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(CNBC)   Experts warning of impending exponential spread of Covid across US. Or in terms the US can grasp, it gonna get real bad, yo   (cnbc.com) divider line
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3557 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 26 Oct 2020 at 10:55 AM (12 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-10-26 3:27:04 PM  

AwfulObject: ??? To date, COVID has killed more people than every conflict the US has been in *combined* if you minus out WW2. This is a bad talking point.


I find this really interesting. 

A man fighting obesity and high blood pressure gets covid and he dies from covid... Not the fact his fat out of shape ass was already one foot in the grave 

Ever think maybe the reason so many are getting sick in the US is because we are all fat half sick bastards to begin with ?
 
2020-10-26 3:28:21 PM  
AwfulObject
You do understand how wealth works, right? Zero-sum and all?

I have a couple years making 4k or less a year... several making zero ... now... 6 figures 

Tell me how the poor cant get help... please
 
2020-10-26 3:29:39 PM  

geggam: OptionC: geggam: AwfulObject: geggam: Tman144:

How does staying at home pay my rent?

Suppose you had been living inside your means and saved ? Maybe not bought so much on credit... listened to your granny who lived thru the depression ?

Where would you be now ?

Can't save what you don't get, most people don't have enough to cover a small emergency let alone a big one.

So you are already in a bad shape and this was going to happen regardless ... 

Perhaps that is why you are so ready for someone to fix your issues ?

Why don't poor people just buy more money?

Or... like when I was poor get free college... community college... apply themselves and change their career path 

All sorts of free money out there. All sorts of programs

You have to get off your ass and go get it


fourpillarfreedom.comView Full Size


A third(!) or households(!!!) make less than $40K per year.  Even aside from the fact that free college doesn't pay next month's rent, do you believe that income distribution would be any different if literally everyone went to college?
 
2020-10-26 3:30:44 PM  

geggam: AwfulObject: ??? To date, COVID has killed more people than every conflict the US has been in *combined* if you minus out WW2. This is a bad talking point.

I find this really interesting. 

A man fighting obesity and high blood pressure gets covid and he dies from covid... Not the fact his fat out of shape ass was already one foot in the grave 

Ever think maybe the reason so many are getting sick in the US is because we are all fat half sick bastards to begin with ?


so, you are saying it is okay if the people who die are fat because that is ... what?  Their own fault, so they had it coming?
 
2020-10-26 3:31:06 PM  

TheSubjunctive: [Fark user image image 500x253]

I wish I could say confidently where we are on this chart.


Well based on that z axis,  I'd say we are pretty far to the right.
 
2020-10-26 3:31:25 PM  

ProcrastinationStation: TheSubjunctive: [Fark user image image 500x253]

I wish I could say confidently where we are on this chart.

Well based on that z axis,  I'd say we are pretty far to the right.


Dammit.  X axis.
 
2020-10-26 3:33:22 PM  
I don't mean to turn this into a whataboutism as the US is doing badly when compared against its neighbours, but I was just looking at the international data and Europe is looking pretty bad.

Fark user imageView Full Size


This is going to get really bad again. The medical system has adapted to it and the death rates are relatively low in the wealthy regions (compare death rates between the US and Mexico), but once the capacity of the health systems starts to be reached, then there's going to be problems.

Fark user imageView Full Size


This is why the death rates were so high initially - because there were regions that were really badly affected that overwhelmed the local health systems: New York in the US and Italy in the EU. But the virus is now pandemic across both continents so it has the potential to affect multiple regions severely and overwhelm local health capacity in multiple regions. Especially now that it's got into small less resourced communities.

This could get bad again.
 
2020-10-26 3:34:17 PM  

geggam: AwfulObject: ??? To date, COVID has killed more people than every conflict the US has been in *combined* if you minus out WW2. This is a bad talking point.

I find this really interesting. 

A man fighting obesity and high blood pressure gets covid and he dies from covid... Not the fact his fat out of shape ass was already one foot in the grave 

Ever think maybe the reason so many are getting sick in the US is because we are all fat half sick bastards to begin with ?


Well, here's a list of comorbidity: Asthma, Obesity, Hypertension, Cancer, Pregnancy, Diabetes. All of these are chronic diseases that you can live a long life with - you aren't exactly "one foot in the grave". Asthma, Cancer, Pregnancy(temporary), (type 1) Diabetes, and some types of Hypertension aren't exactly always lifestyle onset.

These are diseases that are chronic and usually have a component of genetic predisposition - but in many cases aren't fatal - and over 1/3rd of the entire american population has one of them.

So, sorry, yes, we still need to take care of them, even if they're fat, you farking asshole.
 
2020-10-26 3:37:09 PM  

geggam: Tracking and tracing does what ? tells you who is sick it does nothing to stop the spread.

You have a bug that hops into cats and dogs... probably rats.

How are you addressing those vectors without a complete shutdown which will in fact kill more people than this bug is capable of.

The govt printing machine cannot print that much money and keep inflation from going off the rails.

Next idea ?


Test, trace, and isolate. When someone tests positive you find out who else they have been in recent contact with and you tell those people to isolate for 14 days. It takes a few days after exposure before a person is capable of spreading the infection. If you test frequently and process the results quickly you can stop the infection from spreading more than one or two hops from the first positive case.

The other measures are things like mask policies and occupancy limits to reduce the spread from people who don't know that they're contagious as they go about their day-to-day business. It's better to accidentally infect 3 people sharing an outdoor table at a restaurant than to infect 60 at a wedding or choir performance. Yes, that will suck for anyone whose business model relies on packing lots of loud drunk people into a confined space for hours at a time. Deal with it.

There have been a few cases of human-to-animal transmission but it seems to be a minor effect so far. I haven't heard of any cases of it going the other way yet (apart from whichever farmer got too close to one particular bat over in China).

The govt printing machine has no problem finding money to shovel into the stock market. At a minimum the government could have redirected those trillions into zero-interest loans for anyone struggling to afford food or rent. Increase taxes on the top 0.01% and/or put a fee of $0.001 per share on all stock-market transactions (including electronic high-frequency trading) if you want to balance the books later.
 
2020-10-26 3:38:59 PM  

geggam: Tman144:

How does staying at home pay my rent?

Suppose you had been living inside your means and saved ? Maybe not bought so much on credit... listened to your granny who lived thru the depression ? 

Where would you be now ?


lol, restrictions started in March, and things have not eased up yet. We likely won't be able to return to normal until sometime next year. You expect people to have a year and a half of savings just incase we get hit with a once in 100 year catastrophe? Get the fark out of here.

I have an idea, why don't we pay taxes with the idea that our government will help us during a disaster. I don't see you in hurricane threads lambasting people for expecting help. "Well, you should have saved $300,000 so you could rebuild your own house after the hurricane leveled it!"
 
2020-10-26 3:44:11 PM  

OptionC: A third(!) or households(!!!) make less than $40K per year.  Even aside from the fact that free college doesn't pay next month's rent, do you believe that income distribution would be any different if literally everyone went to college?


Actually no

If you cant live on 30k a year if you adjust your standard of living. 

Dont need college ... you can get into trade schools. Not everyone will be rich. 


https://www.glassdoor.com/Salaries/sk​i​lled-worker-salary-SRCH_KO0,14.htm
 
2020-10-26 3:44:13 PM  

AdmirableSnackbar: geggam: If every individual took personal responsibility the collective would be fine.  This idea you need to be told what to do is infantile 

Fix your own house before you worry about others.

Except it's the people saying shiat like you've said in this thread that's making us unable to fix our house. You're the ones making sure the US has the worst response possible to this virus.


We've been trying the "personal responsibility" approach in Indiana. Our governor is fond of saying things like "I trust Hoosiers to do the right thing without the government requiring it". You know how that's working out? IT'S FARKING NOT!

The governor eventually accepted reality and instituted a mask mandate, but with no penalties for non-compliance. Now with hospitalizations up where they were at the height of the first wave back in mid April, he's done nothing. The state has almost no restrictions and the virus continues to spread like wildfire. But hey, no need to mandate restrictions. "Hoosiers will do the right thing". No, they farking won't. They've proven it again and again and many continue to do so, doing whatever the fark they want, acting like there's nothing going on.
 
2020-10-26 3:45:19 PM  

patrick767: We've been trying the "personal responsibility" approach in Indiana. Our governor is fond of saying things like "I trust Hoosiers to do the right thing without the government requiring it". You know how that's working out? IT'S FARKING NOT!


This is called evolution. 

The stupid will eventually figure out how to die even with all the laws or labels you put on things. 

I call this darwin debt... we have had this coming for some time
 
2020-10-26 3:46:21 PM  

geggam: AwfulObject: Let's start with an actual shut-down. One that looks like Canada or Germany. Two weeks - only essential personnel. No wiggle room, government shores up everyone Canada style everybody gets money.

Then robust testing and tracking so you can have a control on where you allocate resource you can be more effective in your usage of PPE and manpower; and I'd utilize the national stockpile and DPA to shore up access to badly needed resources.

I would have had thermal scanners installed at every major airport and probably at major food processing facilities.  There's no reason that these people should be in peril every time they go to work. International flights shut down totally until we get a handle on transmission.

Ease restrictions, keep tracking and tracing, button down locally during flare-ups until a medical solution surfaces. Sure, it would cost a lot of money - but so will a million or so dead people and thrice as much with possibly permanent disability.

OK 

I have been in airports... they are really devoid of people so your impact isnt going to be as big as you think 

Tracking and tracing does what  ? tells you who is sick it does nothing to stop the spread. 

You  have a bug that hops into cats and dogs... probably rats. 

How are you addressing those vectors without a complete shutdown which will in fact kill more people than this bug is capable of. 

The govt printing machine cannot print that much money and keep inflation from going off the rails. 

Next idea ?


We spent $2.4 trillion on the war in Iraq. At the height of the shutdown, we had 23 million unemployed. For the amount we spent in Iraq, we could have paid every unemployed person $2,000 a month for 52 months. Did the Iraq war cause inflation to go off the rails? Funny, how when we want revenge for 3,000 dead Americans, no cost is too high, but when faced with a disaster that has killed hundreds of thousands, first thing assholes like you say is "how can we pay for it?"
 
2020-10-26 3:47:30 PM  

Tman144: I have an idea, why don't we pay taxes with the idea that our government will help us during a disaster. I don't see you in hurricane threads lambasting people for expecting help. "Well, you should have saved $300,000 so you could rebuild your own house after the hurricane leveled it!"


OK 

lets do this.. lets remove all private insurance ( its socialism for profit anyway ) and just go straight taxes to pay for everything. 

How about you check out russia to see how this works out for you... 

spoiler : corruption will find its way to the top
 
2020-10-26 3:49:20 PM  

Tman144: We spent $2.4 trillion on the war in Iraq. At the height of the shutdown, we had 23 million unemployed. For the amount we spent in Iraq, we could have paid every unemployed person $2,000 a month for 52 months. Did the Iraq war cause inflation to go off the rails? Funny, how when we want revenge for 3,000 dead Americans, no cost is too high, but when faced with a disaster that has killed hundreds of thousands, first thing assholes like you say is "how can we pay for it?"


Now this has potential... lets stop the war machine profits and see what happens

In theory you are on to something... in reality if we arent the gobal bully we will be bullied by another country

Wonder which way is better ?
 
2020-10-26 3:49:23 PM  

Tman144: Funny, how when we want revenge for 3,000 dead Americans, no cost is too high,


"Revenge" on a country which had nothing to do with that particular attack, by the way.
 
2020-10-26 3:51:06 PM  
The current USA trajectory for re-opening will not deviate unless the death toll starts getting so big that the Republicans can no longer ignore it. This is a fact.
 
2020-10-26 3:53:58 PM  

geggam: patrick767: We've been trying the "personal responsibility" approach in Indiana. Our governor is fond of saying things like "I trust Hoosiers to do the right thing without the government requiring it". You know how that's working out? IT'S FARKING NOT!

This is called evolution. 

The stupid will eventually figure out how to die even with all the laws or labels you put on things. 

I call this darwin debt... we have had this coming for some time


Ah, so you're a Nazi: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S​ocial_D​arwinism

Good to know.
 
2020-10-26 3:59:07 PM  

AdmirableSnackbar: geggam: If every individual took personal responsibility the collective would be fine.  This idea you need to be told what to do is infantile 

Fix your own house before you worry about others.

Except it's the people saying shiat like you've said in this thread that's making us unable to fix our house. You're the ones making sure the US has the worst response possible to this virus.


Interesting... 

I wear a  mask everywhere I go in public which isn't often ( i stock up and buy truckloads of groceries once a month ) .

I work remote where the closest person is a mile away. 

I dont talk to my family for the most part ( wife and kids I do see ) 

I run MERV filters in the house 

Explain how I cause you issues ?
 
2020-10-26 4:01:09 PM  

Tman144: geggam: patrick767: We've been trying the "personal responsibility" approach in Indiana. Our governor is fond of saying things like "I trust Hoosiers to do the right thing without the government requiring it". You know how that's working out? IT'S FARKING NOT!

This is called evolution. 

The stupid will eventually figure out how to die even with all the laws or labels you put on things. 

I call this darwin debt... we have had this coming for some time

Ah, so you're a Nazi: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/So​cial_Darwinism

Good to know.


LOL

I am opposed to gov telling you what to do and you equate that with authoritarian govt ? 

You arrent real bright are you ?
 
2020-10-26 4:07:40 PM  

geggam: AwfulObject: Let's start with an actual shut-down. One that looks like Canada or Germany. Two weeks - only essential personnel. No wiggle room, government shores up everyone Canada style everybody gets money.

Then robust testing and tracking so you can have a control on where you allocate resource you can be more effective in your usage of PPE and manpower; and I'd utilize the national stockpile and DPA to shore up access to badly needed resources.

I would have had thermal scanners installed at every major airport and probably at major food processing facilities.  There's no reason that these people should be in peril every time they go to work. International flights shut down totally until we get a handle on transmission.

Ease restrictions, keep tracking and tracing, button down locally during flare-ups until a medical solution surfaces. Sure, it would cost a lot of money - but so will a million or so dead people and thrice as much with possibly permanent disability.

OK 

I have been in airports... they are really devoid of people so your impact isnt going to be as big as you think 

Tracking and tracing does what  ? tells you who is sick it does nothing to stop the spread. 

You  have a bug that hops into cats and dogs... probably rats. 

How are you addressing those vectors without a complete shutdown which will in fact kill more people than this bug is capable of. 

The govt printing machine cannot print that much money and keep inflation from going off the rails. 

Next idea ?


"Stop posting" sounds like a good one.
 
2020-10-26 4:15:06 PM  

whidbey: geggam: AwfulObject: Let's start with an actual shut-down. One that looks like Canada or Germany. Two weeks - only essential personnel. No wiggle room, government shores up everyone Canada style everybody gets money.

Then robust testing and tracking so you can have a control on where you allocate resource you can be more effective in your usage of PPE and manpower; and I'd utilize the national stockpile and DPA to shore up access to badly needed resources.

I would have had thermal scanners installed at every major airport and probably at major food processing facilities.  There's no reason that these people should be in peril every time they go to work. International flights shut down totally until we get a handle on transmission.

Ease restrictions, keep tracking and tracing, button down locally during flare-ups until a medical solution surfaces. Sure, it would cost a lot of money - but so will a million or so dead people and thrice as much with possibly permanent disability.

OK 

I have been in airports... they are really devoid of people so your impact isnt going to be as big as you think 

Tracking and tracing does what  ? tells you who is sick it does nothing to stop the spread. 

You  have a bug that hops into cats and dogs... probably rats. 

How are you addressing those vectors without a complete shutdown which will in fact kill more people than this bug is capable of. 

The govt printing machine cannot print that much money and keep inflation from going off the rails. 

Next idea ?

"Stop posting" sounds like a good one.


You dont like other people having different ideas ? 

Does it make you uncomfortable to think other thoughts ?
 
2020-10-26 4:21:03 PM  

Optimus Primate: The current USA trajectory for re-opening will not deviate unless the death toll starts getting so big that the Republicans can no longer ignore it. This is a fact.


Not even then.
We are pretty much past the "...can no longer ignore it."
The rich hath spoken, the worker class shall suffer, and the Morlocks shall inherit the warning sirens.
 
2020-10-26 4:44:25 PM  
COVID-19 would like to dedicate this song to Donald Trump:

With A Little Help From My Friends (Remastered 2009)
Youtube 0C58ttB2-Qg
 
2020-10-26 4:49:14 PM  

Myrdinn: Optimus Primate: The current USA trajectory for re-opening will not deviate unless the death toll starts getting so big that the Republicans can no longer ignore it. This is a fact.

Not even then.
We are pretty much past the "...can no longer ignore it."
The rich hath spoken, the worker class shall suffer, and the Morlocks shall inherit the warning sirens.


I agree in principle, but I think there is a "tipping point" (where bodies start getting stacked like cord wood, etc) that even the most ardent Republican cannot ignore.
 
2020-10-26 4:49:29 PM  

geggam: Froman: Crazy Lee: Ambivalence: And the federal government has officially declared it has no interest in stopping it.

And  the federal government Trump Administration has officially declared it has no interest in utilizing those Federal Resources at their disposal in stopping it.

/just a little more precise

Political pseudo-intellectuals will cry about how this is a perfect example of how terrible government is at everything and that it has failed on every level. Well, that's what happens when you either voted directly for or were OK with a ruthless mobbed up notorious celebrity "business" man who never held public office taking over the executive branch and staffing it with his sycophants and crime partners. It was clear that Trump was the anti-government president. Drain the swamp. Dismantle the administrative state. Disable our regulatory agencies. Fire literally everyone not working directly for the enrichment of America's industrial leaders.

For everyone who thinks they're so SMRT because they hate government and don't trust it, here is a preview of your world. But if you are truly OK with Amazon, Facebook, ExxonMobil, Canadian mining conglomerates, and Big Ag deciding your fate with no ability for you to vote(because what are you gonna do, stop using your computer, stop buying things you want, and stop eating?) then I won't argue. You do you.

Sort of curious what you think a govt can do to protect you ? 

You can stay home... You can wear a mask... You can socially distance. 

Do you need a babysitter to tell you what to do ?


This is kind of a jerk thing to say since 1) not everyone can stay home, they have to work; 2) some of those jobs expose you to high risk people (like being a server in a restaurant); and sometimes in an office, without a mask mandate, you have co-workers who refuse to mask while behaving in other irresponsible ways like refusing to take any precautions, refusing to get testing when they are a close contact.  Even while masked, sitting 6 feet from a guy in coughing fits will mess with your stress levels even if he doesn't give you COVID.

Right now we're on a voluntary compliance basis, more or less, across the country and its going badly and pretty soon the entire country will look like NYC did in April.

People are notoriously unreliable for long term safety, even in their own best interests, which is why we need the largest percentage of compliance as possible.  When the President and half the electorate undermine that message constantly it really has no shot.
 
2020-10-26 4:51:40 PM  

OptionC: geggam: OptionC: geggam: AwfulObject: geggam: Tman144:

How does staying at home pay my rent?

Suppose you had been living inside your means and saved ? Maybe not bought so much on credit... listened to your granny who lived thru the depression ?

Where would you be now ?

Can't save what you don't get, most people don't have enough to cover a small emergency let alone a big one.

So you are already in a bad shape and this was going to happen regardless ... 

Perhaps that is why you are so ready for someone to fix your issues ?

Why don't poor people just buy more money?

Or... like when I was poor get free college... community college... apply themselves and change their career path 

All sorts of free money out there. All sorts of programs

You have to get off your ass and go get it

[fourpillarfreedom.com image 528x538]

A third(!) or households(!!!) make less than $40K per year.  Even aside from the fact that free college doesn't pay next month's rent, do you believe that income distribution would be any different if literally everyone went to college?


I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.
 
2020-10-26 4:51:45 PM  

Optimus Primate: Myrdinn: Optimus Primate: The current USA trajectory for re-opening will not deviate unless the death toll starts getting so big that the Republicans can no longer ignore it. This is a fact.

Not even then.
We are pretty much past the "...can no longer ignore it."
The rich hath spoken, the worker class shall suffer, and the Morlocks shall inherit the warning sirens.

I agree in principle, but I think there is a "tipping point" (where bodies start getting stacked like cord wood, etc) that even the most ardent Republican cannot ignore.


What makes you think that?
 
2020-10-26 5:01:20 PM  

weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.


So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?
 
2020-10-26 5:03:21 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size


it's logistic growth


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-10-26 5:10:28 PM  
So everyone expected something else when you do nothing but ignore it.
 
2020-10-26 5:11:32 PM  

geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?


How about raising corporate taxes, mandating living wages and taxing billionaires out of existence instead of blaming victims and expecting them to have the same economic power as the top 1/10th of the 1%?
 
2020-10-26 5:18:03 PM  

whidbey: geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?

How about raising corporate taxes, mandating living wages and taxing billionaires out of existence instead of blaming victims and expecting them to have the same economic power as the top 1/10th of the 1%?


So you think more govt is the solution to the problem instead of less govt enabling you to help yourself 

Got it

Welfare mentality abounds everywhere
 
2020-10-26 5:22:19 PM  

geggam: whidbey: geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?

How about raising corporate taxes, mandating living wages and taxing billionaires out of existence instead of blaming victims and expecting them to have the same economic power as the top 1/10th of the 1%?

So you think more govt is the solution to the problem instead of less govt enabling you to help yourself 

Got it

Welfare mentality abounds everywhere


No you don't "got it"

you're still blaming people who have no power compared to those with all the money.

Welfare mentality abounds everywhere

I don't see you calling for ending corporate welfare.
 
2020-10-26 5:23:37 PM  

geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?


Without wealth to begin with no one will give you a loan.  The have nots have neither the social capital or the literal capital to start businesses other than self employment where you don't actually have a business, you have a job.

/self-employed for 14 years.  Got out just before the pandemic, thank God.  My one piece of great luck in all this mess.
 
2020-10-26 5:31:38 PM  

weddingsinger: geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?

Without wealth to begin with no one will give you a loan.  The have nots have neither the social capital or the literal capital to start businesses other than self employment where you don't actually have a business, you have a job.

/self-employed for 14 years.  Got out just before the pandemic, thank God.  My one piece of great luck in all this mess.


Interesting... 

How do startups work if they have all that money ? 

See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly 

If you want to complain ... complain about the govt regulations raising the bar so high to get a business started... but you already know that challenge 

Large corporations have already bought n paid for this country.. .either use their method or be poor. 

Changing their methods will require bloodshed... no candidate today is even remotely interested in anything but lip service to the poors... if you think otherwise go ask biden / bernie or any of the countless others to donate their millions to the cause
 
2020-10-26 5:38:13 PM  
Of course, it's gonna spread...people are too stupid to take this virus seriously.

Americans are proud of three things:

Guns
Bigotry
Ignorance
 
2020-10-26 5:46:24 PM  

geggam: weddingsinger: geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?

Without wealth to begin with no one will give you a loan.  The have nots have neither the social capital or the literal capital to start businesses other than self employment where you don't actually have a business, you have a job.

/self-employed for 14 years.  Got out just before the pandemic, thank God.  My one piece of great luck in all this mess.

Interesting... 

How do startups work if they have all that money ?

See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly 

If you want to complain ... complain about the govt regulations raising the bar so high to get a business started... but you already know that challenge 

Large corporations have already bought n paid for this country.. .either use their method or be poor. 

Changing their methods will require bloodshed... no candidate today is even remotely interested in anything but lip service to the poors... if you think otherwise go ask biden / bernie or any of the countless others to donate their millions to the cause


Startups get money because the people who start them have money and connections to other people with money.

Its not about government regulation except in a few circumstances where there is regulatory capture (industry leaders writing the rules).
 
2020-10-26 5:47:01 PM  

geggam: See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly


That is... not how Silicon Valley works.

SV startups are generally 100% equity investment - nobody in their right mind would *lend* money to a startup.
 
2020-10-26 5:47:26 PM  

geggam: weddingsinger: geggam: weddingsinger: I'll add to your point:  50% of working Americans earn $33,000 or less (pre-pandemic numbers).

If wages kept up with inflation/productivity, and other growth that has occurred in the last 40 years then the average wage in America would be double.  Instead, something like $50 trillion in wealth has been transferred away from the bottom 80% to the top 20%.

So here is a thought... 

How about creating jobs... get a small business plan ... market it to banks / investors and sell the idea. Create jobs instead of looking for someone else to do it for you ?

Without wealth to begin with no one will give you a loan.  The have nots have neither the social capital or the literal capital to start businesses other than self employment where you don't actually have a business, you have a job.

/self-employed for 14 years.  Got out just before the pandemic, thank God.  My one piece of great luck in all this mess.

Interesting... 

How do startups work if they have all that money ? 

See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly 

If you want to complain ... complain about the govt regulations raising the bar so high to get a business started... but you already know that challenge 

Large corporations have already bought n paid for this country.. .either use their method or be poor. 

Changing their methods will require bloodshed... no candidate today is even remotely interested in anything but lip service to the poors... if you think otherwise go ask biden / bernie or any of the countless others to donate their millions to the cause


No. Nobody loans money to new corporations without someone putting up their house. Not even the SBA. They require you have 'skin in the game'.

Have you ever started a business? I don't think you have.

That said, there are tricks. Not being the primary on the SBA paperwork is a big one.
That's how people start businesses every 4-5 years and make bank. The businesses are designed to fail, but pay well in the interim.
A person that 'always wanted to be a businessman' is a resource/sucker. You'll need a new one, with at least some assets, every 4-5 years.
Also: Avoid doing business with that kind of company. Ditching their liabilities is part of the unwritten business plan. Once they've got your money, you are a liability to them.
 
2020-10-26 6:25:27 PM  

OptionC: geggam: See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly

That is... not how Silicon Valley works.

SV startups are generally 100% equity investment - nobody in their right mind would *lend* money to a startup.


yep.. and the investors have preferred stock and developers get common meaning when the payout happens investors get theirs first ... and the founders 

So .... be a founder
 
2020-10-26 6:34:57 PM  

geggam: OptionC: geggam: See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly

That is... not how Silicon Valley works.

SV startups are generally 100% equity investment - nobody in their right mind would *lend* money to a startup.

yep.. and the investors have preferred stock and developers get common meaning when the payout happens investors get theirs first ... and the founders 

So .... be a founder


WTF?

Common stock votes.
Preferred stock does not.

Pay no attention to the names.

Everybody except the VCs is contractually prevented from selling their stock until after the VCs had a chance to cash out.
 
2020-10-26 6:38:55 PM  

Ambivalence: And the federally government has officially declared it has no interest in stopping it.


Even less so after the election.
 
2020-10-26 6:42:16 PM  

NewportBarGuy: Might be time to steal a yacht and flee to a small pacific island.


After you have killed several people making your escape and abandoned family members along the way, you would start coughing once you landed and be unable to raise anyone on your radio.  Rod Serling appears to one side wearing an N95 mask to deliver a biting closing narration.
 
2020-10-26 6:56:33 PM  

The knight who says EkiEkiPoontang: geggam: OptionC: geggam: See society today is built on debt... you start an LLC and borrow money with the LLC sheltering your private assets 

If you fail you simply create a new business plan and start over... this is how silicon valley works and the rich people dump so much money into that area its silly

That is... not how Silicon Valley works.

SV startups are generally 100% equity investment - nobody in their right mind would *lend* money to a startup.

yep.. and the investors have preferred stock and developers get common meaning when the payout happens investors get theirs first ... and the founders 

So .... be a founder

WTF?

Common stock votes.
Preferred stock does not.

Pay no attention to the names.

Everybody except the VCs is contractually prevented from selling their stock until after the VCs had a chance to cash out.


This. Was just typing that, except not as concise.

Today we are learning what the view looks like from the peak of Mt. Stupid.
 
2020-10-27 1:07:14 AM  

NewportBarGuy: Might be time to steal a yacht and flee to a small pacific island.


If you want a large Pacific island instead, there's Australia. The state of Victoria, which includes Melbourne but not Sydney, had no new cases of COVID today and no COVID deaths, though its rates are still a lot higher than Queensland (which has Sydney.)  And they've still got crazy right-wingers if you can't live without those.
 
2020-10-27 10:45:06 AM  
dkulprit:
It's not only that, but the European union has more than twice the amount of people.  So per capita, they're still lower....

446 million is not twice 330 million.  you are bad at math.
 
2020-10-27 4:49:03 PM  

geggam: patrick767: We've been trying the "personal responsibility" approach in Indiana. Our governor is fond of saying things like "I trust Hoosiers to do the right thing without the government requiring it". You know how that's working out? IT'S FARKING NOT!

This is called evolution. 

The stupid will eventually figure out how to die even with all the laws or labels you put on things. 

I call this darwin debt... we have had this coming for some time


Problem is the stupid ones kill responsible people too. Responding to pandemics with libertarian individualistic bullshiat is absolutely asinine.
 
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