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(Washington Post)   Wargaming the end of American democracy. Tag is for the fact that this scenario is even plausible   (washingtonpost.com) divider line
    More: Scary, President of the United States, Elections, Election, Voting, George W. Bush, United States Senate, Electoral College, Vice President of the United States  
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3663 clicks; posted to Politics » on 07 Jul 2020 at 5:30 PM (16 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-07-07 9:47:21 AM  
Trump disputing the election is a near certainty, and it's going to get Very ugly.
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2020-07-07 11:55:06 AM  
He will make it ugly but I believe he's going to go off and do TrumpTV, as was his original plan. Unless it is a landslide, he will talk it up as an illegitimate election, which he will believe in his own mind rather than admit internally that he is a loser.

Which is just as hilarious as he will spend the rest of his years angry and resentful at the world.
 
2020-07-07 12:03:45 PM  
"GUYS - IT'S TIME FOR SOME GAME THEORY"
 
2020-07-07 4:40:25 PM  
What if Trump loses but insists he won?

We drag him out of the White House by his mushroom

/wear gloves....several pairs.
 
2020-07-07 4:40:33 PM  
IDK, arrest him for trespassing after the inauguration?

Hell, if we wins (yurp), he'll contest the election to say it was rigged.

He doesn't have to agree, or go quietly or anything else. He will cease to be president upon the inauguration of his successor. Or when his heart stops beating.
 
2020-07-07 5:01:58 PM  
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2020-07-07 5:31:41 PM  
Lots of folks laughed and called us hysterical when we suggested this. 

No one's laughing anymore.
 
2020-07-07 5:31:55 PM  
i.pinimg.comView Full Size
 
2020-07-07 5:33:08 PM  
Congress will desert him off he loses
 
2020-07-07 5:34:19 PM  
If Biden wins the Pop and EC votes by a decent enough margin, it won't matter how many brainfarts and yowlings Donnie makes. As of Noon January 20th, 2021, if Trump still insists that he's still POTUS, the Secret Service will gladly drag his fat ass out and toss him outside the fence.

And I think SS will actually set up a lottery on which agents will get the honor.
 
2020-07-07 5:34:29 PM  
An exciting time to be alive isn't it?
 
2020-07-07 5:35:19 PM  
Nobody will do anything.
Who's going to stop him?
The military?
All those freedom lovers with the second amendment?
Nobody is going to stop him.
 
2020-07-07 5:35:29 PM  
It's 2020. You can be anything you want to be!
 
2020-07-07 5:35:36 PM  
Republicans in general no longer acknowledge the legitimacy of non-Republican rule, even when the acknowledge they got less votes.
 
2020-07-07 5:36:09 PM  
Yes the republicans are going to try to cheat, no they're not going to be able to stage a coup. The military has made it VERY clear where their loyalties lie - and it isn't trump.
 
2020-07-07 5:37:45 PM  
People should seriously make plans for this. We cannot trust in the system, because the system has been run on the honor system for ages and has no mechanisms for actually ousting someone who bucks it.

And before anyone says it's illegal to squat in the White House or he's not allowed to, it's also illegal to ignore subpoenas and sell out the country to Russia and rape 13-year-olds, but he's done it and faced jack sh*t for it.

We are in the middle of a government awkwardly twiddling its thumbs because it apparently doesn't know how to handle someone who brazenly breaks all the rules and doesn't feel sorry about it. Expect this to continue in November with people going "what do we do???"

The answer is obvious, but spines will be tested.
 
2020-07-07 5:37:45 PM  

AAAAGGGGHHHH: If Biden wins the Pop and EC votes by a decent enough margin, it won't matter how many brainfarts and yowlings Donnie makes. As of Noon January 20th, 2021, if Trump still insists that he's still POTUS, the Secret Service will gladly drag his fat ass out and toss him outside the fence.

And I think SS will actually set up a lottery on which agents will get the honor.


Then what happens if he makes Erik Prince head of the secret service?
 
2020-07-07 5:38:05 PM  

Visual Howlaround Title Sequence: He will make it ugly but I believe he's going to go off and do TrumpTV, as was his original plan.


Cosmic fortune willing, "TrumpTV" will be a synonym for CCTV in a federal prison by mid-2021.

=Smidge=
 
2020-07-07 5:38:06 PM  
Any way the election goes, the Floyd riots were just a warm-up. Then once that simmers down, the probability increases we'll have a preponderance of domestic terrorism events (aside from the state against the citizens).
 
2020-07-07 5:39:00 PM  

AAAAGGGGHHHH: If Biden wins the Pop and EC votes by a decent enough margin, it won't matter how many brainfarts and yowlings Donnie makes. As of Noon January 20th, 2021, if Trump still insists that he's still POTUS, the Secret Service will gladly drag his fat ass out and toss him outside the fence.

And I think SS will actually set up a lottery on which agents will get the honor.


Do you think the officers won't worry too much about hitting his head when they put him in the back of the car..?
 
2020-07-07 5:39:16 PM  
Luckily I have a good supply of d6 and a few platoons of Imperial Guard in storage, along with a few Leman Russes.  Push comes to shove, I break out the USCT and the pro-Union Texans.  What ruleset does American Democracy use?  I hope I don't have to re-base any minis.
 
2020-07-07 5:40:27 PM  
We worried about the same thing in 2016 because he was constantly harping about the election being "rigged". That is, right up until the night he eked out a win. Then all of a sudden the electoral college was legit, but the popular vote was "rigged". His biatching got him nowhere then and it will get him nowhere this year. If he loses, he won't have a choice, he's out.
 
2020-07-07 5:40:33 PM  

gameshowhost: "GUYS - IT'S TIME FOR SOME GAME THEORY"


Ohkay, MatPat.
 
2020-07-07 5:41:06 PM  
The 20th Amendment is unambiguous

The terms of the President and Vice President shall end at noon on the 20th day of January, and the terms of Senators and Representatives at noon on the 3d day of January, of the years in which such terms would have ended if this article had not been ratified; and the terms of their successors shall then begin.

It is not clear what happens afterwards if the results are still be disputed.

I suspect the office will fall to the Speaker of the House per the line of succession until the results can be certified.

So, say hello to President Pelosi.
 
2020-07-07 5:41:20 PM  
If he loses, pretty sure that the GOP will no longer hold congress in turtle's maw.  They will simply be looking for the exits.  It will be the White House, Supreme Court and the "Justice" Department farting into the wind.

Which can do a lot of damage.

And if he still has some military support, and fark me if he still doesn't have some, it will be ugly.

Meal Team Six will abandon their stand as soon as the condiments run out.

But unfortunately, there will be bloodshed of sorts if this scenario plays out.
 
2020-07-07 5:41:36 PM  

Private_Citizen: Trump disputing the election is a near certainty, and it's going to get Very ugly.
[Fark user image 425x315]


He was disputing the 2016 election back in August of 2016. 3 months before it happened. And now he's got the supporters that have dug in their heels to support him at all costs. I wouldn't be surprised if he started shouting that 2020 is rigged soon.
 
2020-07-07 5:41:53 PM  

beezeltown: IDK, arrest him for trespassing after the inauguration?

Hell, if we wins (yurp), he'll contest the election to say it was rigged.

He doesn't have to agree, or go quietly or anything else. He will cease to be president upon the inauguration of his successor. Or when his heart stops beating.


What if it's not clear who wins? Imagine this scenario, Republican governors of states Trump loses refuse to certify(claiming voter fraud or other nonsense) the results to the point where no one gets a majority of the EC. At that point, per the 12th amendment, the election goes to the House, but each state gets one vote. Since there are more red states than blue states, the House elects Trump. What happens then?
 
2020-07-07 5:43:12 PM  
Getting behind the paywall for democracy https://outline.com/2XS9hE
 
2020-07-07 5:43:15 PM  

Walker: What if Trump loses but insists he won?

We drag him out of the White House by his mushroom

/wear gloves....several pairs.


Wearing several pairs of gloves will ruin your dexterity. Especially working with small objects.
 
2020-07-07 5:43:27 PM  
Trump is a coward. If he's pouting in the WH after inauguration Biden just needs to walk in, look at the Sec. Service and say "Get this farkstick out of my house, please."
 
2020-07-07 5:43:36 PM  

Tman144: beezeltown: IDK, arrest him for trespassing after the inauguration?

Hell, if we wins (yurp), he'll contest the election to say it was rigged.

He doesn't have to agree, or go quietly or anything else. He will cease to be president upon the inauguration of his successor. Or when his heart stops beating.

What if it's not clear who wins? Imagine this scenario, Republican governors of states Trump loses refuse to certify(claiming voter fraud or other nonsense) the results to the point where no one gets a majority of the EC. At that point, per the 12th amendment, the election goes to the House, but each state gets one vote. Since there are more red states than blue states, the House elects Trump. What happens then?


Invoke Rule 303
 
2020-07-07 5:43:46 PM  
Wargaming the end of American democracy

Jeez, subby, I got burned out of World of Tanks too but that's over the top.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-07-07 5:43:52 PM  
He can't.

That's the answer. It would violate the Constitution, the GOP would follow, Democrats in Congress would throw the hammer down and expel any guilty members hold a quorum and be done with it.
 
2020-07-07 5:44:48 PM  

JohnBigBootay: Congress will desert him off he loses


Don't bet your savings on that.  Trump's base will make their lives miserable if they do.

Trump will continue to insist that he is the leader of the Republican party until he dies and beyond.  Through his tweets and media appearances, he will instruct them how to act, how to vote, what issues to push.  His kids will act as his surrogates, even if he winds up in prison, pushing Trumpism.

And I will celebrate every uncomfortable moment that causes all of these fools.
 
2020-07-07 5:44:50 PM  

nytmare: We worried about the same thing in 2016 because he was constantly harping about the election being "rigged". That is, right up until the night he eked out a win. Then all of a sudden the electoral college was legit, but the popular vote was "rigged". His biatching got him nowhere then and it will get him nowhere this year. If he loses, he won't have a choice, he's out.


The main difference now is that we've had the "leader" of our country destroying world relationships, emboldening not just the racists but also the conspiracy theory nutbags, add in a pandemic with economic turmoil, and unfettered police brutality documentation, well this isn't nearly the same scenario.
 
2020-07-07 5:45:36 PM  

AsparagusFTW: It's 2020. You can be anything you want to be!


Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-07-07 5:46:13 PM  

bluejeansonfire: People should seriously make plans for this. We cannot trust in the system, because the system has been run on the honor system for ages and has no mechanisms for actually ousting someone who bucks it.

And before anyone says it's illegal to squat in the White House or he's not allowed to, it's also illegal to ignore subpoenas and sell out the country to Russia and rape 13-year-olds, but he's done it and faced jack sh*t for it.

We are in the middle of a government awkwardly twiddling its thumbs because it apparently doesn't know how to handle someone who brazenly breaks all the rules and doesn't feel sorry about it. Expect this to continue in November with people going "what do we do???"

The answer is obvious, but spines will be tested.


I imagine there are more than a few Secret Service agents who would be happy to thump Trumpy's head for him.  And as Trump said "don't be so nice" when they put him in the car.
 
2020-07-07 5:46:15 PM  
He'll hire a bunch of Russian hookers to pee on everything before he leaves the White House.
 
2020-07-07 5:47:21 PM  

NM Volunteer: Luckily I have a good supply of d6 and a few platoons of Imperial Guard in storage, along with a few Leman Russes.  Push comes to shove, I break out the USCT and the pro-Union Texans.  What ruleset does American Democracy use?  I hope I don't have to re-base any minis.


Works for me as long as I get to lead a Khornate warband into Wall Street to spill blood and collect skulls.
 
2020-07-07 5:47:21 PM  

1funguy: AAAAGGGGHHHH: If Biden wins the Pop and EC votes by a decent enough margin, it won't matter how many brainfarts and yowlings Donnie makes. As of Noon January 20th, 2021, if Trump still insists that he's still POTUS, the Secret Service will gladly drag his fat ass out and toss him outside the fence.

And I think SS will actually set up a lottery on which agents will get the honor.

Do you think the officers won't worry too much about hitting his head when they put him in the back of the car..?


I'm picturing the scene from Casino. Carry him through the door and use his head to open the farking door.

"Casino" - Cowboy Scene HD
Youtube gEXdIxl3m54
 
2020-07-07 5:47:32 PM  

Tman144: What if it's not clear who wins? Imagine this scenario, Republican governors of states Trump loses refuse to certify(claiming voter fraud or other nonsense) the results to the point where no one gets a majority of the EC. At that point, per the 12th amendment, the election goes to the House, but each state gets one vote. Since there are more red states than blue states, the House elects Trump. What happens then?


They vote to chose which state Representative gets to represent the vote for each state.
 
2020-07-07 5:48:40 PM  
Any time I've said this, I've been called several kinds of idiot.  IT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
 
2020-07-07 5:48:48 PM  

AAAAGGGGHHHH: If Biden wins the Pop and EC votes by a decent enough margin, it won't matter how many brainfarts and yowlings Donnie makes. As of Noon January 20th, 2021, if Trump still insists that he's still POTUS, the Secret Service will gladly drag his fat ass out and toss him outside the fence.

And I think SS will actually set up a lottery on which agents will get the honor.


At the very least, the detail assigned to him post-presidency would be responsible for removing him from somewhere he shouldn't be.
 
2020-07-07 5:48:49 PM  
The danger of an undemocratic outcome only grows in other scenarios that were "war gamed" by other participants. For instance, what if there is no clear-cut winner on election night, with Biden narrowly ahead in the electoral college but with Michigan, North Carolina and Florida still too close to call? The participants in that war game concluded the result would be "near civil war in the streets." Far-fetched rumors are enough to bring out armed right-wing militias today; imagine how they would respond if they imagined that there was an actual plot afoot to steal the election from their hero.

Faaaaaark.

If you live in one of these states, VOTE DAMMIT.
 
2020-07-07 5:50:12 PM  

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: JohnBigBootay: Congress will desert him off he loses

Don't bet your savings on that.  Trump's base will make their lives miserable if they do.

Trump will continue to insist that he is the leader of the Republican party until he dies and beyond.  Through his tweets and media appearances, he will instruct them how to act, how to vote, what issues to push.  His kids will act as his surrogates, even if he winds up in prison, pushing Trumpism.

And I will celebrate every uncomfortable moment that causes all of these fools.


I don't think so.  When Trump loses a lot of Republican voters will suddenly forget they ever voted for him. Or claim they voted for him just to stiggit to the libs.
 
2020-07-07 5:51:09 PM  

toraque: Wargaming the end of American democracy

Jeez, subby, I got burned out of World of Tanks too but that's over the top.
[Fark user image 300x168]


I'm more of a World of Warships guy, but the real GOAT wargames were the SSI series that started with Panzer General.

FTA:  I recently took part in a "war game" to see what would happen under those circumstances. The session was organized by the Transition Integrity Project, a nonpartisan group founded by Rosa Brooks of Georgetown Law School and Nils Gilman of the Berggruen Institute. The scenario we were given predicted a narrow Biden victory in the electoral college: 278 to 260. Various participants played the role of the Trump campaign, the Biden campaign, Republican and Democratic elected officials, the news media, and other key players to see what would happen next.
 
2020-07-07 5:53:26 PM  
He'll basically do what his Russian handlers told him to do if he lost the last election. Only this time he'll have the WH pulpit to do it. The best plans are those where there's two possible outcomes and you have a win either way. He wins, the Russians get their stooge in the WH. He loses, they have an useful ahole ot destabilize the country by destroying the legitimacy of our elections.
 
2020-07-07 5:54:34 PM  
This again?

If Trump loses (and don't kid yourself, he could win and/or steal the election again) he'll leave, just like every other president before him. He'll go kicking and screaming, sure, but he'll leave the WH and die mad about it.
 
2020-07-07 5:55:25 PM  

Icarus_Rising: Trump is a coward. If he's pouting in the WH after inauguration Biden just needs to walk in, look at the Sec. Service and say "Get this farkstick out of my house, please."


Well, a lot of people are not aware of this, but there is a little known provision in the EO's describing the exact procedure should the involuntary removal of a president occur.

The Secret Service agents assigned to ex-presidents are obligated to jello wrestle with the incoming presidents Secret Service agents.
The winner gets to chose to wrestle either Nancy Pelosi or Mitch McConnell for the championship, the party of the winner of this round is declared president.
It's in the little print on the website, the one that every one clicks without reading. It says "I agree" in the little circle...
 
2020-07-07 5:55:34 PM  

Needlessly Complicated: This again?

If Trump loses (and don't kid yourself, he could win and/or steal the election again) he'll leave, just like every other president before him. He'll go kicking and screaming, sure, but he'll leave the WH and die mad about it.


Really? Do you think that he cares what the rules are?

How many different sources close to him have come forward and said "to him, cheating is a way of life."?
 
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