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(NBC Philadelphia)   4 Men were arrested for trying to sell their unlicensed, back mounted, nuclear accelerators after their small business in NYC fails   (nbcphiladelphia.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Firearm, ghost guns, Police, Crime, Handgun, Gun, gun violence epidemic, Pennsylvania Office of Attorney General  
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4700 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Mar 2021 at 10:05 AM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-03-08 9:28:10 AM  
Ghost guns? So there is a such thing as Ghostbusters.
 
2021-03-08 9:52:03 AM  
Back off man, I'm a scientist.
 
2021-03-08 10:07:01 AM  
Backs up against the elevator wall...


/I love that little gesture that makes that even better..
 
2021-03-08 10:08:13 AM  
In B4 "No point having laws that can't be 100% completely enforced!"
 
2021-03-08 10:09:09 AM  
The only way to stop bad ghosts with guns are good ghosts with guns.
 
2021-03-08 10:12:02 AM  

plecos: Back off man, I'm a scientist.


Fark user imageView Full Size



wait what?
 
2021-03-08 10:13:07 AM  
Ghost guns normally start as "80% receivers" that are often sold in kits without background checks. They can be easily and quickly assembled, can't be traced due to a lack of serial numbers and once put together, can operate as fully functioning firearms.

Hah, no they cannot. An 80% receiver requires quite a bit of machine work to function properly. It's not like snapping together LEGOs.
 
2021-03-08 10:13:14 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size

"The ghost..."
 
2021-03-08 10:16:25 AM  
Allowing the sale of all the parts to assemble a functioning firearm without the same laws that apply to selling a functional firearm is pure insanity, and it's well beyond disingenuous to claim that it's impossible to draft an effective law to address this issue. The reality is that too many people simply don't want to.
 
2021-03-08 10:18:15 AM  
It's a start.  Now what about the guy that sold the stuff to them?  What about whoever was running the gun show ?
 
2021-03-08 10:22:05 AM  

jso2897: In B4 "No point having laws that can't be 100% completely enforced!"


In 2017, 112,000 people gave false information on gun applications. 12,700 were investigated.

12 were prosecuted.

When a major felony (10 years in jail and a $250,000 fine) that's in writing has a 1 in 9333 chance of being prosecuted, why bother passing more laws?

Yes, you can make a "ghost gun". If you are a felon, you still can't possess it. You can't sell them. Unless you have access to a machine shop, you can't finish it, and 80% of a gun is scrap metal.
 
2021-03-08 10:22:36 AM  
The whole 80/20 rule is a bit of a strange loophole, frankly. Let's be honest - they're not going to be used for a shop project in High School...
 
2021-03-08 10:24:01 AM  
"I ain't afraid of no ghost." - shoots wildly in all directions
 
2021-03-08 10:29:07 AM  
Oh no this again. Felons can't own/sell/make firearms and non felons can't make guns for sale without an FFL, so they already broke many federal laws. There is no need to make more. But lets keep arguing this non issue.
They have banned the 80% lowers in a lot of places already. I doubt it does much. Are they going to ban metal working tools? CNC? Presses? 3D printers? You've been able to build a gun at home since before this was a country. I have a few home built firearms (not AR's or glock clones if that matters) as I'm legally allowed to (I did serialize them as I'd like to have someone sell them when I'm dead). There is a guy who is internet famous for building an AK out of a shovel. People in the Philippines knock 1911's out in the jungle. Good luck getting that cat back in the bag.

"Davis was part of a criminal enterprise that made and sold unserialized ghost guns in Philadelphia, making $500 on each sale."

$500 profit or selling them for $500? They need to be more clear as to if this guy is a moran. $500 in the current market is losing money so I guess that doesn't make sense. Damn you shiatty journalism.
 
2021-03-08 10:30:51 AM  
Guns are a problem, who would have thought?
 
2021-03-08 10:32:23 AM  

johnny_vegas: Now what about the guy that sold the stuff to them? What about whoever was running the gun show ?


They didn't sell them a firearm, what are they going to assume because they are black they are up to something and call the cops? That's how you turn into an internet mess.
 
2021-03-08 10:32:24 AM  

justanotherfarkinfarker: Oh no this again. Felons can't own/sell/make firearms and non felons can't make guns for sale without an FFL, so they already broke many federal laws. There is no need to make more. But lets keep arguing this non issue.
They have banned the 80% lowers in a lot of places already. I doubt it does much. Are they going to ban metal working tools? CNC? Presses? 3D printers? You've been able to build a gun at home since before this was a country. I have a few home built firearms (not AR's or glock clones if that matters) as I'm legally allowed to (I did serialize them as I'd like to have someone sell them when I'm dead). There is a guy who is internet famous for building an AK out of a shovel. People in the Philippines knock 1911's out in the jungle. Good luck getting that cat back in the bag.

"Davis was part of a criminal enterprise that made and sold unserialized ghost guns in Philadelphia, making $500 on each sale."

$500 profit or selling them for $500? They need to be more clear as to if this guy is a moran. $500 in the current market is losing money so I guess that doesn't make sense. Damn you shiatty journalism.


You're just pissed that you only make $100 on each sale.
 
2021-03-08 10:33:39 AM  

Advernaut: You're just pissed that you only make $100 on each sale.


You wouldn't even make that. You'd probably lose $50-100
 
2021-03-08 10:34:59 AM  

SuburbanCowboy: The only way to stop bad ghosts with guns are good ghosts with guns.


64.media.tumblr.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 10:37:05 AM  

justanotherfarkinfarker: Oh no this again. Felons can't own/sell/make firearms and non felons can't make guns for sale without an FFL, so they already broke many federal laws. There is no need to make more. But lets keep arguing this non issue.
They have banned the 80% lowers in a lot of places already. I doubt it does much. Are they going to ban metal working tools? CNC? Presses? 3D printers? You've been able to build a gun at home since before this was a country. I have a few home built firearms (not AR's or glock clones if that matters) as I'm legally allowed to (I did serialize them as I'd like to have someone sell them when I'm dead). There is a guy who is internet famous for building an AK out of a shovel. People in the Philippines knock 1911's out in the jungle. Good luck getting that cat back in the bag.

"Davis was part of a criminal enterprise that made and sold unserialized ghost guns in Philadelphia, making $500 on each sale."

$500 profit or selling them for $500? They need to be more clear as to if this guy is a moran. $500 in the current market is losing money so I guess that doesn't make sense. Damn you shiatty journalism.


You're assuming they used anymore than the lowest quality parts. I'd expect they used blemish and other "rejected" parts they bought cheap. They'll still work, but you can buy them for a lot less than parts that aren't flawed. I'll also wager they're using lower quality parts overall, I mean which of their customers is going to complain to the government about it not being up to snuff? As long as it works, accuracy (and other items) are probably not high on the list for most criminals unlike competitive shooters. They're not going to care if it has a sloppy trigger or a shiat barrel that won't make it past a couple thousand rounds.
 
2021-03-08 10:37:31 AM  
media.tenor.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 10:41:32 AM  

justanotherfarkinfarker: johnny_vegas: Now what about the guy that sold the stuff to them? What about whoever was running the gun show ?

They didn't sell them a firearm, what are they going to assume because they are black they are up to something and call the cops? That's how you turn into an internet mess.


Yes selling them an 80% receiver was not selling them a gun.  Sure Jan.  Maybe that's the loophole that needs to get fixed, then.
/bonus points for making it racist even though both black and white men were involved
 
2021-03-08 10:45:36 AM  

justanotherfarkinfarker: Oh no this again. Felons can't own/sell/make firearms and non felons can't make guns for sale without an FFL, so they already broke many federal laws. There is no need to make more. But lets keep arguing this non issue.
They have banned the 80% lowers in a lot of places already. I doubt it does much. Are they going to ban metal working tools? CNC? Presses? 3D printers? You've been able to build a gun at home since before this was a country. I have a few home built firearms (not AR's or glock clones if that matters) as I'm legally allowed to (I did serialize them as I'd like to have someone sell them when I'm dead). There is a guy who is internet famous for building an AK out of a shovel. People in the Philippines knock 1911's out in the jungle. Good luck getting that cat back in the bag.

"Davis was part of a criminal enterprise that made and sold unserialized ghost guns in Philadelphia, making $500 on each sale."

$500 profit or selling them for $500? They need to be more clear as to if this guy is a moran. $500 in the current market is losing money so I guess that doesn't make sense. Damn you shiatty journalism.


Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL, then why would it be unreasonable to prohibit the sale of 80% lowers (or hell 50 o 60%) or other gun parts to anyone who doesn't have an FFL?
 
2021-03-08 10:48:02 AM  

Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL


You can legally make a gun without a FFL.
 
2021-03-08 10:48:44 AM  

The Dog Ate My Homework: Allowing the sale of all the parts to assemble a functioning firearm


This doesn't happen. There is physical machine work that must happen for an 80% lower to be made into a functioning firearm.
 
2021-03-08 10:51:03 AM  

kbronsito: SuburbanCowboy: The only way to stop bad ghosts with guns are good ghosts with guns.

[64.media.tumblr.com image 350x178]


I love that movie

media.tenor.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 10:52:26 AM  

Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,


No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.
 
2021-03-08 10:54:04 AM  
media.giphy.comView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 10:56:01 AM  
Sounds like viral marketing to me.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 11:05:58 AM  
Must have been a big cockroach.
 
2021-03-08 11:15:41 AM  
I find it hard to believe that "Ghost Guns" are fueling the violence.  I would challenge them to tell me how many guns out of the ones the confiscate from the streets are ghost guns.  I would be shocked if it was even 1%.   There a much cheaper and easier ways to get a gun and you can always just file off the serial number from an existing gun so a "Ghost Gun" doesn't buy you much.
 
2021-03-08 11:15:44 AM  
Time to update the handy Gun Infographic For Journalists!

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 11:17:39 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size

could have gone Old school.
 
2021-03-08 11:26:04 AM  

dothemath: [Fark user image 130x186]
"The ghost..."


Hey Oooooo'all!
 
2021-03-08 11:31:06 AM  

SFSailor: Time to update the handy Gun Infographic For Journalists!

[Fark user image 850x427]


That was way funnier than it should have been, nice work
 
2021-03-08 11:32:47 AM  
Actually this seems like proof that background checks work.  Convict knew he would get busted if he bought through a dealer so he went this route.  Now extend them to personal transfers and assess personal liability if your "stolen" gun is recovered in the possession of a criminal and we will all be a lot better off.
 
2021-03-08 11:41:07 AM  

jso2897: In B4 "No point having laws that can't be 100% completely enforced!"


We have laws. Trafficking guns is illegal, regardless of type or who made them. They were arrested. They will go to prison.
You have a problem with that? You really seem to have a problem with that.
 
2021-03-08 11:41:35 AM  

justanotherfarkinfarker: Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,

No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.


I'm reasonable certain putting a piece of gas Pipe on the end of you "rifle" would, in fact make it what we call " a musket" and a a dangerous one at that, as machining to groves in a barrel to make it a rifle is a very exacting and involved process.

My dad actually owns a percussion cap muzzle-loader that growing up I assumed was from the early 1800's because ...muzzle loader, ramrod, the whole 9.

Turns out it was actually made in the 20's or 30's as a trade item for my grandpa's employer for trading with the Native tribes along the Orinoco.  (government didn't want them having any guns they could actually use to defend themselves, but were okay with ones for hunting) .  It's barrel was also a length of gas pipe, which is precisely why neith dad nor grandad ever fired the thing; both o f them being smart engineering-minded men who disliked taking potentially fatal gambles
 
2021-03-08 11:43:29 AM  

The Dog Ate My Homework: Allowing the sale of all the parts to assemble a functioning firearm without the same laws that apply to selling a functional firearm is pure insanity, and it's well beyond disingenuous to claim that it's impossible to draft an effective law to address this issue. The reality is that too many people simply don't want to.


The problem is that federal law specifically defines what is and is not considered a 'firearm'.  You would need to amend the legislation in order to change the definition. Without that, the regulations and laws relating to firearms don't apply.

Fun fact, there's a former ATF agent who testifies at trials that even the current legal definition of what constitutes a 'firearm' doesn't apply to most modern guns:

Ex-ATF agent takes aim at former agency over AR-15s - CNN

With that being said, the issue is not parts that can be used to assemble firearms themselves.  The "problem" is the ease of producing a functioning receiver (the serial numbered portion of the firearm, and the key component(s) needed to actually make a firearm) on which these things can be built.

The rise of 3D Printers, cheap CNC machines, and the simplified design of guns like the Glock (intended to make them extremely easy to mass produce) all ultimately mean that anyone of moderate intelligence and an internet connection can produce a functioning firearm quickly, and without the issues you would have had in the past in having to put in a lot of work to create the receiver from scratch.

This runs into yet another issue, which is that the very same laws that protect things like Home Brewing also product producing homemade firearms: if made for personal use and not for any sort of commercial sale, there's no registration, tracking, or regulation that applies.

The law itself steps in by making it a federal felony if you sell the firearm, because that qualifies you as an unlicensed manufacturer.

A "simple" solution would be establishing a law requiring that any firearm receiver made for any purposes has to have a serial number registered with the ATF, thus making it subject to the federal regulations regarding transfer of said firearms to another party. Good luck passing that though.
 
2021-03-08 11:47:11 AM  

justanotherfarkinfarker: Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,

No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.


This is correct.

It is 100% legal to make a firearm for non-commercial, personal use. Selling said firearm without a serial number and the appropriate paperwork (and the specific FFL required for manufacturing) is a felony.

No different than how home brewing works.
 
2021-03-08 11:50:20 AM  

jso2897: In B4 "No point having laws that can't be 100% completely enforced!"


Uhm, I would argue that this is an excellent example of the current laws being enforced. The person committed at least two crimes that I can think of:

1. Manufacturing firearms with intent to sell without an FFL for manufacturing
2. Intent to sell firearms to disallowed persons.

So, laws working as intended.
 
2021-03-08 11:51:25 AM  

The Dog Ate My Homework: Allowing the sale of all the parts to assemble a functioning firearm without the same laws that apply to selling a functional firearm is pure insanity, and it's well beyond disingenuous to claim that it's impossible to draft an effective law to address this issue. The reality is that too many people simply don't want to.


What defines 'potential gun parts'? Normal replacement wear items? Screws? Blocks of raw steel and chunks of wood?
All those kits still require machining. Unless you restrict access to machine tools, people can still make guns.
They manufactured weapons illegally. The reason we have laws against that is that anyone with a machine shop can make firearms with or without kits.
-
/Ask any ban country from Brazil to Australia whose cops bust underground gun factories on a regular basis.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-08 11:51:58 AM  

Magorn: justanotherfarkinfarker: Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,

No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.

I'm reasonable certain putting a piece of gas Pipe on the end of you "rifle" would, in fact make it what we call " a musket" and a a dangerous one at that, as machining to groves in a barrel to make it a rifle is a very exacting and involved process.

My dad actually owns a percussion cap muzzle-loader that growing up I assumed was from the early 1800's because ...muzzle loader, ramrod, the whole 9.

Turns out it was actually made in the 20's or 30's as a trade item for my grandpa's employer for trading with the Native tribes along the Orinoco.  (government didn't want them having any guns they could actually use to defend themselves, but were okay with ones for hunting) .  It's barrel was also a length of gas pipe, which is precisely why neith dad nor grandad ever fired the thing; both o f them being smart engineering-minded men who disliked taking potentially fatal gambles


Fun fact: any weapon that is considered black powder, including old-style black powder revolvers, are not considered firearms by law, and are not subject to any of the regulations on firearms.
 
2021-03-08 12:02:25 PM  

johnny_vegas: justanotherfarkinfarker: johnny_vegas: Now what about the guy that sold the stuff to them? What about whoever was running the gun show ?

They didn't sell them a firearm, what are they going to assume because they are black they are up to something and call the cops? That's how you turn into an internet mess.

Yes selling them an 80% receiver was not selling them a gun.  Sure Jan.  Maybe that's the loophole that needs to get fixed, then.
/bonus points for making it racist even though both black and white men were involved


As had been said, an 80% receiver isn't a gun....or good for anything as it is. Additional machining is required to make something of it.

It's like buying a car with an aluminum block except the cylinders haven't been lined yet. It's mostly there but you're not going anywhere until you do some non-trivial work...
 
2021-03-08 12:04:49 PM  

Kit Fister: Magorn: justanotherfarkinfarker: Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,

No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.

I'm reasonable certain putting a piece of gas Pipe on the end of you "rifle" would, in fact make it what we call " a musket" and a a dangerous one at that, as machining to groves in a barrel to make it a rifle is a very exacting and involved process.

My dad actually owns a percussion cap muzzle-loader that growing up I assumed was from the early 1800's because ...muzzle loader, ramrod, the whole 9.

Turns out it was actually made in the 20's or 30's as a trade item for my grandpa's employer for trading with the Native tribes along the Orinoco.  (government didn't want them having any guns they could actually use to defend themselves, but were okay with ones for hunting) .  It's barrel was also a length of gas pipe, which is precisely why neith dad nor grandad ever fired the thing; both o f them being smart engineering-minded men who disliked taking potentially fatal gambles

Fun fact: any weapon that is considered black powder, including old-style black powder revolvers, are not considered firearms by law, and are not subject to any of the regulations on firearms.


Close.  ATF says see 18 USC 921 a3.  Can it be converted?

State laws are explicit.  See Williams 537 se2d 21 (2000)
 
2021-03-08 12:10:18 PM  

Turbo Cojones: Kit Fister: Magorn: justanotherfarkinfarker: Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,

No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.

I'm reasonable certain putting a piece of gas Pipe on the end of you "rifle" would, in fact make it what we call " a musket" and a a dangerous one at that, as machining to groves in a barrel to make it a rifle is a very exacting and involved process.

My dad actually owns a percussion cap muzzle-loader that growing up I assumed was from the early 1800's because ...muzzle loader, ramrod, the whole 9.

Turns out it was actually made in the 20's or 30's as a trade item for my grandpa's employer for trading with the Native tribes along the Orinoco.  (government didn't want them having any guns they could actually use to defend themselves, but were okay with ones for hunting) .  It's barrel was also a length of gas pipe, which is precisely why neith dad nor grandad ever fired the thing; both o f them being smart engineering-minded men who disliked taking potentially fatal gambles

Fun fact: any weapon that is considered black powder, including old-style black powder revolvers, are not considered firearms by law, and are not subject to any of the regulations on firearms.

Close.  ATF says see 18 USC 921 a3.  Can it be converted?

State laws are explicit.  See Williams 537 se2d 21 (2000)


To the former, "converted" is a pretty loose term. I.e., if the gun is made to be used with both modern and black powder ammunition, then it's regulated as a firearm.

However if the gun is not designed or sold with a conversion capability, the law doesn't apply, even if a third party develops a conversion method later.

At least, that's how I understand it.

And yes, State Laws are a whole different bag.
 
2021-03-08 12:12:37 PM  

Sasquach: johnny_vegas: justanotherfarkinfarker: johnny_vegas: Now what about the guy that sold the stuff to them? What about whoever was running the gun show ?

They didn't sell them a firearm, what are they going to assume because they are black they are up to something and call the cops? That's how you turn into an internet mess.

Yes selling them an 80% receiver was not selling them a gun.  Sure Jan.  Maybe that's the loophole that needs to get fixed, then.
/bonus points for making it racist even though both black and white men were involved

As had been said, an 80% receiver isn't a gun....or good for anything as it is. Additional machining is required to make something of it.

It's like buying a car with an aluminum block except the cylinders haven't been lined yet. It's mostly there but you're not going anywhere until you do some non-trivial work...


So what does the seller think is going to happen to that receiver he is selling?  Shouldn't the person buying it have to prove he is allowed to own a gun?
 
2021-03-08 12:20:39 PM  

solobarik: SFSailor: Time to update the handy Gun Infographic For Journalists!

[Fark user image 850x427]

That was way funnier than it should have been, nice work


... and I'm a gun-grabbin'^ libby-est-lib-who-ever-lib'ed!  Take that, 2Aers!

; )


^ well, more like, "gun registering and taxing, not grabbing; and willing to grant that guns are cool in a mechanical-and-tool sense", but subtlety is lost in these arguments.
 
2021-03-08 12:31:05 PM  

Kit Fister: Turbo Cojones: Kit Fister: Magorn: justanotherfarkinfarker: Magorn: Simple question: if a person can't legally make a gun without an FFL,

No they can't be in the business of making guns for sale without an FFL. Changing the law so you can't buy a new barrel without going through an FFL would be an absurd law. As you can pretty much buy a gun barrel of limited use at home depot.

I'm reasonable certain putting a piece of gas Pipe on the end of you "rifle" would, in fact make it what we call " a musket" and a a dangerous one at that, as machining to groves in a barrel to make it a rifle is a very exacting and involved process.

My dad actually owns a percussion cap muzzle-loader that growing up I assumed was from the early 1800's because ...muzzle loader, ramrod, the whole 9.

Turns out it was actually made in the 20's or 30's as a trade item for my grandpa's employer for trading with the Native tribes along the Orinoco.  (government didn't want them having any guns they could actually use to defend themselves, but were okay with ones for hunting) .  It's barrel was also a length of gas pipe, which is precisely why neith dad nor grandad ever fired the thing; both o f them being smart engineering-minded men who disliked taking potentially fatal gambles

Fun fact: any weapon that is considered black powder, including old-style black powder revolvers, are not considered firearms by law, and are not subject to any of the regulations on firearms.

Close.  ATF says see 18 USC 921 a3.  Can it be converted?

State laws are explicit.  See Williams 537 se2d 21 (2000)

To the former, "converted" is a pretty loose term. I.e., if the gun is made to be used with both modern and black powder ammunition, then it's regulated as a firearm.

However if the gun is not designed or sold with a conversion capability, the law doesn't apply, even if a third party develops a conversion method later.

At least, that's how I understand it.

And yes, State Laws are a whole different bag.


Know anything about those centerfire conversation kits for BP revolvers? I'm curious how those are considered 'non guns.'
 
2021-03-08 12:31:26 PM  

johnny_vegas: Sasquach: johnny_vegas: justanotherfarkinfarker: johnny_vegas: Now what about the guy that sold the stuff to them? What about whoever was running the gun show ?

They didn't sell them a firearm, what are they going to assume because they are black they are up to something and call the cops? That's how you turn into an internet mess.

Yes selling them an 80% receiver was not selling them a gun.  Sure Jan.  Maybe that's the loophole that needs to get fixed, then.
/bonus points for making it racist even though both black and white men were involved

As had been said, an 80% receiver isn't a gun....or good for anything as it is. Additional machining is required to make something of it.

It's like buying a car with an aluminum block except the cylinders haven't been lined yet. It's mostly there but you're not going anywhere until you do some non-trivial work...

So what does the seller think is going to happen to that receiver he is selling?  Shouldn't the person buying it have to prove he is allowed to own a gun?


Yes. Which is one law they violated. Also manufacturing for sale without a license. Also trafficking across state lines. These guys violated a raft of gun laws that could put them away for life, whether the guns had serial numbers or not.
Can anyone explain why adding another law to make the same thing that is already a multiple federal felony into a double-secret-reverse multiple federal felony would help the issue?
 
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