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(NBC News)   Pentagon, whose main purpose is to teach people how to kill their opponents with extreme measures, orders a pause across the whole military to address extremism in its ranks   (nbcnews.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, United States Department of Defense, military-wide pause, Democratic Rep. Jackie Speier of California, Armed forces, meeting of the leaders of each military service Wednesday, problem of extremism, Lloyd Austin, former members of the military  
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767 clicks; posted to Politics » on 04 Feb 2021 at 5:13 PM (10 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2021-02-04 3:18:30 PM  
He added: "There may be cultural issues we have to deal with here."

YA THINK????
 
2021-02-04 3:36:40 PM  
10% do the killing... the other 90% order the wrong supplies and send them to the wrong location.

But, it IS a problem and has been for a long, long time. Funny thing is, the racist sh*theads get in there and for many of them it's their first exposure to black, latinos and everyone else not white in an intimate setting. Where you have to rely on them or you kinda go through the same nasty sh*t and can share that together... I mean, it's pretty damn hard to knock out systemic racism and those who were taught by mommy and daddy and El Rushbo that the government is evil and needs to be destroyed and that only white people are worth anything... But I definitely saw people in the service that would NEVER even cross paths who came to rely on each other and kind of lose a bit of that hatred. Some even became real friends. Not sure how long that lasts after someone gets out...

TL;DR... it's definitely there, but it's not as chronic as one would think. But I'd like to make it as close to 0% as possible so do whatever it takes. Also can vary from unit to unit. Just because I didn't see much of it doesn't mean that other units don't have it. Especially Nat Guard units which are just a gathering of very similar people from the same state where at the Reg Army level you have people from EVERYWHERE.

I hate Nazis.
 
2021-02-04 3:43:27 PM  
You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.
 
2021-02-04 3:49:44 PM  

ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.


Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.
 
2021-02-04 4:53:40 PM  
Well, yes, the main purpose is to teach people how to kill their opponents with extreme measures, and part of that is making sure that members of the military understand who their opponents are.
 
2021-02-04 4:54:38 PM  

HighOnCraic: Well, yes, the main purpose is to teach people how to kill their opponents with extreme measures, and part of that is making sure that members of the military understand who their opponents are.


Judging from the usual MO of militaries throughout history: civilians
 
2021-02-04 5:16:05 PM  
Lol. Good luck.
 
2021-02-04 5:18:54 PM  

phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.


I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.
 
2021-02-04 5:22:10 PM  
Good.  Now be thorough about it!
 
2021-02-04 5:22:30 PM  
Cool.  Won't change anything.

"Sit down and brief people on a problem" and then send them back to work is not a way to change anything, in fact its specifically designed to give the impression of doing something while accomplishing absolutely nothing.
 
2021-02-04 5:23:46 PM  
I'm acquainted with several people who served in the USMC. The level of hero worship they showed for James Mattis was startling.

Even more startling though, was how quickly those same people turned on Mattis after he spoke against Trump following the photo op teargassing outside St John's Church.

That removed any hope I had that the rank and file military would side with their duty to the constitution before their loyalty to an idiot.
 
2021-02-04 5:24:39 PM  
Just another example of the far left radical socialist (((SOROS))) controlled Biden agenda of attacking conservatives for their sincerely held beliefs. A sad day for America.

i.pinimg.comView Full Size
 
2021-02-04 5:26:04 PM  

HighOnCraic: Well, yes, the main purpose is to teach people how to kill their opponents with extreme measures, and part of that is making sure that members of the military understand who their opponents are.


That's kind of what attracts them to the military in the first place, as well as law enforcement. Generally speaking, liberal minded people disdain guns, weapons, and blowing shiat up, so you don't have a group of "Antifa" applying to join, and even if they liked those activities, they don't believe in being a part of said entities in the first place.
 
2021-02-04 5:26:20 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size


Either he is a giant, the soldier next to him is a dwarf, or a combination of the two...
 
2021-02-04 5:27:06 PM  

VisualiseThis: phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.

I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.


I still haven't watched War Horse because my initial thought after seeing the trailer was "What the fark is a horse going to do besides die horrible in a battlefield with tanks and machine guns?"
 
2021-02-04 5:29:29 PM  

VisualiseThis: phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.

I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.


It is more correct to say that they were unprepared for someone else to use the advances of the 20th century on them.  They were used to blowing the fark out of native insurgencies.  There are British letters from the front lines early in the war where the commanders are appalled at what was happening to cavalry charges because how dare the other side machine gun them down like that? The Nerve!  It was unfair!  Hilariously, German commanders were sending back pretty much verbatim letters to their side.  It was like neither one could accept they weren't fighting [racial slurs] anymore.
 
2021-02-04 5:30:57 PM  

NewportBarGuy: 10% do the killing... the other 90% order the wrong supplies and send them to the wrong location.

But, it IS a problem and has been for a long, long time. Funny thing is, the racist sh*theads get in there and for many of them it's their first exposure to black, latinos and everyone else not white in an intimate setting. Where you have to rely on them or you kinda go through the same nasty sh*t and can share that together... I mean, it's pretty damn hard to knock out systemic racism and those who were taught by mommy and daddy and El Rushbo that the government is evil and needs to be destroyed and that only white people are worth anything... But I definitely saw people in the service that would NEVER even cross paths who came to rely on each other and kind of lose a bit of that hatred. Some even became real friends. Not sure how long that lasts after someone gets out...

TL;DR... it's definitely there, but it's not as chronic as one would think. But I'd like to make it as close to 0% as possible so do whatever it takes. Also can vary from unit to unit. Just because I didn't see much of it doesn't mean that other units don't have it. Especially Nat Guard units which are just a gathering of very similar people from the same state where at the Reg Army level you have people from EVERYWHERE.

I hate Nazis.


Honestly, Americans didn't invent genocide. That's prehistoric. But Americans did invent Eugenics. The Nazis merely adopted them. These white power terrorists like nazi stuff now, but predate it.

Bowie had the right of it. I'm afraid of Americans, too.
 
2021-02-04 5:32:26 PM  

NewportBarGuy: Not sure how long that lasts after someone gets out...


That's probably a pretty significant thing. You get out, you go back to the environment which caused the behavior to start with, and you can justify "Oh, well, he's one of the good ones." and keep hating.

I've pretty much lost contact with the friends I knew who served (not that I did). It would interesting to hear their take on extremism/racism, though. It never came up, but it was not a racially diverse group either, and they weren't the kind of folks who get discriminated against.

/white males in the south
 
2021-02-04 5:33:24 PM  
Address it by getting rid of it? Right?
 
2021-02-04 5:34:45 PM  

Mad_Radhu: VisualiseThis: phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.

I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.

I still haven't watched War Horse because my initial thought after seeing the trailer was "What the fark is a horse going to do besides die horrible in a battlefield with tanks and machine guns?"


Tanks didn't appear until half way through WWI.  Also, they had been using horses with machine guns for decades.  But the machine guns supplemented the cavalry charges.  WWI was the first time the Western powers had the machine guns used against their own horses.  It was ... eye-opening ... to them.

Interestingly, horses were still used in WWII.  The high-tech blitzkrieg stuff that people wank to was only a tiny fraction of the German army.  Most of their artillery was still pulled by horses.
 
2021-02-04 5:36:25 PM  

phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.


Advanced World War I Tactics with General Melchett
Youtube rblfKREj50o
 
2021-02-04 5:49:50 PM  

phalamir: VisualiseThis: phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.

I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.

It is more correct to say that they were unprepared for someone else to use the advances of the 20th century on them.  They were used to blowing the fark out of native insurgencies.  There are British letters from the front lines early in the war where the commanders are appalled at what was happening to cavalry charges because how dare the other side machine gun them down like that? The Nerve!  It was unfair!  Hilariously, German commanders were sending back pretty much verbatim letters to their side.  It was like neither one could accept they weren't fighting [racial slurs] anymore.


Black Adder Goes Fourth is still quite worth watching and sums it up well...


George: You know, that's the thing I don't really understand about you, Cap.
You're a professional soldier, and yet, sometimes you sound as though
you bally well haven't enjoyed soldiering at all.

Edmund: Well, you see, George, I did like it, back in the old days when the
prerequisite of a British campaign was that the enemy should under
no circumstances carry guns - even spears made us think twice. The
kind of people we liked to fight were two feet tall and armed with
dry grass.

George: Now, come off it, sir - what about Mboto Gorge, for heaven's sake?

Edmund: Yes, that was a bit of a nasty one - ten thousand Watusi warriors
armed to the teeth with kiwi fruit and guava halves. After the battle,
instead of taking prisoners, we simply made a huge fruit salad.
 
2021-02-04 5:54:20 PM  

JAGChem82: HighOnCraic: Well, yes, the main purpose is to teach people how to kill their opponents with extreme measures, and part of that is making sure that members of the military understand who their opponents are.

That's kind of what attracts them to the military in the first place, as well as law enforcement. Generally speaking, liberal minded people disdain guns, weapons, and blowing shiat up, so you don't have a group of "Antifa" applying to join, and even if they liked those activities, they don't believe in being a part of said entities in the first place.


We need to have hearings to root out right-wing extremism in the Armed Services.  Maybe Kevin McCarthy can be in charge.

/Oh, wait.
 
2021-02-04 5:55:00 PM  
The good news is that the extremists have left records of their beliefs all over social media.  The better news is that there's a continent named Antarctica that could use a few military bases.  Send them there to grow snow potatoes and court martial them a week before their time is up.  Soldiers take an oath to uphold the Constitution.  You don't accomplish that as Anticonstitutionalist valuing conspiracy theories above the lives of your countrymen.
 
2021-02-04 6:03:30 PM  

whosits_112: [Fark user image 425x284]

Either he is a giant, the soldier next to him is a dwarf, or a combination of the two...


I tried googling for his height, but all I could find was "well over six feet"

Here he is next to Obama for comparison.

static.timesofisrael.comView Full Size
 
2021-02-04 6:20:52 PM  
"There wasn't one being in the room that didn't agree that there wasn't a problem," he said.

Ok, I'm going to need a pen and paper to parse all those negatives.
 
2021-02-04 6:22:00 PM  
I remember the army doing this in 1995 when a couple 82nd nazi schmucks killed a black couple.
 
2021-02-04 6:29:40 PM  
i.imgur.comView Full Size
 
2021-02-04 6:35:03 PM  

Krieghund: whosits_112: [Fark user image 425x284]

Either he is a giant, the soldier next to him is a dwarf, or a combination of the two...

I tried googling for his height, but all I could find was "well over six feet"

Here he is next to Obama for comparison.

[static.timesofisrael.com image 850x741]


Trump is also next to both of them in that photo, but he's very, very tiny.
 
2021-02-04 6:41:22 PM  
'Cause they wanna know if I'm moral enough
To join the army, burn women, kids, houses and villages
After being a litterbug
 
2021-02-04 6:44:03 PM  

armyguy35: I remember the army doing this in 1995 when a couple 82nd nazi schmucks killed a black couple.


I think one of their names was Burmeister or Burnmeister...not sure...was a long time ago and I'm knee deep in a bottle of Old Overholt
 
2021-02-04 7:00:06 PM  

MathProf: 'Cause they wanna know if I'm moral enough
To join the army, burn women, kids, houses and villages
After being a litterbug


How about just being an indiscriminate, equal opportunity, trigger puller?
 
2021-02-04 7:36:54 PM  

backhand.slap.of.reason: The good news is that the extremists have left records of their beliefs all over social media.  The better news is that there's a continent named Antarctica that could use a few military bases.  Send them there to grow snow potatoes and court martial them a week before their time is up.  Soldiers take an oath to uphold the Constitution.  You don't accomplish that as Anticonstitutionalist valuing conspiracy theories above the lives of your countrymen.


We'd have to use Alaska. Antarctica is demilitarized by treaty.
 
2021-02-04 8:15:38 PM  
The military is funny that way. A few years back, the Air Force decided the key to stopping sexual harassment was to purge things like Victoria's Secret catalogs and leg lamps  Seriously, they needed to focus on a few things .

Returning to Columbus AFB, MS where I earned my wings, we saw a couple of the most notorious sexist patches of the past still lived on the walls. Ours, depicting cartoon violence, had been eradicated from the base. Figures.

My point here is, don't get your hopes up. The military is pretty good at shooting at the wrong targets when it comes to its own problems.
 
2021-02-04 9:43:53 PM  

phalamir: VisualiseThis: phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.

I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.

It is more correct to say that they were unprepared for someone else to use the advances of the 20th century on them.  They were used to blowing the fark out of native insurgencies.  There are British letters from the front lines early in the war where the commanders are appalled at what was happening to cavalry charges because how dare the other side machine gun them down like that? The Nerve!  It was unfair!  Hilariously, German commanders were sending back pretty much verbatim letters to their side.  It was like neither one could accept they weren't fighting [racial slurs] anymore.


I heard a tale that the king of Poland once asked "how many cavalrymen do we need to stop a tank?"
 
2021-02-04 10:33:26 PM  

dsmith42: backhand.slap.of.reason: The good news is that the extremists have left records of their beliefs all over social media.  The better news is that there's a continent named Antarctica that could use a few military bases.  Send them there to grow snow potatoes and court martial them a week before their time is up.  Soldiers take an oath to uphold the Constitution.  You don't accomplish that as Anticonstitutionalist valuing conspiracy theories above the lives of your countrymen.

We'd have to use Alaska. Antarctica is demilitarized by treaty.


Okay, everybody gets a Big Chicken Dinner, then Uncle Sam pays for their flight home.  Due to the military testing response to GPS outages, the flight home has navigational problems and winds up in Antarctica.  We good?
 
2021-02-05 3:13:52 AM  

phalamir: Mad_Radhu: VisualiseThis: phalamir: ArkPanda: You don't want your military scoring too many own goals.

Tell that to Field Marshal Douglas Haig.  He spent four years killing as many British soldiers as he could, using the German Imperial Army as his weapon of choice.  And got medals for it.

I know I'm parroting Dan Carlin here, but to say that Haig and the other military leaders of the various countries that fought in WWI were wholly unprepared, tactically or strategically, for the technological advances of the prior 20 years is an understatement.

I still haven't watched War Horse because my initial thought after seeing the trailer was "What the fark is a horse going to do besides die horrible in a battlefield with tanks and machine guns?"

Tanks didn't appear until half way through WWI.  Also, they had been using horses with machine guns for decades.  But the machine guns supplemented the cavalry charges.  WWI was the first time the Western powers had the machine guns used against their own horses.  It was ... eye-opening ... to them.

Interestingly, horses were still used in WWII.  The high-tech blitzkrieg stuff that people wank to was only a tiny fraction of the German army.  Most of their artillery was still pulled by horses.


The Horse Cavalry was still in existence into Vietnam but no longer used in battle (esp there!). Some of it still exists for training for funeral caissons & parades, historical units, etc.

There have been several fits & starts on the Camel Cavalry, mostly at Ft. Huachuca, NM. Yes, even as recently as an attempted revival as in response to 9-11. I seem to remember King Chulalongkorn of Siam sending camels to help Lincoln in the Civil War (or was it elephants?). I know fossilized camel skeletons can be found at Ft. Huachuca & at least 3 Camel Corps trained there over the years. (Father was stationed there during WW2 as an air intelligence photographer interpreter: mock-ups of fake buildings/bases/ships/whatever were constructed to fool the enemy & he would photograph them for evaluation from the air.) He may have been exaggerating about the occasional small herd of wild camels. Or not.
 
2021-02-05 3:46:36 AM  
After Stand Down, start scraping Base vehicle access passes on windshields for any POV with a racist sticker. Then, match the car to the troop, counselling & training & bad evals for 1 year ("Does not support the Military's Equal-Opportunity Program, to sit: racist, segregationist displays on his POV, locker & personal space ... ") It works & it's a place to start. No Troop will be promoted with that statement 8n his or her annual evals for at least a couple of years.

From there, surprise Inspections of work & berthing, barracks & housing. (Amazing what can be found during annual base housing maintenance inspections. "I thought I saw a roach run into that dresser drawer! Boy, that looks like a Confederate flag. Oooh! Pot! Guns are supposed to be kept at the Armory.") That's how you root it out. Once you identify the problem Troop, off he gets to training, he is appropriately evaluated, cautioned & mentored, including (I saw it done in the 1970s) field trips to cultural places like synagogues, black colleges, dances, events with the hosts permissions. It works. At least, of it removes some of the scary from the strange.)
 
2021-02-05 8:04:17 AM  

NewportBarGuy: 10% do the killing... the other 90% order the wrong supplies and send them to the wrong location.

But, it IS a problem and has been for a long, long time. Funny thing is, the racist sh*theads get in there and for many of them it's their first exposure to black, latinos and everyone else not white in an intimate setting. Where you have to rely on them or you kinda go through the same nasty sh*t and can share that together... I mean, it's pretty damn hard to knock out systemic racism and those who were taught by mommy and daddy and El Rushbo that the government is evil and needs to be destroyed and that only white people are worth anything... But I definitely saw people in the service that would NEVER even cross paths who came to rely on each other and kind of lose a bit of that hatred. Some even became real friends. Not sure how long that lasts after someone gets out...

TL;DR... it's definitely there, but it's not as chronic as one would think. But I'd like to make it as close to 0% as possible so do whatever it takes. Also can vary from unit to unit. Just because I didn't see much of it doesn't mean that other units don't have it. Especially Nat Guard units which are just a gathering of very similar people from the same state where at the Reg Army level you have people from EVERYWHERE.

I hate Nazis.


Someone hit the lights,anything after this post is redundant
 
2021-02-05 8:05:36 AM  

phalamir: HighOnCraic: Well, yes, the main purpose is to teach people how to kill their opponents with extreme measures, and part of that is making sure that members of the military understand who their opponents are.

Judging from the usual MO of militaries throughout history: civilians


Assymetric warfare where the opposition will blend in not caring about the population usually does that.
 
2021-02-05 8:06:15 AM  

Meatsim1: Cool.  Won't change anything.

"Sit down and brief people on a problem" and then send them back to work is not a way to change anything, in fact its specifically designed to give the impression of doing something while accomplishing absolutely nothing.


You forgot the certificate after the sit-down
 
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