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(KMPH San Joaquin Valley)   Smart: Building a high speed train between Las Vegas and Los Angeles. Stupid: Building a high speed train between Las Vegas and the middle of the California desert   (kmph.com) divider line
    More: Stupid, high-speed train, Rail transport, Nevada, Permits, Las Vegas  
•       •       •

3981 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Sep 2020 at 2:20 PM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



115 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2020-09-24 1:31:37 PM  
Huh? The only thing between Los Angeles and Las Vegas is desert.
 
2020-09-24 1:34:15 PM  
Maybe by way of Omaha.
 
2020-09-24 1:36:34 PM  
Gso go west from LA via the ocean?
 
2020-09-24 1:36:46 PM  

enry: Gso go west from LA via the ocean?


So...
 
2020-09-24 1:37:30 PM  
Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-09-24 1:42:42 PM  
Under the desert is the way to go.
 
2020-09-24 1:56:26 PM  

Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]


Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-09-24 2:09:57 PM  
You can't build here. This is bat country.
 
2020-09-24 2:24:38 PM  
This will turn Victorville into a world-class metropolis. No doubt about it.
 
2020-09-24 2:25:08 PM  

dj_bigbird: Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]

Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

[Fark user image image 783x505]


Depends on where in the LA area you are.

At least Victorville makes sense for everyone - you sort of head in that director regardless, as opposed to spending an hour plus to get to downtown LA to then turn around and head in the opposite direction.
 
2020-09-24 2:25:29 PM  
...at least it ain't Disneyland to the Bunny Ranch, like those libs originally envisioned, amirite?
 
2020-09-24 2:25:46 PM  

optikeye: You can't build here. This is bat country.


Thread's Over
 
2020-09-24 2:27:00 PM  
I wonder if Palin was their consultant
/reference to her Bridges to nowhere

Fark user imageView Full Size
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-09-24 2:27:03 PM  

dj_bigbird: Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]

Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

[Fark user image 783x505]


Its easier to build a train through an unpopulated desert than it is through forested mountains and cities full of yuppies that protests that trains are dangerous to the health of their children when neglecting to remember that they have active oil wells on their school campuses.

Phases, how the fark do they work?
 
2020-09-24 2:27:36 PM  
not that strait for a hsr. anyhow i knew when they kicked out all the Chinese expert to replace them with local grifters that this was going to be a clusterfark.
 
2020-09-24 2:27:51 PM  

dj_bigbird: Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]

Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

[Fark user image image 783x505]


If you've ever had to drive back to California from Las Vegas on a Sunday, you'd happily welcome anything that skips through the state checkpoint.
 
2020-09-24 2:29:41 PM  
Oh wow, beautiful downtown Victorville! I wanna see a mothballed 747!

No really, this high speed rail crap annoys me: do it or do not do it, but quit these periodic news stories about a line that may or may not open ten years from now between Bumblefark, Nowhere, and Wherethehell, Arewe.
 
2020-09-24 2:29:57 PM  
A bus would be cheaper.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-09-24 2:31:23 PM  

WastrelWay: This will turn Victorville into a world-class metropolis. No doubt about it.



It put Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook on the map.
 
2020-09-24 2:35:02 PM  

dj_bigbird: Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]

Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

[Fark user image image 783x505]


I wish the news would actually tell the truth on this, because TFA is wrong.

The train's first phase is being built to Victorville.  Nevada and California had to jointly issue permits for this.  The second phase (which is rarely talked about because, hey, why ruin a good story and FARK headline?) is from Victorville to Rancho Cucomonga, where a train to LA already exists.  That's in the planning and exploratory phase, and if it gets rejected, the phase will instead head west to Palmdale,  where another train already exists, and will join up with the planned bullet train being built.

I'm just always annoyed by the whole "iT's OnLy GoInG tO ViCtOrViLlE" coming from the news.
 
2020-09-24 2:35:25 PM  
Even this is less dumb than the High Speed [sic] Rail rathole project that California has poured billions into.
 
2020-09-24 2:36:18 PM  

WastrelWay: This will turn Victorville into a world-class metropolis. No doubt about it.


Last time I went to California from Las Vegas we stopped at Mcdonalds to get a coffee.  Some nasty drugged out chick was standing outside, leaning against the wall, and when I walked by with my coffee she coughed on me. Unfortunately, Mcdonalds coffee cup lids have a hole in them without a cover.  A couple days later I felt crappy and all I could think of was some glob of spit doing a perfect swish right into my cup.  That is my forever memory of Victorville.
 
2020-09-24 2:37:12 PM  

dj_bigbird: Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.


Victorville already has train service into LA.  I assume this is simply going to connect to the same station and people will transfer.  Doesn't sound entirely stupid.
 
2020-09-24 2:37:46 PM  
How many seismic fault lines are they avoiding by not going all the way to LA?
 
2020-09-24 2:38:30 PM  

WastrelWay: This will turn Victorville into a world-class metropolis. No doubt about it.


Just look at what it did for Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook!
 
2020-09-24 2:40:16 PM  
Ha! Subby never played Simcity
《Reads article》
Oh yeah, that doesn't sound shady at all...🙄
 
2020-09-24 2:45:53 PM  

ng2810: dj_bigbird: Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]

Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

[Fark user image 783x505]

Its easier to build a train through an unpopulated desert than it is through forested mountains and cities full of yuppies that protests that trains are dangerous to the health of their children when neglecting to remember that they have active oil wells on their school campuses.

Phases, how the fark do they work?


you've never driven through that part of California, have you? It's not flat desert, it's fairly rough and mountainous. There's no way a train is going to maintain any real speed through there to make it a good alternative to driving on the I-15, especially if the train has to share the tracks with the freight trains that run that route.
 
2020-09-24 2:45:57 PM  

knbwhite: WastrelWay: This will turn Victorville into a world-class metropolis. No doubt about it.

Last time I went to California from Las Vegas we stopped at Mcdonalds to get a coffee.  Some nasty drugged out chick was standing outside, leaning against the wall, and when I walked by with my coffee she coughed on me. Unfortunately, Mcdonalds coffee cup lids have a hole in them without a cover.  A couple days later I felt crappy and all I could think of was some glob of spit doing a perfect swish right into my cup.  That is my forever memory of Victorville.


I've lived in Victorville. You pretty much nailed it.
 
2020-09-24 2:46:56 PM  

vestona22: dj_bigbird: Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

Victorville already has train service into LA.  I assume this is simply going to connect to the same station and people will transfer.  Doesn't sound entirely stupid.


Yes, once a day and it takes nearly 3 hours.
 
2020-09-24 2:50:32 PM  

dj_bigbird: vestona22: dj_bigbird: Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

Victorville already has train service into LA.  I assume this is simply going to connect to the same station and people will transfer.  Doesn't sound entirely stupid.

Yes, once a day and it takes nearly 3 hours.


Oh, and it's Amtrak's Southwest Chief. So, the run from Los Angeles MIGHT be on time, maybe. If you're lucky. Maybe. But going the other way (Victorville to Los Angeles), it's a complete crap shoot as to when the train will ever show up as the train starts in Chicago. It's not unheard of for that train to be HOURS late by the time it gets to Los Angeles. So, it's not a reliable way to get between LA & Victorville.
 
2020-09-24 2:51:06 PM  
It is also easier to terminus initially in Victorville.  Otherwise you have to go over the Cajon Pass (there is existing rail line there but it slow and crowded with freight trains so I don't imagine they would use it).  If you go east to Palmdale there is another freight/commuter rail line that follows the 14 freeway through the Escondito and Soledad passes.  At least you might have a view of the world famous Vasquez Rocks that have appeared in numerous TV and movies. Either way, to get things started there is probably a market there, just need to make sure security is tight in the parking lots.  Otherwise riders will be awfully annoyed if their return from Vegas has missing or stripped cars.
 
2020-09-24 2:51:11 PM  
This should have been done 20 years ago. In fact it's been talked about for about 30 years. Weekend traffic is insane on the I-15, especially on holiday weekends. This would allow for more visitors to Vegas, while decreasing traffic and accidents and save people a lot of time and headaches.
Now if they could only settle on some mass transportation on The Strip. They've been fighting over a monorail there for decades as well.
 
2020-09-24 2:51:34 PM  
And any good sim player knows you have to build a construction yard first
 
2020-09-24 2:54:29 PM  
Too late to buy a parking lot in Victorville?  I don't mean a chunk of I15 either.
 
2020-09-24 2:59:24 PM  

KodosZardoz: This should have been done 20 years ago. In fact it's been talked about for about 30 years. Weekend traffic is insane on the I-15, especially on holiday weekends. This would allow for more visitors to Vegas, while decreasing traffic and accidents and save people a lot of time and headaches.
Now if they could only settle on some mass transportation on The Strip. They've been fighting over a monorail there for decades as well.


No, it wouldn't. It'd only mitigate a small portion of the traffic between LV & Victorville. To make any real dent, you'd need trains running at least every 30 min or so between the two places. And then what? How do the people from OC, LA, SD, etc get back to their homes from Victorville? They all jump on the 15 (or 10). All you've done postpone the traffic for the 180mi between LV & Victorville. Until a train can sustain a speed of 100mph+ from LA or San Diego (or whatever) with few/no stops, it's never going to be faster than a car from southern California. Doing this would require separate tracks (from the freight) and lots of tunnels (like through the Cajon Pass). And it's definitely not going to beat a plane that you can catch from Burbank, John Wayne (Orange County), LAX, Long Beach or San Diego into Vegas which takes under an hour.
 
2020-09-24 2:59:35 PM  
You just know the Fiends are going to have a field day with that....
 
2020-09-24 3:01:11 PM  
I think this might be a more helpful image for those of us who didn't know where Victorville was in relation to any relevant city/landmark.  Specifically, it's according to google maps 90 minutes outside of LA.  Unclear if that accounts for traffic but considering it's 85 miles my guess is no.

So I don't know how this helps to be honest.  Like others have said/suggested, unless you happen to currently live in Victorville, you've still got to account for at least an hour of travel distance whether that be via your personal car or bus or whatnot making the commute super annoying.  Maybe the longer term hope is to get the train from Victorville to LA?  (and maybe later to SF?)

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-09-24 3:05:20 PM  
So, whose palms got greased, or didn't get greased, to get the rail to stop in Victorville instead of going all the way to LA?

/We seriously need HSR in this country.
//Bring back the concept of express trains and Flyers.
 
2020-09-24 3:05:27 PM  

Bob Falfa: Huh? The only thing between Los Angeles and Las Vegas is desert.


Bat country.
 
2020-09-24 3:05:32 PM  

dj_bigbird: dj_bigbird: vestona22: dj_bigbird: Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

Victorville already has train service into LA.  I assume this is simply going to connect to the same station and people will transfer.  Doesn't sound entirely stupid.

Yes, once a day and it takes nearly 3 hours.

Oh, and it's Amtrak's Southwest Chief. So, the run from Los Angeles MIGHT be on time, maybe. If you're lucky. Maybe. But going the other way (Victorville to Los Angeles), it's a complete crap shoot as to when the train will ever show up as the train starts in Chicago. It's not unheard of for that train to be HOURS late by the time it gets to Los Angeles. So, it's not a reliable way to get between LA & Victorville.


Add a back-and-forth commuter line to that stretch of rail. Should solve the problem of having only one passenger train daily with unreliable inbound service.
 
2020-09-24 3:08:21 PM  

lennavan: I think this might be a more helpful image for those of us who didn't know where Victorville was in relation to any relevant city/landmark.  Specifically, it's according to google maps 90 minutes outside of LA.  Unclear if that accounts for traffic but considering it's 85 miles my guess is no.

So I don't know how this helps to be honest.  Like others have said/suggested, unless you happen to currently live in Victorville, you've still got to account for at least an hour of travel distance whether that be via your personal car or bus or whatnot making the commute super annoying.  Maybe the longer term hope is to get the train from Victorville to LA?  (and maybe later to SF?)

[Fark user image 576x555]


There's no train service from anywhere in southern California to San Francisco. The closest you can get, really, is Oakland and then you take an Amtrak or Greyhound bus from Oakland the rest of the way into SF.
 
2020-09-24 3:08:54 PM  

Kit Fister: So, whose palms got greased, or didn't get greased, to get the rail to stop in Victorville instead of going all the way to LA?

/We seriously need HSR in this country.
//Bring back the concept of express trains and Flyers.


The San Andreas fault line.

The terrain (especially the elevation changes) between Victorville and downtown LA are not particularly conductive to 150+ MPH rail travel.

/you're right about the need for HSR though
 
2020-09-24 3:10:48 PM  
King Something:
Add a back-and-forth commuter line to that stretch of rail. Should solve the problem of having only one passenger train daily with unreliable inbound service.

That's a nice idea, but there's no demand for a commuter rail from Victorville to LA. Plus, to have an impact on the traffic, you'd need to run lots (dozens?) of trains per day on the weekends (Fri/Sat/Sun), and then that rolling stock sits idle Mon-Thurs when there's no one who really wants to take the train between the two, especially when it'd take 2 hrs by rail and you can drive it in less time and then you have your car to get around LA.
 
2020-09-24 3:11:41 PM  

Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image image 850x611]


Uber to LAX/LB - 20-30min
Get to airport 1hr before min - 1hr
Flight delay average: 10-15min?
Flight time - 1hr
Taxi/Depart plane - 20min
Uber to hotel - 30min

Total time - 3.5hr min

Average drive door to door for Vegas: 4hrs?

Benefit of flying: not driving and all that horseshiat

Benefits of driving: not on a schedule, and you can transport booze
 
2020-09-24 3:12:31 PM  

dj_bigbird: Badmoodman: Here Subby, this may be helpful to you:

[Fark user image 850x611]

Someone didn't RTFA. The train is going between Vegas and Victorville, which really is in the middle of the desert. And if you're going to drive to Victorville to catch the train to go to LV, you might as well drive the rest of the way.

[Fark user image image 783x505]


At least they're being upfront about this one also being a train to nowhere.
 
2020-09-24 3:13:27 PM  

knbwhite: WastrelWay: This will turn Victorville into a world-class metropolis. No doubt about it.

Last time I went to California from Las Vegas we stopped at Mcdonalds to get a coffee.  Some nasty drugged out chick was standing outside, leaning against the wall, and when I walked by with my coffee she coughed on me. Unfortunately, Mcdonalds coffee cup lids have a hole in them without a cover.  A couple days later I felt crappy and all I could think of was some glob of spit doing a perfect swish right into my cup.  That is my forever memory of Victorville.


i read 'forever' as 'favorite'
it still works
 
2020-09-24 3:13:53 PM  
Between drought and megafires and pollution and corruption and corona virus, LA won't be viable much longer.  Between drought and coronavirus and economic collapse, Vegas wont be viable either.  Just shut down both cities and relocate the inhabitants to a regional work camp.
 
2020-09-24 3:14:59 PM  
VICTORVILLE?! Why would you... Jesus, that really IS the middle of the desert!

I mean, congratulations to f**king VICTORVILLE and all on becoming a major travel hub, but who the f**k decided that one? Hell, Palmdale would've made a better choice. Sure, it's further west, but at least has an airport!

Seriously, what am I supposed to do in Victorville? Visit the Route 66 Museum? Kill time at the Wal-Mart? I have SEVERAL questions! >:-(
 
2020-09-24 3:15:05 PM  
is there a chance the track could bend?
 
2020-09-24 3:15:30 PM  

King Something: Kit Fister: So, whose palms got greased, or didn't get greased, to get the rail to stop in Victorville instead of going all the way to LA?

/We seriously need HSR in this country.
//Bring back the concept of express trains and Flyers.

The San Andreas fault line.

The terrain (especially the elevation changes) between Victorville and downtown LA are not particularly conductive to 150+ MPH rail travel.

/you're right about the need for HSR though


Routing via Palmdale crosses the SAF and is done with it. The route through Cajon Pass is in the fault zone for miles.
 
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