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(Politico)   We've spent $10 billion on "Operation Warp Speed" and not only are we not going to get green Orion girls out of it, but we might not even get a usable Covid vaccine-which is a problem because we've sacrificed treatment and prevention research for it   (politico.com) divider line
    More: Fail, Vaccine, Donald Trump, development of a Covid-19 vaccine, Trump administration, Operation Warp Speed, joint health-defense project, Public health, Federal government of the United States  
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2091 clicks; posted to Politics » on 30 Jun 2020 at 4:14 PM (5 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-06-30 1:22:17 PM  
In the grand scheme of things, the money doesn't matter. The problem is soaking up all the clinical trial capacity at centers that can actually run these studies.
 
2020-06-30 2:08:33 PM  
i.pinimg.comView Full Size


Happy now?!
 
2020-06-30 2:22:26 PM  
The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.


My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.
 
2020-06-30 2:50:32 PM  
If there's a vaccine then Gilead can't make any money off their drug.

We can't have that.

Also this:
Vaccines are notoriously difficult to make; the vaccine for mumps, the fastest ever developed, took four years.
 
2020-06-30 3:00:04 PM  
The REAL vaccine was the friends we made along the way....
 
2020-06-30 4:17:38 PM  
There was never any treatment and prevention research anyway... at least if Trump had his way with it
 
2020-06-30 4:18:40 PM  

HighOnCraic: [i.pinimg.com image 426x282]

Happy now?!


...I am.
 
2020-06-30 4:19:13 PM  
Breaking from Mr. Romero: long shot, high risk efforts do not often lead to success, also detract funds and resources from more proven methods.  Film from our home studios at 11.
 
2020-06-30 4:20:15 PM  
It's was Trump going all in on re-election.  He doesn't care about deaths if he can take credit for saving the leftovers.
 
2020-06-30 4:21:18 PM  
Well f*ck. There goes my approach of "I'm going to become a hermit and stay indoors until a proven vaccine is readily available."
 
2020-06-30 4:21:39 PM  
Operation Grift.
 
2020-06-30 4:21:53 PM  
The important thing is that someone *made* $10 billion on Operation Warp Speed.
 
2020-06-30 4:22:25 PM  
Operation Warp Speed:
Kill All Americans for Debt Forgiveness.

/It all makes sense if you assume Trump is stacking bodies to collect bounties.
 
2020-06-30 4:22:32 PM  
Oh what, something else Trump touched is a disaster?

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-06-30 4:22:44 PM  
Did you guys not get the list of pharma companies to invest in?
 
2020-06-30 4:23:10 PM  

Nadie_AZ: The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.

My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.


We knew how to make flu vaccines in 1918?
 
2020-06-30 4:23:30 PM  
Why the farking hell would the richest country in the world, with the Ivy League med schools and advanced chemistry corporations like GE and DuPont, need to sacrifice spending on treatment to fund vaccine?
 
2020-06-30 4:23:49 PM  
Inovio has a vaccine that has passed the first phase of trials, but has recently had issues with its partner that would be needed for mass production.
 
2020-06-30 4:24:09 PM  
"The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?
 
2020-06-30 4:24:12 PM  
They're developing a vaccine to enrich Trump and friends.
 
2020-06-30 4:25:04 PM  

Bennie Crabtree: Why the farking hell would the richest country in the world, with the Ivy League med schools and advanced chemistry corporations like GE and DuPont, need to sacrifice spending on treatment to fund vaccine?


Fortune 500 companies need that sweet stimulus money.
 
2020-06-30 4:25:54 PM  

bluejeansonfire: Well f*ck. There goes my approach of "I'm going to become a hermit and stay indoors until a proven vaccine is readily available."


...which is what I recommend for people aged 65 or older, or those with pre-existing medical conditions.  Unfortunately.

/people are going to give up at some point
 
2020-06-30 4:26:52 PM  
That's a lot of money for a U V light and a bottle of Clorox ..
 
2020-06-30 4:27:23 PM  

Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?


Cause covid 19 basically crippled an aircraft carrier battle group for starters?
 
2020-06-30 4:28:05 PM  
....I suppose in hindsight, the fact that it was named after a fictional concept that requires non-existent substances to get around the rules and which would necessarily cause massive paradoxes if you ever actually did it was probably a clue.
 
2020-06-30 4:28:28 PM  

bdub77: If there's a vaccine then Gilead can't make any money off their drug.

We can't have that.

Also this:
Vaccines are notoriously difficult to make; the vaccine for mumps, the fastest ever developed, took four years.


I heard on the radio this morning that Gilead has a treatment that cost 3k with insurance, after they got 80m in federal funding. It was on 6am morning drive, so there's that.
 
2020-06-30 4:28:49 PM  

Mad_Radhu: Nadie_AZ: The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.

My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

We knew how to make flu vaccines in 1918?


Besides, the 1918 flu wasn't a coronavirus.

Fauci seems optimistic about the virus and I don't think he would say anything like that unless he actually was. We got a head start on this virus because of SARS and MERS vaccines under development, and because we had the genome quickly. I am not losing hope, I think we can pull this off.  But it would be stupid to not plow a bunch of money into therapeutics that would prevent people from getting critically ill with it.
 
2020-06-30 4:28:58 PM  

Bennie Crabtree: Why the farking hell would the richest country in the world, with the Ivy League med schools and advanced chemistry corporations like GE and DuPont, need to sacrifice spending on treatment to fund vaccine?


DOD, like all humans, have a vested interest in seeing this thing done with.

Also they are logistical experts. If you need medical staff dispatched immediately to far-flung locations (like, say, across the US) they can do it.
 
2020-06-30 4:30:54 PM  
Strange that the "But how will we pay for Medicare For All!?" brigade isn't raising hell about this.
 
2020-06-30 4:31:39 PM  

Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?


Reading between the lines, I think actual scientists in the White House tried to send it to people who couldn't be farked with by Trump easily.
 
2020-06-30 4:33:10 PM  

DORMAMU: Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?

Cause covid 19 basically crippled an aircraft carrier battle group for starters?


Huh? It's "crippled" most every part of government and society. That doesn't mean we should shovel a few billion to the Department of Housing and Urban Development so they can help develop a vaccine.
 
2020-06-30 4:35:31 PM  

Nadie_

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

Mad_Radhu: Nadie_AZ: The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.

My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

We knew how to make flu vaccines in 1918?


Came here to say that, but I guess I don't know enough to be sure. We didn't even know what a virus was in 1918 or what caused the flu. However there was a sort of a vaccine against smallpox made from cowpox and by purposefully injecting people under the skin with smallpox from an infected person, or to use serum from recovered people, they knew about that too although antibodies had not really been discovered, so I can't say exactly what attempts at a cure were made in 1918.
 
2020-06-30 4:35:34 PM  
Operation Warped Mind, more like.
 
2020-06-30 4:35:43 PM  

Mad_Radhu: Nadie_AZ: The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.

My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

We knew how to make flu vaccines in 1918?


Kinda, yeah.
Doctors have been injecting pus and blood from recovering patients into otherwise healthy patients to provide some degree of immunity / resistance for hundreds of years.
 
2020-06-30 4:36:43 PM  
I just read that the US have bought every last drop of Remdesivir.
 
2020-06-30 4:39:25 PM  
encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.comView Full Size


Green Onion Girls!?
 
2020-06-30 4:41:49 PM  

madgonad: Mad_Radhu: Nadie_AZ: The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.

My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

We knew how to make flu vaccines in 1918?

Kinda, yeah.
Doctors have been injecting pus and blood from recovering patients into otherwise healthy patients to provide some degree of immunity / resistance for hundreds of years.


Variolation? Well, that is a possible route. Slow. And, given that current indications showing that antibodies die out after a few months(!) for the coronavirus, it seems to be a palliative alternative. Really, the only way to knock this virus out is reduce R0 to be as close to 0 as possible and then wait it out for 4 weeks. Other nations have done that and they're back to normal. Well, everything normal except allowing US residents from traveling there. Can't blame them.
 
2020-06-30 4:42:50 PM  

Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?


Likely because they already have the labs and equipment needed for such.
 
2020-06-30 4:42:58 PM  
"The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years"

Trump is hoping that something good happen with this before he finishes his first and hopefully ONLY term. Along with so many other things he has failed at he's afraid of being "The president that farked the country with COVID-19". Even if there's no vaccine during Biden's time in office he can just say that he was handed this clusterfark, and that he did the best he could with it... which I believe he will do.

There will be no "miracle shot". Trump's name will be on this forever.
 
2020-06-30 4:44:07 PM  

HighOnCraic: [i.pinimg.com image 426x282]

Happy now?!


Fark user imageView Full Size

Oh yes.. quite happy.
 
2020-06-30 4:44:57 PM  

KarmicDisaster: Nadie_

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

Mad_Radhu: Nadie_AZ: The pursuit of a vaccine across federal health agencies has also forced tradeoffs. The Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, for example, has halted a push for lung treatments to fight the coronavirus, potentially putting a treatment option on the back burner.

The danger of going all in on a vaccine may be that President Donald Trump is pinning hopes on a miracle shot while there's considerable reason to believe that the outbreak could stretch on for years.

My ex is an epidemiologist. We are in this for years, she says.

Inside Operation Warp Speed, officials are brimming with confidence. Five people involved in the vaccine project insist that there are reasons to be confident it will succeed: Two vaccines may be just weeks away from beginning the late-stage clinical trials; there are as many as six other viable candidates being tested and plans to radically expedite production are well underway.

They'll be expensive and won't work. Just like it happened in 1918.

We knew how to make flu vaccines in 1918?

Came here to say that, but I guess I don't know enough to be sure. We didn't even know what a virus was in 1918 or what caused the flu. However there was a sort of a vaccine against smallpox made from cowpox and by purposefully injecting people under the skin with smallpox from an infected person, or to use serum from recovered people, they knew about that too although antibodies had not really been discovered, so I can't say exactly what attempts at a cure were made in 1918.


You could be right, but I think people had an understanding of viruses (versus bacteria) back around 1918. Sure, microscopy back then wasn't as sophisticated as what we have now, but I think they knew there were these things that were smaller than bacterium, and isn't exactly a living organism, and so on.
 
2020-06-30 4:46:18 PM  

Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?


Defense runs a infectious disease program. Partly to research biological weapons and partly to research protections against same.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_​S​tates_Army_Medical_Research_Institute_​of_Infectious_Diseases
 
2020-06-30 4:46:57 PM  

DORMAMU: Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?

Cause covid 19 basically crippled an aircraft carrier battle group for starters?


Enemies, foreign or domestic, need not always be human enemies.
 
2020-06-30 4:47:52 PM  

NateAsbestos: Bennie Crabtree: Why the farking hell would the richest country in the world, with the Ivy League med schools and advanced chemistry corporations like GE and DuPont, need to sacrifice spending on treatment to fund vaccine?

DOD, like all humans, have a vested interest in seeing this thing done with.

Also they are logistical experts. If you need medical staff dispatched immediately to far-flung locations (like, say, across the US) they can do it.


Sorry, my punctuation was confusing. What meant was, why did the USA need to choose between paying for treatment and paying for vaccines? They are wealthy, they have advanced medical tech, they have plenty of staff. If anyone can afford to do it all, they can.
 
2020-06-30 4:49:51 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-06-30 4:50:04 PM  

Hector_Lemans: DORMAMU: Hector_Lemans: "The federal government has poured $10 billion into Operation Warp Speed, the joint project of the departments of Health and Human Services and Defense"

WHY THE HELL IS DEFENSE INVOLVED WITH THIS???!!! Is our multi-trillion-dollar military industrial complex in need of a few billion more?

Cause covid 19 basically crippled an aircraft carrier battle group for starters?

Huh? It's "crippled" most every part of government and society. That doesn't mean we should shovel a few billion to the Department of Housing and Urban Development so they can help develop a vaccine.


But since you poi Ted they have a big budget already... they are likely a significant contributor utor to that 10 bil spent so far.

Also, as others have pointed out, they are masters of logistics.  They can get what was developed to where it needs to be fast.

They also have an active NBC program. (Nuke Bio Chem)
 
2020-06-30 4:50:10 PM  
Careful. We might go past plaid and straight into salamander.
 
2020-06-30 4:51:23 PM  

Bennie Crabtree: NateAsbestos: Bennie Crabtree: Why the farking hell would the richest country in the world, with the Ivy League med schools and advanced chemistry corporations like GE and DuPont, need to sacrifice spending on treatment to fund vaccine?

DOD, like all humans, have a vested interest in seeing this thing done with.

Also they are logistical experts. If you need medical staff dispatched immediately to far-flung locations (like, say, across the US) they can do it.

Sorry, my punctuation was confusing. What meant was, why did the USA need to choose between paying for treatment and paying for vaccines? They are wealthy, they have advanced medical tech, they have plenty of staff. If anyone can afford to do it all, they can.


It sounds like the number of staff may in fact be the bottleneck.
 
2020-06-30 4:52:54 PM  
10 billion for a chance at returning a 21 trillion dollar a year economy back to some sort of normality? Seems like a bargain worth the expense. Especially since I'm also perfectly happy to fund healthcare in addition to it. It doesn't have to be a one or the other approach. This is actually one of the sane things Trump has done. I expect it was proposed and being pushed by someone else and they never told trump. The idea that they aren't pulling resources with the rest of the world is idiotic though.
 
2020-06-30 4:53:02 PM  

dericwater: Variolation? Well, that is a possible route. Slow. And, given that current indications showing that antibodies die out after a few months(!) for the coronavirus, it seems to be a palliative alternative. Really, the only way to knock this virus out is reduce R0 to be as close to 0 as possible and then wait it out for 4 weeks. Other nations have done that and they're back to normal. Well, everything normal except allowing US residents from traveling there. Can't blame them.


Yep. When we think of vaccines we think of precise doses of only the concerned pathogen after rigorous testing for safety and effectiveness. A hundred years ago it was hold on tight and hope for the best.

I am wondering what happened to September. Weren't there supposed to be hundreds of millions of doses ready to inject of AZ's vaccine (assuming it sailed through stage 3)? Now it is 4 months further back? Didn't we write billions of dollars of checks to pre-buy three different vaccines that won't be ready until the fall, but here's the money to start mass production NOW?
 
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