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(KSL Salt Lake City)   That neighborhood you moved into because it had no HOA. Well about that   (ksl.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Real estate, Layton's city attorney, Home, Dozens of Layton homeowners, Gary Crane, city attorney, Anica Smith, city ordinance  
•       •       •

7512 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Jul 2020 at 1:30 AM (9 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-07-21 8:44:04 PM  
Ahhh, the Karen of organizations.
 
2020-07-21 9:07:21 PM  
Ours is run by our local small government conservative who even uses the GOP log on his Facebook page.
 
2020-07-21 9:22:07 PM  

edmo: Ours is run by our local small government conservative who even uses the GOP log on his Facebook page.


It's log. All homeowners love log.
 
TWX [TotalFark]
2020-07-21 10:26:15 PM  
The only 'association' that these homeowners should participate in is the one that sues the developer and the city to compel the developer and city to work out a solution among themselves and to leave the parcel owners out of it.
 
2020-07-21 10:46:00 PM  
I think the appropriate response is to take off your shoes, grab your AR-15 and threaten to shoot someone in self-defense.
 
2020-07-22 1:36:11 AM  
At least the local government isn't too keen on enforcing anything on the homeowners at this point.
 
zez
2020-07-22 1:39:49 AM  
I live in an "HOA", it's called the city I live in. Don't understand why you need another layer of  "government"  to tell you what laws there are.
 
2020-07-22 1:42:57 AM  
Haha. No. If it were me, they could suck my balls from the back, while I paint my house neon green and purple just to rub it in their faces. And by "it" I mean my taint.
 
2020-07-22 1:44:57 AM  
If you move into a modern subdivision of cookie-cutter stick built homes you bring it upon yourself. You're buying enforced uniformity.
 
2020-07-22 1:45:29 AM  
"Feel free to fark right off."


Alright. I think I've had my fill of Fark for this year, see you farkers next year, if there is one.
 
2020-07-22 2:03:01 AM  
I put even money on the developer facing a chasm of debt during a tanking economy that isn't buying new houses, and looking for ways they can invent a stream of income out of old buyers. In other words, fake HOA scam. If it's not in the deed, it doesn't exist.

Even if it's not that, they screwed up massively in finalizing the HOA and now they're trying to ram it through, which will never hold up in court.
 
2020-07-22 2:04:00 AM  

Throbelisk: "Feel free to fark right off."


Alright. I think I've had my fill of Fark for this year, see you farkers next year, if there is one.


????
 
2020-07-22 2:05:07 AM  
HOA needs to be illegal. And their leaders cained.
 
2020-07-22 2:06:49 AM  
Decent chance the developer was already bankrupt and closed long before this came to light.

Because otherwise the homeowners would be burning down his office and that would be the story.

The day a developer is incorporated is the first day of the beginning of its bankruptcy. It's usually baked right in.
 
2020-07-22 2:14:11 AM  

TWX: The only 'association' that these homeowners should participate in is the one that sues the developer and the city to compel the developer and city to work out a solution among themselves and to leave the parcel owners out of it.


Did you read the article?

Crane added as long as the landscaping is kept neat, the city won't enforce the ordinance. But the homeowners will have to take care of it, somehow.

"How they do that is up to them. The city is not going to force them into an HOA relationship, after the fact," said Crane.
 
2020-07-22 2:14:54 AM  
Is this a case where the homeowner can actually make use of the title insurance they were forced to buy? Seems like it's a papework screw-up.
 
2020-07-22 2:16:06 AM  
I feel like I must be missing something here.

    HOA; We exist now, you owe us money and have to obey us
    Home owner: (throws letter in trash)

                              THE END

Is there another step to this?
 
2020-07-22 2:18:13 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-07-22 2:36:11 AM  

zez: I live in an "HOA", it's called the city I live in. Don't understand why you need another layer of  "government"  to tell you what laws there are.


Because a lot of americans secreyly love facism so they organize these tiny local clones of it for cosplaying purposes.
 
2020-07-22 2:41:54 AM  

billix0: I feel like I must be missing something here.

HOA; We exist now, you owe us money and have to obey us
Home owner: (throws letter in trash)

                          THE END

Is there another step to this?


Well yes, the step where the property owners have to agree to membership in a new HOA.
 
2020-07-22 3:05:45 AM  
Crane added as long as the landscaping is kept neat, the city won't enforce the ordinance. But the homeowners will have to take care of it, somehow.
"How they do that is up to them. The city is not going to force them into an HOA relationship, after the fact," said Crane.


*eyeroll*

Congrats on getting a green, I guess, subby
 
2020-07-22 3:41:45 AM  
No one seems to read their deeds, but since 1980s in CA many new neighborhoods included an option to establish HOAs under the name the developer gave the subdivision. Be careful if you live in adouble-barreled name like "The Cottages at the Lakes of Hochfleisch" because there may be a master ÜberHOA as well as a more immediate UnterHOA written know the CC&Rs. As a retired Planning & Building guy, those unread & obscure rules you agree to can be used to enforce Codes. In CA, you are given a notice to sign that starts a 72 hr clock during which you can cancel the purchase of the home without penalty if you read the CC&Rs and find any condition you can't live with; when the clock runs out, you've accepted the HOA even if it never met, but you could be liable for the payments back-dated to purchase. Sadly, the selling agent will probably say you have 72 hrs to read the "paperwork." Hopefully, your buyer's agent will explain it. If enough people (not a majority of homeowners, just enough (4) to form a board & stump-up the incorpoation  fees can bring every homeowner into a long-dormant HOA that previously only existed as an obscure 3 or so pages you initialed but never read.

Personally, I've lived in several  HOAs but never had a problem. Since my degree is in Arch. Hist., I've always volunteered for the Architecture Committee to get rid of anti-fun rules (no flags, approval for patio furniture, no driveway car-washing, ...).

Our "culture-sack" of 12 homes has a dormant HOA in existence 1991-2008 when it died of neglect during the Bush Bust. Since then, my family (in-Laws & kids) have purchased 10 of the 12 homes & we've talked about it.  Mostly we want 2 things: painting street parking spaces & assigning them to homes (reasons too long for even my screeds) & building/maintaining a BBQ island & covered space in the middle of the Court. Also, gates (would leave 1 house outside) & changing name (we have to spell it because the developer named it for his son with a weird spelling instead of common - imagine "Barron" instead of "Baron." WTF does that? Why curse little Klent or Jahnnee or Rouppert with a desire to stick your ass in the county's worse nursing home? But they want to name it after my late  mother-in-law: Jorgina, which is the most common way to spell it in her native Portugal, but it puts us back at 1, doesn't it?) "Zhyor-zheen-uh."
 
2020-07-22 3:45:25 AM  
If there was no paper informing you, and you signed and agreed too, when you closed on your property, I don't see how they could force you to do it after the fact without a lot of legal wrangling..

zez: I live in an "HOA", it's called the city I live in. Don't understand why you need another layer of  "government"  to tell you what laws there are.


Totally agree!
 
2020-07-22 3:49:49 AM  
It's not the way we work. It's not the way real estate works."

i.imgflip.comView Full Size
 
2020-07-22 3:53:04 AM  
HOA discussions tend to be where "obey the law" and "it's my property" ideologies converge into the same person.
 
2020-07-22 4:00:50 AM  

Smoking GNU: zez: I live in an "HOA", it's called the city I live in. Don't understand why you need another layer of  "government"  to tell you what laws there are.

Because a lot of americans secreyly love facism so they organize these tiny local clones of it for cosplaying purposes.


....secretly!?
 
2020-07-22 4:12:47 AM  

Throbelisk: "Feel free to fark right off."


Alright. I think I've had my fill of Fark for this year, see you farkers next year, if there is one.


You can't leave now. There's so much more to come this year. The world is growing crazier by the day. There's an election coming up. A pandemic still going in full force. Even if you want to stay away from the politics there are still loads of topics to cover in the Sunday music thread, some great looking new releases for the gaming thread and weeks and weeks of Caturdays to come.
 
2020-07-22 4:13:52 AM  
But as Libertarians and Conservatives always say, if you don't like it, start your own.

/what's that, you'd have to sell your home? who cares! the solution is always that you can start your own if you don't like it.
 
2020-07-22 4:20:44 AM  

waxbeans: HOA needs to be illegal. And their leaders cained.


Would we be abel to do that?
 
2020-07-22 4:33:50 AM  

zez: I live in an "HOA", it's called the city I live in. Don't understand why you need another layer of  "government"  to tell you what laws there are.


BUT THE SANCTITY OF CONTRACT!!!
 
2020-07-22 4:46:03 AM  
Here in Oklahoma, something like this would trigger the title insurance to have to pay out for the HOA fees. And the title insurance people, so incensed in actually having to pay something out, would be suing the balls off of the developer or anyone associated with them, like the current administrators of the HOA. Or, more likely, the title insurance would be paying off someone in the city government to declare the HOA null and void.
 
2020-07-22 4:56:16 AM  

mrparks: Smoking GNU: zez: I live in an "HOA", it's called the city I live in. Don't understand why you need another layer of  "government"  to tell you what laws there are.

Because a lot of americans secreyly love facism so they organize these tiny local clones of it for cosplaying purposes.

....secretly!?


Fair enough.
 
2020-07-22 5:39:32 AM  

ameeriklane: Is this a case where the homeowner can actually make use of the title insurance they were forced to buy? Seems like it's a papework screw-up.


It's not a paperwork screw-up.  I'ts just a developer trying to force people to join an HOA after the fact.

They can voluntarily join, which of course would be stupid.  But they can't be forced to join.
 
2020-07-22 5:51:31 AM  

Lurk Who's Talking: No one seems to read their deeds, but since 1980s in CA many new neighborhoods included an option to establish HOAs under the name the developer gave the subdivision. Be careful if you live in adouble-barreled name like "The Cottages at the Lakes of Hochfleisch" because there may be a master ÜberHOA as well as a more immediate UnterHOA written know the CC&Rs. As a retired Planning & Building guy, those unread & obscure rules you agree to can be used to enforce Codes. In CA, you are given a notice to sign that starts a 72 hr clock during which you can cancel the purchase of the home without penalty if you read the CC&Rs and find any condition you can't live with; when the clock runs out, you've accepted the HOA even if it never met, but you could be liable for the payments back-dated to purchase. Sadly, the selling agent will probably say you have 72 hrs to read the "paperwork." Hopefully, your buyer's agent will explain it. If enough people (not a majority of homeowners, just enough (4) to form a board & stump-up the incorpoation  fees can bring every homeowner into a long-dormant HOA that previously only existed as an obscure 3 or so pages you initialed but never read.

Personally, I've lived in several  HOAs but never had a problem. Since my degree is in Arch. Hist., I've always volunteered for the Architecture Committee to get rid of anti-fun rules (no flags, approval for patio furniture, no driveway car-washing, ...).

Our "culture-sack" of 12 homes has a dormant HOA in existence 1991-2008 when it died of neglect during the Bush Bust. Since then, my family (in-Laws & kids) have purchased 10 of the 12 homes & we've talked about it.  Mostly we want 2 things: painting street parking spaces & assigning them to homes (reasons too long for even my screeds) & building/maintaining a BBQ island & covered space in the middle of the Court. Also, gates (would leave 1 house outside) & changing name (we have to spell it because the developer named it for his son with a weird ...


If I am buying the house, could I cross out those sections at signing with initials from the seller and myself and get out of the HOA?
 
2020-07-22 6:23:41 AM  

JuggleGeek: ameeriklane: Is this a case where the homeowner can actually make use of the title insurance they were forced to buy? Seems like it's a papework screw-up.

It's not a paperwork screw-up.  I'ts just a developer trying to force people to join an HOA after the fact.

They can voluntarily join, which of course would be stupid.  But they can't be forced to join.


It is a paperwork screw-up. The didn't supply the addendum to the papers to be signed.
 
2020-07-22 7:09:56 AM  

Skeleton Man: Haha. No. If it were me, they could suck my balls from the back, while I paint my house neon green and purple just to rub it in their faces. And by "it" I mean my taint.


You owe me a new keyboard.
 
2020-07-22 7:36:26 AM  

sleze: Lurk Who's Talking: No one seems to read their deeds, but since 1980s in CA many new neighborhoods included an option to establish HOAs under the name the developer gave the subdivision. Be careful if you live in adouble-barreled name like "The Cottages at the Lakes of Hochfleisch" because there may be a master ÜberHOA as well as a more immediate UnterHOA written know the CC&Rs. As a retired Planning & Building guy, those unread & obscure rules you agree to can be used to enforce Codes. In CA, you are given a notice to sign that starts a 72 hr clock during which you can cancel the purchase of the home without penalty if you read the CC&Rs and find any condition you can't live with; when the clock runs out, you've accepted the HOA even if it never met, but you could be liable for the payments back-dated to purchase. Sadly, the selling agent will probably say you have 72 hrs to read the "paperwork." Hopefully, your buyer's agent will explain it. If enough people (not a majority of homeowners, just enough (4) to form a board & stump-up the incorpoation  fees can bring every homeowner into a long-dormant HOA that previously only existed as an obscure 3 or so pages you initialed but never read.

Personally, I've lived in several  HOAs but never had a problem. Since my degree is in Arch. Hist., I've always volunteered for the Architecture Committee to get rid of anti-fun rules (no flags, approval for patio furniture, no driveway car-washing, ...).

Our "culture-sack" of 12 homes has a dormant HOA in existence 1991-2008 when it died of neglect during the Bush Bust. Since then, my family (in-Laws & kids) have purchased 10 of the 12 homes & we've talked about it.  Mostly we want 2 things: painting street parking spaces & assigning them to homes (reasons too long for even my screeds) & building/maintaining a BBQ island & covered space in the middle of the Court. Also, gates (would leave 1 house outside) & changing name (we have to spell it because the developer named it for his son with a weird ...

If I am buying the house, could I cross out those sections at signing with initials from the seller and myself and get out of the HOA?


In most cases, HOAs are baked into the deed. The house and HOA are a package deal, period. Still, consult a real estate lawyer for your state to be sure.
 
2020-07-22 7:39:38 AM  

I_told_you_so: TWX: The only 'association' that these homeowners should participate in is the one that sues the developer and the city to compel the developer and city to work out a solution among themselves and to leave the parcel owners out of it.

Did you read the article?

Crane added as long as the landscaping is kept neat, the city won't enforce the ordinance. But the homeowners will have to take care of it, somehow.

"How they do that is up to them. The city is not going to force them into an HOA relationship, after the fact," said Crane.


The developer screwed up, and the city is forcing the homeowners to make good for the developer's mistake.  That seems to support the argument that the homeowners should band together to force the city and developer to solve the problem "and to leave the parcel owners out of it".
 
2020-07-22 7:43:09 AM  

sleze: If I am buying the house, could I cross out those sections at signing with initials from the seller and myself and get out of the HOA?


Usually, passing along HOA-ness is one of the covenants that goes with the property sale, so the HOA could sue to enforce that if the seller tried to agree to what you suggest.  It would be a function of the specific contracts the seller signed when buying the property.
 
2020-07-22 7:57:15 AM  

TWX: The only 'association' that these homeowners should participate in is the one that sues the developer and the city to compel the developer and city to work out a solution among themselves and to leave the parcel owners out of it.


Without more details, it sounds like they've got a case against the developer; not so much against the city.
 
2020-07-22 7:59:08 AM  

sleze: If I am buying the house, could I cross out those sections at signing with initials from the seller and myself and get out of the HOA?


No.

/at least not in Massachusetts
//I've been at closings where people try to do things like that
///it doesn't go well
 
2020-07-22 8:02:06 AM  

Shaggy_C: If you move into a modern subdivision of cookie-cutter stick built homes you bring it upon yourself. You're buying enforced uniformity.


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-07-22 8:03:22 AM  
I can hear this video preview...
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
TWX [TotalFark]
2020-07-22 8:04:24 AM  

PunGent: TWX: The only 'association' that these homeowners should participate in is the one that sues the developer and the city to compel the developer and city to work out a solution among themselves and to leave the parcel owners out of it.

Without more details, it sounds like they've got a case against the developer; not so much against the city.


The city is trying to compel them to take care of something that they do not own.  Sounds like a case to me.
 
2020-07-22 8:04:33 AM  
"How they do that is up to them. The city is not going to force them into an HOA relationship, after the fact," said Crane.

Easy answer. Pave it over.  It will never become overgrown.
 
2020-07-22 8:19:16 AM  
I am 1 month and 5 days away from our HOA property closing, moving to a place without one.

Fun fact, my HOA dictator for life (been president for 9+ years I think) is actually named Karen.

And she is a Karen.
 
2020-07-22 8:23:07 AM  

I_told_you_so: TWX: The only 'association' that these homeowners should participate in is the one that sues the developer and the city to compel the developer and city to work out a solution among themselves and to leave the parcel owners out of it.

Did you read the article?

Crane added as long as the landscaping is kept neat, the city won't enforce the ordinance. But the homeowners will have to take care of it, somehow.

"How they do that is up to them. The city is not going to force them into an HOA relationship, after the fact," said Crane.


All fine and well, until there arises up a new king in Egypt, who knows not Joseph.
 
2020-07-22 8:27:40 AM  

Skeleton Man: Haha. No. If it were me, they could suck my balls from the back, while I paint my house neon green and purple just to rub it in their faces. And by "it" I mean my taint.


This is more of a common area upkeep that the city requires, and is usually handled by a landscaper hired by an HOA. It would be easy to just take turns mowing and doing a bit of maintenance by the homeowners in this development, and the city has said they would be fine with how ever it gets done.
Last place I lived had a very loose HOA, where our fees were $70 a year, and that was to cover keeping the common areas in nice shape. There were no other rules that were strictly enforced. The only letter we received from the HOA in the ten years we lived there, was a reminder to make sure our addresses were clearly marked on our mail boxes, to assist any emergency services that may get called to the area; and to please pick up after your dog when taking it for a walk. This was a letter that was sent to all the homes, and not singling anyone out.

Not all HOA's are evil. We only tend to hear about the bad ones on the news.

But there will always be some moron that wants to paint his house neon green and purple, so that is why people will form an HOA, or move into an existing one.
 
2020-07-22 8:33:35 AM  

SpectroBoy: Shaggy_C: If you move into a modern subdivision of cookie-cutter stick built homes you bring it upon yourself. You're buying enforced uniformity.

[Fark user image 800x450]


Suburbanite-like typing detected!
 
2020-07-22 8:38:50 AM  
No HOA where I live, no parks to maintain, there isn't even any kind of "Twin Pines" subdivision sign.  Honestly, I don't even know what the name of my subdivision is.

A couple months after I moved in to my 30 year old house some other newbies decided the neighborhood needed an HOA and started campaigning for its creation.  I was horrified until I did some research and found there was nothing to force me to join.  Then I talked with neighbors, many of whom are the original owners of their 30 year old homes, and found without exception they told the HOA wannabes to fark off.

Gotta say the one neighbor with a hole in one of his dormers that has raccoons waving out of it could use an HOA but the rest of us keep our places looking decent.
 
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