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(Politico)   No one knows how the hell to safely reopen schools   (politico.com) divider line
    More: Murica, High school, Education, School, Teacher, Fairfax County's teachers unions, school districts, new school year, public spaces  
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3959 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 04 Jul 2020 at 6:46 PM (1 year ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-07-04 8:01:58 PM  
I think I'm gonna send the little french fries to a catholic school.  Once those nuns get a 2-yard stick then I know social distancing will be maintained with a vengeance.
 
2020-07-04 8:03:37 PM  
If you stop having kids you won't need schools.
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-07-04 8:06:54 PM  

HotIgneous Intruder: jumac: the issue is you can't have a 1 size fits all go at it.  each level of school is going have to be done different.  For example high school, 90% of it could be done with 1 or 2 days with the teachers and the reset online. and those kids are old enough to be home alone while the parent(s) are at work.

k-5 on the other hand, the kids are to young to stay home alone and most stuff can't be done online at that age.

middle school is something in between.

How is it you think that having students mixing for one or two days would serve any purpose at all in stopping the spread?


Stopping? no slowing it down and keep it somewhat under control? maybe.    the issue is there is some stuff you can't teach online very good.  and it wouldn't even have to be all the kids.  could be set up so depending on grades.  you keep a high b to a+ and you don't have to see the teacher unless you need to.  c- to b and you see the teacher maybe 1 or 2 times a week.  anything under a c- and you see the teacher more.

There is no way to reopen school without having some sort of increase of cases.  The best we can do is find a way to limit/control that increase.
 
2020-07-04 8:07:13 PM  
And then there are the parents who will REFUSE to let their kids wear masks, and who will teach their children that it's all some hoax, or that kids are immune, or that masks don't do anything, or some other dumb-ass thing.

Nobody wants their kids back in school with the children of these covidiots. Rightly so.
 
2020-07-04 8:07:58 PM  

Not Y3K Compliant: Ugh, they closed schools in March and went to online "learning".  I understand it was rushed and teachers had very little time to prepare, but it was basically seeing the teacher once a week via zoom and printing out assignments.  The 1st grade teacher told us that half the class never even checked in online for the remaining of the school year.

They will end up opening schools up with limited capacity; those that can afford to not send their kids can stay fully online - the rest have no choice.  No idea what they will do with the buses.

They will try to get all the kids to wear masks; there will be no recess, desks will be spaced out as much as possible.  I think they will ask parents to take their children't temperature every day and give unlimited sick days.

We are lucky that one of us can stay home with the kids.  We are not going to be sending them and have been learning about home schooling to at least gauge how the online component of the school compares.


My high schooler was incin from 8:20-3:00 every day. Required to be on the zoom meeting for each class. Schedule just like normal. The elementary kids had zoom class, recess, study time, zoom class etc. Just like being there in person. They learned a lot and got a lot done.

Oh yeah, they go to evil private school. Public school parents did nothing but complain about how unprepared their school was. eLearning was basically print your assignment and hope the kid does it. Every passes.
 
2020-07-04 8:09:09 PM  
Don't Oh, and return the sportsball portion of the school budget to the taxpayers while you're at it.


Don't kid yourself if you think that isn't a big reason a lot of people are pushing to reopen schools.
 
2020-07-04 8:10:43 PM  

AllCatsAreBeautiful: the money is in the banana stand: Herein lies the problem.

1.) The obvious solution is to not open them. Of all of the teachers I know, this is the preference.
2.) Teachers for the most part, hate trying to teach remotely as they know it is vastly less efficient and effective than in person.
3.) We have come to finally realize that schools are more so child care facilities than they are viewed as educational facilities. The entire strategy of a return to work revolves around kids going back to school or parents finding an effective child care strategy which were already in short supply or cost-prohibitive.
4.) The idea is that kids will likely rebound. What isn't mentioned often enough is that the teachers and staff won't, the parents and extended family of the child won't. Children are primary plague vectors of almost every illness as it will spread through the family unit rapidly.
5.) This does not leave a whole lot of good options. When some sort of return to work is needed but childcare and school are not open, what happens? Well, I will tell you what happens. The parents are going to win this one and schools will be pushed to reopen so parents can go back to work. We will see an ungodly spike because A) You cannot effectively manage kids on a good day let alone with masks and social distancing during a pandemic B) Same goes for adults.

The best solution in my eyes would be to keep the farking schools closed and subsidize families who cannot afford to stay home. There has to be a hell of a lot of money we start throwing at this problem as that is the only way people are likely to stay the fark at home. The other option is to hemorrhage money dealing with the repercussions and economic calamity.

When a child brings home covid-19 and kills off the immune comprised parents; we're going to see a lot less children being sent to school by nervous parents. Those are all great solutions but will never happen because it's America.
/developing country and all that.


I've read a fair bit of opinion on this that takes the position that, given the established nature of the virus, most schoolkids will get infected sooner or later no matter what happens, and as a society we just have to accept that.

That might be true, but in a democracy it's still not something most parents are ready to hear.  Even if they acknowledge the tokenism of precautions, they still want to hear that school systems are are taking reasonable/measured/proportionate steps to do things a bit differently.

The biggest tragedy possible are public school systems that say "we will make no changes."  The obvious response to that, as you say, are scared parents who will keep their kids out of school.  All that will do is exacerbate existing class divisions.  Better-off families who can afford at-home tutors will see their kids' education accelerate and become even more distant from the public norm than they had been.

It's a bad scene all around.  I wouldn't want to be on a school trustee board at the moment.
 
2020-07-04 8:11:21 PM  

meanmutton: Snapper Carr: Easy answer:

Don't.

You think adults are bad at infection control discipline?

We are but kids are much much worse.

As far as I've seen - the kids have been better than most of the adults. You tell the kid about the sickness, tell them what they need to do, and by and large the kids are gonna do it. It's like wearing a seat belt.


Kids aren't all poisoned by the culture war and identity politics.
 
2020-07-04 8:11:36 PM  

gregz18: We keep hearing, over and over, that this virus spreads so much more in an indoor setting.  Schools are not a magical place where the virus won't spread.

School districts all over the country, since April/May, should have been creating plans for at least a hybrid system for this fall, and should be trying to get that information out to parents, teachers, and students, so that they know what to expect.

Of course, again - NO leadership from the federal government - although in this case, like the article mentions, we probably don't want the Secretary of Education involved on this one.  You want to talk about useless - she is beyond useless.


Yeah, my kids private school has been making plans since there was a hint back in March that schools might close.

Why is your school waiting for the federal government? Why can't they figure this out? Why do they need someone in Washington telling them what to do?

Oh yeah, victim mentality.
 
2020-07-04 8:12:14 PM  
Teachers are going to be treated as cannon fodder.
Sadly, School is as much a childcare as anything for many people, and if the schools are not open, people can't go to work.

I've already got word here that they WILL be open somehow.  Of course this was decided by people who will not be in the classroom.
 
2020-07-04 8:12:41 PM  
You do it remotely or you don't do it at all. With the state of our public education I'm not sure you could tell a difference.
 
2020-07-04 8:14:13 PM  

Snapper Carr: Easy answer:

Don't.

You think adults are bad at infection control discipline?

We are but kids are much much worse.


Challenge level: kids don't get infected often, don't spread it, and don't get very sick if they do catch it.

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-0​6​-schools-evidence-kids-coronavirus.htm​l

/Yeah, you can find that vanishingly small number that get seriously ill.
 
2020-07-04 8:14:39 PM  

gregscott: Home Schools don't have a significant problem with this.


Sure, except that enrollment for home schooling is filling up the programs and people are having trouble getting slots.

So yeah, that counts as "a problem".
 
2020-07-04 8:15:13 PM  
Wave 2 of the 1918 flu emerged in late August. Then wave 3 the following January. Of course we're still going to be riding wave 1...
 
2020-07-04 8:17:26 PM  

the money is in the banana stand: Herein lies the problem.

1.) The obvious solution is to not open them. Of all of the teachers I know, this is the preference.
2.) Teachers for the most part, hate trying to teach remotely as they know it is vastly less efficient and effective than in person.
3.) We have come to finally realize that schools are more so child care facilities than they are viewed as educational facilities. The entire strategy of a return to work revolves around kids going back to school or parents finding an effective child care strategy which were already in short supply or cost-prohibitive.
4.) The idea is that kids will likely rebound. What isn't mentioned often enough is that the teachers and staff won't, the parents and extended family of the child won't. Children are primary plague vectors of almost every illness as it will spread through the family unit rapidly.
5.) This does not leave a whole lot of good options. When some sort of return to work is needed but childcare and school are not open, what happens? Well, I will tell you what happens. The parents are going to win this one and schools will be pushed to reopen so parents can go back to work. We will see an ungodly spike because A) You cannot effectively manage kids on a good day let alone with masks and social distancing during a pandemic B) Same goes for adults.

The best solution in my eyes would be to keep the farking schools closed and subsidize families who cannot afford to stay home. There has to be a hell of a lot of money we start throwing at this problem as that is the only way people are likely to stay the fark at home. The other option is to hemorrhage money dealing with the repercussions and economic calamity.


1. Not true
2. True
3. If schools are just child care we should close them. This is the dumbest thing I've heard in a while
4. Children are not vectors. Please do some actual research.
5. No, we won't.
 
2020-07-04 8:20:08 PM  

bobbyjoebobby: Snapper Carr: Easy answer:

Don't.

You think adults are bad at infection control discipline?

We are but kids are much much worse.

Challenge level: kids don't get infected often, don't spread it, and don't get very sick if they do catch it.

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-06​-schools-evidence-kids-coronavirus.htm​l

/Yeah, you can find that vanishingly small number that get seriously ill.


Multiply that "vanishingly small number" by the millions of school kids in each state, and go ahead and count in all of the susceptible adults they come across in the average school day, along with the people THOSE people interact with outside of school, add up the numbers, and then fark off.
 
2020-07-04 8:22:10 PM  
WE JUST HAVE TO ALL WEAR MASKS UNTIL MID-AUGUST! BUT BECAUSE FREEDOM WE CAN'T DO BASIC farkING HYGINE!
 
2020-07-04 8:23:26 PM  

bobbyjoebobby: the money is in the banana stand: Herein lies the problem.

1.) The obvious solution is to not open them. Of all of the teachers I know, this is the preference.
2.) Teachers for the most part, hate trying to teach remotely as they know it is vastly less efficient and effective than in person.
3.) We have come to finally realize that schools are more so child care facilities than they are viewed as educational facilities. The entire strategy of a return to work revolves around kids going back to school or parents finding an effective child care strategy which were already in short supply or cost-prohibitive.
4.) The idea is that kids will likely rebound. What isn't mentioned often enough is that the teachers and staff won't, the parents and extended family of the child won't. Children are primary plague vectors of almost every illness as it will spread through the family unit rapidly.
5.) This does not leave a whole lot of good options. When some sort of return to work is needed but childcare and school are not open, what happens? Well, I will tell you what happens. The parents are going to win this one and schools will be pushed to reopen so parents can go back to work. We will see an ungodly spike because A) You cannot effectively manage kids on a good day let alone with masks and social distancing during a pandemic B) Same goes for adults.

The best solution in my eyes would be to keep the farking schools closed and subsidize families who cannot afford to stay home. There has to be a hell of a lot of money we start throwing at this problem as that is the only way people are likely to stay the fark at home. The other option is to hemorrhage money dealing with the repercussions and economic calamity.

1. Not true
2. True
3. If schools are just child care we should close them. This is the dumbest thing I've heard in a while
4. Children are not vectors. Please do some actual research.
5. No, we won't.


In modern American society, yes, schools  are literally free daycare centers for the working class.

Trying to argue otherwise makes you sound 1) very white,  2) suburban and 3) very upper middle class.
 
2020-07-04 8:24:59 PM  
Don't care how they do it. Just get the little shiats off the streets.
 
2020-07-04 8:26:40 PM  
HOME SCHULE KIDS URENT WEERDOS ANYMOREE!!!
 
2020-07-04 8:29:17 PM  

MikeyFuccon: If the Taiwanese can do it, so can the Americans.


Taiwan seized their domestic mask factories in January, ran them 24 hours a day until everyone in the country got and was forced to wear a mask by February when they also stopped international travel.

You stop this on the landing beach or it over runs your country.

Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Singapore TOTAL COMBINED dead since the start of the pandemic: 1293.

In the USA, with 36% of the population supporting Trump and refusing to wear masks in July (8 months after Japan, Korea, Taiwan and Singapore started pandemic preparations), viral control is simply impossible. They will serve as a viral reservoir until 100% masking or herd immunity. Some models say that at this point, 100% masking will no longer work. The virus may be too deeply seeded into the population.

If you can't open the schools, most 2-bread-earner families will not be able to send both parents to work. Kiss what's left of the economy goodbye.

Winter 2020/21 will be simply be apocalyptic in the USA when flu season and Covid-19 hit at the same time. We should get close to herd immunity by the end of the winter. Winter 2021/22 will have a small wave which will push us into herd immunity. Virus will be controlled by Summer 2022.

A successful vaccine will create herd immunity faster.
 
2020-07-04 8:36:00 PM  

bobbyjoebobby: gregz18: We keep hearing, over and over, that this virus spreads so much more in an indoor setting.  Schools are not a magical place where the virus won't spread.

School districts all over the country, since April/May, should have been creating plans for at least a hybrid system for this fall, and should be trying to get that information out to parents, teachers, and students, so that they know what to expect.

Of course, again - NO leadership from the federal government - although in this case, like the article mentions, we probably don't want the Secretary of Education involved on this one.  You want to talk about useless - she is beyond useless.

Yeah, my kids private school has been making plans since there was a hint back in March that schools might close.

Why is your school waiting for the federal government? Why can't they figure this out? Why do they need someone in Washington telling them what to do?

Oh yeah, victim mentality.


As someone who has taught, most administrators are not the best and brightest and fled the classroom at the  first opportunity. Don't expect much forward thinking.
 
2020-07-04 8:36:36 PM  
Gee. Slashing education budgets year after year across 4 decades, forcing more and more kids to be crammed like sardines into each classroom, may one day bite America on the ass if......oh I dunno.....a pandemic came along?

i.ytimg.comView Full Size
 
2020-07-04 8:36:56 PM  

bobbyjoebobby: Snapper Carr: Easy answer:

Don't.

You think adults are bad at infection control discipline?

We are but kids are much much worse.

Challenge level: kids don't get infected often, don't spread it, and don't get very sick if they do catch it.

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-06​-schools-evidence-kids-coronavirus.htm​l

/Yeah, you can find that vanishingly small number that get seriously ill.


Not true.
 
2020-07-04 8:43:39 PM  

Vacation Bible School: Wave 2 of the 1918 flu emerged in late August. Then wave 3 the following January. Of course we're still going to be riding wave 1...


The Godfather Part II cam out two years after the original.  Then Part III came out 16 years later.  I think we can all agree that Part III was much worse than the first two, but at least we have 18 years to prepare.
 
2020-07-04 8:44:27 PM  

wademh: There's some growing data from contact tracing studies that show that younger children both tend not to get infected as easily, and that those who do turn positive for the virus are about 4 fold less likely to transmit the virus to adults. This is still what would have to be called preliminary but it contrasts with our instincts about how schools spread the flu and colds.

Some places are bound and determined to open schools. What we should do is follow those "experiments" closely. Every kid gets tested twice a week. Not individual tests, do the simpler oral saliva swab, pool 10 students. Turn over results in 24 hours. If you get a positive on a pool for a class, individually test everyone in that class, their siblings, and the teacher. Pull the positive kid for two weeks. If you get a second positive in the class during that two weeks, the whole class goes home on quarantine.

Have a plan for what it will take to shut down the whole school. Publish it. If you trigger the condition, follow through and close the school.

Different school districts will have their variations. Keep track of what works, what fails. Avoid repeating failures.


How fortuitous we're finding exactly what we hope to find...
// wishful thinking is my Weeners, but time will tell
 
2020-07-04 8:46:42 PM  
Rand Paul knows. Did anyone ask him?
 
2020-07-04 8:48:09 PM  
If it's not safe enough to allow people to cram together in church, in restaurants, in movie theaters, or inside sports arenas, what kind of moran thinks a school classroom can be made safe for the kids and teachers?

People say that adults will take risks when it comes to their own lives, but not when it comes to kids' safety, I laugh. No one would be talking about opening schools right now if that was true. I think what's closer to the truth is people are desperately looking for some way to spin it as safe to reopen schools IF we do the magic safety steps. Things like limiting how long everyone is in class for the day, limiting the amount of students in any one class, staggering the schedule so only part of the student body is in school on any given day, and filling in the gaps with online learning. That's doing something but it's not making it safe.

Part of the push is because money is involved. If a school gets funding based on how many kids are in school everyday then they need to reopen because you know the Republicans will be glad to withhold funding from schools which don't go along with their push to reopen 'the economy'. By the way, once the effects of reduced tax revenue start to hit the school districts there will be fewer teachers as layoffs start happening. So right at the time you need maximum amounts of teachers to allow class sizes to be reduced for safety reasons, you'll have fewer teachers meaning class sizes will be bigger than ever. More kids crammed in each class+contagious deadly virus= I don't know I flunked advanced math.
 
2020-07-04 8:52:50 PM  

Jerseysteve22: bobbyjoebobby: gregz18: We keep hearing, over and over, that this virus spreads so much more in an indoor setting.  Schools are not a magical place where the virus won't spread.

School districts all over the country, since April/May, should have been creating plans for at least a hybrid system for this fall, and should be trying to get that information out to parents, teachers, and students, so that they know what to expect.

Of course, again - NO leadership from the federal government - although in this case, like the article mentions, we probably don't want the Secretary of Education involved on this one.  You want to talk about useless - she is beyond useless.

Yeah, my kids private school has been making plans since there was a hint back in March that schools might close.

Why is your school waiting for the federal government? Why can't they figure this out? Why do they need someone in Washington telling them what to do?

Oh yeah, victim mentality.

As someone who has taught, most administrators are not the best and brightest and fled the classroom at the  first opportunity. Don't expect much forward thinking.


As an half-admin, I agree.  In so many ways.

I fled the classroom because being part admin doubled my salary.

I found the admin part very easy if you stay on top of things with a few related ideals:

1) they are policies, not law
2) policies will not properly address all situations; exceptions do exist.
3) realizing half of people are below average
4) empathy

all my fellow admins lament how busy they are while I spend 80% of my day on fark.  I really never saw a group of people so dedicated to solving problems that don't exist.
 
2020-07-04 8:53:53 PM  
I guess we'll have to do it unsafely, then.
 
2020-07-04 8:55:20 PM  

bobbyjoebobby: Children are not vectors


Daaaaaaamn, son.  You went right out there, to the edge of stupid, looked around, and jumped right the fark in.
 
2020-07-04 8:56:15 PM  

jtown: Was the obvious tag MIA?

Without a vaccine, we can't put kids back in school.


It was social distancing
 
2020-07-04 8:56:32 PM  

namegoeshere: This is one where there is no good answer.


Plenty of bad ones, though.

I'm sure this administration will pick some of them from the long and growing list.
 
2020-07-04 9:00:14 PM  

Birnone: If it's not safe enough to allow people to cram together in church, in restaurants, in movie theaters, or inside sports arenas, what kind of moran thinks a school classroom can be made safe for the kids and teachers?


The kind of moron who also opened all those other things.

You know... Republican governors.
 
2020-07-04 9:00:24 PM  
Test everyone.  So you quarantine the right people, and then cautiously reopen things.  You know, like the experts have been saying for 5 FARKING MONTHS NOW.
 
2020-07-04 9:02:51 PM  

bobbyjoebobby: Not Y3K Compliant: Ugh, they closed schools in March and went to online "learning".  I understand it was rushed and teachers had very little time to prepare, but it was basically seeing the teacher once a week via zoom and printing out assignments.  The 1st grade teacher told us that half the class never even checked in online for the remaining of the school year.

They will end up opening schools up with limited capacity; those that can afford to not send their kids can stay fully online - the rest have no choice.  No idea what they will do with the buses.

They will try to get all the kids to wear masks; there will be no recess, desks will be spaced out as much as possible.  I think they will ask parents to take their children't temperature every day and give unlimited sick days.

We are lucky that one of us can stay home with the kids.  We are not going to be sending them and have been learning about home schooling to at least gauge how the online component of the school compares.

My high schooler was incin from 8:20-3:00 every day. Required to be on the zoom meeting for each class. Schedule just like normal. The elementary kids had zoom class, recess, study time, zoom class etc. Just like being there in person. They learned a lot and got a lot done.

Oh yeah, they go to evil private school. Public school parents did nothing but complain about how unprepared their school was. eLearning was basically print your assignment and hope the kid does it. Every passes.


Private schools should be banned.
 
2020-07-04 9:03:59 PM  
I would love to go back to the classroom this fall.

Several European countries opened up their schools pretty early. Neat stuff - they had hourly handwashing and less than 10 kids per room. They took all kinds of precautions, and didn't even require masks for the wee ones. It's worked out fairly well.

Of course...their general population also took the advice of scientists pretty quickly.

Since we didn't take advice quickly, and in many cases are still actively resisting sensible measures to reduce disease spread, this fall will be a sh*tshow. Because of the rush to fix the economy- which will continue to limp along until the virus is suppressed - we will be forced to open. And I can guarandamntee you that we won't be given the resources or freedom to protect our students like we should.

It doesn't have to be this way. But I don't know how to stop it from happening. I'll be reporting to work because it's what I love to do. But I wish we didn't have to do it the most backasswards way imaginable.

I don't have kids of my own, so I don't have to make that choice for them. I am furious on behalf of those who have no choice but to send them in person. It's yet another way in which we penalize the poor for being poor.
 
2020-07-04 9:05:05 PM  

Hyjamon: Jerseysteve22: bobbyjoebobby: gregz18: We keep hearing, over and over, that this virus spreads so much more in an indoor setting.  Schools are not a magical place where the virus won't spread.

School districts all over the country, since April/May, should have been creating plans for at least a hybrid system for this fall, and should be trying to get that information out to parents, teachers, and students, so that they know what to expect.

Of course, again - NO leadership from the federal government - although in this case, like the article mentions, we probably don't want the Secretary of Education involved on this one.  You want to talk about useless - she is beyond useless.

Yeah, my kids private school has been making plans since there was a hint back in March that schools might close.

Why is your school waiting for the federal government? Why can't they figure this out? Why do they need someone in Washington telling them what to do?

Oh yeah, victim mentality.

As someone who has taught, most administrators are not the best and brightest and fled the classroom at the  first opportunity. Don't expect much forward thinking.

As an half-admin, I agree.  In so many ways.

I fled the classroom because being part admin doubled my salary.

I found the admin part very easy if you stay on top of things with a few related ideals:

1) they are policies, not law
2) policies will not properly address all situations; exceptions do exist.
3) realizing half of people are below average
4) empathy

all my fellow admins lament how busy they are while I spend 80% of my day on fark.  I really never saw a group of people so dedicated to solving problems that don't exist.


You sound like one or the good ones! So many dumb directives or needless changes because someone was looking for something to do or flex their power muscles.

I may go in that direction someday, but I enjoy the classroom too much, plus another graduate doesn't appeal to me right now.
 
2020-07-04 9:08:05 PM  
Easy, don't and tell the economy to fark off till COVID-19 is sorted out properly. We can always make a new one and fark the rich who complain.
 
2020-07-04 9:08:42 PM  

binkius: MikeyFuccon: If the Taiwanese can do it, so can the Americans.

Taiwan seized their domestic mask factories in January, ran them 24 hours a day until everyone in the country got and was forced to wear a mask by February when they also stopped international travel.

You stop this on the landing beach or it over runs your country.

Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Singapore TOTAL COMBINED dead since the start of the pandemic: 1293.

In the USA, with 36% of the population supporting Trump and refusing to wear masks in July (8 months after Japan, Korea, Taiwan and Singapore started pandemic preparations), viral control is simply impossible. They will serve as a viral reservoir until 100% masking or herd immunity. Some models say that at this point, 100% masking will no longer work. The virus may be too deeply seeded into the population.

If you can't open the schools, most 2-bread-earner families will not be able to send both parents to work. Kiss what's left of the economy goodbye.

Winter 2020/21 will be simply be apocalyptic in the USA when flu season and Covid-19 hit at the same time. We should get close to herd immunity by the end of the winter. Winter 2021/22 will have a small wave which will push us into herd immunity. Virus will be controlled by Summer 2022.

A successful vaccine will create herd immunity faster.


What are you basing herd immunity on? We have no data on how long antibodies last.  Might only be a few months.  If that's true then herd immunity is out the window.
 
2020-07-04 9:12:18 PM  
Lots of good points, observations and ideas here but the fact is that we are going to have a worsening pandemic -- at least until we get a good vaccine and leadership that will make it widely and easily available.  We need to come to terms with the idea that our entire society is going to take a step back and lose much of what economic progress we have made in the past half century or so.   The best we can do is mitigate it and find ways of dealing with the consequences.

What would happen if we just decided that most families had to have an adult staying at home and not working so that their would be much less need for childcare?  What would happen if kids ended up taking a year off from school and just learning what they can remotely or by other means?

I am old enough to remember when stay-at-home mothers (rarely dads) were the norm and when the expectations of the school systems were less broad.  We survived canned food at home and rare trips to restaurants or movies.  We survived single-car families and hand-me-down clothing and eventually prospered to some degree. It wasn't all as pleasant as some seem to remember but we got through it to better times.  Now our collective arrogance, shortsightedness, gullibility and impatience is combining with fate to bring us down a notch.  It is time to accept that we need to reboot our whole society in many ways.
 
2020-07-04 9:16:01 PM  

Jerseysteve22: I fled the classroom because being part admin doubled my salary.



Sort of starting to understand how we keep having lowering education quality....
 
2020-07-04 9:18:43 PM  
There is NO way to do this responsibly, so the question is will the idea be abandoned (the earlier, the better chance we have to create a more productive alternative), or will it be done irresponsibly, at the cost of numerous children's lives.

Since we're talking about the United States, we all already know the answer.
 
2020-07-04 9:27:47 PM  
I live in a "liberal" state with a governor who tried to control things with regulations.  He backed off too soon and we are headed back to higher-risk country right now as he tries again to control it.

Locally, some Head Start pre-schools are starting to reopen -- mostly because of their function as day-care for low-income, working parents.  They are going with less than half the normal class sizes but I noticed that the one I entered had all the kids and half the staff without masks.  It amounts to a gamble on half-measures combined with a reduced risk population (kids) to stay safe.  I have no idea what the plans are in case of an outbreak but the administration seems competent so I am guessing they have thought that through.

However, these schools can more easily limit class size and schedules than regular schools where they have to accommodate however many want to attend for a more fixed curriculum.  I can't see the K-12 schools doing better even if they do pick up some lessons from what is happening now.
 
2020-07-04 9:30:12 PM  

DarnoKonrad: Test everyone.  So you quarantine the right people, and then cautiously reopen things.  You know, like the experts have been saying for 5 FARKING MONTHS NOW.


The USA is pretty much past the point of no return. It's too late in the game to even attempt contact tracing.

You really want someone to risk their life by dropping by Cleutus's trailer park and asking all sorts of questions regarding where they've been & whom they've had been in contact with because the government scientists need to know?

We're looking at 4M to 10M confirmed and unconfirmed covid-19 deaths easily by the time this is all over.

Hell, we might be looking at whole towns in the Midwest and the rural south cleared out because of the medical cormobidities like obesity, diabetes, cardiovascular disease and high blood pressure that are ever so prevalent and untreated in rural America.
 
2020-07-04 9:42:11 PM  
Trying to get actual children to follow the guidelines having to do with physical spacing, masks and contact will be impossible when this f'king country can't even get "adults" to do these things. There is no way that the virus CAN'T be transmitted in a closed room with 15-30 people breathing each others air for hours, even if only one is initially infected that day.

And even if they don't drop dead - although some have - they WILL be taking it home to everyone else. The rugrats and teens will have to quarantined in their own homes the way some health care workers have been staying away from their families for months. "Johnny, go to your room... until May".
 
2020-07-04 9:43:27 PM  
What a bunch of great comments here. If most of you were running the country we would be in much better shape.

We had the chance to do it the right way. We saw what was going on in other countries and we saw the steps being taken to successfully crush that first wave. Coulda. Shoulda. Mostly didn't.

All we needed to do was mask up and avoid indoor group settings. And we had to do that as a nation for maybe six weeks. Unfortunately that's hard for people. The uproar is going to be epic when schools are forced to close again in September. Commenters in our local news rag already are calling for schools to be defunded because they don't want to pay tax dollars for "services promised but not delivered". Yeah go ahead and find out how much that would ultimately cost.

Tbh districts ought to be working overtime right now developing plans, and maybe they are, but teachers should be involved also. I haven't heard a peep since the first week in June. Personal opinion? Yeah, it's gonna be a total shiatshow as we expect.
 
2020-07-04 9:44:41 PM  
Somebody needs to come up with a plan, soon. A lot of companies were willing to let people work from home during the lockdowns, but are now requiring people to return to work. A lot of families will be faced with the unenviable decision of sending Young kids to schools knowing they may be exposed to the virus, or abandoning their jobs to stay home with their young kids for e-learning. We could see a significant jump in government assistance requests and the trend of jobs coming back the past few weeks may reverse again.

I cannot fathom having to make that call as a parent of kids too young to stay home alone.
 
2020-07-04 9:46:20 PM  
I think it's obviously apparent - your children must die.
 
2020-07-04 9:53:18 PM  
My friends who are teachers are freaking out.  Some of them are personally at risk medically, live with medically at-risk people, or are close to them.  So you're expecting your child's teacher to not see their parents anymore?  To have their spouse with severe copd move out?  To decide between going to work and having chemotherapy?
 
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