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(Esquire)   This is all just a beta test for when the Republicans will just never accept a Democratic victory   (esquire.com) divider line
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2127 clicks; posted to Politics » on 23 Nov 2020 at 2:23 PM (13 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-11-23 12:32:14 PM  
Newt's legacy.
 
2020-11-23 12:36:27 PM  
The Republican party needs to be put out of our misery
 
2020-11-23 12:37:21 PM  
So their grand strategic plan is to evolve into the Larouchites?   Oh no, we must stop them.
 
2020-11-23 12:50:57 PM  
I actually agree with that premise, but the only thing that's keeping me sane is reflecting back on the arc of the GOP during the past three cycles. In 2008 they were still a relatively sane and legitimate party. Then stirred the beginnings of populism with the Tea Party and letting the inmates out of the asylum, even if just on a day pass, with Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and others who previously would never have been allowed near an electrical socket without a child cover, let alone national political power. By 2012 the GOP was in real trouble, with moderates being driven out and former "rising stars" like Cantor being taken out in primary after primary in a "race to the right". And by 2016, what was left of the former GOP was completely subsumed by Dump and his cult of MAGAs. And just when it looked like that was the worse outcome for the former Grand Old Party, along came Q, gift that just keeps on giving.

Hand to God, I honestly don't know if the GOP will even exist in 2024. They may still call themselves Republicans, but they will essentially just be a neo-fascist party led by Dump. The only way that ends is when he does, as neither of his chinless sons could ever fill his high-heeled shoes, and too many of the MAGA faithful could never bring themselves to follow a woman, even if her last name is Dump.

And if he DOES finally throw a 7 before 2024, then all bets are off. Literally no telling what kind of creatures will crawl out of the woodwork or from under their rocks looking to grab a slice of power. And doubtful that any one of them would be able to consolidate it under their own banner. We may finally get a few viable third parties, but they'll be white nationalists, fascists, libertarians, Q or other conspiracy theory nutters, and evangelical Dominionists.
 
2020-11-23 12:51:42 PM  
I can't remember the last time Republicans accepted a Democratic victory. Hell, I can't remember the last time Democrats accepted a Democratic victory.
 
2020-11-23 12:57:00 PM  
Beta? They've been doing this since George HW Bush lost.

We're on at least version Sid 6.7

imfdb.orgView Full Size
 
2020-11-23 2:28:03 PM  
A lot of Democrats are still stewing over 2000 and 2016.

Count the votes, deal with any recounts or discrepancies as needed, and accept the results.  It's not that damn hard.  If you want more votes, come up with better candidates and better ideas.
 
2020-11-23 2:28:07 PM  

AdmirableSnackbar: I can't remember the last time Republicans accepted a Democratic victory. Hell, I can't remember the last time Democrats accepted a Democratic victory.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-11-23 2:28:25 PM  
"Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy."
― David Frum
 
2020-11-23 2:28:55 PM  
Ah, the Republicans are using a disposable test Trump for the experiment.

He's their lab monkey to be used and discarded.

Trump's survival after the experiment is irrelevant.
 
2020-11-23 2:28:56 PM  
A soft, disorganized coup attempt is still a coup attempt.

They've been suppressing votes for years and stole two SCOTUS picks despite being a minority party. They have told us our voices don't matter, multiple times over.
 
2020-11-23 2:30:09 PM  
Fortunately, reality is not something that needs to give a fark what Republicans think.

As the 'rona has been proving since March. And emphasizing in the weeks just after the election.

It shouldn't matter what Republicans think and our country would be much better off if we'd stop pretending that it does.
 
2020-11-23 2:30:59 PM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: The Republican party needs to be put out of our misery


The problem is that the bigots, the bumpkins, the knuckle-draggers, the god-botherers, those with a less than 60 IQ, NASCAR-watchers, tobacco chewers, mouth-breathers, FOX News fans, Coors Lite-drinkers, pickup-truck drivers, old bikers, unemployed steel workers and conspiracy-theorists just farkin' LOVE the Greedy Old Pigs.
 
2020-11-23 2:34:00 PM  

AdmirableSnackbar: I can't remember the last time Republicans accepted a Democratic victory. Hell, I can't remember the last time Democrats accepted a Democratic victory.


When Katie Hill won in a red district . Of course, that did not end up well as it seems it is back to being red.
 
2020-11-23 2:36:01 PM  

Fonaibung: A soft, disorganized coup attempt is still a coup attempt.

They've been suppressing votes for years and stole two SCOTUS picks despite being a minority party. They have told us our voices don't matter, multiple times over.


While I agree with you and hate the GOP with all my being, I will note that however you slice it, 2 of the 3 SCOTUS appointments were legit. Kennedy retired mid-term so there's no argument there. As for the Scalia and Ginsberg deaths, the GOP either robbed Obama or they robbed Biden. If they adhered to a single set of rules, we still would have gotten only one of those picks.
 
2020-11-23 2:36:15 PM  
WASHINGTON - Hillary Clinton said in a new interview that Joe Biden should not concede the 2020 presidential election "under any circumstances," anticipating issues that could prolong knowing the final outcome.

NBC News in August
 
2020-11-23 2:37:33 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-11-23 2:37:59 PM  
The Democratic margins of victory are only going to get larger.  The GOP is farked and they know it.

You know what might save their party?  Policies that appeal to living voters.  Not being assholes.  Doing something effective about things like climate change, economic disasters, and pandemics.

You know.  Effective governance.  Joining the 21st century.

/does not include packing the judiciary and voter disenfranchisement
//seems unlikely to happen, eh?
 
2020-11-23 2:39:09 PM  

Groupon boob job: Fonaibung: A soft, disorganized coup attempt is still a coup attempt.

They've been suppressing votes for years and stole two SCOTUS picks despite being a minority party. They have told us our voices don't matter, multiple times over.

While I agree with you and hate the GOP with all my being, I will note that however you slice it, 2 of the 3 SCOTUS appointments were legit. Kennedy retired mid-term so there's no argument there. As for the Scalia and Ginsberg deaths, the GOP either robbed Obama or they robbed Biden. If they adhered to a single set of rules, we still would have gotten only one of those picks.


Kennedy retired so he could avoid looking really *really* bad since his son was part of Deutsche Bank.
 
2020-11-23 2:39:25 PM  

capn' fun: Hand to God, I honestly don't know if the GOP will even exist in 2024. They may still call themselves Republicans, but they will essentially just be a neo-fascist party led by Dump.


Yes, but as we have seen that will probably drive higher participation and voter turnout than ever before.
-
/The problem is not that GOP is openly fascist, its that fascism is proving more attractive to Americans than Democracy
 
2020-11-23 2:40:39 PM  

bughunter: The Democratic margins of victory are only going to get larger.  The GOP is farked and they know it.

You know what might save their party?  Policies that appeal to living voters.  Not being assholes.  Doing something effective about things like climate change, economic disasters, and pandemics.

You know.  Effective governance.  Joining the 21st century.

/does not include packing the judiciary and voter disenfranchisement
//seems unlikely to happen, eh?


This is true. Progressives will be able to punt at the nightmare that was Trump for a generation and say, "See what happens when you don't vote?"

I think giving the keys to that orange fool gave them some short term gains but in the long run I bet it farks then.
 
2020-11-23 2:41:43 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size


They haven't accepted one in quite a while.
 
2020-11-23 2:43:12 PM  

AdmirableSnackbar: I can't remember the last time Republicans accepted a Democratic victory. Hell, I can't remember the last time Democrats accepted a Democratic victory.


They two parties aren't at all the same.
The Republicans job is to attack, obstruct, and delegitimize -ALL- Democrats.
The Democrats job is to attack, obstruct, and delegitimize only the Democrats that win.
 
2020-11-23 2:43:13 PM  

Erebus1954: Hillary Clinton said in a new interview that Joe Biden should not concede the 2020 presidential election "under any circumstances,"


[...]"because I think this is going to drag out, and eventually I do believe he will win if we don't give an inch, and if we are as focused and relentless as the other side is."
 
2020-11-23 2:44:28 PM  

Erebus1954: WASHINGTON - Hillary Clinton said in a new interview that Joe Biden should not concede the 2020 presidential election "under any circumstances," anticipating issues that could prolong knowing the final outcome.

NBC News in August


Should not concede...on election night.

She said this year's election day results might point to Trump having a narrow advantage. But in that case, Clinton said, "Joe Biden should not concede under any circumstances because I think this is going to drag out."
 
2020-11-23 2:47:30 PM  
Which would would be clear and unambiguous grounds for open armed revolt, and thus the end of the UNited States of America

And so it goes
 
2020-11-23 2:47:53 PM  

notmyjab: [Fark user image 447x640]


I suspect that one of his many excuses in the coming weeks will be that he will never 'concede' but will 'allow' Joe Biden to become President 'for the good of the nation' while he takes a four-year break to golf, tweet, and lust after Ivanka.
 
2020-11-23 2:50:20 PM  

Shaggy_C: "Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy."
― David Frum


It's a good quote.

It's amazing to me the Frum has abandoned democracy as well.
 
2020-11-23 2:50:53 PM  

bughunter: The Democratic margins of victory are only going to get larger.  The GOP is farked and they know it.

You know what might save their party?  Policies that appeal to living voters.  Not being assholes.  Doing something effective about things like climate change, economic disasters, and pandemics.

You know.  Effective governance.  Joining the 21st century.

/does not include packing the judiciary and voter disenfranchisement
//seems unlikely to happen, eh?


You assume they still want to be a party of effective government.

They actually just want to win elections. On that front they're doing just fine telling bitter, ignorant people what they want to hear. Why offer solutions when it's easier to offer scapegoats?
 
2020-11-23 2:51:03 PM  
We don't really need them to. We're not their victims, time to start acting like it.
 
2020-11-23 2:52:52 PM  

Groupon boob job: Fonaibung: A soft, disorganized coup attempt is still a coup attempt.

They've been suppressing votes for years and stole two SCOTUS picks despite being a minority party. They have told us our voices don't matter, multiple times over.

While I agree with you and hate the GOP with all my being, I will note that however you slice it, 2 of the 3 SCOTUS appointments were legit. Kennedy retired mid-term so there's no argument there. As for the Scalia and Ginsberg deaths, the GOP either robbed Obama or they robbed Biden. If they adhered to a single set of rules, we still would have gotten only one of those picks.


I see what you're saying, and I disagree. Take McConnell's reasoning during 2016 at face value: Ginsberg died a month before the election. The right thing to do would be to let the winner of the election pick.

Garland was early in 2016 and was simply stolen.
 
2020-11-23 2:53:03 PM  
The entire past 4 years has been dry run for future authoritarianism. There will be a New Jim Crow, eventually unless they're movement is stopped.
 
2020-11-23 2:53:10 PM  

Iworkformsn: Shaggy_C: "Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy."
― David Frum

It's a good quote.

It's amazing to me the Frum has abandoned democracy as well.


I take that back. I thought he had gone much more in the Trump camp.

My apologies to Mr. Frum.
 
2020-11-23 2:54:18 PM  

capn' fun: I actually agree with that premise, but the only thing that's keeping me sane is reflecting back on the arc of the GOP during the past three cycles. In 2008 they were still a relatively sane and legitimate party. Then stirred the beginnings of populism with the Tea Party and letting the inmates out of the asylum, even if just on a day pass, with Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and others who previously would never have been allowed near an electrical socket without a child cover, let alone national political power. By 2012 the GOP was in real trouble, with moderates being driven out and former "rising stars" like Cantor being taken out in primary after primary in a "race to the right". And by 2016, what was left of the former GOP was completely subsumed by Dump and his cult of MAGAs. And just when it looked like that was the worse outcome for the former Grand Old Party, along came Q, gift that just keeps on giving.

Hand to God, I honestly don't know if the GOP will even exist in 2024. They may still call themselves Republicans, but they will essentially just be a neo-fascist party led by Dump. The only way that ends is when he does, as neither of his chinless sons could ever fill his high-heeled shoes, and too many of the MAGA faithful could never bring themselves to follow a woman, even if her last name is Dump.

And if he DOES finally throw a 7 before 2024, then all bets are off. Literally no telling what kind of creatures will crawl out of the woodwork or from under their rocks looking to grab a slice of power. And doubtful that any one of them would be able to consolidate it under their own banner. We may finally get a few viable third parties, but they'll be white nationalists, fascists, libertarians, Q or other conspiracy theory nutters, and evangelical Dominionists.


I'm not so sure about all that. Remember that Trump actually GREW his base this election, in terms of total numbers. I think we're seeing a fascist movement rising, not falling.
 
2020-11-23 2:55:26 PM  
It's only recast as a beta test now that the bugs in the code are too numerous.

This has been a genuine coup attempt by shiat-tier incoherent garbage... and it nearly worked. Next time, they will  bring their shiat-tier *incompetent* garbage, so we'd better be ready.
 
2020-11-23 2:56:03 PM  
As someone who never "accepted" Trump in 2016 or W in 2000, I have to say my non-acceptance had all the effect of an ant scratching its toes. Unlike the presidential transition, "acceptance" is just a non-starter. Who cares?
 
2020-11-23 2:58:07 PM  

bughunter: The Democratic margins of victory are only going to get larger.  The GOP is farked and they know it.


Republicans have only won the popular vote once since 1992.
 
2020-11-23 2:59:26 PM  

MikeyFuccon: They actually just want to win elections. On that front they're doing just fine telling bitter, ignorant people what they want to hear. Why offer solutions when it's easier to offer scapegoats?


Did you mean to describe the Democratic Party?
 
2020-11-23 3:02:34 PM  

RasIanI: The entire past 4 years has been dry run for future authoritarianism. There will be a New Jim Crow, eventually unless they're movement is stopped.


It won't be. They may be enthusiastically 100% for Jim Crow on ideological grounds, but probably the majority of even the left-leaning white middle class is all for either soft support of Jim Crow or for at least quietly looking the other way out of personal necessity.
-
Like it or not, Jim Crow is one of the few topics popular on both sides of the political divide. Only one side openly revels in doing so with overtness and cruelty, but both view it as a hard necessity.
 
2020-11-23 3:06:27 PM  

Dryad: RasIanI: The entire past 4 years has been dry run for future authoritarianism. There will be a New Jim Crow, eventually unless they're movement is stopped.

It won't be. They may be enthusiastically 100% for Jim Crow on ideological grounds, but probably the majority of even the left-leaning white middle class is all for either soft support of Jim Crow or for at least quietly looking the other way out of personal necessity.
-
Like it or not, Jim Crow is one of the few topics popular on both sides of the political divide. Only one side openly revels in doing so with overtness and cruelty, but both view it as a hard necessity.


Lol
 
2020-11-23 3:07:05 PM  

capn' fun: Hand to God, I honestly don't know if the GOP will even exist in 2024.


Why not?  They will control the Senate, and look lined up to regain the House.  They may even have the presidency if their delaying shiatshow continues until January 6th.  As some Farker pointed out in another thread, the 2020 election actually went rather well for the GOP.  Future elections won't matter very much.
 
2020-11-23 3:08:35 PM  

MikeyFuccon: They actually just want to win elections.


They're showing that they don't have to.
 
2020-11-23 3:11:17 PM  

Iworkformsn: Iworkformsn: Shaggy_C: "Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy."
― David Frum

It's a good quote.

It's amazing to me the Frum has abandoned democracy as well.

I take that back. I thought he had gone much more in the Trump camp.

My apologies to Mr. Frum.


Was gonna say. I think Frum has a lot to answer for, but he wasn't on the Trump train.
 
2020-11-23 3:12:16 PM  
2016:  Yes, yes, Democrats won the popular vote, but the ELECTORAL vote its what matters.

2020:  Yes, yes, Democrats won the electoral vote, but the state ELECTORAL BOARD CERTIFICATION vote is what matters.

2024:  Yes, yes, Democrats won the state electoral board certification vote, but the @TRUMP_TV_Paler_Poll is what matters.
 
2020-11-23 3:12:48 PM  

Dryad: RasIanI: The entire past 4 years has been dry run for future authoritarianism. There will be a New Jim Crow, eventually unless they're movement is stopped.

It won't be. They may be enthusiastically 100% for Jim Crow on ideological grounds, but probably the majority of even the left-leaning white middle class is all for either soft support of Jim Crow or for at least quietly looking the other way out of personal necessity.
-
Like it or not, Jim Crow is one of the few topics popular on both sides of the political divide. Only one side openly revels in doing so with overtness and cruelty, but both view it as a hard necessity.


That's quite a stretch.

There exist White liberals who suffer from a great deal of privilige-blindness, that's true. But that's a very different thing than an entire big-tent bloc actively maintaining Jim Crow in secret.
 
2020-11-23 3:20:45 PM  

Shaggy_C: "Conservatives will always be with us. If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. They will reject democracy."
― David Frum


This right here. The Republicans noticed they were having a hard time getting elected following the rules so they broke the rules. Once breaking the rules got harder to do, they turned the system on itself. Once they can longer twist the system to create an outcome, they will switch to a new system.

They may still call is democracy or freedom but it's all just a boot on the face, forever.
 
2020-11-23 4:10:25 PM  

capn' fun: I actually agree with that premise, but the only thing that's keeping me sane is reflecting back on the arc of the GOP during the past three cycles. In 2008 they were still a relatively sane and legitimate party. Then stirred the beginnings of populism with the Tea Party and letting the inmates out of the asylum, even if just on a day pass, with Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, and others who previously would never have been allowed near an electrical socket without a child cover, let alone national political power. By 2012 the GOP was in real trouble, with moderates being driven out and former "rising stars" like Cantor being taken out in primary after primary in a "race to the right". And by 2016, what was left of the former GOP was completely subsumed by Dump and his cult of MAGAs. And just when it looked like that was the worse outcome for the former Grand Old Party, along came Q, gift that just keeps on giving.

Hand to God, I honestly don't know if the GOP will even exist in 2024. They may still call themselves Republicans, but they will essentially just be a neo-fascist party led by Dump. The only way that ends is when he does, as neither of his chinless sons could ever fill his high-heeled shoes, and too many of the MAGA faithful could never bring themselves to follow a woman, even if her last name is Dump.

And if he DOES finally throw a 7 before 2024, then all bets are off. Literally no telling what kind of creatures will crawl out of the woodwork or from under their rocks looking to grab a slice of power. And doubtful that any one of them would be able to consolidate it under their own banner. We may finally get a few viable third parties, but they'll be white nationalists, fascists, libertarians, Q or other conspiracy theory nutters, and evangelical Dominionists.


I don't really care what they're called and whether it's the end of the GOP as we know it, the problem is there are at least 65 million of them. It's not like they're going to all stop being reactionary morons if and when the GOP liquidates. What does it change on the operational level?
 
2020-11-23 4:13:47 PM  
This is all just a beta test for when the Republicans will just never accept a Democratic victory

Are we there yet?

/I thought we were
 
2020-11-23 4:50:50 PM  

NewportBarGuy: Beta? They've been doing this since George HW Bush lost.

We're on at least version Sid 6.7

[imfdb.org image 600x255]


Actually since Goldwater and the passage of the Civil Rights Act they failed to stop.  Yes, I know, they were mostly Democrats at the time, but it's the same people.  Hippies weren't the only ones on the Left to have sold out since the 1970s.  The leaders of any real opposition have been too busy cashing checks from the same people pulling the strings of the Radical Right to do much of anything about the Plutocrization and Authoritarization of America for nearly 60 years now.
 
2020-11-23 5:09:21 PM  

capn' fun: Hand to God, I honestly don't know if the GOP will even exist in 2024. They may still call themselves Republicans, but they will essentially just be a neo-fascist party led by Dump. The only way that ends is when he does, as neither of his chinless sons could ever fill his high-heeled shoes, and too many of the MAGA faithful could never bring themselves to follow a woman, even if her last name is Dump.


I think we're already there. Problem is the new "GOP" is more popular and successful than the old GOP.

And when Trump dies, I'm pretty confident there will be a new Trump. Doesn't have to actually be one of his kids. If we get someone with an attention span over three minutes who can actually speak well, he will be a lot more dangerous.
 
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