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(NBC News)   Former DHS official who predicted the rise of far-right violence in 2009 says it will get worse, and we're doing it wrong when it comes to stopping it   (nbcnews.com) divider line
    More: Scary, United States Capitol, White supremacy, Janet Napolitano, Right-wing politics, Daryl Johnson, NBC News, Far right, White House  
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3269 clicks; posted to Politics » on 13 Jan 2021 at 6:30 PM (22 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2021-01-13 1:00:01 PM  
You can't make the horse drink.

There's another thread about he FBI giving information on last week to people in advance and what is the Fark reaction? That the FBI is useless so why listen to them.

The problem is right here, even amongst people who believe they stand against extremism.
 
2021-01-13 1:43:09 PM  
yeah much worse, stay off flights, out of elevators, in fact, just don't go out
like there is a pandemi.... oh
 
2021-01-13 1:51:33 PM  
This part was pretty telling I think:

NBC NEWS: And you didn't publicize this report, but it got out.

JOHNSON: We disseminated it to police, and then it got leaked.


Going through the rest of the article, I'm trying to be hopeful, but this only gets stopped if the people currently treating it like a feature start treating it like a serious threat. But a lot won't because they're COUNTING on this.  They encourage it, stoke it.  Because it benefits them.  It's present top to bottom.  And even if everybody got on the same page and started treating right-wing nationalism and extremism as a threat today, it would take a LOT of time to root out.  Certainly longer than one or two presidential terms.

A major problem is that opponents to this have successfully whipped up so much hand-wringing from people who are oh-so-upset that people can be deplatformed; calling it "censorship" and complaining about "woke" or "cancel culture".  Lots of people think they have legitimate concerns, but all they're doing is expressing their ignorance.

"Cancel culture" has another name:  "Capitalism."  A company is under no obligation to retain you as a client, a customer, or anything else.  If you're a liability to profits, if you're a threat to the brand, they're under no obligation to keep you around, and can ban you from the property; brick and mortar OR ones and zeroes.
 
2021-01-13 3:01:50 PM  
When he won the Democratic nomination (Obama), we started seeing white supremacist groups lashing out and threatening him. That, coupled with the housing bubble bursting in '08, left lot of people underwater financially - they started looking for scapegoats for their problems.

The rise of the Right is linked to the now 4 decade long economic crisis working people have been in. Little wonder people get radicalized and little wonder they have the numbers and resources in the Government at all levels that they do.

Good read. I encourage everyone to read on it and think.
 
2021-01-13 6:14:56 PM  
I mean, yeah, okay, he's not wrong about a lot of things, but if he thinks we can fix these people with just LOVE LOVE LOVE, maybe you can personally convert your grandma back to sanity with LOVE LOVE LOVE, but when these people start showing up to kill you and they are armed and they believe crazy stuff like QAnon, we're past the point where this is going to have any effect at all on them.

A lot of these people live in towns where EVERYONE TACITLY AGREES WITH THEM. There is no one to provide love to them, much less a counter-narrative. Everyone in their family is a Trump voter. Everyone in their workplace is a Trump voter. Everyone in their church is a Trump voter. And the few that are not are smart enough to keep quiet about it. Who, precisely, does this guy think is going to deconvert Toad Suck, Arkansas or Booger Hole, West Virginia? And yes, those towns actually exist and both are chock full of Trump voters.
 
2021-01-13 6:32:03 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: I mean, yeah, okay, he's not wrong about a lot of things, but if he thinks we can fix these people with just LOVE LOVE LOVE, maybe you can personally convert your grandma back to sanity with LOVE LOVE LOVE, but when these people start showing up to kill you and they are armed and they believe crazy stuff like QAnon, we're past the point where this is going to have any effect at all on them.

A lot of these people live in towns where EVERYONE TACITLY AGREES WITH THEM. There is no one to provide love to them, much less a counter-narrative. Everyone in their family is a Trump voter. Everyone in their workplace is a Trump voter. Everyone in their church is a Trump voter. And the few that are not are smart enough to keep quiet about it. Who, precisely, does this guy think is going to deconvert Toad Suck, Arkansas or Booger Hole, West Virginia? And yes, those towns actually exist and both are chock full of Trump voters.


We keep hearing that China is 're-educating' the Uighur radicalized minority in schools (re education camps). This is their attempt to tamp down the radicalization that took place due to events in Central Asia in the 2000s.

My point in raising this is - how do we de radicalize a large segment of the US population that backed a fascist and some of them even stormed the halls of the Federal Government in that effort?

I don't know. Well, I think part of it is economic opportunity, health care, and some sense of long term stability.
 
2021-01-13 6:37:12 PM  
Obvious tag missing?

That neo-nazis and KKK members arent hunted down like terrorists and shot on sight if they resist arrest is a travesty.
 
2021-01-13 6:38:17 PM  

The Green Intern: "Cancel culture" has another name:  "Capitalism."  A company is under no obligation to retain you as a client, a customer, or anything else.  If you're a liability to profits, if you're a threat to the brand, they're under no obligation to keep you around, and can ban you from the property; brick and mortar OR ones and zeroes.


LOL, I know, right? If you don't like authoritarian fiefdoms controlling so much of your life, to the point that it makes you wonder why people worry so much about only government oppression, and when you think about it a little you realize corporations are materialized, sanctioned, legitimized, and empowered by government, so that making the distinction between oppression by government or oppression by a corporation makes less and less sense by the minute... welcome to the progressive left. Come on in. We have vegan cookies. If you brought real cookies, feel free to eat those instead.
 
2021-01-13 6:38:43 PM  
So:

- de-Nazification
- help the working class

Seems "simple" enough for me.  So of course we won't do it.
 
2021-01-13 6:39:00 PM  
For every white supremacist, there are many orders of magnitude more white supremacist sympathizers. That right there's your problem.
 
2021-01-13 6:39:15 PM  
The only thing Fascists understand is punches to the face.
 
2021-01-13 6:39:34 PM  

Nadie_AZ: When he won the Democratic nomination (Obama), we started seeing white supremacist groups lashing out and threatening him. That, coupled with the housing bubble bursting in '08, left lot of people underwater financially - they started looking for scapegoats for their problems.

The rise of the Right is linked to the now 4 decade long economic crisis working people have been in. Little wonder people get radicalized and little wonder they have the numbers and resources in the Government at all levels that they do.

Good read. I encourage everyone to read on it and think.


We've long known this though. What helps in actual economic anxiety? Strong social safety nets, job training, fair wages, and healthcare. And when we've proposed any of it, you'd've thought we killed their mother right in front of them for the screaming. We became Soviet Russia overnight for proposing a Republican's healthcare plan. Anything except staggering tax breaks on the top 1% is evil and cannot be allowed, because "those people" may benefit also.
 
2021-01-13 6:41:12 PM  

edmo: You can't make the horse drink.

There's another thread about he FBI giving information on last week to people in advance and what is the Fark reaction? That the FBI is useless so why listen to them.

The problem is right here, even amongst people who believe they stand against extremism.


The FBI has an extremely long history of being horrifyingly lax on white-supremacy groups and going after "socialists/communists," homosexuals, and people of color with ruthless ferocity.  There's a reason people say they're useless--they're not entirely useless, but they're not the country's saviors.  Not until they clean their own house.
 
2021-01-13 6:42:09 PM  
A Message from President Donald J. Trump
Youtube hDNiNdsPHNA


This was posted on The White House Youtube channel some 35 minutes ago.

This man is scared out of his farking mind, if he's willing to actually sit down and say this.

But it's not enough... I'm pretty sure he didn't run this on actual TV, though I could be wrong. He could have made sure it was seen by all Americans, but he did not. He just threw it on a channel very few know about... so he could say he denounced everything.

I have a feeling this is the last we'll see of him on TV. If he does anything weapons grade stupid before his term is over, he's basically stabbing Mitch and the GOP in the back... again.

And he might just do it.
 
2021-01-13 6:42:27 PM  
"NBC NEWS: Do you believe the president's defeat will potentially stoke the fires even more, or do you think his ouster paves the way for calming them?

JOHNSON: It has the potential to do either. And it's going to depend on Republican leaders, what they decide to do. Because the Democrats, no matter how hard they're going to try, these people won't listen. It's going to take Republican leadership for these people to listen and actually tone down.
"


Hmm undoing this problem depends on Republican leadership basically abandoning their main talking points of xenophobia, racism, guns, and supply-side jesus.  We're boned.  I hope where ever I move isn't of strategic importance in WWIII.
 
2021-01-13 6:45:11 PM  

edmo: You can't make the horse drink.

There's another thread about he FBI giving information on last week to people in advance and what is the Fark reaction? That the FBI is useless so why listen to them.


Isn't this the FBI telling us that the FBI had it totally handled but that it wasn't the FBI that failed because it was other people and not the FBI?

Seriously, though, I'm not letting those assholes off the hook. They're the ones who looked the other way for decades. The ones who tried to kill MLK. Got Jean Seberg to kill herself after hounding her for years -- for supporting the NAACP. The ones who did fark-all about 9/11. Who vastly contributed to the election of Donald Trump.

Get the fark off with "Let's all give the FBI big thick smooches."
 
2021-01-13 6:46:11 PM  
Trying to get the U.S. government to care about white terrorists before they conduct an attack is the ninth circle of hell. You can only sell it if they are a religious minority of some kind.
 
2021-01-13 6:47:14 PM  

New Rising Sun: "NBC NEWS: Do you believe the president's defeat will potentially stoke the fires even more, or do you think his ouster paves the way for calming them?

JOHNSON: It has the potential to do either. And it's going to depend on Republican leaders, what they decide to do. Because the Democrats, no matter how hard they're going to try, these people won't listen. It's going to take Republican leadership for these people to listen and actually tone down."


Hmm undoing this problem depends on Republican leadership basically abandoning their main talking points of xenophobia, racism, guns, and supply-side jesus.  We're boned.  I hope where ever I move isn't of strategic importance in WWIII.


All the more reason to remove every single last one of the assholes.  Again, here's your chance, Democrats.
 
2021-01-13 6:48:39 PM  
Abolish and outlaw the Republican party for starters.
 
2021-01-13 6:49:21 PM  
If you've got family members, neighbors, co-workers that are part of these movements, rather than ostracize and debate and criticize and isolate them, we need to love them, have compassion and bring them into the mainstream. The only way you're going to get rid of hate is through love. Every person I've ever known about that's been a white supremacist has left the movement through an act of compassion or love. They didn't leave it because someone convinced them that their belief systems were wrong.

He's the expert, so maybe this is true. I'm just not a big enough person to live with the feeling that I rewarded someone for being willfully ignorant, bigoted, and violent. Thousands of people are dying every day now. I guess that's because we didn't run up to the anti-maskers and hug them when they were parading through stores, shoving employees, and coughing in peoples' faces? I guess it wasn't compassionate enough to only shoot ONE of the thousands of insurrectionists, despite how close they were to assassinating 1/3 of our government.

He's the expert, so maybe he's right. But since we haven't tried just sticking them all in Florida and Alabama, then walling it off, we don't know for sure that that wouldn't also work. It certainly seems like it would be easier and less costly in terms of lives than "loving" the sense back into them.
 
2021-01-13 6:49:29 PM  

edmo: You can't make the horse drink.

There's another thread about he FBI giving information on last week to people in advance and what is the Fark reaction? That the FBI is useless so why listen to them.

The problem is right here, even amongst people who believe they stand against extremism.


It's hard to argue with the claim that the FBI is useless when their collective response to "A bunch of white guys are going to attack Congress" could be boiled down to a shrug emoji.
 
2021-01-13 6:49:41 PM  

Nadie_AZ: Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: I mean, yeah, okay, he's not wrong about a lot of things, but if he thinks we can fix these people with just LOVE LOVE LOVE, maybe you can personally convert your grandma back to sanity with LOVE LOVE LOVE, but when these people start showing up to kill you and they are armed and they believe crazy stuff like QAnon, we're past the point where this is going to have any effect at all on them.

A lot of these people live in towns where EVERYONE TACITLY AGREES WITH THEM. There is no one to provide love to them, much less a counter-narrative. Everyone in their family is a Trump voter. Everyone in their workplace is a Trump voter. Everyone in their church is a Trump voter. And the few that are not are smart enough to keep quiet about it. Who, precisely, does this guy think is going to deconvert Toad Suck, Arkansas or Booger Hole, West Virginia? And yes, those towns actually exist and both are chock full of Trump voters.

We keep hearing that China is 're-educating' the Uighur radicalized minority in schools (re education camps). This is their attempt to tamp down the radicalization that took place due to events in Central Asia in the 2000s.

My point in raising this is - how do we de radicalize a large segment of the US population that backed a fascist and some of them even stormed the halls of the Federal Government in that effort?

I don't know. Well, I think part of it is economic opportunity, health care, and some sense of long term stability.


Geld them.
 
2021-01-13 6:50:32 PM  
This is when you need to apply "non-liberal" solutions to liberal concerns.

The far right thinks that Democrats and liberals are a bunch of "soft on crime pussies", because they believe in criminal justice reform and less harsh sentencing, so they act out and when they're caught, they try to play on the kind heartenedness of liberals to be gentle towards them.

Well, my advice is to take the "tough on crime" mantle from R's and apply those same laws that R's proposed to their side - and do it 100% on the basis of "conservative" policy. We all know that they can't live by their own standard, so call their bluff.
 
2021-01-13 6:51:48 PM  

quo vadimus: If you've got family members, neighbors, co-workers that are part of these movements, rather than ostracize and debate and criticize and isolate them, we need to love them, have compassion and bring them into the mainstream. The only way you're going to get rid of hate is through love. Every person I've ever known about that's been a white supremacist has left the movement through an act of compassion or love. They didn't leave it because someone convinced them that their belief systems were wrong.

He's the expert, so maybe this is true. I'm just not a big enough person to live with the feeling that I rewarded someone for being willfully ignorant, bigoted, and violent. Thousands of people are dying every day now. I guess that's because we didn't run up to the anti-maskers and hug them when they were parading through stores, shoving employees, and coughing in peoples' faces? I guess it wasn't compassionate enough to only shoot ONE of the thousands of insurrectionists, despite how close they were to assassinating 1/3 of our government.

He's the expert, so maybe he's right. But since we haven't tried just sticking them all in Florida and Alabama, then walling it off, we don't know for sure that that wouldn't also work. It certainly seems like it would be easier and less costly in terms of lives than "loving" the sense back into them.


He's also a middle-aged straight white dude who doesn't have to deal with family members trying to kill him simply for existing.  If we're gonna be all about "love" and whatnot, the people doing it need to be the strongest and most privileged among us.  This ain't for minorities to do.  Way too much of this work falls on us.
 
2021-01-13 6:51:50 PM  
The Right's endgame has been obvious since at least 1995 and we've been doing it wrong ever since by, essentially, doing nothing.

The response to the Malheur occupation was only one recent instance of this.
 
2021-01-13 6:53:16 PM  
There needs to be a massive marketing campaign on what should citizens be doing. If you've got family members, neighbors, co-workers that are part of these movements, rather than ostracize and debate and criticize and isolate them, we need to love them, have compassion and bring them into the mainstream. The only way you're going to get rid of hate is through love. Every person I've ever known about that's been a white supremacist has left the movement through an act of compassion or love. They didn't leave it because someone convinced them that their belief systems were wrong.

Easier said than done, but yeah, I find this is worth a try instead of just skipping to Gitmo.
 
2021-01-13 6:54:18 PM  
When you look at the DHS's original analysis on possible uncontrolled contagions/bio weapons outbreak in the US, the US collapsed in a either a few weeks from bio weapons or 6-12 months from viral outbreak with high hospitalization rates.  We are fully realizing the possible outcomes from Operation Dark Winter and things are gonna get a lot worse because none of the simulations took into a wing of the government actively trying to destroy the system.  The podcast It Could Happen Here is slowly coming to fruition.
 
2021-01-13 6:55:05 PM  
I remember when that report came out. Oh how the right squealed! If they'd had the phrase "cancel culture" they would have used it.

Just like the CDC isn't allowed to study gun violence, Homeland Security (and FBI) hasn't been allowed to study or track RWNJs. The Dems don't squeal like that when DHS call environmentalists terrorists, so all recognized domestic terrorist organizations are lefty. The FBI's got some catching up to do.
 
2021-01-13 6:55:38 PM  
The problem is that everything we're doing is simply addressing the symptoms.  The root cause is that a large minority of the population is in a complete unreality bubble that reinforces lies.

We will not get these people back to reality unless we start to enforce some kind of norms on the media they consume.

Fox News, AM radio, random guys driving around on YouTube, and now OANN and NewsMax (and probably TrumpTV) exist to stoke hatred and division by warping truth into bullshiat.

We need to bring back the fairness doctrine and update it so it applies to all media that claims to be news--and that includes 'entertainment' programs and editorial segments.  Everyone's allowed to have and broadcast their own opinion, but if you present things that are factually and demonstrably untrue as true, then there should be some kind of penalty.

Yes, China has reeducation camps for the UIghur, but that's a farking crime against humanity and we are better than that.  We just need to stop letting people lie for profit and brainwash people who don't know any better.
 
2021-01-13 6:57:38 PM  

rjakobi: Every person I've ever known about that's been a white supremacist has left the movement through an act of compassion or love. They didn't leave it because someone convinced them that their belief systems were wrong.

Easier said than done, but yeah, I find this is worth a try instead of just skipping to Gitmo.


Actually, one left the movement in the 6th of January when she was shot trying to break into the capitol.
 
2021-01-13 6:57:50 PM  
"NBC NEWS: Do you believe the president's defeat will potentially stoke the fires even more, or do you think his ouster paves the way for calming them?

JOHNSON: It has the potential to do either. And it's going to depend on Republican leaders, what they decide to do. Because the Democrats, no matter how hard they're going to try, these people won't listen. It's going to take Republican leadership for these people to listen and actually tone down.
"


America is boned.
 
2021-01-13 6:58:11 PM  

Nadie_AZ: how do we de radicalize a large segment of the US population that backed a fascist and some of them even stormed the halls of the Federal Government in that effort?


Address the societal woes that have a boot on half the necks in America, for starters.  Do something to reverse the 4 decades of upward transfer of wealth.  Put for-profit corporations in their place and remove them from any and all roles of public service (buh-bye health-insurance leeches).  Break up the mega-corporations into sensible sizes.  Fix political campaign financing.  Close Gitmo.  End the wars.  Legalize pot and fix the roads/bridges/infrastructure.  Institute a living wage or better yet, UBI.  Increase Social Security.  Increase education spending to ridiculous levels to make up for the decades of reduced funding.

Huh, looks like everyone is happier, oh, except for a few dozen oligarchs, but fark their feelings, amirite?  When people are healthy, educated and can afford leisure time due to higher wages they aren't angrily searching on the internet for why they feel a rage inside.  Cuz they won't feel a rage inside.  When you have an imbalance of power and resources like we do in the U.S., political instability quickly follows.  Kvetching about details of how fascists are influencing people will not solve the problems.
 
2021-01-13 6:58:19 PM  
He thinks the solution is more hugs.  Not gun control.  Not bringing down the wrath of god when these numbnuts engage in terrorism.  We should instead be nice to them to avoid hurting their fee fees.

Maybe we should have tried that with ISIS, or Nazi Germany.  Maybe when they invaded France they were really just looking for love.
 
2021-01-13 7:01:15 PM  

Moroning: The only thing Fascists understand is punches to the face.


hey now.

That's inflammatory and unless you are punching nazis, you shouldn't tell anyone else that it's okay.

/s
 
2021-01-13 7:01:26 PM  

quiotu: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/hDNiNdsP​HNA?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3​A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsap​i=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&​widgetid=1]

This was posted on The White House Youtube channel some 35 minutes ago.

This man is scared out of his farking mind, if he's willing to actually sit down and say this.

But it's not enough... I'm pretty sure he didn't run this on actual TV, though I could be wrong. He could have made sure it was seen by all Americans, but he did not. He just threw it on a channel very few know about... so he could say he denounced everything.

I have a feeling this is the last we'll see of him on TV. If he does anything weapons grade stupid before his term is over, he's basically stabbing Mitch and the GOP in the back... again.

And he might just do it.


Yeah. this is a little kid saying they're sorry they're being caught doing something wrong.  Also, talking like he has been drugged.
 
2021-01-13 7:01:41 PM  

austerity101: So:

- de-Nazification
- help the working class

Seems "simple" enough for me.  So of course we won't do it.


Well luckily the person running the Senate isn't an obstructionist so we've got that (not) going for us.
 
2021-01-13 7:02:03 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: A lot of these people live in towns where EVERYONE TACITLY AGREES WITH THEM. There is no one to provide love to them, much less a counter-narrative. Everyone in their family is a Trump voter. Everyone in their workplace is a Trump voter. Everyone in their church is a Trump voter. And the few that are not are smart enough to keep quiet about it.


Look, all you need to say is you can't be bothered to help this guy and we'll understand.  All this "nobody will change their mind about Trump" crap hasn't brought out the result we desired so some of us are trying something different.
 
2021-01-13 7:03:38 PM  

quiotu: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/hDNiNdsP​HNA?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3​A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsap​i=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&​widgetid=1]

This was posted on The White House Youtube channel some 35 minutes ago.

This man is scared out of his farking mind, if he's willing to actually sit down and say this.

But it's not enough... I'm pretty sure he didn't run this on actual TV, though I could be wrong. He could have made sure it was seen by all Americans, but he did not. He just threw it on a channel very few know about... so he could say he denounced everything.

I have a feeling this is the last we'll see of him on TV. If he does anything weapons grade stupid before his term is over, he's basically stabbing Mitch and the GOP in the back... again.

And he might just do it.


Ah, now he's turning on the supporters he sent. He's stabbed everyone close to him in the back, might as well stab the millions of his rube base too to save his skin.

"But he told me to march on the capitol and fight!  Why am I going to jail?"
 
2021-01-13 7:04:49 PM  
Maybe start treating the terrorists like terrorists?
 
2021-01-13 7:05:15 PM  
Their endgame: murder and mayhem leading to fascist control of the country

Our counter: love

I'm going to head all the desks.
 
2021-01-13 7:05:30 PM  
Well, one of the problems is that MSM loves right-wing extremism because it makes more some tasty page clicks, it whips people in a frenzy, and makes for a great business. They cannot help but propagate right wing extremism by allowing them a platform and then greatly embellishing their numbers and influence, which ironically serves to bolster their numbers and influence becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy.

What is being done to Parler, Trump's Twitter and social media is fantastic. Now, rather than drowning everyone in hopeless dystopian noise, the MSM SHOULD be focusing almost entirely on an optimistic future and starve these asshats from the attention they seek. Yeah, punch Nazis and all that, but more importantly don't farking hand them the microphone to begin with. This is where we are failing hard. If you believed what MSM is telling you, 50+ million people are supportive of the actual insurrectionists and terrorists - this is patently false bullshiat sensationalism.

I am not saying we don't call people out publicly when they are douches, but this media fixation is every bit to blame for where we are now as Trump. Couldn't help but eat that shiat up and pump his toxicity out to everyone.
 
2021-01-13 7:07:00 PM  

quo vadimus: If you've got family members, neighbors, co-workers that are part of these movements, rather than ostracize and debate and criticize and isolate them, we need to love them, have compassion and bring them into the mainstream. The only way you're going to get rid of hate is through love. Every person I've ever known about that's been a white supremacist has left the movement through an act of compassion or love. They didn't leave it because someone convinced them that their belief systems were wrong.

He's the expert, so maybe this is true. I'm just not a big enough person to live with the feeling that I rewarded someone for being willfully ignorant, bigoted, and violent. Thousands of people are dying every day now. I guess that's because we didn't run up to the anti-maskers and hug them when they were parading through stores, shoving employees, and coughing in peoples' faces? I guess it wasn't compassionate enough to only shoot ONE of the thousands of insurrectionists, despite how close they were to assassinating 1/3 of our government.

He's the expert, so maybe he's right. But since we haven't tried just sticking them all in Florida and Alabama, then walling it off, we don't know for sure that that wouldn't also work. It certainly seems like it would be easier and less costly in terms of lives than "loving" the sense back into them.


I think he's right about all the ones leaving having done so through love, but that doesn't mean all the ones who haven't just haven't gotten enough hugs. Some folks just can't be reached, just aren't going to change, and will slap away a helping hand no matter how much love it's offered with. He is the expert, so I take what he's saying very seriously, but I think if you look around, there's evidence he's wrong, or at least not right about everyone.
 
2021-01-13 7:07:03 PM  

Moroning: The only thing Fascists understand is punches to the face.


I disagree.  They never understand anything.  There is no reason to ever explain anything to them.  Personally, I think the people found guilty of the attack on democracy need to be shipped off to serve all the people in US concentration camps for the next 20 years and be rated by those refugees.  If they are poorly rated, send them to gitmo for Islam training.  When their term is finished, they can swim back.

I figure being a servant 24/7 for 20 years would do them all good.
 
2021-01-13 7:08:08 PM  
And what he doesn't suggest is calling for mass executions, labeling people as traitors and declaring a need for increasing the police state.

His solution is the only solution that ever achieves anything. Community organization.

If you have radicalized family whom you can tolerate, keep trying to deradicalize them.

Consider two scenarios. One, a radicalized person is ostracized and ridiculed, they turn to people who share their views and values for needed validation. Thet silo themselves and become further radicalized. Their only community is online and they have no meaningful connections in their actual lives. Why not turn to terrorism? They have nothing good to live for and all of this anger.

Consider the conservative who is treated with kindness by their family, even if they don't entertain the persons politics, they still treat them like a valued person. That person might vote the wrong way, but they aren't going to take up arms.

The thing that stops terror is a recognition of humanity. And that is both for the radicalized individual and by the radicalized individual.

This might be difficult to accept but it's just how people work. And as good as it might feel to say "fark your feelings" to the right wing, the thing that is supposed to differentiate the left is that we care about how people feel and preventing unnecessary pain and suffering. Even if there isn't profit in it.
 
2021-01-13 7:09:42 PM  

Farker Soze: quiotu: [iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/hDNiNdsP​HNA?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3​A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsap​i=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&​widgetid=1]

This was posted on The White House Youtube channel some 35 minutes ago.

This man is scared out of his farking mind, if he's willing to actually sit down and say this.

But it's not enough... I'm pretty sure he didn't run this on actual TV, though I could be wrong. He could have made sure it was seen by all Americans, but he did not. He just threw it on a channel very few know about... so he could say he denounced everything.

I have a feeling this is the last we'll see of him on TV. If he does anything weapons grade stupid before his term is over, he's basically stabbing Mitch and the GOP in the back... again.

And he might just do it.

Ah, now he's turning on the supporters he sent. He's stabbed everyone close to him in the back, might as well stab the millions of his rube base too to save his skin.

"But he told me to march on the capitol and fight!  Why am I going to jail?"


Once again, and again, and again, no accountability for causing this, no backing off the voter fraud bullshiat, no earnest concession to Biden, just more empty words about not wanting violence and crying about being cut off social media.

If his twitter account was still up I would expect hime to contradict everything he said in the video within 15 minutes, Greatest Most Best Election In The History Of Forever!! Stolen!! from PATRIOTS!!, Don't Let It Happen!!! etc.

Fark this lying disingenuous rapist.
 
2021-01-13 7:09:56 PM  

the money is in the banana stand: Well, one of the problems is that MSM loves right-wing extremism because it makes more some tasty page clicks, it whips people in a frenzy, and makes for a great business. They cannot help but propagate right wing extremism by allowing them a platform and then greatly embellishing their numbers and influence, which ironically serves to bolster their numbers and influence becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy.

What is being done to Parler, Trump's Twitter and social media is fantastic. Now, rather than drowning everyone in hopeless dystopian noise, the MSM SHOULD be focusing almost entirely on an optimistic future and starve these asshats from the attention they seek. Yeah, punch Nazis and all that, but more importantly don't farking hand them the microphone to begin with. This is where we are failing hard. If you believed what MSM is telling you, 50+ million people are supportive of the actual insurrectionists and terrorists - this is patently false bullshiat sensationalism.

I am not saying we don't call people out publicly when they are douches, but this media fixation is every bit to blame for where we are now as Trump. Couldn't help but eat that shiat up and pump his toxicity out to everyone.


Yeah, but if you don't give Nazis the mic you are silencing the simple difference of opinion of Real Americans.  You will never convince them otherwise.  They've proven that they are incapable of the introspection required to make that change.
 
2021-01-13 7:13:07 PM  
quiotu:

This was posted on The White House Youtube channel some 35 minutes ago.

This man is scared out of his farking mind, if he's willing to actually sit down and say this.



Um, guys, I hate to type this, but to me he actually sounded properly presidential. Didn't lie about the election outcome, didn't blame violence on someone else (although he didn't say he was sorry, either).

Was that really President Trump or just a skilled mimic?
 
2021-01-13 7:13:59 PM  
You know what? No. fark this guy and his "We need to love and nurture these people!" bullshiat. You know how you deradicalize people? By making radicalization so abhorrent and dangerous that no one wants to try. And it works. Germany basically made being a Nazi illegal after WW2, and they're one of the few countries not having major issues with far right nationalists right now. Meanwhile, the rest of us are wringing our hands about possibly hurting some white trash piece of shiat's feelings? fark that. Take their guns. Throw their leaders in prison to rot till they die. Assault their compounds, bomb their meeting places, burn their flags, and salt the ground they lived on.

It'll suck for a while - chemo always does, if you don't catch the cancer early enough. But it's the only way we move forward. Make it absolutely and undoubtedly toxic to be a right wing extremist.
 
2021-01-13 7:16:40 PM  

oa330_man: rjakobi: Every person I've ever known about that's been a white supremacist has left the movement through an act of compassion or love. They didn't leave it because someone convinced them that their belief systems were wrong.

Easier said than done, but yeah, I find this is worth a try instead of just skipping to Gitmo.

Actually, one left the movement in the 6th of January when she was shot trying to break into the capitol.


Approves
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2021-01-13 7:17:21 PM  

recombobulator: He thinks the solution is more hugs.  Not gun control.  Not bringing down the wrath of god when these numbnuts engage in terrorism.  We should instead be nice to them to avoid hurting their fee fees.

Maybe we should have tried that with ISIS, or Nazi Germany.  Maybe when they invaded France they were really just looking for love.


The problem isn't the guns.  It is the people using the guns.  Take care of the problems I listed above and we won't have angry/mentally unstable people shooting places up.
 
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