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(Taiwan News)   US congressman introduces bill to scrap "one China" policy, normalize ties with Taiwan. "America doesn't need a permission slip from the Chinese Communist Party to talk to Taiwan"   (taiwannews.com.tw) divider line
    More: Unlikely, Republic of China, U.S. Congressman Tom Tiffany, Taiwan News, People's Republic of China, United Nations, formal relations, President of the United States, U.S.-Taiwan Free Trade Agreement  
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1089 clicks; posted to Politics » on 18 Sep 2020 at 3:50 PM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-09-18 11:52:29 AM  
I haven't heard a Republican sound like a Republican on foreign policy in years.
 
2020-09-18 12:06:15 PM  
I think he's alone now. There doesn't seem to be anyone around.
 
2020-09-18 12:49:03 PM  
Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.
 
2020-09-18 3:20:18 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.


I wonder how a Chinese robot would react to that input, noting they claim Taiwan as part of China.

It doesn't matter, the robot would just break anyway.
 
2020-09-18 3:33:33 PM  

puffy999: I wonder how a Chinese robot would react to that input, noting they claim China as part of China.


Filters.
 
2020-09-18 3:50:59 PM  
Elaine Chao's glare darkens.
 
2020-09-18 3:53:21 PM  
Hell yeah. Fark China.
 
2020-09-18 3:53:29 PM  
While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.
 
2020-09-18 3:53:37 PM  
I don't disagree with him at all.
 
2020-09-18 3:53:42 PM  
As much as I would love to flip off the Chinese Communist Party, I don't see how this is a good idea right now.  It's already looking like China will use our election as a distraction for invading Taiwan.

Maybe a better plan would be a U.S. show of force in and around Taiwan.
 
2020-09-18 3:54:02 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: puffy999: I wonder how a Chinese robot would react to that input, noting they claim China as part of China.

Filters.


biatchina?

ChiBoobies?

Weenas?
 
2020-09-18 3:54:48 PM  
I just think we need to focus on the fact that they guy is named Tom Tiffany.
 
2020-09-18 3:55:28 PM  
It would be nice.
 
2020-09-18 3:55:33 PM  
His twitter profile doesn't mention his party. He must be GOP, but at least he's embarrassed about it.
 
2020-09-18 3:56:20 PM  

tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.


And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.
 
2020-09-18 3:59:43 PM  

tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.


I think you may be underestimating their obsession with Taiwan.
 
2020-09-18 3:59:47 PM  
At least move shops to Vietnam, FARK CHINA.
 
2020-09-18 4:00:43 PM  
Thighwan is a wonderful country. Trump has been there.
 
2020-09-18 4:00:56 PM  
i.ytimg.comView Full Size


How about second China?
 
2020-09-18 4:01:51 PM  

Tannhauser: At least move shops to Vietnam, FARK CHINA.


No kidding. After we blew up Japan, we threw them some jobs. We should have used Vietnam to do something more than make shoes.
 
2020-09-18 4:02:26 PM  

Myria: Maybe a better plan would be a U.S. show of force in and around Taiwan.


We do those, China protests, and that's that. We need to break the cycle of bullshiat.
 
2020-09-18 4:02:58 PM  

puffy999: Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.

I wonder how a Chinese robot would react to that input, noting they claim Taiwan as part of China.

It doesn't matter, the robot would just break anyway.


Cool story time: When I was in college, I remember playing a game of Scattergories with a group of friends, one of whom was raised in China, went to high school in Japan, and then came to America for her degrees.  The catagory was countries, and the letter was T.  Someone in the group gave Taiwan as an answer. My Chinese friend, in all seriousness, challenged the answer because she believed Taiwan was part of China and not a separate country.
 
2020-09-18 4:04:54 PM  

lolmao500: Hell yeah. Fark China.


This
 
2020-09-18 4:05:40 PM  

puffy999: Tannhauser: At least move shops to Vietnam, FARK CHINA.

No kidding. After we blew up Japan, we threw them some jobs. We should have used Vietnam to do something more than make shoes.


Phage hunting.
 
2020-09-18 4:06:00 PM  
China is run by mass murdering pro-genocide totalitarian pieces of shiat. Why again are we trading with them or even talking to them??

Because money? Can we, for the first time since WW2, not sell our soul for money and actually LIVE UP to our made up beliefs about ourselves and how we're really a good country that loves democracy and liberty??
 
2020-09-18 4:07:52 PM  

lolmao500: China is run by mass murdering pro-genocide totalitarian pieces of shiat. Why again are we trading with them or even talking to them??

Because money? Can we, for the first time since WW2, not sell our soul for money and actually LIVE UP to our made up beliefs about ourselves and how we're really a good country that loves democracy and liberty??


We're capitalists before anything. Nobody was buying our values, but they sure like our finished goods.
 
2020-09-18 4:08:11 PM  

aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.

And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.


It's the morally correct stance. People shouldn't be ruled by oppressors against their will.
 
2020-09-18 4:08:34 PM  

aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.

And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.


So the US should only implement policy that is of direct and immediate benefit to the US itself?

Are you a Republican?
 
2020-09-18 4:09:11 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.


I may sound like a pessimist but I take China seriously when they say that Taiwan is their province. Given that, I also think it's a foregone conclusion that Taiwan will one day be taken back into the fold. Given that, I also think it's unwise to step in and declare Taiwan to be a separate country.

An analogy I'd use is if you're the best friend and your friend tells you their marriage is breaking up because of something their spouse did. You don't want to take sides. You can listen and be supportive, but you'd be stupid to start talking shiat about their spouse. There's chance, a good one, that the couple will work out their differences and stay together. It happens all the time. Then you will lose your friendship since you took sides.

Now imagine you're also in business with the spouse of your friend. Not only do you lose the friendship but also who knows how much money when the business relationship falls apart.
 
2020-09-18 4:09:47 PM  
踩踩踩舞蹈版反面版
Youtube v_hJVXpl580
 
2020-09-18 4:12:19 PM  
Right now, we mostly pretend that there's only one China because Taiwan wants us to (as it provides them diplomatic cover and lessens the chance that mainland China invades them).  Let's ask them first if they want us to take this step, because they will be the ones suffering the most potential consequences of such if we do.  If they are cool with it, yeah, this is a step that needs to be taken at some point, as the one China policy is not a stable policy and will collapse at some point (very similar the Palestinian situation).  But if don't want us to go forward, we shouldn't do so.
 
2020-09-18 4:14:33 PM  
Day 1337 of trump's apology tour. "They're laughing at us!"
 
2020-09-18 4:14:45 PM  

quizzical: puffy999: Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.

I wonder how a Chinese robot would react to that input, noting they claim Taiwan as part of China.

It doesn't matter, the robot would just break anyway.

Cool story time: When I was in college, I remember playing a game of Scattergories with a group of friends, one of whom was raised in China, went to high school in Japan, and then came to America for her degrees.  The catagory was countries, and the letter was T.  Someone in the group gave Taiwan as an answer. My Chinese friend, in all seriousness, challenged the answer because she believed Taiwan was part of China and not a separate country.


It is not technically a separate country.  They go out of their way to pretend to not be such.  Both the governments of mainland China and Taiwan claim to rule over all of China, including the part the other government currently controls.

Now, on a practical matter, it of course is.  But maintaining this fiction has helped there not be a Chinese invasion of Taiwan.
 
2020-09-18 4:15:07 PM  

Geotpf: Let's ask them first if they want us to take this step, because they will be the ones suffering the most potential consequences of such if we do.


Nuance and subtlety in diplomacy? Why you gotta be so weak?

Real leaders make decisions on their own in a vacuum and stand proudly beside them.

Like the US Embassy in Jerusalem.
 
2020-09-18 4:15:10 PM  

Birnone: Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.

I may sound like a pessimist but I take China seriously when they say that Taiwan is their province. Given that, I also think it's a foregone conclusion that Taiwan will one day be taken back into the fold. Given that, I also think it's unwise to step in and declare Taiwan to be a separate country.

An analogy I'd use is if you're the best friend and your friend tells you their marriage is breaking up because of something their spouse did. You don't want to take sides. You can listen and be supportive, but you'd be stupid to start talking shiat about their spouse. There's chance, a good one, that the couple will work out their differences and stay together. It happens all the time. Then you will lose your friendship since you took sides.

Now imagine you're also in business with the spouse of your friend. Not only do you lose the friendship but also who knows how much money when the business relationship falls apart.


This analogy only seems to work if your friend a) tells everyone to boycott your wife, b) calls her by a different name and requires you to call her by that name or else you're no longer friends, and c) threatens his estranged wife regularly.

Also, a and b reciprocally.
 
2020-09-18 4:15:33 PM  
Why am I not surprised this is a Republican dipshiat?
 
2020-09-18 4:19:42 PM  
And China responds by  recognizing all 50 states and breaking off federal contact
 
2020-09-18 4:20:53 PM  

tyyreaunn: aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.

And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.

So the US should only implement policy that is of direct and immediate benefit to the US itself?

Are you a Republican?


Are you in favor of more wars in Asia?  I did not say direct benefit should be the only driving factor in foreign policy.  Why precisely are we risking pissing off China, for no real purpose?  What commitment do we have to Taiwan?  What immediate threat are they under that warrants Team America interfering?
 
2020-09-18 4:23:31 PM  

Birnone: Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.

I may sound like a pessimist but I take China seriously when they say that Taiwan is their province. Given that, I also think it's a foregone conclusion that Taiwan will one day be taken back into the fold. Given that, I also think it's unwise to step in and declare Taiwan to be a separate country.

An analogy I'd use is if you're the best friend and your friend tells you their marriage is breaking up because of something their spouse did. You don't want to take sides. You can listen and be supportive, but you'd be stupid to start talking shiat about their spouse. There's chance, a good one, that the couple will work out their differences and stay together. It happens all the time. Then you will lose your friendship since you took sides.

Now imagine you're also in business with the spouse of your friend. Not only do you lose the friendship but also who knows how much money when the business relationship falls apart.


+1 to puffy's response above.

If your friend's spouse was abusive and controlling throughout the entire relationship, not talking shiat about them may be the "safe" strategy, but it's not necessarily the moral one.  Taking a somewhat symbolic step to tell them to cut that shiat out isn't necessarily out of line.
 
2020-09-18 4:23:39 PM  

Geotpf: Right now, we mostly pretend that there's only one China because Taiwan wants us to (as it provides them diplomatic cover and lessens the chance that mainland China invades them).  Let's ask them first if they want us to take this step, because they will be the ones suffering the most potential consequences of such if we do.  If they are cool with it, yeah, this is a step that needs to be taken at some point, as the one China policy is not a stable policy and will collapse at some point (very similar the Palestinian situation).  But if don't want us to go forward, we shouldn't do so.


This - even if our ultimate objective is two Chinas, this is a terrible idea right now.
 
2020-09-18 4:23:41 PM  

Metastatic Capricorn: His twitter profile doesn't mention his party. He must be GOP, but at least he's embarrassed about it.


That's an old-school-GOP argument for an old-school-GOP policy.  He might be GOP, but he may be avoiding the Trump party.

/I'd be careful of any declaration of "permanent" conditions around China
//The US might think of Europe as old
///China is many times older and likely makes plans as such
 
2020-09-18 4:25:23 PM  

Birnone: Marcus Aurelius: Taiwan wasn't the world's #1 exporter of goods, last time I checked.

I may sound like a pessimist but I take China seriously when they say that Taiwan is their province. Given that, I also think it's a foregone conclusion that Taiwan will one day be taken back into the fold. Given that, I also think it's unwise to step in and declare Taiwan to be a separate country.

An analogy I'd use is if you're the best friend and your friend tells you their marriage is breaking up because of something their spouse did. You don't want to take sides. You can listen and be supportive, but you'd be stupid to start talking shiat about their spouse. There's chance, a good one, that the couple will work out their differences and stay together. It happens all the time. Then you will lose your friendship since you took sides.

Now imagine you're also in business with the spouse of your friend. Not only do you lose the friendship but also who knows how much money when the business relationship falls apart.


Not a great analogy, as A) PRC and Taiwan were never meaningfully "married" in the first place, and B) They've been growing less likely over the years to reunite under the CPC's rule. Even the Taiwanese pro-reunification coalition's stance is "We'll reunite with the Mainland once the CPC falls." And widespread, U.S.-led recognition of their independence would serve to further solidify their independent identity.
 
2020-09-18 4:26:44 PM  
I see that the geopolitical ITGs are out in force today.

China is not a monolith and neither is Taiwan.
 
2020-09-18 4:27:17 PM  

aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.

And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.


Taiwan is responsible for 25% of the worlds electronic chip manufacturing, which necessary for the continued functioning of the modern world.

On the other hand, this republican congressman, is a moron who doesn't know what he is talking about. China is the worlds largest car market. I'm sure GM, Ford, and Tesla can afford to halve their sales with no catastrophic economic impact. Also, long term exclusion from not only the worlds largest market, but one that still only has 15% penetration will not at all handicap American auto makers.

How are all those farmers who were hit with China's retaliatory tariffs doing btw?
 
2020-09-18 4:27:33 PM  

lolmao500: China is run by mass murdering pro-genocide totalitarian pieces of shiat. Why again are we trading with them or even talking to them??

Because money? Can we, for the first time since WW2, not sell our soul for money and actually LIVE UP to our made up beliefs about ourselves and how we're really a good country that loves democracy and liberty??


Uighur please.
 
2020-09-18 4:31:48 PM  

aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.

And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.

So the US should only implement policy that is of direct and immediate benefit to the US itself?

Are you a Republican?

Are you in favor of more wars in Asia?  I did not say direct benefit should be the only driving factor in foreign policy.  Why precisely are we risking pissing off China, for no real purpose?  What commitment do we have to Taiwan?  What immediate threat are they under that warrants Team America interfering?


I have it on good authority that land wars in Asia are eminently winnable!

Seriously, though, I would say we do have some commitment to help out democratic nations under threat from larger, abusive, totalitarian regimes - as long as they want said help, anyway.  Sure, that line of thinking has led to disasters like Vietnam, but it's not inherently flawed if applied in moderation.
 
2020-09-18 4:36:52 PM  

edmo: I haven't heard a Republican sound like a Republican on foreign policy in years.


"sound like", key words there.
 
2020-09-18 4:39:02 PM  
In the past the problem was not just that the PRC claimed ownership of Taiwan, but that Chinese government in exile in Taiwan claimed to be "the real China."  When did Taiwan abandon the latter claim?
 
2020-09-18 4:39:24 PM  
Does he support Taiwanese independence because of concern for human rights abuses from the mainland or because Donald threw a b****fit about China and they're the target of the day?
 
2020-09-18 4:43:05 PM  

Heliodorus: aleister_greynight: tyyreaunn: While I fully agree with the use of the "Unlikely" tag, my general response is: about damn time.

China will moan and complain, but at the end of the day they need us as much as we need them.

And none of us need Taiwan.  Yeah great policy.

Taiwan is responsible for 25% of the worlds electronic chip manufacturing, which necessary for the continued functioning of the modern world.

On the other hand, this republican congressman, is a moron who doesn't know what he is talking about. China is the worlds largest car market. I'm sure GM, Ford, and Tesla can afford to halve their sales with no catastrophic economic impact. Also, long term exclusion from not only the worlds largest market, but one that still only has 15% penetration will not at all handicap American auto makers.

How are all those farmers who were hit with China's retaliatory tariffs doing btw?


Counter point: China extracts and produces almost 2/3s of the worlds rare earth metals, that are needed for producing electronics, microchips, etc.
 
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