakland," the lawyer, Brian Getz, said. "And that's why this happened."

I guess unblocked fire exits and proper storage of flammable items is privilege???

At some point people need to realize that their guilt is being used as a weapon against them. 9 years for the death of 36 farking people. California's justice system is dead... it's the wrist slappers union now.


You should take a look at how sentencing works in your own state; I bet it's practically the same thing. Concurrent sentencing is the norm across the country for most crimes involving a single event, no matter how much harm it did.

The prosecutors already lost one case against him and his buddy -- the mistrial is practically a loss -- and in the run-up to a second trial they decided the odds were still shaky enough that it was worth cutting their losses and making sure he had some additional punishment and permanent felony conviction status. They didn't want a second acquittal. Remember, this is a plea deal, not a full trial conviction by a jury, so none of the other comparisons in this thread are even comparable.
 
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