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(Wired UK)   You may like a show on Netflix but if you don't watch the entire season the first month it comes out, Netflix thinks you suck   (wired.co.uk) divider line
    More: Dumbass, Television program, Cancellation, Cost, Ayumi Hamasaki, Netflix Original, Television network, Television, Costs  
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1222 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 25 Sep 2020 at 2:05 PM (9 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2020-09-25 12:23:02 PM  
Netflix acts like they have their finger on the pulse but this story proves they don't know squat.  Hulu and Amazon should pick up all those shows that aren't popular enough (but still have fanbases) according to Netflix's moronic metrics.

Everybody who latched on to the internet early and scored big with one type of business or another - shockingly they all think they're huge geniuses.  See Jeff Bezos, Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, whoever runs Netflix, etc.  I will say this, their timing was excellent.
 
2020-09-25 12:52:04 PM  
Cobra Kai, Cobra Kai, Cobra Kai...

Strike First
Strike Hard
No Mercy
 
Xai [TotalFark]
2020-09-25 1:01:28 PM  
Now I understand why they have so many anime shows - lower cost to produce, so when compared against viewership it seems like a better deal.

I think the factor they might be missing is that there is too much overlap, that they may have too much content focussed on the binge viewers and not enough on more casual viewers who are, ironically the most likely to cancel their subscription and thus require the most attention, not the least.
 
2020-09-25 1:20:42 PM  
Or, in other words, Netflix is acting exactly like the networks have been for the past decade.  If a show doesn't immediately bring in top 10 ratings, it's toast.
 
2020-09-25 1:41:34 PM  
*kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.
 
2020-09-25 1:55:52 PM  

IlGreven: Or, in other words, Netflix is acting exactly like the networks have been for the past decade.  If a show doesn't immediately bring in top 10 ratings, it's toast.


This show was canceled 15 years ago, let's do a reunion! The reunion bombed, cancel it!
 
2020-09-25 2:12:49 PM  
Dark Crystal: Age of Resistance didn't even get a second season.  :-(
 
2020-09-25 2:16:59 PM  

Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.


Season 2 was absolute expired ass on a plate. How do you go from cyperpunk noir detective stuff to Syfy original movie so quickly?!

That said, Luke Cage needs to finish the arc they were going with it's main character.
 
2020-09-25 2:18:07 PM  

Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.


Stand next to a reactor
 
2020-09-25 2:18:32 PM  

Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.


It ran its course. Especially after the mindless drek it turned into in season 2. Still waiting for a new Love Death and Robots tough.
 
2020-09-25 2:20:13 PM  
Can I say I like how Amazon is staggering the release of The Boys? It's been letting me better absorb and digest each individual episode while also giving me an extra something to look forward to on the weekend.
 
2020-09-25 2:20:45 PM  

Subtonic: Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.

It ran its course. Especially after the mindless drek it turned into in season 2. Still waiting for a new Love Death and Robots tough.


The spiritual sequel to Heavy Metal deserves more love. LD&R is nothing short of quick works of art for everyone to enjoy.
 
2020-09-25 2:25:38 PM  
And Disney+ ate their lunch with the weekly release of their series instead of dumping it all at once.

Netflix acts like it can't learn anything from anyone and they're more arrogant than Disney, if that's possible.

Most amazing thing I saw was the Netflix chief declaring in WSJ that work-from-home was 100% negative and he saw no value in it at all. I see.
 
2020-09-25 2:26:02 PM  

LaBlueSkuld: Can I say I like how Amazon is staggering the release of The Boys? It's been letting me better absorb and digest each individual episode while also giving me an extra something to look forward to on the weekend.


I think that even the people who complain about it will enjoy the show more because of it. One piece of cake a day tastes great. Eating the whole cake in one sitting becomes boring if not sickening after a few pieces. The parts of one's brain that are engaged by comedy/storytelling/action need time to recharge as well.
 
2020-09-25 2:35:10 PM  
You mean like Space Force. I am still only about half way through that thing and for the most part I can't figure out why it is not funnier. I think a big part of it is the episodes should have only been about 23 minutes long.
 
2020-09-25 2:35:43 PM  
i find the premise unlikely.
I'm pretty sure the answer is:

1: new shows pull new viewers to at least check it out, instantly, while established shows have audiences that don't tend to be as much growth as stable.
+
2: the more powerful market force these days is total amount of options + continuous churn of new stuff.
more than a stacked deck of sought after IPs.
+
3: established popular shows actually just more costly to make over time as the producers, actors, writers all wind up with leverage to demand a bigger slice of the pie for themselves, makes for a lower margin for the business to keep it going.
+
4: it's sub fees not advertiser monye, so no guessing at what is popular and agreeing with advertisers about what they are willing to pay for a time slot based on show a maintained popularity anyway. Just the subs and what they pay for is more fresh choices churn than same old stuff week after week like old days of scheduled TV watching
=
market responds to environmental changes too, just that it evolves to suit the needs/wants of sellers really, not so much the consumers.

Belly ache all you want, it is the flow rate of revenue that is all they can hear to respond to.
 
2020-09-25 2:38:58 PM  
I loved the first series of Altered Carbon. Second one, I lasted two episodes and bailed.

I'm screwing with their metrics. I've just started Sons of Anarchy. I'm doing one to two episodes a night.
 
2020-09-25 2:43:28 PM  
They're the new Fox.

Sarah Conner Chronicles, Futurama, Firefly, New Amsterdam, Keen Eddy, etc etc.
 
2020-09-25 2:43:46 PM  

IlGreven: Or, in other words, Netflix is acting exactly like the networks have been for the past decade.  If a show doesn't immediately bring in top 10 ratings, it's toast.


I think the networks' average has been much worse. If you look at the period from each year's pilot season, when the networks start doling out development deals, to the subsequent season, the percentage of shows that actually make it from pilot deal through a first season is abysmal.
 
2020-09-25 2:50:12 PM  

IlGreven: Or, in other words, Netflix is acting exactly like the networks have been for the past decade.  If a show doesn't immediately bring in top 10 ratings, it's toast.


That frustrated me so much about network TV:
"(sigh) This new show didn't reach the ratings we thought it was entitled to by the time pilot episode ended. I guess we have to cancel it... poor pitiful us... might as well order some new reality shows, cop/lawyer procedurals, and smart wife/dumb husband sitcoms. (sigh) Our job is soooooooo tough."
 
2020-09-25 2:54:38 PM  

Darth_Saltine: IlGreven: Or, in other words, Netflix is acting exactly like the networks have been for the past decade.  If a show doesn't immediately bring in top 10 ratings, it's toast.

That frustrated me so much about network TV:
"(sigh) This new show didn't reach the ratings we thought it was entitled to by the time pilot episode ended. I guess we have to cancel it... poor pitiful us... might as well order some new reality shows, cop/lawyer procedurals, and smart wife/dumb husband sitcoms. (sigh) Our job is soooooooo tough."


Or reality show
 
2020-09-25 2:54:56 PM  
Some of us aren't vegetables.
We have lives.

That is Why you aren't putting out streaming live content, Netflunks
 
2020-09-25 2:58:21 PM  

Capo Del Bandito: Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.

Season 2 was absolute expired ass on a plate. How do you go from cyperpunk noir detective stuff to Syfy original movie so quickly?!


Plus, season 2 didn't have Martha Higareda:

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-09-25 2:59:21 PM  

Capo Del Bandito: Subtonic: Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.

It ran its course. Especially after the mindless drek it turned into in season 2. Still waiting for a new Love Death and Robots tough.

The spiritual sequel to Heavy Metal deserves more love. LD&R is nothing short of quick works of art for everyone to enjoy.


LD&R was a real mixed bag for me (I wouldn't have minded some more robots, for starters...), but I'm glad it's out there for people to form their own opinions on. Also I'm pretty sure it started as Fincher's Heavy Metal project that they just rebranded later.
 
2020-09-25 2:59:59 PM  

JolobinSmokin: They're the new Fox.

Sarah Conner Chronicles, Futurama, Firefly, New Amsterdam, Keen Eddy, etc etc.


I liked Sarah Connor Chronicles but it's cancellation made total sense. The first episode was aired after I think an NFL playoff game and got insane rating (like 18 million people watched it). It was also linked to a hugely successful movie franchise. But even with all of that working in it's favour by the end of season 2 it only had 2-3 million people watching it.
 
2020-09-25 3:01:32 PM  

wejash: And Disney+ ate their lunch with the weekly release of their series instead of dumping it all at once.


Not that Disney had a choice, given their dearth of content, if they wanted people to subscribe for more than a free trial.
 
2020-09-25 3:29:57 PM  

Michael J Faux: wejash: And Disney+ ate their lunch with the weekly release of their series instead of dumping it all at once.

Not that Disney had a choice, given their dearth of content, if they wanted people to subscribe for more than a free trial.


I don't think the bingeing model is particularly good, anyway. People watch a whole series in a sitting or two and then forget that it exists for the next year.
 
2020-09-25 3:36:39 PM  

Michael J Faux: Also I'm pretty sure it started as Fincher's Heavy Metal project that they just rebranded later.


You know I wouldn't doubt that...
 
2020-09-25 3:39:50 PM  
Seems like a perfectly reasonable model, niche shows with rabid fanbases are nice but doesn't bring in any new viewers, it might retain viewers but retaining more then their loss compared to the cost of the season is much harder to compile data for I would imagine. I wouldn't cry to hard, what show might be greenlit that wouldn't have but for the loss of another show that fans will love even more? This be less of an issue if they rented out their shows to other services but that dilutes the reason to come to their brand too which is a reasonable business decision too.
 
2020-09-25 3:41:54 PM  

JolobinSmokin: They're the new Fox.

Sarah Conner Chronicles, Futurama, Firefly, New Amsterdam, Keen Eddy, etc etc.


Family guy has been cancelled
Youtube 0oMTmtN7lHI
 
2020-09-25 3:43:28 PM  

IlGreven: Or, in other words, Netflix is acting exactly like the networks have been for the past decade.  If a show doesn't immediately bring in top 10 ratings, it's toast.


That's not how they work.

Broadcast has a limited timeframe to work with.  8-11pm window for NBC, CBS, ABC, 8-10pm window for CW and Fox (Fox even less with Thursday nights tied up with football and Friday nights tied up with smackdown).  You have X slots you can fill.  You produce so many new pilots a year, so you have to trim the fat away from the lowest performing ones (or ones not worth the cost) to slide them to the limited slots you have.

Streaming services aren't bound to that.  They're not bound to a number of slots.  They're not bound to begging for 18-49 demographics that advertisers crave.

For years Netflix used this to their advantage to cater to any and all demographics and niches they could.  As long as it found some sort of an audience, they kept it.

Now it's literally 'must have very large audience to renew it' and then 'to get more than 3 seasons, it must have an enormous audience'.  And they seem to decide this pretty quickly.

Every show I've liked gets cut without warning, usually after 2 or 3 'seasons' (which adds up to about 1 season of a normal show).  They barely get to find their footing and it's gone. 

/So I purposefully refuse to watch any Netflix original show now.  I'll happy go back and watch after the fact in the event there's actually a show that's good that passes a couple seasons.  The Crown actually got to do what it planned, so I'll watch that.  Chilling Adventures of Sabrina I got into before I made the decision to not get involved with any more shows, so I'll watch the final part of that as well.  That's it.
 
2020-09-25 4:00:04 PM  

Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.


Me too, but they shot their wad on season 2.
And Mackie just didn't do Kovacs well.
 
2020-09-25 4:28:19 PM  

Capo Del Bandito: Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.

Season 2 was absolute expired ass on a plate. How do you go from cyperpunk noir detective stuff to Syfy original movie so quickly?!



Because they didn't follow the books for the second season?
 
2020-09-25 4:38:35 PM  

Krab: Because they didn't follow the books for the second season?


Perhaps they should have instead of going full Syfy.
 
2020-09-25 5:17:22 PM  
At least Ozark is getting a final season.
 
2020-09-25 5:20:36 PM  
glad i dont use netflix.  But then i am not the market. 

Only show i have watched with passion is the Expanse.
 
2020-09-25 6:41:17 PM  
Altered Carbon season 2 was a mess.
 
2020-09-25 7:18:06 PM  
So basically the article's theory is that Netflix is making renew/drop decisions too soon after the release of a show's second season?  When in fact viewership patterns are too dispersed for that to be a valid way to judge the overall draw of a show, since people presumedly watch a couple episodes then come back later to finish it instead of literally binging everything all the time?

I mean, okay, that theory passes the smell test of not being obviously impossible on first inspection, but I don't know how you'd actually prove it without access to Netflix's actual viewer data... which TFA doesn't have, and the writer doesn't prove in any way.

Like... cool theory, bro, but it's basically raw speculation and even that assessment's being generous.

Not helping his case is that all three of their four examples that I've actually seen (Sense8, Luke Cage, and Altered Carbon) had massive fall-off in the quality of the writing in their second season, something that I'm the opposite of alone in thinking to the point that the seasonal rot being for reals is more or less the consensus outside of super-obsessed but small fan groups.  Sense8 especially was hit hard by this, going from a pretty interesting thriller with a unique supernatural twist to "All My Children"/"General Hospital" level soap-opera bullshiat at record speed and adopting a laser-focus on the least-likable of the eight available options for no goddamned reason beyond what I assume was Author Appeal of the most superficial sort.

// I do feel a little bad for Altered Carbon, because by its very premise it was going to shuffle the cast and writers every season and had a strong chance of being good again in season 3... but still, season 2 was weak, and that's that.

// Luke Cage season 2 had a good series in it, too bad it was surrounded by filler and ended... weirdly.
 
2020-09-25 8:20:09 PM  

Swiss Colony: I loved the first series of Altered Carbon. Second one, I lasted two episodes and bailed.

I'm screwing with their metrics. I've just started Sons of Anarchy. I'm doing one to two episodes a night.


You may want to bail on that. For the most part, the series is great, but the ending smacks of the writers saying, "We don't wanna do this anymore."
 
2020-09-25 9:14:56 PM  
So I feel the lesson here is to leave your favorite streaming at all times.
 
2020-09-25 9:28:32 PM  

Krab: Capo Del Bandito: Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.

Season 2 was absolute expired ass on a plate. How do you go from cyperpunk noir detective stuff to Syfy original movie so quickly?!


Because they didn't follow the books for the second season?


The second book wasn't cyberpunk noir either. But yeah, the second season blew.
 
2020-09-25 10:27:50 PM  

Capo Del Bandito: Subtonic: Myrdinn: *kicks ground* I wanted more Altered Carbon.

It ran its course. Especially after the mindless drek it turned into in season 2. Still waiting for a new Love Death and Robots tough.

The spiritual sequel to Heavy Metal deserves more love. LD&R is nothing short of quick works of art for everyone to enjoy.


I would have put Sturgill Simpson's Sound and Fury as the spiritual successor to Heavy Metal.  LD&R is more like The Outer Limits
 
2020-09-25 11:08:12 PM  
You'd think Netflix would just give up on the "season" concept and simply commission shows that tell their entire story in N episodes or whatever.
 
2020-09-25 11:15:10 PM  
Don't worry. When Netflix releases a new series you're bound to binge watch within the first month of its release, they'll give it another season and then cancel it.
 
2020-09-26 4:51:41 AM  
Dont like the model, get your friends to watch the show. Oh and pay for Netflix
 
2020-09-26 5:57:49 AM  
This crap is exactly why I rarely watch anything new when it comes out, especially scifi stuff on Fox, that gets cancelled in a heartbeat.

Bosch was an exception to this rule. Everything else I wait until the series is over or start after it's been renewed so I don't get into something then be disappointed. For example, started watching Gotham a few weeks ago...I was so sure it was going to get cancelled while it was on.
 
kab
2020-09-26 2:56:40 PM  
Given the rate of cancellations and not wanting to deal with wasting my own time, I tend to not watch shows until several seasons in.

/same goes for trilogies.
 
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