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(Reuters)   You know your judiciary is world class when three judges get into a 3am drunken fight at White Castle   (reuters.com) divider line
    More: Awkward, Judge, JudgeLes Hayes, Supreme Court of the United States, Judge Hayes, Judicial Inquiry Commission, state records, court documents, Cullman District Court's Kim Chaney  
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2968 clicks; posted to Politics » on 05 Dec 2020 at 2:56 PM (12 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-12-05 3:01:46 PM  
white southern judges being racist 
media1.giphy.comView Full Size
 
2020-12-05 3:09:32 PM  
Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?
 
2020-12-05 3:14:25 PM  
Absolutely shocked it wasn't New Jersey.
 
2020-12-05 3:15:37 PM  
Among judges who continue to serve after discipline for ethics breaches, I would be curious to see how many are elected and how many are appointed. I have a hunch that elected judges are a disproportionate part of the problem, but I would love to see some evidence one way or the other.
 
2020-12-05 3:17:21 PM  
How many are Turtle appointments?
 
2020-12-05 3:18:50 PM  
We have always had a two tier legal system .. This is nothing new but it needs to change ..
 
2020-12-05 3:19:29 PM  
FTA:
Judge Les Hayes once sentenced a single mother to 496 days behind bars for failing to pay traffic tickets. The sentence was so stiff it exceeded the jail time Alabama allows for negligent homicide.
Marquita Johnson, who was locked up in April 2012, says the impact of her time in jail endures today. Johnson's three children were cast into foster care while she was incarcerated. One daughter was molested, state records show. Another was physically abused.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-12-05 3:19:32 PM  
Not sure Wiggins really belonged at the bottom of the list.  The blood drive thing seemed more or less harmless.  I don't think he should be a judge, but I don't think he's a bad person.  Especially compared to the others listed.
 
2020-12-05 3:21:29 PM  
In Indiana, three judges attending a conference last spring got drunk and sparked a 3 a.m. brawl outside a White Castle fast-food restaurant that ended with two of the judges shot. Although the state supreme court found the three judges had "discredited the entire Indiana judiciary," each returned to the bench after a suspension.

Jeebus subby, way to bury the lead. Two of the judges got shot at the White Castle brawl! I want to party with those guys.
 
2020-12-05 3:22:07 PM  

casual disregard: Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?


Eat?
 
2020-12-05 3:22:37 PM  

BMulligan: Among judges who continue to serve after discipline for ethics breaches, I would be curious to see how many are elected and how many are appointed. I have a hunch that elected judges are a disproportionate part of the problem, but I would love to see some evidence one way or the other.


Electing judges seems like a good idea only if you have a well informed and reasonable electorate.  Judges should be appointed.  Makes them much easier to remove for one.
 
2020-12-05 3:22:52 PM  

BMulligan: Among judges who continue to serve after discipline for ethics breaches, I would be curious to see how many are elected and how many are appointed. I have a hunch that elected judges are a disproportionate part of the problem, but I would love to see some evidence one way or the other.


For the life of me, I'll never understand how judges can be elected officials in the US. Does any other country operate like that? I'm In Canada and it's unthinkable to me to have a judge on a ballot.
 
gcc [TotalFark]
2020-12-05 3:23:19 PM  
Law for three, but not for me.

Welcome to America, I'm glad you've enjoyed your first day here as much as I have.
 
2020-12-05 3:24:35 PM  
There's more than just a brawl in the White Castle incident. 3 judges (two men and a female judge) were bar hopping, and tried to get into a closed strip club at 3AM. After that, they were at White Castle when some locals drove by in a pickup truck. Words were exchanged, the female judge flipped them off, then hilarity ensued.


Back in the wee hours of the May 1, 2019 morning, the three judges wanted to party after a Spring Judicial College event. They got smashed, tried to go into a closed strip club at 3am, then, dejectedly, ended up at that storied American burger establishment: White Castle. Two men drove past the judges, shouting something at them, and Judge Bell offered up her middle finger in response.

The men in the car were not amused, and then both sides spewed vulgarities and aggressive gestures. Failing to either "avoid a confrontation or de-escalate the conflict," Judge Jacobs punched one of judges' foes to the ground. Judge Adams, at one point during the fracas, kicked the same guy, Brandon Kaiser, in the back.

Setting aside later discipline, it didn't end up great for the judges. The Honorable Jacobs and Adams ended up being shot by Kaiser, who later was charged with multiple aggravated assault counts, and sent to a local hospital for emergency surgery.



https://filtermag.org/judges-brawl-in​d​iana/
 
2020-12-05 3:24:58 PM  

Glenford: BMulligan: Among judges who continue to serve after discipline for ethics breaches, I would be curious to see how many are elected and how many are appointed. I have a hunch that elected judges are a disproportionate part of the problem, but I would love to see some evidence one way or the other.

For the life of me, I'll never understand how judges can be elected officials in the US. Does any other country operate like that? I'm In Canada and it's unthinkable to me to have a judge on a ballot.


There's a few, but it's overwhelmingly by appointment everywhere else.
 
2020-12-05 3:25:00 PM  
Goddamnit, I was really hoping it had happened again.  Way to get my hopes up.

That aside, Jesus Christ we need to investigate each and every single instance of judicial malfeasance and yank these monsters off the bench.  What an utter disgrace.
 
2020-12-05 3:29:06 PM  

Glenford: BMulligan: Among judges who continue to serve after discipline for ethics breaches, I would be curious to see how many are elected and how many are appointed. I have a hunch that elected judges are a disproportionate part of the problem, but I would love to see some evidence one way or the other.

For the life of me, I'll never understand how judges can be elected officials in the US. Does any other country operate like that? I'm In Canada and it's unthinkable to me to have a judge on a ballot.


Same for Australia mate! As we say here, 'don't vote, it only encourages the bastards'. (We do vote, but we're in no doubt that we're voting for bastards.)

We don't elect judges anywhere in Australia but I've noticed in my home state that quite a proportion of the judges are from the same schools, which is not uncommon in legal sectors or politics. But wheras our politicians are disproportionally alumni of protestant private schools, our judges are disproportionally from catholic schools with a grounding in social justice. As someone who attended a b-grade protestant private school back in the day, I don't hate this. Our judges are nicer people than the guys I was at school with who wound up in politics.
 
2020-12-05 3:35:16 PM  

Aussie_As: In Indiana, three judges attending a conference last spring got drunk and sparked a 3 a.m. brawl outside a White Castle fast-food restaurant that ended with two of the judges shot. Although the state supreme court found the three judges had "discredited the entire Indiana judiciary," each returned to the bench after a suspension.

Jeebus subby, way to bury the lead. Two of the judges got shot at the White Castle brawl! I want to party with those guys.


I got to attend a three day conference at the National Judicial College once. There was a big cocktail hour/banquet on our last night and then the party went mobile. It was a fairly raucous event and a lot of fun, but no one got shot - which is lucky considering we were in Reno, where they've been known to shoot a man just to watch him die.
 
2020-12-05 3:38:07 PM  

casual disregard: Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?


Buy drugs?
 
2020-12-05 3:40:19 PM  

Aussie_As: In Indiana, three judges attending a conference last spring got drunk and sparked a 3 a.m. brawl outside a White Castle fast-food restaurant that ended with two of the judges shot. Although the state supreme court found the three judges had "discredited the entire Indiana judiciary," each returned to the bench after a suspension.

Jeebus subby, way to bury the lead. Two of the judges got shot at the White Castle brawl! I want to party with those guys.


Seriously
 
2020-12-05 3:40:47 PM  

kokomo61: There's more than just a brawl in the White Castle incident. 3 judges (two men and a female judge) were bar hopping, and tried to get into a closed strip club at 3AM. After that, they were at White Castle when some locals drove by in a pickup truck. Words were exchanged, the female judge flipped them off, then hilarity ensued.


Back in the wee hours of the May 1, 2019 morning, the three judges wanted to party after a Spring Judicial College event. They got smashed, tried to go into a closed strip club at 3am, then, dejectedly, ended up at that storied American burger establishment: White Castle. Two men drove past the judges, shouting something at them, and Judge Bell offered up her middle finger in response.

The men in the car were not amused, and then both sides spewed vulgarities and aggressive gestures. Failing to either "avoid a confrontation or de-escalate the conflict," Judge Jacobs punched one of judges' foes to the ground. Judge Adams, at one point during the fracas, kicked the same guy, Brandon Kaiser, in the back.

Setting aside later discipline, it didn't end up great for the judges. The Honorable Jacobs and Adams ended up being shot by Kaiser, who later was charged with multiple aggravated assault counts, and sent to a local hospital for emergency surgery.


https://filtermag.org/judges-brawl-ind​iana/


Yeah that sounds like just about any convention ever really.
 
2020-12-05 3:49:27 PM  

Glenford: BMulligan: Among judges who continue to serve after discipline for ethics breaches, I would be curious to see how many are elected and how many are appointed. I have a hunch that elected judges are a disproportionate part of the problem, but I would love to see some evidence one way or the other.

For the life of me, I'll never understand how judges can be elected officials in the US. Does any other country operate like that? I'm In Canada and it's unthinkable to me to have a judge on a ballot.


I like the idea of holding judges accountable, and I like the way Colorado handles it.  Judges are initially appointed and then every two years can be voted out.  The state does performance reviews that you can read before the election.  Here's an example: https://www.coloradojudicial​performanc​e.gov/retention.cfm?ret=1602.  Then on the ballot it simply asks whether so and so should be retained as a judge.  I think this avoids partisan wing nuts being elected into judicial positions but still lets them be tossed on their asses if they deserve it.
 
2020-12-05 3:59:42 PM  

LurkerSupreme: casual disregard: Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?

Buy drugs?


qorkfiend: casual disregard: Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?

Eat?


I was gonna go with "unload the truck and put the food in the fridge" but it sounds like y'all have worked for a living.
 
2020-12-05 4:29:42 PM  
I still can't figure out how a judge in a municipal court is allowed to sentence anyone to jail time of any length.
 
2020-12-05 4:38:48 PM  
How do you write a sentence like this:

"Judicial misconduct specialists say such behavior has the potential to erode trust in America's courts and, absent tough consequences, could give judges license to behave with impunity."

...in the middle of an article clearly laying out that this has already taken place, and not due from an irony-induced aneurysm?
 
2020-12-05 4:39:45 PM  

Man with the Red Eyes: How do you write a sentence like this:

"Judicial misconduct specialists say such behavior has the potential to erode trust in America's courts and, absent tough consequences, could give judges license to behave with impunity."

...in the middle of an article clearly laying out that this has already taken place, and not due from an irony-induced aneurysm?


Die*, not due.
 
2020-12-05 4:42:08 PM  

qorkfiend: casual disregard: Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?

Eat?


At a White Castle?
Hard pass.
 
2020-12-05 4:44:00 PM  
Read the whole article. Its shocking and appalling.
 
2020-12-05 4:50:48 PM  

Gyrfalcon: Read the whole article. Its shocking and appalling.


Yes.  I know it flies in the face of all Fark dot com conventions, but read the article.
 
2020-12-05 5:03:27 PM  

ViolentEastCoastCity: Absolutely shocked it wasn't New Jersey.


Yup.   NJ judges are all appointed and are especially noxious.
 
2020-12-05 5:11:54 PM  
If this happened at a Waffle House they would chalk it up to being just another typical Tuesday.
 
2020-12-05 5:15:59 PM  
Holy Fock.

Biggest takeaway, don't go near alabama. If you needed another reason.
 
2020-12-05 5:20:53 PM  

fragMasterFlash: If this happened at a Waffle House they would chalk it up to being just another typical Tuesday.


It's what makes Waffle House special. Every one I've ever been in is essentially a David Lynch movie with slightly worse lighting.
 
2020-12-05 5:23:03 PM  

Fissile: ViolentEastCoastCity: Absolutely shocked it wasn't New Jersey.

Yup.   NJ judges are all appointed and are especially noxious.


I mostly meant because fighting at White Castle at 3am is peak New Jersey, but yes that too.
 
2020-12-05 5:27:51 PM  

Avery614: FTA:
Judge Les Hayes once sentenced a single mother to 496 days behind bars for failing to pay traffic tickets. The sentence was so stiff it exceeded the jail time Alabama allows for negligent homicide.
Marquita Johnson, who was locked up in April 2012, says the impact of her time in jail endures today. Johnson's three children were cast into foster care while she was incarcerated. One daughter was molested, state records show. Another was physically abused.

[Fark user image image 425x239]


Judicial discretion was supposed to PREVENT this. But instead it's used so rich, young rapists don't ruin their lives by getting caught.


And a lot of our society is based on the infallibility of the justice system.
It's awful to work with individuals who are in substance abuse recovery and who have to integrate the flaws of the justice system into an internal sense of "accountability".
 
2020-12-05 5:27:58 PM  

mrmopar5287: I still can't figure out how a judge in a municipal court is allowed to sentence anyone to jail time of any length.


They don't.

They just deny them bail and set their court date 3 years away.
 
2020-12-05 5:32:17 PM  

Ishkur: mrmopar5287: I still can't figure out how a judge in a municipal court is allowed to sentence anyone to jail time of any length.

They don't.

They just deny them bail and set their court date 3 years away.


What municipal offenses are there that a judge has to set bail?
 
2020-12-05 5:33:18 PM  

fragMasterFlash: If this happened at a Waffle House they would chalk it up to being just another typical Tuesday.


https://www.theonion.com/undaunted-te​x​as-waffle-house-waitress-has-been-expe​ctin-1843137772
 
2020-12-05 5:37:22 PM  
We're living in a nightmare combination of Starship Troopers and Idiocracy.
 
2020-12-05 5:41:48 PM  

mrmopar5287: What municipal offenses are there that a judge has to set bail?


If you want the defendant to actually show up -- everything.

Ever watch Night Court?
 
2020-12-05 5:49:01 PM  

Ishkur: If you want the defendant to actually show up -- everything.


It's a municipal court. The punishment is fines.

Unless I'm missing something where "municipal court" means something different in Alabama.
 
2020-12-05 6:15:28 PM  

mrmopar5287: It's a municipal court. The punishment is fines.


Misdemeanors can be fines, jail, or both. Municipal courts handle both misdemeanors and felonies, both of which offer jail time.

mrmopar5287: Unless I'm missing something where "municipal court" means something different in Alabama.


Doesn't sound like you know what municipal courts actually do.
 
2020-12-05 6:19:56 PM  

mrmopar5287: Ishkur: If you want the defendant to actually show up -- everything.

It's a municipal court. The punishment is fines.

Unless I'm missing something where "municipal court" means something different in Alabama.


Unpaid fines lead to jail time. It's one of the ways that municpalities use small fines to imprison non-white and impoverished citizens. The meter maid doesn't patrol the expensive neighbourhoods.
 
2020-12-05 6:30:21 PM  

Ishkur: Misdemeanors can be fines, jail, or both. Municipal courts handle both misdemeanors and felonies, both of which offer jail time.

Doesn't sound like you know what municipal courts actually do.


Oh God, it sounds like the title of "municipal court" is vastly different than in my state. We call them "administrative court" and it handles municipal ordinance violations that are offenses with only the threat of fines. No one can go to jail for ordinance violations.
 
2020-12-05 6:42:23 PM  

mrmopar5287: fragMasterFlash: If this happened at a Waffle House they would chalk it up to being just another typical Tuesday.

https://www.theonion.com/undaunted-tex​as-waffle-house-waitress-has-been-expe​ctin-1843137772


That town is about 8 miles from me right now

Honestly, don't think they have a Waffle House, you have to drive to Longview
 
2020-12-05 6:49:18 PM  

phamwaa: qorkfiend: casual disregard: Devil's advocate:

What the heck else would you do at 3 am at a White Castle?

Eat?

At a White Castle?
Hard pass.


Remember it is 3 am and you are drunk.
 
2020-12-05 9:11:01 PM  

mrmopar5287: Oh God, it sounds like the title of "municipal court" is vastly different than in my state. We call them "administrative court" and it handles municipal ordinance violations that are offenses with only the threat of fines. No one can go to jail for ordinance violations.


Administrative courts are NOT municipal courts. They are tribunals that resolve disputes, they don't require lawyers (though you can hire one if you like), and they have nothing to do with judicial courts (though administrative courts can be appealed to judicial courts). You know all the television judge shows like Judy, Wapner, etc? Those are administrative courts.

You're not even talking about the same thing now.
 
2020-12-05 10:17:10 PM  
Judges are humans. Humans are capable of horrible failures and turning into massive fark ups. Problem is in a 3-branch government there are very few ways for anyone but other judges to deal with them and any single profession is terrible at policing itself.
 
2020-12-05 10:17:35 PM  
Let me know when it's a Waffle House. Then I'll know we're really scraping bottom.
 
2020-12-05 10:40:49 PM  

archeochick: Avery614: FTA:
Judge Les Hayes once sentenced a single mother to 496 days behind bars for failing to pay traffic tickets. The sentence was so stiff it exceeded the jail time Alabama allows for negligent homicide.
Marquita Johnson, who was locked up in April 2012, says the impact of her time in jail endures today. Johnson's three children were cast into foster care while she was incarcerated. One daughter was molested, state records show. Another was physically abused.

[Fark user image image 425x239]

Judicial discretion was supposed to PREVENT this. But instead it's used so rich, young rapists don't ruin their lives by getting caught.


And a lot of our society is based on the infallibility of the justice system.
It's awful to work with individuals who are in substance abuse recovery and who have to integrate the flaws of the justice system into an internal sense of "accountability".


Absolutely. It's adding insult to injury considering that I personally know several who picked up their addiction while incarcerated.
 
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