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(The New Yorker)   Trump is Hungary for MAGA   (newyorker.com) divider line
    More: Sick, Democracy, Autocracy, Democratic Party, Government, Joe Biden, Blint Magyar, Viktor Orbn, former President Donald Trump  
•       •       •

3967 clicks; posted to Politics » on 05 Mar 2021 at 1:53 AM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



48 Comments     (+0 »)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-03-04 9:31:42 PM  
Fun read. Not unpossible sooth forecasting.
 
2021-03-04 9:31:55 PM  
Well, some of us are hungry for justice
 
2021-03-04 10:00:59 PM  
Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.
 
2021-03-04 10:45:38 PM  

GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.


I'm on mobile safari, and I just hit reader view immediately after hitting refresh. Seems to work on quite a few paywalls.
 
2021-03-04 10:47:09 PM  

GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.


TFA loads fine for me with cookies blocked and javascript turned off.

The meat of the article, though, is:

Of course, Orbán, Trump, and other populists do not deliver actual solutions: Magyar is describing their political offer, not their practice. The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness. The Hungarian government in power during Orbán's period in the opposition faced all the familiar pitfalls: it responded to a budgetary shortfall by requiring tuition payments at public universities and co-payments for medical services. These wildly unpopular and painful austerity measures only solidified support for Fidesz. The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system.

Which boils down to the idea that right-wing populism is a garbage notion that will always fail at best, and the counter to that is for leftists to take advantage of power and actually do good things for people.
 
2021-03-04 10:52:34 PM  

monsatano: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

I'm on mobile safari, and I just hit reader view immediately after hitting refresh. Seems to work on quite a few paywalls.


Nevermind - you only need an account to read this article, not a subscription.
 
2021-03-04 10:53:34 PM  
Soros is Hungarian. 
Study it out.

If you know someone into the Q thing, tell them this and watch smoke come out of their processor.
 
2021-03-04 11:04:52 PM  

monsatano: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

I'm on mobile safari, and I just hit reader view immediately after hitting refresh. Seems to work on quite a few paywalls.


Same here. I meant more for the masses.
 
2021-03-05 12:09:02 AM  
Hungary? Is Austria included too?
 
2021-03-05 1:55:50 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-05 1:59:24 AM  
Ever wonder why Trump was so fond of hanging with RWA strongman, president4life types?

Cos he was taking notes.

He wanted to turn the US into an authoritarian shiathole like Russia or Hungary.
 
2021-03-05 2:04:24 AM  

iron de havilland: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

TFA loads fine for me with cookies blocked and javascript turned off.

The meat of the article, though, is:

Of course, Orbán, Trump, and other populists do not deliver actual solutions: Magyar is describing their political offer, not their practice. The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness. The Hungarian government in power during Orbán's period in the opposition faced all the familiar pitfalls: it responded to a budgetary shortfall by requiring tuition payments at public universities and co-payments for medical services. These wildly unpopular and painful austerity measures only solidified support for Fidesz. The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system.

Which boils down to the idea that right-wing populism is a garbage notion that will always fail at best, and the counter to that is for leftists to take advantage of power and actually do good things for people.


There is an enormous segment of our population that would look at increased minimum wage, more accessible healthcare, and better infrastructure and think either (a) things are worse than they've ever been or (b) all these good things were given to them by Trump, and the Democrats want to take it away.
 
2021-03-05 2:05:57 AM  
"The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness."

Welp the US is boned.


"The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system."

So very very boned.
 
2021-03-05 2:09:57 AM  

GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.


Were you able to re-click and see it?
Are you on Farkdotcom mobile?
YMmvbbqiykwim
 
2021-03-05 2:10:57 AM  
On the plus side, I would be shocked if Trump lives another 8 years. On the downside, his fascist party will live on.
 
2021-03-05 2:18:30 AM  
While I very much see the author's point, I can't believe this will happen here. I know under Trump I was starting to get to that point where I was thinking about getting into carpentry as a hobby to build a guillotine and I feel I am saner than a lot of folks here on the politics tab. Four or even six years of Trump? Nah. There would be riots in the street.
 
2021-03-05 2:27:30 AM  

Dangl1ng: While I very much see the author's point, I can't believe this will happen here. I know under Trump I was starting to get to that point where I was thinking about getting into carpentry as a hobby to build a guillotine and I feel I am saner than a lot of folks here on the politics tab. Four or even six years of Trump? Nah. There would be riots in the street.


It's not about Trump. He's a symptom. He could die tomorrow and the warnings of the article would lose no credence.
 
2021-03-05 2:36:35 AM  
Trump stole MAGA from a Reagan speech.
 
2021-03-05 2:39:58 AM  

Lord Dimwit: iron de havilland: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

TFA loads fine for me with cookies blocked and javascript turned off.

The meat of the article, though, is:

Of course, Orbán, Trump, and other populists do not deliver actual solutions: Magyar is describing their political offer, not their practice. The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness. The Hungarian government in power during Orbán's period in the opposition faced all the familiar pitfalls: it responded to a budgetary shortfall by requiring tuition payments at public universities and co-payments for medical services. These wildly unpopular and painful austerity measures only solidified support for Fidesz. The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system.

Which boils down to the idea that right-wing populism is a garbage notion that will always fail at best, and the counter to that is for leftists to take advantage of power and actually do good things for people.

There is an enormous segment of our population that would look at increased minimum wage, more accessible healthcare, and better infrastructure and think either (a) things are worse than they've ever been or (b) all these good things were given to them by Trump, and the Democrats want to take it away.


This is 100% true, but Democrats are going to be giving the public a significant chunk of cash and other things of value, and elected Republicans are 100% tantrum throwing about it.

So it will be very hard to convince non-kook independents that they were really all for those things given the crap that they're pulling right now.

We don't need to convince the hate filled MAGA nutballs. We only need to convince the independents and the moderate "RINO" Republicans appalled at Trump behavior (some of them very recently "ex"-Republicans after what went on in the capital) that we're less bad than the Trump grifters are. Biden seems to be doing a fine job at both.
 
2021-03-05 2:40:28 AM  
So, what do we do about it here? Just give in as if it were inevitable?
 
2021-03-05 2:44:38 AM  
New face of the GOP GQP

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-05 2:55:12 AM  

AAAAGGGGHHHH: So, what do we do about it here? Just give in as if it were inevitable?


Crush them like bugs.

Make the Rethuglicans own their policies. No more, "Well, we'll be nice and help you out if the mess you created trying to make the rich even richer." Nope, no free rides. End the red state / county welfare. End bailing out red states who create their own problems. Let. Them. Vote. If. They. Want. Change.

That's it. When they biatch, spout Rethuglican platitudes back at them and tell them to pull on their bootstraps.
 
2021-03-05 3:14:35 AM  
Isn't it ironic that the tsunami of neo-fascist mobsters that was started all over Eastern Europe in the early 90s and is still largely aided and abeted by the US government has hit back the homeland.
 
2021-03-05 3:41:26 AM  
Trump may be too old to pull it off - I think he's likely to die before 2024 - but if there is anyone in the republican party that can step into that spot, the result is the same. The next one will consolidate authoritarian rule in the US.

It's possible that the democrats will do the needful and get the sort of long term support they had after the new deal, but seeing them shoot themselves in the dick about the $15 minimum wage doesn't give me very much hope. They have a voting rights bill, but it's gonna be in courts for years before implementation (if they manage to pass it at all), and those courts are run by the republicans.

I think it's very likely the US will become an authoritarian state. I would say more likely than the alternative.
 
2021-03-05 4:31:51 AM  

vudukungfu: Well, some of us are hungry for justice


We're kinda like Jesus
 
2021-03-05 4:48:15 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size


You mad, bro?
 
2021-03-05 4:50:40 AM  
Does this mean the GOP will offer European-style universal healthcare, like the have in Hungary and Poland?
 
2021-03-05 4:54:34 AM  

mistahtom: Trump stole MAGA from a Reagan speech.


Speech? You mean he just straight-up stole his campaign slogan:

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-05 5:05:47 AM  

FatherChaos: mistahtom: Trump stole MAGA from a Reagan speech.

Speech? You mean he just straight-up stole his campaign slogan:

[Fark user image 425x414]


That's no surprise. Trump had to get Republicans on his side to brainwash them. What better way to accomplish that than to rip off the Republicaniest Republican of the last 40 years?
 
2021-03-05 5:16:52 AM  

quatchi: Ever wonder why Trump was so fond of hanging with RWA strongman, president4life types?

Cos he was taking notes.

He wanted to turn the US into an authoritarian shiathole like Russia or Hungary.


To be fair, his abysmal grades in school indicate that he's been under the impression that the Presidency would have had those powers, and he was quite dismayed when he realized that the other Presidents weren't chumps for stepping down instead of raising an army to defeat the armies of their opponents, and that even his own military had lines that they wouldn't cross. Vlad wasn't about to disabuse him of his error while on the campaign trail, so really, whose fault is this? The teachers that let this idiot slide. Or his parents. Or anyone OTHER than Donnie, because it can't be his fault, can it? I mean, that would mean he was a f*cking idiot, who surrounded himself with the corrupt and venal...
 
2021-03-05 6:10:42 AM  
Which is why those who say we can\should ignore Trump need to shut the fark up. He's still very much a danger to the country, as are his supporters.
 
2021-03-05 6:13:37 AM  

Lord Dimwit: iron de havilland: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

TFA loads fine for me with cookies blocked and javascript turned off.

The meat of the article, though, is:

Of course, Orbán, Trump, and other populists do not deliver actual solutions: Magyar is describing their political offer, not their practice. The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness. The Hungarian government in power during Orbán's period in the opposition faced all the familiar pitfalls: it responded to a budgetary shortfall by requiring tuition payments at public universities and co-payments for medical services. These wildly unpopular and painful austerity measures only solidified support for Fidesz. The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system.

Which boils down to the idea that right-wing populism is a garbage notion that will always fail at best, and the counter to that is for leftists to take advantage of power and actually do good things for people.

There is an enormous segment of our population that would look at increased minimum wage, more accessible healthcare, and better infrastructure and think either (a) things are worse than they've ever been or (b) all these good things were given to them by Trump, and the Democrats want to take it away.


That doesn't mean Democrats shouldn't work for those things.
 
2021-03-05 7:11:25 AM  

Tyrone Slothrop: Which is why those who say we can\should ignore Trump need to shut the fark up. He's still very much a danger to the country, as are his supporters.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2021-03-05 7:15:45 AM  

Mr.Insightful: We don't need to convince the hate filled MAGA nutballs. We only need to convince the independents and the moderate "RINO" Republicans appalled at Trump behavior (some of them very recently "ex"-Republicans after what went on in the capital) that we're less bad than the Trump grifters are. Biden seems to be doing a fine job at both.


The best way to do that is when the Republicans start taking credit for the stimulus bill passing, what we need to do as a nation is call the motherfu*kers out on it.

We need to remind the people that they're lying to that they actually went out of their way to vote it down when they had the chance, and that they didn't want any of their constituents to benefit from it.  And continue to tell every Republican in front of their constituents that they are lying.
 
2021-03-05 7:46:11 AM  
I guess the important difference between Viktor Orbán and Trump is that Viktor Orbán is 57 years old and Trump old enough that we can assume (or hope) he will be dead soon.
 
2021-03-05 7:56:48 AM  
Yea except all those other countries, Russia included, are backwards AF and don't have the built up inertia that America does. We don't lose our govt or our country unless Goldman Sachs And Boeing and Northrop and Dupont etc, say we do. And they make too much money off of it to change their minds. It kills me when people compare this country to places like Hungary lol. The only comparable country to us is China, and Russia would be close except their people die of alcoholism at an alarming rate and the russia mafia owns most of what matters there. Keep in mind that Russia and other eastern bloc states nearly didn't exist after 1991, they lost an entire system of government and the communist hegemony that surrounded it.
 
2021-03-05 8:01:00 AM  

kdawg7736: Hungary? Is Austria included too?


Well yeah, I'm not gonna give up the Great Barrier Reef for anything.
 
2021-03-05 8:03:40 AM  

AurizenDarkstar: Mr.Insightful: We don't need to convince the hate filled MAGA nutballs. We only need to convince the independents and the moderate "RINO" Republicans appalled at Trump behavior (some of them very recently "ex"-Republicans after what went on in the capital) that we're less bad than the Trump grifters are. Biden seems to be doing a fine job at both.

The best way to do that is when the Republicans start taking credit for the stimulus bill passing, what we need to do as a nation is call the motherfu*kers out on it.

We need to remind the people that they're lying to that they actually went out of their way to vote it down when they had the chance, and that they didn't want any of their constituents to benefit from it.  And continue to tell every Republican in front of their constituents that they are lying.


The Republican isn't to pretend they were for the stimulus. It's to higlight every small detail that doesn't work exactly like it was supposed (and it's a huge bill so there's gonna be many of those) and convince the moderates and independents that the stimulus bill sucked. It's the playbook they used with Obamacare: convince a large enough chunk of the population that a popular bill/policy is actually bad. And they have a very good chance of succeeding.
 
2021-03-05 8:10:35 AM  
During the past week, the conservative commentators Joe Walsh and William Kristol have floated the possibility of leaving the Republican Party to Trump and forming a new centrist conservative party or joining the Democrats. In Magyar's opinion, that would be an ineffective response to Trumpism. "Whoever leaves a party always loses," he said.

Yes, but Trump would lose too. A spoiler third party would be like Nader or Perot -- detrimental to one of the other two parties. By branding itself as a TRUE Conservative party for TRUE Conservatives, and not just blind obedience to Trump, it would siphon off enough votes that the Republicans could conceivably lose up to 100 seats in the House, and maybe 10 Seats in the Senate.

Keep this party running for office until the Trump clan is dead or gone. Refuse to merge with the Republicans until they clean up their act, get rid of the conspiracy theorists, stop grandstanding and demagoguing and Big Lying, and re-adopt classic Eisenhower Conservative principles again.

It wouldn't be hard to pull it off, and the Democrats being in power wouldn't be such a bad thing anyway since they have become Republican-lite in the last 20 years.
 
2021-03-05 8:13:29 AM  
He did the same thing in 2016, calling the election rigged, while rigging the election
 
2021-03-05 9:34:43 AM  

169th Cousin: [Fark user image image 425x235]


Yoink
 
2021-03-05 10:20:54 AM  

Dangl1ng: While I very much see the author's point, I can't believe this will happen here. I know under Trump I was starting to get to that point where I was thinking about getting into carpentry as a hobby to build a guillotine and I feel I am saner than a lot of folks here on the politics tab. Four or even six years of Trump? Nah. There would be riots in the street.


You don't think Cruz or Hawkeye could take up his banner and continue what he started?
 
2021-03-05 10:21:35 AM  
WTfF autocorrect Hawley is a word!
 
2021-03-05 10:44:21 AM  

iron de havilland: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

TFA loads fine for me with cookies blocked and javascript turned off.

The meat of the article, though, is:

Of course, Orbán, Trump, and other populists do not deliver actual solutions: Magyar is describing their political offer, not their practice. The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness. The Hungarian government in power during Orbán's period in the opposition faced all the familiar pitfalls: it responded to a budgetary shortfall by requiring tuition payments at public universities and co-payments for medical services. These wildly unpopular and painful austerity measures only solidified support for Fidesz. The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system.

Which boils down to the idea that right-wing populism is a garbage notion that will always fail at best, and the counter to that is for leftists to take advantage of power and actually do good things for people.


I've been so happy the idea of needing to be bipartisan with a party that will never be bipartisan is not getting traction.
 
2021-03-05 10:58:16 AM  

Moroning: Dangl1ng: While I very much see the author's point, I can't believe this will happen here. I know under Trump I was starting to get to that point where I was thinking about getting into carpentry as a hobby to build a guillotine and I feel I am saner than a lot of folks here on the politics tab. Four or even six years of Trump? Nah. There would be riots in the street.

You don't think Cruz or Hawkeye could take up his banner and continue what he started?


I don't.  Neither has the "charisma" of the former guy, nor do they have the sociopathic tweeting ability.  They aren't  driven by rallying cultists.  They are both tangentially tethered to reality.
 
2021-03-05 11:22:15 AM  

iron de havilland: GardenWeasel: Essential articles like this should not be paywalled.

TFA loads fine for me with cookies blocked and javascript turned off.

The meat of the article, though, is:

Of course, Orbán, Trump, and other populists do not deliver actual solutions: Magyar is describing their political offer, not their practice. The challenge for the party in power is to create solutions, proving in practice that solidarity can be more rewarding than selfishness. The Hungarian government in power during Orbán's period in the opposition faced all the familiar pitfalls: it responded to a budgetary shortfall by requiring tuition payments at public universities and co-payments for medical services. These wildly unpopular and painful austerity measures only solidified support for Fidesz. The secret to saving the American system of government, according to Magyar, is not much of a secret. Will the Biden Administration and the Democratic Congress raise the minimum wage; provide all Americans with accessible and reliable health care; introduce a wealth tax; cancel student debt; and invest in infrastructure, particularly in rural areas? These are existential questions for both American society and the American political system.

Which boils down to the idea that right-wing populism is a garbage notion that will always fail at best, and the counter to that is for leftists to take advantage of power and actually do good things for people.


When leftists have any power in this country im sure they will be happy to oblige
 
2021-03-05 12:38:32 PM  
the conservative commentators Joe Walsh and William Kristol have floated the possibility of leaving the Republican Party to Trump and forming a new centrist conservative party or joining the Democrats.

Oh ffs both of you need to stfu and gtfo
 
2021-03-05 1:03:40 PM  
Based on that timeline, I don't think the fat farking idiot is going to live that long. If he was in his 40s or 50s, I might worry. But he's not, so I don't.
 
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