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(Politico)   "By believing passionately in something that still does not exist, we create it"   (politico.com) divider line
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5905 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 21 Oct 2020 at 1:05 AM (12 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



79 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2020-10-20 8:44:25 PM  
This isn't White Wolf's Mage: The Ascension.

This is, however, the stupefyingly misappropriation of subjective reality that a lot of NeoCons glommed on to. They really liked the idea of feeding a view of reality that was divorced from facts. It is a weaponization of limited perception, as opposed to an understanding of how mind and emotions color our experience.

And boy howdy do they REALLY want to limit folks' perceptions.
 
2020-10-20 8:51:15 PM  
Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

/the judge is ~being diplomatic~
 
2020-10-20 9:30:25 PM  
I'd say that probably 50% of the time a Trump Admin motion is rejected by a court it is because they did their paperwork incorrectly. The rest of the time is is just illegal or unconstitutional.
 
2020-10-20 10:10:16 PM  
94% rejection rate. I'll hazard a guess. The judge was trying to expedite a backlog of claims, and in order to return to compliance, DeVos's people were sending denial letters. There were 4400 claims accepted, so they had to have at least looked at the paperwork. How many claims were they looking at? What was there benchmark? What kind of orders were given to the Education Dept that they could come up with a 94% rejection rate? DeVos is only one woman. How were there that many employees under her willing to screw people trying to get justice for being caught up in lending fraud? Yes, Trump has filled his cabinets with the dregs of corporate society, but that doesn't fill out entire departments with cronies. These are still career employees for the most part.
 
2020-10-20 10:12:52 PM  
 

IgG4: I'd say that probably 50% of the time a Trump Admin motion is rejected by a court it is because they did their paperwork incorrectly. The rest of the time is is just illegal or unconstitutional.


My GED in law is a little out of date but I would guess that judges HATE having their time wasted with BS, incomplete, or incorrect filings etc. Why they even give them an in person hearing I don't understand. You would think they would just give it a grade of I and rule for the other side.
 
2020-10-20 11:45:48 PM  
Franz Kafka - Rock Opera
Youtube 8uaaF83eVig
 
2020-10-21 1:14:47 AM  
LA BOUM - Reality - Richard Sanderson (HD)
Youtube 8ejtIwBpqK4
 
2020-10-21 1:17:58 AM  
i.chzbgr.comView Full Size
 
2020-10-21 1:19:20 AM  
I can't be the only person who wishes using that word was an impeachable offense.
 
2020-10-21 1:25:45 AM  
Sounds suspiciously like prosperity gospel bullshiate
 
2020-10-21 1:26:04 AM  
DRGFA
 
2020-10-21 1:26:34 AM  
A bit sauced
 
2020-10-21 1:46:16 AM  

gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.


What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?
 
2020-10-21 1:47:31 AM  
I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company
 
2020-10-21 1:53:09 AM  
I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.
 
2020-10-21 1:55:23 AM  

Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.


Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.
 
2020-10-21 1:58:15 AM  

Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.


Meh, banks do the same shiat with credit cards and mortgages, not to mention "investment" accounts.

/But thanks even smarter guy.
 
2020-10-21 2:00:03 AM  

bsmz: gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?


She gets to keep all the stamps they don't use. Sweet untouched sheets of Forever stamps just lay there waiting for her grasp.
 
kab [TotalFark]
2020-10-21 2:01:28 AM  
Well.. duh.  See: religion.
 
2020-10-21 2:02:09 AM  

Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.


I did find this funny:

"Students came together to speak up for themselves and show the court the massive scope of the trauma they have endured at the hands of the Department of Education, and the courts are listening," said Eileen Connor, legal director at Harvard Law School's Project on Predatory Student Lending...

/Trauma???
//Seriously???
 
2020-10-21 2:07:50 AM  
a denial rate of 94 percent

Is that for loan forgiveness or reality?
 
2020-10-21 2:12:49 AM  

gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

/the judge is ~being diplomatic~


Even today, despite the mountains of evidence and years of flagrant misbehaviour our institutions continue to treat the Trump administration and the GOP as if they were acting in good faith. It boggles the mind.
 
2020-10-21 2:24:08 AM  

Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.


Except this article isn't about ALL student loans, it's specifically about the student loans from institutions (allegedly) engaging in fraud. Where, by definition, the students were misled and therfore did NOT know exactly what they were getting themselves into.
 
2020-10-21 2:47:01 AM  

PerryWinnwet: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Except this article isn't about ALL student loans, it's specifically about the student loans from institutions (allegedly) engaging in fraud. Where, by definition, the students were misled and therfore did NOT know exactly what they were getting themselves into.


If only they were educated beforehand.
 
2020-10-21 2:47:18 AM  

bsmz: gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?


She is heavily invested in for-profit education.  If loans are forgiven eventually there will be fewer loans.
 
2020-10-21 2:52:08 AM  

PerryWinnwet: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Except this article isn't about ALL student loans, it's specifically about the student loans from institutions (allegedly) engaging in fraud. Where, by definition, the students were misled and therfore did NOT know exactly what they were getting themselves into.


That's fairy. I see you're point:

She has sought to curtail loan forgiveness for defrauded students - an effort that has enraged her Democratic critics.
 
2020-10-21 2:59:05 AM  

Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

Meh, banks do the same shiat with credit cards and mortgages, not to mention "investment" accounts.


Oh, banks do it? Those moral paragons? Then by all means, let it continue. After all, if we make any attempt to protect anyone from being financially taken advantage of then we're not properly punishing them for being financially vulnerable in the first place. Or something.
 
2020-10-21 3:18:41 AM  

TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company


Now that your credit score is -720 because of bullshiat you'll only be able to borrow from these lenders, and at predatory rates.  Mission Accomplished.  MAGA.  This is the future they had in mind.

2.bp.blogspot.comView Full Size
 
2020-10-21 3:22:21 AM  

Phony_Soldier: That's fairy. I see you're point:


NSFW

Jhené Aiko - P*$$Y FAIRY (OTW)
Youtube wy2ujCUtCHU
 
2020-10-21 4:00:53 AM  

Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

I did find this funny:

"Students came together to speak up for themselves and show the court the massive scope of the trauma they have endured at the hands of the Department of Education, and the courts are listening," said Eileen Connor, legal director at Harvard Law School's Project on Predatory Student Lending...

/Trauma???
//Seriously???


Being forcibly evicted from your rented accommodation when you know your lack of money is due to an orchestrated scam IS pretty traumatic.
 
2020-10-21 4:32:13 AM  

Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

I did find this funny:

"Students came together to speak up for themselves and show the court the massive scope of the trauma they have endured at the hands of the Department of Education, and the courts are listening," said Eileen Connor, legal director at Harvard Law School's Project on Predatory Student Lending...

/Trauma???
//Seriously???


Well the DoE under DeVos has been rolling back protections for rape victims...
 
2020-10-21 4:40:02 AM  

zepillin: Phony_Soldier: That's fairy. I see you're point:

NSFW

[iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/wy2ujCUt​CHU?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3​A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsap​i=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&​widgetid=1]


What was NSFW about that? You are never allowed to plan a bachelor party.
 
2020-10-21 5:08:23 AM  

Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.


This program is designed to help people who literally didn't know what they were getting into. The program helps people by forgiving loans when they were defrauded. The schools and programs lied to them to get them to sign up and take loans.

Might help if you actually read the farking article
 
2020-10-21 5:13:12 AM  

bsmz: gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?


At one point, while holding her office, she was invested win at least one debt collection company involved in collecting delinquent student loans. She was supposed to divest herself of that interest. I don't know if that ever happened.

Even if she did do it and is no longer directly invested in the debt collection industry, you can bet she still has friends there.
 
2020-10-21 5:18:15 AM  

TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company


Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.
 
2020-10-21 5:40:04 AM  

Do you know the way to Mordor: Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

I did find this funny:

"Students came together to speak up for themselves and show the court the massive scope of the trauma they have endured at the hands of the Department of Education, and the courts are listening," said Eileen Connor, legal director at Harvard Law School's Project on Predatory Student Lending...

/Trauma???
//Seriously???

Being forcibly evicted from your rented accommodation when you know your lack of money is due to an orchestrated scam IS pretty traumatic.


Nope, rent is first priority.
 
2020-10-21 5:41:10 AM  

IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.


I'm actually okay with people being forced to pay for the loans they take out, as opposed to taxpayers bailing them out. If someone was actually conned into taking a loan then that is a different story.
 
2020-10-21 5:49:45 AM  

IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.


Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.
 
2020-10-21 5:53:24 AM  

Phony_Soldier: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

I'm actually okay with people being forced to pay for the loans they take out, as opposed to taxpayers bailing them out. If someone was actually conned into taking a loan then that is a different story.


Glad to hear it.  As stated in the article people actually were conned.  And as also discussed in the article, the department of education is turning down relief applications en masse instead of applying the program rules to help the victims.
 
2020-10-21 5:59:23 AM  

fusillade762: a denial rate of 94 percent

Is that for loan forgiveness or reality?


Yes.
 
2020-10-21 6:00:58 AM  

The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.


There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.
 
2020-10-21 6:07:01 AM  

IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.


You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.
 
2020-10-21 6:21:52 AM  

bsmz: gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?


Forcing them to sell AmWay on the side?  Purchasing their homes for pennies on the dollar when they're insolvent?  Have them forced to work for her brother's mercenary company?
 
2020-10-21 6:37:34 AM  

The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.


According to the federal government, you aren't eligible for income-based repayment if you're in default. Not sure why you slipped through, but I'm glad you did.

https://studentaid.gov/manage-loans/r​e​payment/plans/income-driven/questions
 
2020-10-21 6:45:05 AM  

RogueWallEnthusiast: bsmz: gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?

Forcing them to sell AmWay on the side?  Purchasing their homes for pennies on the dollar when they're insolvent?  Have them forced to work for her brother's mercenary company?


Getting kickbacks from the loan companies.
 
2020-10-21 7:01:26 AM  
LOL oh I luv it - "disturbingly Kafkaesques"- you just know that DeVos had no farking idea what that meant.  I hate DeVos, I would like to see her in jail next year, but all the evil she has done is probably legal.
 
2020-10-21 7:06:52 AM  

Phony_Soldier: /Trauma???
//Seriously???


Millennial-speak for upset. Cf "anxiety" which is millennial-speak for "worry".
 
2020-10-21 7:09:32 AM  

orbister: Phony_Soldier: /Trauma???
//Seriously???

Millennial-speak for upset. Cf "anxiety" which is millennial-speak for "worry".


Your post:

Asshole speak for "I lack empathy and am a human shi ... Er ... I'm a Republican"
 
2020-10-21 7:13:45 AM  

Langdon_777: LOL oh I luv it - "disturbingly Kafkaesques"- you just know that DeVos had no farking idea what that meant.  I hate DeVos, I would like to see her in jail next year, but all the evil she has done is probably legal.


It's corruption since she has invested in a student loan company.
Or maybe we should embrace crony capitalism and naked corruption.
Why not defund the police and have them funded only by the funds from fines, fees, and civil asset forfeiture?  Or politicians only get paid by developers and other businesses directly?
Or how about for profit prisons, health care, and public schools. Wait, already did that...
 
2020-10-21 7:19:53 AM  

Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.



That is what I was going to say.

Furthermore...  The schools charge outrageous amounts of money for things knowing that loans will pay for it all.  And if you want to continue in school, you had damned well come up with a way to pay.

If the Fed were serious about helping kids with education, these loans, at the very least, would be interest free.  There is no reason that the Fed needs to be making a profit off of a shiatload of kids not being able to afford college.
 
2020-10-21 7:40:03 AM  

Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.


No one knew they were getting defrauded in the cases at hand before it happened. Stick the they-deserved-it victim blaming bullshiat back with all the other crap we hear from DeVos.
 
2020-10-21 7:45:49 AM  

IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.

According to the federal government, you aren't eligible for income-based repayment if you're in default. Not sure why you slipped through, but I'm glad you did.

https://studentaid.gov/manage-loans/re​payment/plans/income-driven/questions


That's interesting, though besides the point: this is a case, or rather, 160,000 cases of fraud. Nobody should be forced to pay on fraudulent terms if the government already has proof the fraud was committed, and the rest of this is nothing but victims providing evidence that they were wronged in this process. The fraud itself isn't even in dispute, it's solely DeVos who wants to be a horrid biatch and deny people their right to have fraud committed against them rectified.
 
2020-10-21 8:00:58 AM  
I absolutely agree with the headline statement. Just  not for her.
 
2020-10-21 8:09:31 AM  

PerryWinnwet: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Except this article isn't about ALL student loans, it's specifically about the student loans from institutions (allegedly) engaging in fraud. Where, by definition, the students were misled and therfore did NOT know exactly what they were getting themselves into.


And perhaps many of the applications don't prove fraud - they prove that people want their loan to go away.

Proving fraud is a high hurdle to clear. If you can prove actual fraud, then you actually open up the door to the Federal False Claims Act, which allows the government to go after the entity committing fraud for treble damages.
 
2020-10-21 8:10:32 AM  
well

/sh*t
//mom always said don't play with your balls in the house
 
2020-10-21 8:11:40 AM  

Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

Meh, banks do the same shiat with credit cards and mortgages, not to mention "investment" accounts.

/But thanks even smarter guy.


There aren't a whole lot of 18 year olds shopping for mortgages and investment accounts.
 
2020-10-21 8:12:33 AM  

IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.

According to the federal government, you aren't eligible for income-based repayment if you're in default. Not sure why you slipped through, but I'm glad you did.

https://studentaid.gov/manage-loans/re​payment/plans/income-driven/questions


In default is not the same as behind on payments.
 
2020-10-21 8:26:57 AM  
God unavailable for comment.
 
2020-10-21 8:31:36 AM  
Joseph Goebbels: If you repeat the same lie, eventually people will believe it
 
2020-10-21 8:31:48 AM  

Kairam: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.

According to the federal government, you aren't eligible for income-based repayment if you're in default. Not sure why you slipped through, but I'm glad you did.

https://studentaid.gov/manage-loans/re​payment/plans/income-driven/questions

That's interesting, though besides the point: this is a case, or rather, 160,000 cases of fraud. Nobody should be forced to pay on fraudulent terms if the government already has proof the fraud was committed, and the rest of this is nothing but victims providing evidence that they were wronged in this process. The fraud itself isn't even in dispute, it's solely DeVos who wants to be a horrid biatch and deny people their right to have fraud committed against them rectified.


I completely agree with you that nobody should be forced to repay loans that were procured by fraud.

But income-based repayment isn't completely unrelated to the topic at hand - not everyone with student loans was defrauded but there are supposed to be avenues for loan relief for them as well.

Also, similar to the forgiveness program being discussed, the DeVos DoE screwed students by looking the other way when loan servicers didn't properly inform borrowers of their repayment options - an effect of which was to cause people to lose eligibility for alternate plans by falling behind.

So another example of DeVos screwing the little people.
 
2020-10-21 8:32:37 AM  

IndyJohn: orbister: Phony_Soldier: /Trauma???
//Seriously???

Millennial-speak for upset. Cf "anxiety" which is millennial-speak for "worry".

Your post:

Asshole speak for "I lack empathy and am a human shi ... Er ... I'm a Republican"


You sound traumatised.
 
2020-10-21 8:36:43 AM  

gar1013: PerryWinnwet: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Except this article isn't about ALL student loans, it's specifically about the student loans from institutions (allegedly) engaging in fraud. Where, by definition, the students were misled and therfore did NOT know exactly what they were getting themselves into.

And perhaps many of the applications don't prove fraud - they prove that people want their loan to go away.

Proving fraud is a high hurdle to clear. If you can prove actual fraud, then you actually open up the door to the Federal False Claims Act, which allows the government to go after the entity committing fraud for treble damages.


1). This isn't a court of law.  Borrowers aren't required to prove fraud by clear and convincing evidence.  The program as written has its own standards and the DoE wasn't applying those standards.

2).  The entities in question who were perpetrating fraud are generally (I think maybe all) defunct.  The issue of potential remedies under the False Claims Act is moot.
 
2020-10-21 8:39:24 AM  

TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

We will just garnish your wages, tax returns, and put a lien on your possessions and you can't file for Bankruptcy to get rid of us anymore.

Fixed for reality
 
2020-10-21 8:43:25 AM  

gar1013: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.

According to the federal government, you aren't eligible for income-based repayment if you're in default. Not sure why you slipped through, but I'm glad you did.

https://studentaid.gov/manage-loans/re​payment/plans/income-driven/questions

In default is not the same as behind on payments.


Unless the loan has specific terms saying otherwise, someone behind on loan payments is absolutely in default.

That said, some loans are written with specific provisions defining default as being behind by X days or more.  It's possible that student loans have a provision of that sort.  I don't know.

But the general rule (absent specific terms) is that you are in default of a contract to pay money when you are behind on your payments.
 
2020-10-21 8:46:59 AM  

orbister: IndyJohn: orbister: Phony_Soldier: /Trauma???
//Seriously???

Millennial-speak for upset. Cf "anxiety" which is millennial-speak for "worry".

Your post:

Asshole speak for "I lack empathy and am a human shi ... Er ... I'm a Republican"

You sound traumatised.


I've never been evicted and I have never been behind on my student loans (I still have an outstanding loan from grad school but I haven't paid in full since the interest rate is low).

But I'm not a heartless asshole.
 
2020-10-21 9:11:08 AM  

IndyJohn: I've never been evicted and I have never been behind on my student loans (I still have an outstanding loan from grad school but I haven't paid in full since the interest rate is low).

But I'm not a heartless asshole.


I have the greatest sympathy for those who were sold loans fraudulently and agree completely that their debts should be cancelled. That does not mean that I have to agree with the word "trauma" to describe any upsetting experience. Being upset is bad too.
 
2020-10-21 9:20:59 AM  

chitownmike: Do you know the way to Mordor: Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

I did find this funny:

"Students came together to speak up for themselves and show the court the massive scope of the trauma they have endured at the hands of the Department of Education, and the courts are listening," said Eileen Connor, legal director at Harvard Law School's Project on Predatory Student Lending...

/Trauma???
//Seriously???

Being forcibly evicted from your rented accommodation when you know your lack of money is due to an orchestrated scam IS pretty traumatic.

Nope, rent is first priority.


They take that choice away from you by garnishing your wages.

You try paying rent on $75 a week.
 
2020-10-21 9:41:47 AM  
st3v3piper.files.wordpress.comView Full Size
 
2020-10-21 10:07:53 AM  
media.tenor.comView Full Size
 
2020-10-21 10:11:46 AM  

MadHatter500: chitownmike: Do you know the way to Mordor: Phony_Soldier: Bandito King: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Predatory lending practices exist, smart guy.

As for DeVos, lock her up.

I did find this funny:

"Students came together to speak up for themselves and show the court the massive scope of the trauma they have endured at the hands of the Department of Education, and the courts are listening," said Eileen Connor, legal director at Harvard Law School's Project on Predatory Student Lending...

/Trauma???
//Seriously???

Being forcibly evicted from your rented accommodation when you know your lack of money is due to an orchestrated scam IS pretty traumatic.

Nope, rent is first priority.

They take that choice away from you by garnishing your wages.

You try paying rent on $75 a week.


Getting off topic but if you work a job where your primary income is tips it's basically impossible to be garnished because your paycheck is nothing after withholding.  So wait tables or work the pole.

But it doesn't stop interest from accruing so it is just kicking the can down the road.
 
2020-10-21 10:33:49 AM  

IndyJohn: gar1013: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.

According to the federal government, you aren't eligible for income-based repayment if you're in default. Not sure why you slipped through, but I'm glad you did.

https://studentaid.gov/manage-loans/re​payment/plans/income-driven/questions

In default is not the same as behind on payments.

Unless the loan has specific terms saying otherwise, someone behind on loan payments is absolutely in default.

That said, some loans are written with specific provisions defining default as being behind by X days or more.  It's possible that student loans have a provision of that sort.  I don't know.

But the general rule (absent specific terms) is that you are in default of a contract to pay money when you are behind on your payments.


You're wrong, and the person who smarted you is wrong.

CFR §674.5 clearly defines the number of days past due before the loan is considered in default for Perkins loans.

Looking elsewhere, in the mortgage world, a Notice of Default is sent once a loan is 60 days past due.

Words mean something. Sorry, but that's the truth.
 
2020-10-21 11:30:27 AM  

PerryWinnwet: Phony_Soldier: I don't understand why the loans should be forgiven. People knew what they were getting into.

Except this article isn't about ALL student loans, it's specifically about the student loans from institutions (allegedly) engaging in fraud. Where, by definition, the students were misled and therfore did NOT know exactly what they were getting themselves into.


This refutation of the statement as presented goes against my partisan narrative.  I will thusly disregard. Because magiclican thinking.
 
2020-10-21 11:34:03 AM  

haknudsen: bsmz: gameshowhost: Shut up, Politico.  DeVos is simply *lying*.  She doesn't believe a goddamned thing she's pushing - she has a financial interest in pushing what she's pushing, and that's all she cares about.

What is DeVos' financial interest in denying all those claims?

She is heavily invested in for-profit education.  If loans are forgiven eventually there will be fewer loans.


ty for infroming bsmz and the three other knuckleheads that smarted his/her/it's post

<- went to bed much earlier than usual
 
2020-10-21 11:35:44 AM  

The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.


Ummm...how the holy hell did you get 400k in the hole.

I got a MBA and borrowed enough on top to support my wife and kid and at the end of the day I was only ate about 120. (2004-5) still owe 27k after 15yrs of paying 550 a month. I've emigrated now and am about to default because ... im out of reach at this point.

W that total you might consider doing same?
 
2020-10-21 11:51:32 AM  

Father_Jack: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: The_Homeless_Guy: IndyJohn: TorpedoOrca: I honestly do not understand how this student loan pyramid scheme is supposed to play out.

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Oh, you defaulted on your loan? Well there goes your credit score that was already in the toilet. I'll just sell this off to another debt collection company

Student loans generally can't be discharged in bankruptcy. This means they can follow you forever into the grave unlike most other debts.

It also means that you can be subjected to ongoing collection activity through the courts. Wage garnishment, and also harassing requirements to appear in court and potential arrest for failure to appear.  The debt collectors don't just sit back passively and sell the debt to the next chump.  They try to collect and can make peoples lives hell while doing so.

Are most of the loans in question federal loans and if so aren't they eligible for PAYE or other repayment plans? I wouldn't think the department of education would have much authority over the completely private. With a repayment plan 10 percent of your income (minus a basic cost of living adjustment so the first few 10's of thousands of income don't count) isn't that bad. Many people pay nothing or a couple hundred bucks a month. The only problem is that, when they forgive your loans after 20 years, the amount forgiven is taxable as income. Owing money to the IRS at the end could be a significant problem. Change that part of the law and you have essentially solved the student loan crisis.

There are a number of income-based repayment plans for student loans. However, my understanding is that every single one of them requires you to be current in order to qualify. If you are I behind at all, you can end up falling down a rabbit hole never to get out.

In addition and related, some of the major student loan servicers have been sued because they did not provide proper and adequate information to borrowers about income-based repayment.

You don't have to be current to enroll I was a bit behind as I forgot the paperwork at one point. They literally let anyone. The process is simple too. In most cases they just need either last year's tax return or a months worth of paystubs to calculate your income. I owe close to 400k in loans. I pay 400 bucks a month. I'd like to have that extra money but such is life. I do have a mutual fund account I am placing enough in to cover the eventual tax bill as I am not even covering the interest at this point and will never pay off any of the principle. However I realize that everyone might not be able to save in that manner so again what needs to happen is to just not tax that money at the end.

Ummm...how the holy hell did you get 400k in the hole.

I got a MBA and borrowed enough on top to support my wife and kid and at the end of the day I was only ate about 120. (2004-5) still owe 27k after 15yrs of paying 550 a month. I've emigrated now and am about to default because ... im out of reach at this point.

W that total you might consider doing same?


So you're a scumbag?
 
2020-10-21 12:08:44 PM  

gar1013: You're wrong, and the person who smarted you is wrong.

CFR §674.5 clearly defines the number of days past due before the loan is considered in default for Perkins loans.

Looking elsewhere, in the mortgage world, a Notice of Default is sent once a loan is 60 days past due.

Words mean something. Sorry, but that's the truth.


1)  That CFR section literally does NOT define the term "default" for borrowers.  It's part of a scheme to penalize institutions with too may bad loans, and it sets out a calculation that takes into account how long loans have been in "default".  Notably, when talking about borrowers the CFR uses the word "default" in a way that's consistent with the general definition I noted -- that is, the duration of the borrower's default is the amount of time that they have been behind in their payments.

2)  In mortgage context, notices of default are sent according to the loan terms -- there is no 60-day standard.  I literally filed an eviction case 2 weeks ago under a seller-financed mortgage, and notice of default was sent when payment was late by 15 days because that's how the terms of the document defined a default.

3)  Again, I said that "the general rule (absent specific terms) is that you are in default of a contract to pay money when you are behind on your payments".  The existence contract terms that specifically define default does not make my statement inaccurate.

4)  Words do mean something, but not what you think.  Try looking up "default" in an online legal dictionary -- Law.com and Merriam-Webster both have good, free law dictionaries.  You will find definitions of "default" consistent with what I stated.  For example, "failure to make a payment when due".  https://dictionary.law.com/Default.as​p​x?selected=459
 
2020-10-21 2:28:50 PM  

Bandito King: zepillin: Phony_Soldier: That's fairy. I see you're point:

NSFW

[iFrame https://www.youtube.com/embed/wy2ujCUt​CHU?autoplay=1&widget_referrer=https%3​A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&start=0&enablejsap​i=1&origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fark.com&​widgetid=1]

What was NSFW about that? You are never allowed to plan a bachelor party.


better safe than sorry

language I guess, I have no idea what is and what isn't but I have gotten ragged for it so

unless it's obviously not it is
 
2020-10-21 2:36:42 PM  
And even if it's obviously not it maybe

better safe than sorry
 
2020-10-21 7:07:32 PM  
Your belief, or mine has no bearing on reality.  Believing in something real does not make it more real.  Not believing in something unreal does not make it less real.  Believing in something unreal (faith) does not make it real at all, it just makes you look stupid.  Our beliefs are meaningless and unproductive.  The world would be a less ignorant place without belief.
 
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