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(WV Gazette Mail)   Someone help this poor guy out as he's asking an impossible question. Why do evangelicals love Trump?   (wvgazettemail.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Virtue, Evangelicalism, Jimmy Carter, own life, op-ed columns, West Virginia, sense of shock, Donald Trump  
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3014 clicks; posted to Politics » on 27 Dec 2020 at 1:20 PM (15 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-12-27 8:44:03 AM  
Because they've been told to.  Just like everything else in their lives.  Next question?
 
2020-12-27 8:55:42 AM  
Transactional relationship.....
 
2020-12-27 8:56:09 AM  
Not that complicated. He pays lip service to their "conservative" social agenda (although he probably doesn't actually understand it). Having chosen to support him over that, they then have to deal with the massive cognitive dissonance that comes from everything else he does, and they handle that by being "all in" on Trump.

The latter part comes easier than you might expect: conservatives on the whole are inherently "follow the leader" personalities (compare for example how other prominent GOP figures talked about Trump before and after he won the nomination).

And this isn't anything new: Trump is the logical end-point of the Faustian bargain evangelicals made with Reagan.
 
2020-12-27 8:57:05 AM  
Evangelicals, preppers (well, small government types), and fiscal conservatives are single issue voters.  The GOP promises to address their single issue and they come out as a massive bloc.  They then get screwed over and tell themselves that their guy was great but wasn't far enough right or was thwarted by Nancy Pelosi, George Soros, and reverse vampires.  Usually both.
 
2020-12-27 8:58:13 AM  
Why does anyone love Trump?


/mental illness
 
2020-12-27 9:02:12 AM  
They're not really religious, in the sense of following a higher moral code. They're sheep, following a Master, in the sense of a flock being led to fleecing.

Trump bought off their leaders and they said, "Follow Him!"
 
2020-12-27 9:08:13 AM  
They haven't heard anything negative about Trump, or if they have, discount those things as "fake news"

We all have our own "filter bubbles" now and it's difficult to reach out to anyone who is not already in yours.

It may be difficult to believe but this is true. I have Trump supporting co-workers and clients, they haven't heard most of the facts about Trump.
 
2020-12-27 9:12:22 AM  
 
2020-12-27 9:16:09 AM  
Religious people are hard-wired to love charlatans and their bullshiat.  Jim Jones didn't manage to kill over 900 people without understanding how to make them believe him, and then how to control them.  Trump is a dumber, more ignorant version of Jones, but still very much a cult leader.
 
2020-12-27 9:20:16 AM  

HighOnCraic: The Christian Devotion to a White America

https://newrepublic.com/article/158845​/tom-cotton-slavery-christianity-white​-supremacy


This.  The root cause is racism.  Secondarily, the blind allegiance of your average evangelical rube means they put rational thinking aside and do what their "leaders" say.
 
2020-12-27 9:21:21 AM  
Because for some of them, "evangelical" means "God told me straight white men should have all the power," and being evangelical means you can ignore civil rights, women's rights, LGBT rights, and essentially the last 50-70 years of American history and believe the world is still the way it was in your childhood.

For others, they believe their life is a narrative, and the story ends with them all being vindicated while their enemies are humiliated.  They imagine the world doesn't matter since it will all be destroyed, and Trump encourages them to believe that the story is 'playing out' and their lives have meaning.

For others, they want a strong authoritarian voice telling them what to do and speaking with absolute certitude.  They don't want nuance.  That seems weak to them.  They were swayed by Trump because of his tone, and they didn't really care that what he said was nonsense.  He "spoke with authority, unlike their own teachers."

Others thrive on persecution.  They believe in the "line of blood" theory that says the True Church is the one that gets reviled and oppressed.  Trump must be right because the "elites" hate him, plus they believe they live in a perpetually hostile world and Trump reinforces that belief for them.

Others hate abortion and gay rights.  They might not like Trump but the Democrats are f*gs and baby-killers, so what can you do?

Others, especially the pastors, see material benefits to being attached to Trump.  They're happy to support him because there's no money in being opposed to him, but why keep your convictions when you can sell them for a place at the National Prayer Breakfast?

And lastly, there are some who are mad that the world is changing, mad that their time in it is almost done, and would rather see it burn than believe people will still have lives once they're gone.  THEIR world ends at their death, so why shouldn't everyone else's?
 
2020-12-27 9:26:17 AM  
People in cults tend to believe what they're told, and not ask questions.
 
2020-12-27 9:43:13 AM  
Donnie brings the First Testament God to life.
 
2020-12-27 10:40:27 AM  
Abortion.
 
2020-12-27 10:43:29 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-12-27 10:45:26 AM  
My brother in law and his wife are super religious. It's all about abortions. Period.

Anything Republicans do that is bad is simply waived away with "I can't vote for baby killing!" (always said with the beaming pride of moral superiority)

Once my mother and law passes away he's out of my life for good.
 
2020-12-27 10:45:44 AM  
mother IN law


d'oh!
 
2020-12-27 10:46:05 AM  

Sub Human: They haven't heard anything negative about Trump, or if they have, discount those things as "fake news"

We all have our own "filter bubbles" now and it's difficult to reach out to anyone who is not already in yours.

It may be difficult to believe but this is true. I have Trump supporting co-workers and clients, they haven't heard most of the facts about Trump.


This may be true, but the leaders of these movements certainly know all about Trump, and have actively hidden that information from their flocks or simply implored them to follow him in spite of them.
 
2020-12-27 11:01:03 AM  
I have always admired the humanity, and decency, of many of the devout Christians I have known and worked beside

*cough cough cough bullsh*t cough*
 
2020-12-27 11:27:38 AM  
Because a very high percentage of evangelicals are just bigoted assholes who use a couple dozen words out of context from a book to further their divine agenda.

Dump is the embodiment of their warped faith.
 
2020-12-27 11:28:13 AM  

Albert911emt: Religious people are hard-wired to love charlatans and their bullshiat.  Jim Jones didn't manage to kill over 900 people without understanding how to make them believe him, and then how to control them.  Trump is a dumber, more ignorant version of Jones, but still very much a cult leader.


And he's killed many, many more people than Jim Jones.
 
2020-12-27 11:28:39 AM  
Right-wing political Christianity has nothing to do with Jesus Christ.
 
2020-12-27 11:30:09 AM  
Because they're as crazy as he is.

And abortion.
 
2020-12-27 11:34:57 AM  
Evangelicals correlatively tend high-RWA, and to a lesser degree high-SDO. Both correlate to racism, and to support for Trump.

The arrow of time suggests that support for Trump was more a consequence than a cause.
 
2020-12-27 11:35:28 AM  
Because, he's so dreamy. Evangelicals never worshiped Sunday School Jesus. They much prefer Supply-side Jesus.
 
2020-12-27 11:41:48 AM  
media0.giphy.comView Full Size
 
2020-12-27 11:44:30 AM  

Hoban Washburne: HighOnCraic: The Christian Devotion to a White America

https://newrepublic.com/article/158845​/tom-cotton-slavery-christianity-white​-supremacy

This.  The root cause is racism.  Secondarily, the blind allegiance of your average evangelical rube means they put rational thinking aside and do what their "leaders" say.


And many of their leaders told them God approved of racism.

https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/bl​o​gs/evangelical-history/is-segregation-​scriptural-a-radio-address-from-bob-jo​nes-on-easter-of-1960/
 
2020-12-27 11:47:32 AM  
For the ones that actually try, even a just little, to reconcile Trump's words and actions with their faith, it begins and ends with the Supreme Court.  He's a "flawed vessel", or something.  Any given president is in office for 4-8 years, and many of their actions can be contained, mitigated, or reversed.  The current conservative majority on the court is likely to last a generation, and supreme court decisions can potentially affect the trajectory of the country for centuries.
 
2020-12-27 11:51:46 AM  

Sub Human: They haven't heard anything negative about Trump, or if they have, discount those things as "fake news"

We all have our own "filter bubbles" now and it's difficult to reach out to anyone who is not already in yours.

It may be difficult to believe but this is true. I have Trump supporting co-workers and clients, they haven't heard most of the facts about Trump.


I think many have heard lots of facts about Trump. Just fake news though, of course.
 
2020-12-27 12:03:16 PM  
Because only trump can save them from socialism long enough for the medicaid check to come in.
 
2020-12-27 12:13:05 PM  
Trump hates the same people they hate.
 
2020-12-27 12:20:35 PM  

bostonguy: Right-wing political Christianity has nothing to do with Jesus Christ.


You know how for the last four years, you haven't been able to swing a dead cat without some never-Trumper publishing an op-ed about how "racism was never a core Republican value" or "Conservatism is about freedom, not about dividing people?" After four years of Trump - of actually paying attention to what he's doing, and thinking about how it relates to the New Testament - I hear "Evangelicals have nothing to do with Jesus" basically the same way.

Trump, just by pure showman instinct, tapped into a number of ideas that are central to Christianity:

- The idea that Christians are a favored religious minority oppressed by "elites" who hold all the power, but don't worry, those elites are about humiliated (1 Corinthians 1:27.)

- The idea that Christians, and Christians only, are the rightful rulers of the world, and their power comes from God so man's rules don't apply to you.(Matthew 19:27-28,Matthew 12:1-7 among many others)

- The only reason anyone would decline to in Christianity and join them is because you are evil - so evil you are worthy of death and destruction. (Many, many passages, but good examples are Matthew 11:20-24, or John 3:16-20)

- Conservative Christianity is happy to accept you, whatever group you come from, provided you start off so humble you don't care if people treat you like a second-class citizen. (See, for example, the story of the Canaanite woman, Matthew 15:21-28, or the Parable of the Prodigal son, Luke 15:11-31)

---------

Now, I know a lot of people get mad when I say things like this. They'll accuse me of misinterpreting all of the passages I quoted because I'm not presupposing that their meaning is morally perfect - I don't think I am, since I spent 20 years listening to pastors give basically the same exegeses but act they were good things.

They will respond with, "You're wrong because what about all the nice things Jesus said about love and forgiveness? Aren't those his central message?" You know who else says really nice things about love and forgives you for burning his dinner but threatens to kill you if you ever leave him? An abusive husband.

People will also say, "What about this church I like, or my church, or Jimmy Carter?" If you can find positive meaning in Christianity, great! There are some parts of it I like too. The problem is that just because you've filtered out the bad doesn't mean the bad isn't in the source material, and you can't act surprised when it keeps popping up again and again for thousands of years.

"But Trump clearly doesn't believe and doesn't pay lip service to love and doesn't follow evangelical sexual mores." Entirely true. This was the main reason I didn't think Evangelicals would fall in behind Trump. But at the end of the day he promised them the power to make America reflect the ideas I mentioned, and I guess that makes up for it.

---------

TL;DR:

"Christianity is about love, not shiatting on other groups of people" = "The Republican Party is about freedom, not racism"
 
2020-12-27 12:27:37 PM  

Forty-Three: For the ones that actually try, even a just little, to reconcile Trump's words and actions with their faith, it begins and ends with the Supreme Court.  He's a "flawed vessel", or something.


I've had Christian Trumpers tell me that King David and King Solomon were flawed. And Trump is flawed.

I have never pictured myself doing such a big facepalm in my life during those conversations. DO NOT COMPARE DONALD TRUMP TO DAVID AND SOLOMON.* And, Christians, do not interpret some of the major figures in my religion and culture for me, thanks.

/ that is the very definition of chutzpah
 
2020-12-27 12:28:28 PM  

Martian_Astronomer: The idea that Christians are a favored religious minority oppressed by "elites" who hold all the power, but don't worry, those elites are about to be humiliated


FTFM
 
2020-12-27 12:29:50 PM  

SpectroBoy: My brother in law and his wife are super religious. It's all about abortions. Period.


I want someone on live TV to ask Trump how many abortions he has paid for either in full or in part.
 
2020-12-27 12:34:42 PM  
Politicians like Trump are kind of an emergent property of the toxic primordial soup that Evangelicals have created for themselves. Here's a whole book on the subject by a history professor at a Dutch Reformed church-run college:

public-platform.s3.amazonaws.comView Full Size


"...American evangelicals have worked for decades to replace the Jesus of the Gospels with an idol of rugged masculinity and Christian nationalism, or in the words of one modern chaplain, with 'a spiritual badass.' ... And evangelical popular culture is teeming with muscular heroes―mythical warriors and rugged soldiers, men like Oliver North, Ronald Reagan, Mel Gibson, and the Duck Dynasty clan, who assert white masculine power in defense of 'Christian America.'

"Trump, in other words, is hardly the first flashy celebrity to capture evangelicals' hearts and minds, nor is he the first strongman to promise evangelicals protection and power. Indeed, the values and viewpoints at the heart of white evangelicalism today―patriarchy, authoritarian rule, aggressive foreign policy, fear of Islam, ambivalence toward #MeToo, and opposition to Black Lives Matter and the LGBTQ community―are likely to persist long after Trump leaves office."


https://kristindumez.com/books/jesus-​a​nd-john-wayne/
 
2020-12-27 12:37:32 PM  
Once, the crazy thing for zealous Christians to do was to support communism and defect to the Soviet Union.

Today, it's to support fascism. (And be an asset of Russia?)
 
2020-12-27 12:42:50 PM  
I'm sorry. The answer to that question is ***CLASSIFIED***
 
2020-12-27 12:54:58 PM  
We could start by parsing out the main reasons: 1. He put judges on the court that evangelicals believe will overturn Roe. 2. This specific form of cognitive dissonance: "I'm not racist; I'm just against BLM and immigrants." 3. Because they actually believe loyalty to party is part and parcel of being loyal to the country and to Christianity, and most people who voted Biden aren't Real Americans somehow--and anyone who voted Biden and is Christian isn't the right kind of Christian.

One thing that's very often overlooked, though, is just how easy it is for anyone--liberals included--to look at Trump and see what they want to see. If someone wants to look at Trump and be convinced that he's a brilliant businessman and the stock market went up solely because of him, well, one can believe that. If someone wants to see Trump as a Christian pro-lifer, it's easy to look at his court picks and nod approval. If someone wants to see him as a strong man who can get things done--and tell themselves that this isn't the same as Mussolini somehow--one can do that, too. In 2016, I very much wanted to see Trump as an idiot and a sick joke who never would stand a chance at winning the Presidency. It was very easy to see him as that, right up until he very suddenly wasn't the loser on election night.

So, maybe this is best answered more simply: Why do evangelicals support him? Short answer: they see what they want to see.
 
2020-12-27 1:06:33 PM  
Evangelicals are proof that religion, like crime, is a minor nuisance until it's organized.
 
2020-12-27 1:14:02 PM  

bostonguy: Forty-Three: For the ones that actually try, even a just little, to reconcile Trump's words and actions with their faith, it begins and ends with the Supreme Court.  He's a "flawed vessel", or something.

I've had Christian Trumpers tell me that King David and King Solomon were flawed. And Trump is flawed.

I have never pictured myself doing such a big facepalm in my life during those conversations. DO NOT COMPARE DONALD TRUMP TO DAVID AND SOLOMON.* And, Christians, do not interpret some of the major figures in my religion and culture for me, thanks.

/ that is the very definition of chutzpah


I have also heard this specific comparison, and it really galls me too.  I'm not really "religious" now, but I did spend the first 18 years of my life in a rather progressive Methodist congregation in the northeast, whose teachings were pretty much the antithesis of Trump as a whole.  I used to try to engage hardcore "christian" Trump supporters on shiat like that, since I still remember enough from those days to counter such bs with actual religious arguments, but have (mostly) long since given up, because it's just so...futile
 
2020-12-27 1:18:37 PM  

Forty-Three: I used to try to engage hardcore "christian" Trump supporters on shiat like that, since I still remember enough from those days to counter such bs with actual religious arguments, but have (mostly) long since given up, because it's just so...futile


One of the first things you learn in marketing (yes, kill myself) is that people usually make decisions based on emotion and then rationalize the already-made decisions later.

Bonus round question: Republicans and Trumpers are really good at capitalizing on that. How can Democrats and liberals do the same?
 
2020-12-27 1:19:45 PM  

Some Junkie Cosmonaut: Because they've been told to.  Just like everything else in their lives.  Next question?


This. They are already self selecting to be brainwashed incurious unthinking robots.

Also this:
https://forsetti.tumblr.com/post/1531​8​1757500/on-rural-america-understanding​-isnt-the-problem
 
2020-12-27 1:23:05 PM  
Power to impose their will over their fellows in a humanistic manner. Ya know, the opposite of what Christ actually taught.
Duh
 
2020-12-27 1:23:17 PM  

HugeMistake: Not that complicated. He pays lip service to their "conservative" social agenda (although he probably doesn't actually understand it). Having chosen to support him over that, they then have to deal with the massive cognitive dissonance that comes from everything else he does, and they handle that by being "all in" on Trump.

The latter part comes easier than you might expect: conservatives on the whole are inherently "follow the leader" personalities (compare for example how other prominent GOP figures talked about Trump before and after he won the nomination).

And this isn't anything new: Trump is the logical end-point of the Faustian bargain evangelicals made with Reagan.


I'm not convinced they experience cognitive dissonance.  That would tend to lead them to reject one or the other conflicting idea, which they never do.
 
2020-12-27 1:23:38 PM  
https://youtu.be/IKLVIm7Q0IQ?t=64
Donald Trump: "I haven't asked God for forgiveness "
Youtube IKLVIm7Q0IQ



Trump admits that he has never asked god for forgiveness, nor would he ever need to do such a thing as he always makes things right if he does something wrong to someone.
 
2020-12-27 1:24:15 PM  

Hoban Washburne: HighOnCraic: The Christian Devotion to a White America

https://newrepublic.com/article/158845​/tom-cotton-slavery-christianity-white​-supremacy

This.  The root cause is racism.  Secondarily, the blind allegiance of your average evangelical rube means they put rational thinking aside and do what their "leaders" say.


Yup. The end goal of the evangelical movement was never ending abortion. It was, is and always will be segregation. They want a walled-off white society where they're never bothered by anything outside their little white Jesus bubble.
 
2020-12-27 1:24:24 PM  
Because he's just as venal and horrible as they are.  He validates their behavior and attitudes.
 
2020-12-27 1:24:49 PM  
Evangelicals do not care WHO trump is.  They only perceive him as who he can be.

yep, pretty messed up if you ask me.
 
2020-12-27 1:25:01 PM  

Albert911emt: Religious people are hard-wired to love charlatans and their bullshiat.  Jim Jones didn't manage to kill over 900 people without understanding how to make them believe him, and then how to control them.  Trump is a dumber, more ignorant version of Jones, but still very much a cult leader.


And on January 6th, he's having his very own Jonestown
 
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