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(Universe Today)   Musk's satellites proving about as reliable as his cars   (universetoday.com) divider line
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1956 clicks; posted to STEM » on 25 Oct 2020 at 3:41 PM (5 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-10-25 12:03:00 PM  
All of them will fail and burn up eventually.  3% isn't bad for a $400k mass produced bird.
 
2020-10-25 12:04:31 PM  
Unfortunately, the company did not provide enough information to indicate which of their satellites were affected

And if you can't tell from the orbit, it ain't a serious problem, breathless.  Take this chill pill and relax a stitch.
 
Xai [TotalFark]
2020-10-25 12:07:21 PM  
While we consider it 'space' they are technically still inside our atmosphere and without their engines will fall to earth eventually. Given their low mass, likely they will burn up.
 
2020-10-25 12:10:57 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: 3% isn't bad


They plan to launch 42,000 of those things, if 3% of them can't maneuver then a very unfortunate billiards game could result.
 
2020-10-25 12:22:39 PM  
As others have said these things have a limited lifespan. If they can't maintain control, most likely because they run out of fuel for their ion engines, the atmosphere drags them down and they burn up. Then they launch more,
 
2020-10-25 12:39:50 PM  
So Musk will simply design low cost satellite interceptors to be launched along with fresh satellites and help the incommunicado units de-orbit safely. Easy peasy, genius squeezy.
 
2020-10-25 1:24:15 PM  
That's what happens when you try to get two birds stoned at once.
 
2020-10-25 1:28:42 PM  

Barfmaker: Marcus Aurelius: 3% isn't bad

They plan to launch 42,000 of those things, if 3% of them can't maneuver then a very unfortunate billiards game could result.


I would assume that you learn a few things from the early ones so that your later in the production run you can iron out those kinks.

Which is much the same way as he treats his cars I guess.

/try not to buy early in their production cycle
 
2020-10-25 1:52:06 PM  
1260 dead satellites before the end of the decade. Well, being able to stick anything in orbit was fun while it lasted.
 
2020-10-25 3:08:19 PM  
I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.
 
2020-10-25 3:47:05 PM  

sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.


Well, there's AWing even forcing his way into life-threatening situations.

And there's his insane politics.

There's the stock fraud and manipulation.

There's the slandering of innocent bystanders.
 
2020-10-25 3:47:36 PM  

sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.


What about the rational dislike?
 
2020-10-25 3:54:38 PM  

fragMasterFlash: So Musk will simply design low cost satellite interceptors to be launched along with fresh satellites and help the incommunicado units de-orbit safely. Easy peasy, genius squeezy.


No need. Orbital mechanics will keep this layer of space fairly clean on its own.  Musk requested the lower orbit specifically because it made it much easier to deal with any wayward birds.
These aren't even the final platforms. Spacex is developing a new booster and a new generation of satellites that use laser communications.
If both come to fruition soon then everything about spaceflight and internet will change at a rather alarming pace.

Fark user imageView Full Size


/possible 15km hop this week.
 
2020-10-25 3:58:52 PM  

koder: 1260 dead satellites before the end of the decade. Well, being able to stick anything in orbit was fun while it lasted.


This looks like a job for... SPAAAAACE FOOOOORCE!
 
2020-10-25 4:02:08 PM  

wejash: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

Well, there's AWing even forcing his way into life-threatening situations.

And there's his insane politics.

There's the stock fraud and manipulation.

There's the slandering of innocent bystanders.


It's entirely possible to dislike the man, but love his vision for a space-faring future.  He isn't the tech-messiah that some make him out to be, but I still hope for SpaceX's long-term success as probably humanity's best current chance for meaningful interplanetary colonization.


Regarding the concerns about orbital debris, as a wise man once said: Space is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly hugely mind-bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist, but that's just peanuts to space

Between objects eventually de-orbiting themselves, different options for orbital altitudes, etc., and (as someone mentioned above) the fact that cheaper space travel will make "clean-up missions" feasible, I see it as a risk that needs to be factored into current plans, not a show-stopper.
 
2020-10-25 4:11:46 PM  

leeksfromchichis: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

What about the rational dislike?


You read statements like:

koder: 1260 dead satellites before the end of the decade. Well, being able to stick anything in orbit was fun while it lasted.


When people have already pointed that means 1260 satellites tossed into the South Pacific, you think this is rational dislike?  LEO has never been permanent.  Sputnik stayed up a whopping 3 months.

Yes, the guy is a nut.  You have to be, to start the businesses he made.  How many fortune 500 companies have been founded by those who weren't complete douchebags?  And of those, did any make a real difference in human life?  Sure, he (and Tesla) would be better off having someone like Gwynne Shotwell run Tesla, but until then you can just deal with his antics.

I have to wonder if all the Musk hate could be collected and used as great reasons for socialism.

/Woz isn't that way
//but Apple needed Jobs to take off
///and Jobs was
 
2020-10-25 4:17:42 PM  

sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.


Me either... Anywhere I go, I pass 6-7 Teslas, and that's for short trips down to pick someone up from work. I see them all over the place now, and I've seen a grand total of one on the side of the road...
 
2020-10-25 4:24:14 PM  

koder: 1260 dead satellites before the end of the decade. Well, being able to stick anything in orbit was fun while it lasted.


Without power they self-deorbit in five years
 
2020-10-25 4:41:56 PM  

sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.


He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.
 
2020-10-25 4:45:58 PM  

fragMasterFlash: So Musk will simply design low cost satellite interceptors to be launched along with fresh satellites and help the incommunicado units de-orbit safely. Easy peasy, genius squeezy.


And then you send up gorillas to take out the interceptors.
 
2020-10-25 5:28:45 PM  

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.


Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?

If we wait for Saints, nothing will ever get done.  I hate to break it to you, but there's an old saying that "Everyone is an asshole at least once a day.  The trick is to not exceed your quota."  Now, I'm not going to say Musk doesn't exceed his quota.  It's obvious that a lot of people think he does.

All I'm going to say is that I'm glad that assholes can still do good things, because flawed human beings are all we have to work with.
 
2020-10-25 5:29:35 PM  

fragMasterFlash: So Musk will simply design low cost satellite interceptors to be launched along with fresh satellites and help the incommunicado units de-orbit safely. Easy peasy, genius squeezy.


The fun part will be designing those 'interceptors' so they work right:
* High-efficiency engine will let them change orbit as needed, so they can match with a disabled satellite.
* Soft grippers to grab on to the failed satellite, and a set of metal rods are electromagnetically pulled into the interceptor, setting up the 'push'.
* The interceptor uses its own engine to decelerate the satellite along a pre-calculated trajectory so it will land near Point Nemo.
* At the right moment, the soft claws release and the metal rods get a reverse charge, pushing the bad satellite into a rapidly decelerating orbit, and the opposite reaction is used to restore the orbit of the interceptor so it can go after its next target.
* If the interceptor's fuel gets low it might be able to plot its own course for the ISS, so it can be recovered and refueled.  Turn the ISS into not just a science platform, but also a maintenance/repair platform
 
2020-10-25 6:12:59 PM  
3% isnt bad. Most of the failures safely deorbited.
 
2020-10-25 6:19:21 PM  

Cthushi: fragMasterFlash: So Musk will simply design low cost satellite interceptors to be launched along with fresh satellites and help the incommunicado units de-orbit safely. Easy peasy, genius squeezy.

The fun part will be designing those 'interceptors' so they work right:
* High-efficiency engine will let them change orbit as needed, so they can match with a disabled satellite.
* Soft grippers to grab on to the failed satellite, and a set of metal rods are electromagnetically pulled into the interceptor, setting up the 'push'.
* The interceptor uses its own engine to decelerate the satellite along a pre-calculated trajectory so it will land near Point Nemo.
* At the right moment, the soft claws release and the metal rods get a reverse charge, pushing the bad satellite into a rapidly decelerating orbit, and the opposite reaction is used to restore the orbit of the interceptor so it can go after its next target.
* If the interceptor's fuel gets low it might be able to plot its own course for the ISS, so it can be recovered and refueled.  Turn the ISS into not just a science platform, but also a maintenance/repair platform


Musk can afford his own space stations.

The ISS is a high tech lab, not a gas station.
 
2020-10-25 6:30:47 PM  
3% dead?  I didn't even realize satellites could get COVID.
 
2020-10-25 6:41:19 PM  

wejash: There's the stock fraud and manipulation.


quizzicalgoldenretriever.gif

I get it. He's a douchebag. I don't disagree with you, but you have to wonder why there's so much media hate directed at him in particular. In the pantheon of douchebag CEOs, he's probably not even in the top 100.
 
rka
2020-10-25 7:25:38 PM  

Nicholas D. Wolfwood: Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?


So he's a big enough asshole to warrant mentioning it on Fark.

Is there a problem with that? No one is asking for SpaceX to get broken up and sold off for IP and scrap metal and Musk tossed into a volcano.

Are people supposed to just shut up about him?
 
2020-10-25 7:34:22 PM  

Likwit: wejash: There's the stock fraud and manipulation.

quizzicalgoldenretriever.gif

I get it. He's a douchebag. I don't disagree with you, but you have to wonder why there's so much media hate directed at him in particular. In the pantheon of douchebag CEOs, he's probably not even in the top 100.


It's the publicity.
Elon does the same tactic used by Trump, Steve Jobs and other ceos who enter the spotlight. They make their face the brand to increase their companies value, but then the hand holding that spotlight just wants to see them fall on their face.
When that doesn't happen, Twitter goes nuclear and regurgitates round the clock bile.

I don't think Elon is any more of an asshole than someone in his wealth class is probably bound to be by the nature of their business (you need to be smart, cynical, and a bit of a cutthroat to hold on to a multimillion dollar empire). I think it's that every misstep is magnified by people who have nothing to do all day but gossip, and that makes it seem like he's much worse than he actually is.
 
2020-10-25 7:37:11 PM  

way south: Likwit: wejash: There's the stock fraud and manipulation.

quizzicalgoldenretriever.gif

I get it. He's a douchebag. I don't disagree with you, but you have to wonder why there's so much media hate directed at him in particular. In the pantheon of douchebag CEOs, he's probably not even in the top 100.

It's the publicity.
Elon does the same tactic used by Trump, Steve Jobs and other ceos who enter the spotlight. They make their face the brand to increase their companies value, but then the hand holding that spotlight just wants to see them fall on their face.
When that doesn't happen, Twitter goes nuclear and regurgitates round the clock bile.

I don't think Elon is any more of an asshole than someone in his wealth class is probably bound to be by the nature of their business (you need to be smart, cynical, and a bit of a cutthroat to hold on to a multimillion dollar empire). I think it's that every misstep is magnified by people who have nothing to do all day but gossip, and that makes it seem like he's much worse than he actually is.


There are no ethical billionaires.

encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.comView Full Size
 
2020-10-25 7:38:15 PM  
Have they turned them off and then back on again?
 
2020-10-25 7:42:08 PM  

Tom Marvolo Bombadil: 3% dead?  I didn't even realize satellites could get COVID.


5G! 5 GEEEEEEEEEEE
 
2020-10-25 7:46:14 PM  

Breaker Moran: That's what happens when you try to get two birds stoned at once.


It's not as if it's rocket appliances.
 
2020-10-25 7:56:48 PM  
3%? How many sigmas is that?
 
2020-10-25 8:07:35 PM  
These things have a five-year lifespan, even when they work, so every one launched so far will be down by 2025.

FTA: There are even plans to have a constellation of 42,000 satellites in orbit before the decade is out.

And every one of those will have been launched after 2025, with another 8000+ launched per year, every year after that, just to maintain the constellation. Sounds legit.
 
2020-10-25 8:34:29 PM  

Nicholas D. Wolfwood: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.

Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?

If we wait for Saints, nothing will ever get done.  I hate to break it to you, but there's an old saying that "Everyone is an asshole at least once a day.  The trick is to not exceed your quota."  Now, I'm not going to say Musk doesn't exceed his quota.  It's obvious that a lot of people think he does.

All I'm going to say is that I'm glad that assholes can still do good things, because flawed human beings are all we have to work with.


Yeah. We ran out of all the decent people years ago. We need Musk to show us how to make cars and Trump to show us how to run a country because decent people just can not get it done.

Is Biden the Saint we were waiting for? Or are we surrendering by not voting for an asshole? Hmm. I think I lost you somewhere along the line.
 
2020-10-25 8:46:27 PM  

tyyreaunn: wejash: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

Well, there's AWing even forcing his way into life-threatening situations.

And there's his insane politics.

There's the stock fraud and manipulation.

There's the slandering of innocent bystanders.

It's entirely possible to dislike the man orange guy, but love his vision for a space-faring herd immunityfuture.  He isn't the managertech-messiah that some make him out to be, but I still hope for SpaceX's The Supreme Court'slong-term success as probably humanity's best current chance for meaningful interplanetary colonizationdestruction of liberal democracy.



Just having a little fun here. Don't read too much into it. A man on a mission is not flawless. Often his followers have to take the good with the bad. And we do not see our heroes as others do.

Maybe rules and norms were set up to keep us from getting swept up in hero worship in the first place. When the rules and norms get violated, it means something.
 
2020-10-25 8:50:09 PM  

2fardownthread: Nicholas D. Wolfwood: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.

Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?

If we wait for Saints, nothing will ever get done.  I hate to break it to you, but there's an old saying that "Everyone is an asshole at least once a day.  The trick is to not exceed your quota."  Now, I'm not going to say Musk doesn't exceed his quota.  It's obvious that a lot of people think he does.

All I'm going to say is that I'm glad that assholes can still do good things, because flawed human beings are all we have to work with.

Yeah. We ran out of all the decent people years ago. We need Musk to show us how to make cars and Trump to show us how to run a country because decent people just can not get it done.

Is Biden the Saint we were waiting for? Or are we surrendering by not voting for an asshole? Hmm. I think I lost you somewhere along the line.


There was an adage I read somewhere that there are two classes of people-- generally good people who do bad things by accident, and generally bad people whose good acts happen by accident.  I don't pronounce my judgement on Musk, but it seems to me fashionable now, especially among people who show a tendency to need to defend questionable behaviors, that they pronounce all people bad whose good acts are essentially accidental.  Frankly I don't find it all that distant from the idea that successful people are intrinsically ubermenchen who in the Nietzschian tradition, are successful precisely because they don't constrain themselves to good or evil.  Thus, one can be as big of a prick (or worse) as they want and that is the separator of success or failure.
 
2020-10-25 8:59:58 PM  

Barfmaker: Marcus Aurelius: 3% isn't bad

They plan to launch 42,000 of those things, if 3% of them can't maneuver then a very unfortunate billiards game could result.


Says the person who has no idea how insanely large low earth orbit is.
 
2020-10-25 9:00:28 PM  

Nicholas D. Wolfwood: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.

Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?

If we wait for Saints, nothing will ever get done.  I hate to break it to you, but there's an old saying that "Everyone is an asshole at least once a day.  The trick is to not exceed your quota."  Now, I'm not going to say Musk doesn't exceed his quota.  It's obvious that a lot of people think he does.

All I'm going to say is that I'm glad that assholes can still do good things, because flawed human beings are all we have to work with.


Yeah, these purity tests are getting ridiculous.
 
2020-10-25 9:07:32 PM  

Mikey1969: Nicholas D. Wolfwood: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.
He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.
Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?
If we wait for Saints, nothing will ever get done.  I hate to break it to you, but there's an old saying that "Everyone is an asshole at least once a day.  The trick is to not exceed your quota."  Now, I'm not going to say Musk doesn't exceed his quota.  It's obvious that a lot of people think he does.
All I'm going to say is that I'm glad that assholes can still do good things, because flawed human beings are all we have to work with.
Yeah, these purity tests are getting ridiculous.


Yeah, I'm tired of people who think that we deserve to have a living planet.
 
2020-10-25 10:31:16 PM  

Olympic Trolling Judge: koder: 1260 dead satellites before the end of the decade. Well, being able to stick anything in orbit was fun while it lasted.

This looks like a job for... SPAAAAACE FOOOOORCE!


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-10-25 10:31:37 PM  
I used to be against Musk, but seeing as his mad dash to advance humanity will create a junk barrier to prevent spreading the human virus to other planets, I am kind of okay with this.
 
2020-10-25 10:54:25 PM  
Dr Kessler, to the white courtesy phone, please.
 
2020-10-25 11:15:00 PM  
Suck it, haters.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-10-25 11:16:27 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: Unfortunately, the company did not provide enough information to indicate which of their satellites were affected

And if you can't tell from the orbit, it ain't a serious problem, breathless.  Take this chill pill and relax a stitch.


So not only did you not bother reading the entire article, you also ignored the additional reading it suggested about Kessler Syndome. If you understood what that was, then you might change your opinion.

End of Space - Creating a Prison for Humanity
Youtube yS1ibDImAYU
 
2020-10-25 11:30:36 PM  

Barfmaker: Marcus Aurelius: 3% isn't bad

They plan to launch 42,000 of those things, if 3% of them can't maneuver then a very unfortunate billiards game could result.


At 150 kliks up, I'll sell you tickets.
 
2020-10-25 11:31:43 PM  

the unabomber was right: So not only did you not bother reading the entire article, you also ignored the additional reading it suggested about Kessler Syndome. If you understood what that was, then you might change your opinion.


Sweetheart.
 
2020-10-25 11:50:35 PM  

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.


I'm pretty sure his only real goal is to go to Mars. He, himself. And build the first city. And probably rule it with an iron fist with the help of his modified ape army. Money is just the means to do that. If it means he has to build cool shiat to do that, so be it. I don't really think it's anything more than that. And yes I'm aware he doesn't "build" or "design" the cool shiat. That's irrelevant. And yeah, maybe he's an asshole but I don't have to deal with him. I generally like where this is going.
 
2020-10-25 11:53:37 PM  

sxacho: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.

I'm pretty sure his only real goal is to go to Mars. He, himself. And build the first city. And probably rule it with an iron fist with the help of his modified ape army. Money is just the means to do that. If it means he has to build cool shiat to do that, so be it. I don't really think it's anything more than that. And yes I'm aware he doesn't "build" or "design" the cool shiat. That's irrelevant. And yeah, maybe he's an asshole but I don't have to deal with him. I generally like where this is going.


He's an Edison.
 
2020-10-26 12:19:52 AM  

Nicholas D. Wolfwood: Abe Vigoda's Ghost: sithon: I dislike his employment and union busting tactics, but I don't get the irrational hate a lot of you people have.

He's an asshole. Just because some of his projects may be beneficial (he's in it for the money, not for the betterment of humanity), does not make him less of an asshole.

Ok, so he's an asshole.  So what?

If we wait for Saints, nothing will ever get done.  I hate to break it to you, but there's an old saying that "Everyone is an asshole at least once a day.  The trick is to not exceed your quota."  Now, I'm not going to say Musk doesn't exceed his quota.  It's obvious that a lot of people think he does.

All I'm going to say is that I'm glad that assholes can still do good things, because flawed human beings are all we have to work with.


This is exactly the kind of shiat thinking that lead to Trump being elected.  "Oh he gives me stuff I want and everyone else is just as bad".
 
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