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(Centers for Disease Control)   Hey gang, hoping someone out there has a link to solid data on 2019 vs 2020 monthly/weekly morbidity. I'm in an battle with a guy I need to convince covid is real. This seems like the best way of showing it is. Since everything else is "tainted"   (cdc.gov) divider line
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287 clicks; posted to Discussion » on 24 Sep 2020 at 10:11 PM (10 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-09-24 8:47:52 PM  
4 votes:
This might sound like a weird question but...do you have a shovel?
 
2020-09-24 9:36:46 PM  
2 votes:

hebrides: I could go on and on, but this one hits close to home. I haven't been able to work since May and recently got let go from a job I gave my heart and soul to for five years. I don't blame my former employer -- they worked with and waited for me as long as they could. I blame the virus your friend doesn't believe in.


I'm so sorry. I think I have some leftover symptoms myself. Yeah, I tell everybody that I had it, it was pretty bad, and it is quite real. Then they say, well, my friend got sick, but his wife didn't, so how bad can it be? And they'll keep saying that it's no big deal even if someone they know gets pretty sick. Because cult.
 
2020-09-25 1:34:25 AM  
1 vote:
never argue with an idiot.  They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
 
2020-09-24 11:43:46 PM  
1 vote:

Destructor: Shostie: Have you considered the idea that this dude is just a dumb asshole?

Hey listen. I'm a dumber asshole than a lot of people I know. I've made so many mistakes. So many. So many countless tears of regret....... They haunt me constantly... They can never be forgiven...... Never.


I have felt the same way. But understand something: In life there are innumerable paths. And very few of them are well lit and have truthful signposts. Most of them, in fact, are shrouded in fog and lie to us about where they go.

For each choice there are so many paths available. And all of them seem random, due to lack of knowledge and the fact that other humans (through their ignorance, or through laziness, or on purpose) distort your perception of the nature of those paths. And for each choice in your life, only one of those paths is the "right" one. Simply by random chance, most of your choices will be wrong. That, unfortunately, is called "being Human." The human mind is not entirely rational. It is mainly emotional, and always choosing the rational course is difficult.
I tried to say all this in the novel: "The Maze Race is metaphor for the Struggle of Life. The moral hallmark of civilization is commitment to dismantling the world's  death traps and dead ends, so that each Maze Racer in the  Maze of Life may more expeditiously travel their Path." - The martyred Universist Sage Dothallian


All we can each do is muddle forward, and be easy on ourselves. The mistakes can be forgiven, and the nidus for that is truly felt regret, newly discovered understanding, and a commitment to pass along the torch, regardless of how guttered and flickering it may be.

It's hackneyed and (some say) stupid, but Max Ehrmann's Desiderata is, in fact, true. Be easy with yourself. You're human, not a robot. shiat happens.
 
2020-09-24 11:38:14 PM  
1 vote:
Fark user imageView Full Size

Imagine if they could see the virus among the crowd.
 
2020-09-24 11:11:32 PM  
1 vote:

Carter Pewterschmidt: Ask him if he thinks pretty much every other country on the planet is in on this conspiracy.  Why would countries like France and the UK cause huge damage to their economies, and huge criticism of the leaders of those countries, to support a US conspiracy? Who does he think is behind this? Why?


(((SOROS!))) Is. Just. That. Good. And don't forget (((Bill Gates))). He has to get his zombie microchip mind controller implanted in everyone some way.
 
2020-09-24 11:07:15 PM  
1 vote:

Xcott: Destructor: My adversary (so to speak) is blowing it off with stuff like "well, grandma died of cancer, and they're marking it as covid!!!1!" And that there is a massive conspiracy to hide what's really happening because Doctors and/or hosptial/health-care systems are paid to lie on Death Certificates for big Buck$$$.

You could always put the guy on defense.  Dare him to name the last time the US death toll was at least 100,000 more than the previous year.   Give him some of this data and ask him how far back you have to go to see such a thing.  I'm guessing the Civil war. Pandemic of 1918.

Then present the extra deaths and say (1) what could have suddenly killed so many extra people in a single year, exactly in synch with the COVID outbreak?  And (2) does anyone seriously believe that without the coronavirus outbreak, all those extra deaths would have just happened as a statistical fluke?


FTFY
 
2020-09-24 10:32:14 PM  
1 vote:

Xcott: Does this help?

It's also worth providing data of past death counts to show just how little they normally change from year to year.  I recently gathered these death totals from an admittedly arbitrary source:

2018: 2,839,205 (25702 from previous year)
2017: 2,813,503 (69255 from previous year)
2016: 2,744,248 (31618 from previous year)
2015: 2,712,630 (86212 from previous year)
2014: 2,626,418 (29425 from previous year)
2013: 2,596,993 (53714 from previous year)
2012: 2,543,279 (27821 from previous year)
2011: 2,515,458 (47023 from previous year)
2010: 2,468,435 (31272 from previous year)
2009: 2,437,163 (-34821 from previous year)
2008: 2,471,984 (48272 from previous year)
2007: 2,423,712 (-2552 from previous year)
2006: 2,426,264 (-21753 from previous year)
2005: 2,448,017 (50402 from previous year)
2004: 2,397,615 (-50673 from previous year)
2003: 2,448,288 (4901 from previous year)
2002: 2,443,387 (26962 from previous year)
2001: 2,416,425 (13074 from previous year)
2000: 2,403,351

Here's the thing, though:  I put these numbers in front of a COVID denier, a guy who insisted that the deaths this year weren't caused by COVID.  I pointed out that

1.  We never see an extra few hundred thousand deaths just by random chance.
2.  This year we are seeing extra deaths in the 6-figure range.
3.  They exactly coincide with the coronavirus outbreak, and peak when the outbreak peaks
4.  There is no other phenomenon that would suddenly kill 200,000 extra people for no reason.

Therefore

z.  This clearly must be caused by something, and the cause is very obviously COVID.

The guy still didn't accept it.  He said it wasn't caused by COVID.  I asked what else could have done it, and he basically said "causes."  I asked if he believes these extra deaths would have happened if there was no coronavirus outbreak, and he just rebooted his brain and started over.  There was no way to convince him.

On the other hand, I think it might have made some inroads with other people readi ...


The same thing holds true for AGW.  There's the rise in temps. There's the physics that shows what it would take to produce the rise in temps.

Deniers: natural variability.

Science: OK. What changed?

Deniers: natural variability.

Science: Of course, natural variability isn't a process or phenomenon of its own. Some force has to fluctuate within it's usual limits. Known physics says it's the increase in human source greenhouse gases. Particularly cO2. In fact, some forces are belownormal limits.

Deniers: natural variability.

Then you remember that people are automatons. Like Poe's Raven.
 
2020-09-24 9:31:57 PM  
1 vote:

Destructor: My adversary (so to speak) is blowing it off with stuff like "well, grandma died of cancer, and they're marking it as covid!!!1!" And that there is a massive conspiracy to hide what's really happening because Doctors and/or hosptial/health-care systems are paid to lie on Death Certificates for big Buck$$$.


I hear this one regularly. And I like my coworkers, but they are immune to science. I tried telling one woman that "cause of death" was an actual medical term. If someone had been obese and had high blood pressure for decades, then finally died because they caught covid, covid was the CAUSE OF DEATH. Obesity helped, but the cause of the person dying was the covid. It was a specific thing that the medical examiner was looking for- it was the CAUSE OF DEATH.

I don't think she heard me.
 
2020-09-24 9:06:55 PM  
1 vote:
Piss on their shoes and walk away.
 
2020-09-24 8:36:43 PM  
1 vote:

Shostie: Have you considered the idea that this dude is just a dumb asshole?


Hey listen. I'm a dumber asshole than a lot of people I know. I've made so many mistakes. So many. So many countless tears of regret....... They haunt me constantly... They can never be forgiven...... Never.

But, you know, you've got to do Right as you see the Right.

Right? :-)

Maybe, if I can salvage just one soul... Just one.... It might make a difference.

/And scene!
 
2020-09-24 8:06:01 PM  
1 vote:

Destructor: jasonvatch: It's a cult. They cannot be convinced that they are wrong, and the harder you try, the harder they'll fight it. It's a lose-lose situation; just cut your losses and run away.

We have to try. We have to. :-(


Fark Independent gets confronted by the true face of American conservatism and now thinks at the eleventh hour that he can reason with Frankenstein's monster.

I mean, it's not really funny since this is the shiat that's going to kill us all, and you and people like you have enabled it into existence. But it's kind of funny.
 
2020-09-24 7:40:33 PM  
1 vote:

Destructor: jasonvatch: It's a cult. They cannot be convinced that they are wrong, and the harder you try, the harder they'll fight it. It's a lose-lose situation; just cut your losses and run away.

We have to try. We have to. :-(


I don't deny that. But this guy thinks he's as smart as the President - and unfortunately, he's right. It's a failure of the educational system in the USA, which has been under attack for decades.

Make me President, and I'll declare that a healthy, educated populace is necessary for our National Defense.
 
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