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(Cycling News)   After 3 weeks of bicycling around France the peloton arrives in Paris just before their one month free trial expires   (cyclingnews.com) divider line
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262 clicks; posted to Sports » on 20 Sep 2020 at 3:36 PM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-09-20 12:38:46 PM  
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2020-09-20 5:39:34 PM  
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2020-09-20 6:39:20 PM  
in the penultimate stage a 21 year old kid swept up the yellow jersey, the white jersey and the king of the mountains. today's final stage was boring.
kid is probably juicing. Lance broke all my enjoyment of cycling. the only way to win is to cheat.
 
2020-09-20 6:47:31 PM  

chucknasty: in the penultimate stage a 21 year old kid swept up the yellow jersey, the white jersey and the king of the mountains. today's final stage was boring.
kid is probably juicing. Lance broke all my enjoyment of cycling. the only way to win is to cheat.


As Bill Burr said. "Our roided up guy beat your roided up guy." They were all cheating at the time. Wasn't the guy from the Post Office team also stripped of medals?
 
2020-09-20 7:22:27 PM  

bfh0417: chucknasty: in the penultimate stage a 21 year old kid swept up the yellow jersey, the white jersey and the king of the mountains. today's final stage was boring.
kid is probably juicing. Lance broke all my enjoyment of cycling. the only way to win is to cheat.

As Bill Burr said. "Our roided up guy beat your roided up guy." They were all cheating at the time. Wasn't the guy from the Post Office team also stripped of medals?


That's why when Lance Armstrong was stripped of his wins, no one else was retroactively awarded the win because you would have to go deep into the field to find someone not juicing their body or their bike.
 
2020-09-20 7:35:28 PM  

nursetim: bfh0417: chucknasty: in the penultimate stage a 21 year old kid swept up the yellow jersey, the white jersey and the king of the mountains. today's final stage was boring.
kid is probably juicing. Lance broke all my enjoyment of cycling. the only way to win is to cheat.

As Bill Burr said. "Our roided up guy beat your roided up guy." They were all cheating at the time. Wasn't the guy from the Post Office team also stripped of medals?

That's why when Lance Armstrong was stripped of his wins, no one else was retroactively awarded the win because you would have to go deep into the field to find someone not juicing their body or their bike.


Thank you. I wasn't aware of that. I don't follow the sport closely.
 
2020-09-20 7:57:11 PM  
I usually follow the Tour pretty closely but this year had trouble even remembering it was on.  I did watch the ITT yesterday though.  Who knew that Slovenia was going to be the next cycling powerhouse.

Anybody else reminded of LeMond taking the yellow jersey from Fignon when Pogacar was putting time on Roglic?
 
2020-09-20 8:06:41 PM  

relaxitsjustme: I usually follow the Tour pretty closely but this year had trouble even remembering it was on.  I did watch the ITT yesterday though.  Who knew that Slovenia was going to be the next cycling powerhouse.

Anybody else reminded of LeMond taking the yellow jersey from Fignon when Pogacar was putting time on Roglic?


it reminded me of how the announcers spoke about Lance, how it was 'incredible' and 'unbelievable' (they later said they were sure there was something up in documentaries about lance doping). there is no way a clean racer has that much left at stage 20. not after winning two stages. human bodies do not work like that.
 
2020-09-20 9:04:36 PM  

chucknasty: relaxitsjustme: I usually follow the Tour pretty closely but this year had trouble even remembering it was on.  I did watch the ITT yesterday though.  Who knew that Slovenia was going to be the next cycling powerhouse.

Anybody else reminded of LeMond taking the yellow jersey from Fignon when Pogacar was putting time on Roglic?

it reminded me of how the announcers spoke about Lance, how it was 'incredible' and 'unbelievable' (they later said they were sure there was something up in documentaries about lance doping). there is no way a clean racer has that much left at stage 20. not after winning two stages. human bodies do not work like that.


First of all, everyone was invoking Lemond with the performance yesterday.

The primary reason why I can't rule out the possibility of doping is because Pogacar's team is sponsored by the UAE. While it's not as overt as a team being sponsored by a Russian state company, I don't think you can completely rule out the possibility with a state-sponsored team.

That said, Pogacar wasn't supposed to be "the man" for his team. He turns 22 on Monday, it was his first Tour, and he has more experienced teammates that he was supposed to help. But he earned that role.

I hope that any skepticism about his performance is unfounded and that history shows that he earned the win fairly. But the sport can't escape the shadows of the Lance era yet and until it can, questions will follow everyone.
 
2020-09-21 1:04:52 AM  

chucknasty: in the penultimate stage a 21 year old kid swept up the yellow jersey, the white jersey and the king of the mountains. today's final stage was boring.
kid is probably juicing. Lance broke all my enjoyment of cycling. the only way to win is to cheat.


Was talking this over with my brother.  The Kid ditched his power meter and Watt meter and just rode by feel.  I think the current UCI women's time trial champ did the same.  There's probably something to be said for the idea that data like that can sometimes hold you up.  Yes, you risk blowing up, but he took the risk.

Also, he had a few bad days here and there.  You saw him not able to fully respond to some attacks, unlike the flawless type performances you'd see from Armstrong and Froome.

Not saying he's absolutely not juicing, he just doesn't have the look of invincibility that other juicers had.

Also, the white jersey is for best young rider, so naturally he will get both, as did Bernal last year.

The polka dot jersey was weird this year.  The guy that had a bunch of points crashed out of the stage where he got most of those points.  Then pogacar got a bunch in the process of chasing Roglic.  Them Carapaz took up a bunch more points once he was free to ride without having to protect Bernal.  So the points were spread out over a bunch of people and the kid with two or three mountain stage wins naturally took the polka dots as well.
 
2020-09-21 1:08:49 AM  

nursetim: bfh0417: chucknasty: in the penultimate stage a 21 year old kid swept up the yellow jersey, the white jersey and the king of the mountains. today's final stage was boring.
kid is probably juicing. Lance broke all my enjoyment of cycling. the only way to win is to cheat.

As Bill Burr said. "Our roided up guy beat your roided up guy." They were all cheating at the time. Wasn't the guy from the Post Office team also stripped of medals?

That's why when Lance Armstrong was stripped of his wins, no one else was retroactively awarded the win because you would have to go deep into the field to find someone not juicing their body or their bike.


While this is true, I think this sport is  criticized for PED rather unfairly.  Yes, we've heard a lot about juicing, but there's also massive amounts of testing done to catch it.  On top of that, the governments of the countries where most of the teams are based have also policed these programs heavily.

If the NFL or MLB or even NBA had this level.of testing and policing, you'd have to vacate the last 25 years of championships as well.
 
2020-09-21 1:10:45 AM  

relaxitsjustme: I usually follow the Tour pretty closely but this year had trouble even remembering it was on.  I did watch the ITT yesterday though.  Who knew that Slovenia was going to be the next cycling powerhouse.

Anybody else reminded of LeMond taking the yellow jersey from Fignon when Pogacar was putting time on Roglic?


Yeah.  I saw the headline accidentally before watching the stage.  I was a bit disappointed that Pogacar just blew past him (virtually speaking) up the climb.  I had kind of figured it was going to come down to a furious sprint to the line and by the time Pogacar hit the line the writing was on the wall.
 
2020-09-21 1:17:17 AM  

desertgeek: chucknasty: relaxitsjustme: I usually follow the Tour pretty closely but this year had trouble even remembering it was on.  I did watch the ITT yesterday though.  Who knew that Slovenia was going to be the next cycling powerhouse.

Anybody else reminded of LeMond taking the yellow jersey from Fignon when Pogacar was putting time on Roglic?

it reminded me of how the announcers spoke about Lance, how it was 'incredible' and 'unbelievable' (they later said they were sure there was something up in documentaries about lance doping). there is no way a clean racer has that much left at stage 20. not after winning two stages. human bodies do not work like that.

First of all, everyone was invoking Lemond with the performance yesterday.

The primary reason why I can't rule out the possibility of doping is because Pogacar's team is sponsored by the UAE. While it's not as overt as a team being sponsored by a Russian state company, I don't think you can completely rule out the possibility with a state-sponsored team.

That said, Pogacar wasn't supposed to be "the man" for his team. He turns 22 on Monday, it was his first Tour, and he has more experienced teammates that he was supposed to help. But he earned that role.

I hope that any skepticism about his performance is unfounded and that history shows that he earned the win fairly. But the sport can't escape the shadows of the Lance era yet and until it can, questions will follow everyone.


That's probably right.  I do wonder how much advantage any 21 year old would have in such a grueling race if they had the same experience as a veteran racer.  The ability to recover after a hard stage is paramount in this race (look at Pinot last year), but the people with an edge in that category also.lack seniority and experience.  Gotta wonder if the shuffle in his team combined with better bike smarts and maturity than usual helped him.

I remember being 21 and being able to go out and run ten miles even untrained.  Even ten years later in my thirties I could still go out and do it, but I'd end up with injuries or just so sore I couldn't run for days.  Recovery has been by far the biggest detriment as I've aged.  I can still hold my own on a single day hard effort, but I find myself needing much more rest or cross training to avoid injury.
 
2020-09-21 1:24:04 AM  

chucknasty: relaxitsjustme: I usually follow the Tour pretty closely but this year had trouble even remembering it was on.  I did watch the ITT yesterday though.  Who knew that Slovenia was going to be the next cycling powerhouse.

Anybody else reminded of LeMond taking the yellow jersey from Fignon when Pogacar was putting time on Roglic?

it reminded me of how the announcers spoke about Lance, how it was 'incredible' and 'unbelievable' (they later said they were sure there was something up in documentaries about lance doping). there is no way a clean racer has that much left at stage 20. not after winning two stages. human bodies do not work like that.


Thing about Lance is, he started out clean.  I had my VO2 max tested by the same guy who tested him when he was a wet behind the ears amateur, and even at that time Lance was through the roof.  He made a pro team and was a rising star in europe until everybody got blown out.od the water by, I think, Banesto.

So he juiced, and he was juicing more and better than anybody around him, and he was a nasty horrible dumb asshole to former friends and teammates when they came clean (hell, he made juicing a requirement to be part of the team so that's part of the reason many of them juiced).  So Lance has a lot of judgment to deal with for that.  I dislike him more for his behavior after retirement than for actually juicing.

That being said, if the field had been completely clean, including Lance, it's quite possible he would still have won a few tours.  The lab that tested him actually rechecked their gear after his test.  He was that high.
 
2020-09-21 12:29:06 PM  

rga184: So he juiced, and he was juicing more and better than anybody around him, and he was a nasty horrible dumb asshole to former friends and teammates when they came clean (hell, he made juicing a requirement to be part of the team so that's part of the reason many of them juiced).  So Lance has a lot of judgment to deal with for that.  I dislike him more for his behavior after retirement than for actually juicing.


The Armstrong Lie documentary is infuriating due to his absolute unchecked egotistical assholism to everyone around him, his raging hatred against journalists calling out his barely-concealed juicing, and his feigned shock and hurt at those accusations. Absolute trash of a human being.
 
2020-09-21 9:57:45 PM  

DecemberNitro: rga184: So he juiced, and he was juicing more and better than anybody around him, and he was a nasty horrible dumb asshole to former friends and teammates when they came clean (hell, he made juicing a requirement to be part of the team so that's part of the reason many of them juiced).  So Lance has a lot of judgment to deal with for that.  I dislike him more for his behavior after retirement than for actually juicing.

The Armstrong Lie documentary is infuriating due to his absolute unchecked egotistical assholism to everyone around him, his raging hatred against journalists calling out his barely-concealed juicing, and his feigned shock and hurt at those accusations. Absolute trash of a human being.


Agreed.  Your words are stronger than mine, but his actions completely cost him his legacy.  People in Spain still like Indurain, Germans still like Ulrich, but Americans downright hate Armstrong.

He could have weathered the storm if he were just a guy among many who used drugs.  It was his behavior that basica)y destroyed any possibility of rehabbing his image.

He is basically banned from any event bigger than a goddamn elementary school bicycle rodeo.

Good.
 
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