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(Minneapolis Star Tribune)   You know that student loan forgiveness policy thing..yeah, about that   (startribune.com) divider line
    More: Asinine, Barack Obama, Democratic Party, President of the United States, Debt, Education Secretary Betsy DeVos, House Democrats, United States presidential election, 2008, Education Department's tough policy  
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6309 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 27 Jun 2020 at 12:40 AM (9 days ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



101 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2020-06-26 7:20:32 PM  
Republicans again endorse and vote for fraud for profit by the their kind of people.
The republicans truly are the party for fraud and corruption in addition to racism.
 
2020-06-26 7:27:55 PM  

eurotrader: Republicans again endorse and vote for fraud for profit by the their kind of people.
The republicans truly are the party for fraud and corruption in addition to racism.


So they're branching out?
 
2020-06-26 8:47:04 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-06-26 10:36:15 PM  
Keeping the public dumb, gullible and poor.  Republican voter base maintenance 101.

Vote accordingly in November.
 
2020-06-27 12:41:24 AM  
Real life Scott's Tots.
 
2020-06-27 12:46:06 AM  
Is Betsy's face with a heavy amount of makeup?
 
2020-06-27 12:46:57 AM  
Is there an article not hidden behind a beggar's wall that shows up even in incognito mode?
 
2020-06-27 12:50:07 AM  

ElvisThroop: eurotrader: Republicans again endorse and vote for fraud for profit by the their kind of people.
The republicans truly are the party for fraud and corruption in addition to racism.

So they're branching out?


Sounds par for the course to me.
 
2020-06-27 12:51:50 AM  
You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.
 
2020-06-27 12:56:26 AM  
Debt release is more a Putin thing.
 
2020-06-27 12:57:18 AM  
That should make for some helpful campaign ads.
 
2020-06-27 12:57:54 AM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-06-27 12:58:24 AM  
I doubt a man as dedicated to higher education as Donald Trump would want to make things more difficult for those stuck with crippling student loan debt.

cdn.studyinternational.comView Full Size
 
2020-06-27 12:58:37 AM  

pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.


Didn't read the article, did you?

Or are you for allowing fraud to stand?
 
2020-06-27 12:59:28 AM  
They should have taken the time to get a government loan.
 
2020-06-27 1:00:22 AM  
Can Rapepublicans act like adults ever?
 
2020-06-27 1:02:13 AM  

Declassify Issue: Is Betsy's face with a heavy amount of makeup?


Looks like she's been using the dickweed's tanning machine.
 
2020-06-27 1:03:05 AM  

joker420: They should have taken the time to get a government loan.


Should that matter in instances of fraud?
 
2020-06-27 1:04:53 AM  

Declassify Issue: Is Betsy's face with a heavy amount of makeup?


no, that's a baboon's ass. Betsy couldn't make the photo shoot that day.
 
2020-06-27 1:07:15 AM  

pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.


I mean why not forgive my house and car loan while we're at it? And that money I borrowed from my brother when I was 11. I shouldn't have to pay that 5 bucks back.
 
2020-06-27 1:08:28 AM  

MythDragon: pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.

I mean why not forgive my house and car loan while we're at it? And that money I borrowed from my brother when I was 11. I shouldn't have to pay that 5 bucks back.


You mean like declaring bankruptcy for people that hit rock bottom?
 
2020-06-27 1:12:16 AM  

pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.


I don't support simply forgiving the loan, but I'm all for freezing the interest under the right circumstances.

Unless the degree is in womyn's studies. For that, double the interest rate.
 
2020-06-27 1:12:34 AM  

pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.


🙄

Says the house flipper that walked away from there upside down mortgages
 
2020-06-27 1:13:51 AM  

Declassify Issue: Is Betsy's face with a heavy amount of makeup?


If they averaged the color of her makeup with Trump's, it might actually look human.
 
2020-06-27 1:16:50 AM  

Resident Muslim: MythDragon: pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.

I mean why not forgive my house and car loan while we're at it? And that money I borrowed from my brother when I was 11. I shouldn't have to pay that 5 bucks back.

You mean like declaring bankruptcy for people that hit rock bottom?


I predict that the future will bring many bankruptcies across the nation. Rock bottom is going to welcome any and all.
 
2020-06-27 1:16:51 AM  
Why is this 'democrats failed to override' instead of 'republicans succeeded in blocking an override'?

The problem here is republicans.
 
2020-06-27 1:34:15 AM  
There are some things which create (or encourage) a vicious cycle; an example of that would be health insurance and health care costs. Without many alternatives for healthcare such as charity foundations and low cost hospitals, the health care costs and insurance costs just keep feeding each other.
You know you can't afford to get treated without insurance, so you need to get insurance, and because they know that, they can raise their prices. And because healthcare institutions know that your health care costs will be covered, they raise their prices and are uninhibited with adding more tests/treatments.
Which in turn raises health insurance premiums.
And so on.

Unforgivable student loans + pushing that everyone should have a degree and get a traditional job seems to me the same way, that it feeds into each other until the cost of higher education has become ridiculous.
This bubble will burst in the near future, 5-10 years.
Some of the main reasons:
- the gig economy. This is not just a double-edged sword, it's more of an unknown. It will give people more freedom, but take away benefits. It will open up the doors to work across borders, but that also means people are competing worldwide, including poor countries where the cost of living is so much cheaper than more advanced countries. So the main factor will simply be "Can you do the job well?"
- online learning. This used to have such a high bar set, with a LOT of hesitation to offer online learning. Covid slammed that into the ground. Institutions have been heading this way, mostly with executive education, but with Covid have realized that they can offer structured classes as well.
- Unforgivable loans. This, I believe, will be challenged, again, and will end up forgivable. So universities that used to depend on getting paid so raise prices will realize that this future might not hold.
- competencies. people and organizations are realizing that shorter more specific courses offer better return than broad programs that last forever. Some time back I recall hearing one speaker talk about how the future will train people how to do entry-level work, but will then give them online courses for specific skills. Let me give an example: Instead of a four-year accounting degree, students learn the basics of accounting for 1-2 years (intense), then hit the workforce as accountant trainees. At that level, they can do they entry-level stuff, the grunt work. Then they train them according to their job needs, say managerial accounting for factory/production businesses, or accounts receivables if they are moving into that department. This has a multi-faceted impact on society: 1) students get experience of professional workplaces early in their lives 2) They start generating income for themselves, and indirectly raise the GDP 3) Context: whatever they learn just makes more sense because they now have context and can mentally fit everything together as opposed to trying to assimilate things mentally in a bubble.4) Saving time, as less time is spend on specific topics that have a minor probability of being used, and can be learned later on. An example of this is for those that learned Fortran (programming language), and were still having it set in their curriculum even as the industry was moving away. My GOD higher learning institutions have some inertia that makes it difficult to change course.

I think I need to stop here before this becomes a thesis and before I branch out into more thoughts which may or may not be useful :)
 
2020-06-27 1:36:35 AM  

MellowMauiMan: Resident Muslim: MythDragon: pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.

I mean why not forgive my house and car loan while we're at it? And that money I borrowed from my brother when I was 11. I shouldn't have to pay that 5 bucks back.

You mean like declaring bankruptcy for people that hit rock bottom?

I predict that the future will bring many bankruptcies across the nation. Rock bottom is going to welcome any and all.


My understanding is student loans are 1) unforgivable 2) keep accumulating interest.

/stand to be corrected
 
2020-06-27 1:37:35 AM  
That Student Loan forgiveness policy that didn't work BEFORE Betsy Devos took over? Yeah I remember that
 
2020-06-27 1:40:23 AM  

Resident Muslim: MellowMauiMan: Resident Muslim: MythDragon: pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.

I mean why not forgive my house and car loan while we're at it? And that money I borrowed from my brother when I was 11. I shouldn't have to pay that 5 bucks back.

You mean like declaring bankruptcy for people that hit rock bottom?

I predict that the future will bring many bankruptcies across the nation. Rock bottom is going to welcome any and all.

My understanding is student loans are 1) unforgivable 2) keep accumulating interest.

/stand to be corrected


You are not wrong. They also add collections fees as they are bounced from debt collector to debt collector while they are sold off as uncollectable debt. Are you familiar with the subprime mortgage industry crash? Have I got a tranche to sell you!
 
2020-06-27 1:40:41 AM  

puffy999: Can Rapepublicans act like adults ever?


"Just act like an adult" says the party begging to be coddled like children by a high-tax/big-government/nanny-state that will act responsibly on their behalf since they can't be expected to.
 
2020-06-27 1:47:02 AM  

Resident Muslim: huge ass wall o'text that I won't quote.


I wanted to touch on a few points you made.

Student loans and college degrees.  I've been criticizing this thinking for years.  In high school they push the lie that if you don't get a college degree you are a failure.  That's a disservice to the students.  For many, college is not right for them.  They would be much happier going to a trade school.  Plus, plumbers make bank.  As you pointed out, the colleges know they are getting paid no matter what, so they have raised tuition through the roof.  They need to change it so that the colleges take on the risk for non-payment.

Gig economy.  My state, California, has effectively destroyed the gig economy with AB5, which made most gig jobs illegal.  I know a few people who did gig work.  One is a translator.  She went from having a reliable income to wondering how long before she'll be homeless.  On top of that, the state government has announced they will start going after companies like Lyft if they don't convert everyone to full time employee status - in the middle of a pandemic when public transportation options are nonexistent or very limited.

Unforgivable loans.   Besides student loans, the credit industry has made it very difficult to clear your credit card debt with a bankruptcy.  I don't know too much of the details, so won't comment any further.
 
2020-06-27 1:47:11 AM  

Resident Muslim: I think I need to stop here before this becomes a thesis and before I branch out into more thoughts which may or may not be useful :)


Overshot by 5 paragraphs.

You should go ahead and open the "forgivable loan department" and save the world, sound like a perfectly viable plan. Everyone will make their best efforts to repay you. No advantage will be taken. People simply have far too much integrity.
 
2020-06-27 1:50:10 AM  
Can't let that rigged system ever become unrigged.
 
2020-06-27 1:56:12 AM  

shaggai: Can't let that rigged system ever become unrigged.


Just curious, aren't colleges dominated by liberals? I mean aren't these institutions run by the Dems/left?

Is it the Republicans job to figure out how to make these ridiculous tuition rates at leftist institutions affordable? And are the Republicans the ones who are working to keep this system of accredited indoctrination In between children and a successful career?

These are just questions...
 
2020-06-27 1:58:12 AM  

GrinzGrimly: Just curious, aren't colleges dominated by liberals? I mean aren't these institutions run by the Dems/left?


There's a secret republican illuminati running colleges behind the scenes.  It's the same group that runs the police in cities that have been overwhelmingly democrat for over 50 years.
 
2020-06-27 2:14:50 AM  

OgreMagi: GrinzGrimly: Just curious, aren't colleges dominated by liberals? I mean aren't these institutions run by the Dems/left?

There's a secret republican illuminati running colleges behind the scenes.  It's the same group that runs the police in cities that have been overwhelmingly democrat for over 50 years.


That idea is both far fetched and almost certainly true.
 
2020-06-27 2:19:17 AM  

GrinzGrimly: shaggai: Can't let that rigged system ever become unrigged.

Just curious, aren't colleges dominated by liberals? I mean aren't these institutions run by the Dems/left?

Is it the Republicans job to figure out how to make these ridiculous tuition rates at leftist institutions affordable? And are the Republicans the ones who are working to keep this system of accredited indoctrination In between children and a successful career?

These are just questions...


The goal is to try to help people who have been farked over by institutions of "higher learning" which were merely money grabs like Trump University. People who were sold the goods of you need a college education in order to make it in America, and proceeded to get an education that was worth nothing. Just because this might have helped someone who made an incredibly bad choice of majors in one of the liberal colleges you describe is apparently enough to offend the GOP.
 
2020-06-27 2:21:37 AM  
Wait they're conversing with themselves now? Jesus Christ.
 
2020-06-27 2:37:53 AM  

Boojum2k: Is there an article not hidden behind a beggar's wall that shows up even in incognito mode?


Beggars wall?  Somebody has to fund their work?  What do you do for a living, can you do it for me for free?

This is the internet we have created with our habits.  They tried to monetize it through ads on pages, people hated it.

They add a paywall people hate it.

How else do you propose they fund paying their employees?
 
2020-06-27 2:41:45 AM  
To the one deleting his comments about trade schools and plumbers "making bank." If we went another direction with schooling in the past fourth years, how many plumbers would still be "making bank?"

If you doubled the amount of certified plumbers, what does that normally do to the wages they command? Uhh huh. And if they quadrupled or even went up by a factor of ten? We are talking about long term here, right?

It's not like you need a plumber all the time. Build something, get it plumbed. If the plumber does the job right and you don't screw it up, you very well may be able to live the rest of your life and die without ever having to pay another plumber ever again.

Same goes for all other licensed and certified contract labor. We could use more of them, sure, but if that's all we have to offer we might as well just sell outright to the Chinese because we've collectively given up.

Plumbers would be the new burger flippers.
 
2020-06-27 2:54:56 AM  

dkulprit: Boojum2k: Is there an article not hidden behind a beggar's wall that shows up even in incognito mode?

Beggars wall?  Somebody has to fund their work?  What do you do for a living, can you do it for me for free?

This is the internet we have created with our habits.  They tried to monetize it through ads on pages, people hated it.

They add a paywall people hate it.

How else do you propose they fund paying their employees?


I don't mind advertisements.
But too many sites use them incorrectly, intrusively, or let evil ppl hijack, or data mine.
Someone really ruined advertising for like, every single one.

Pay walls? Okay. But, there can't be any adds what so ever. Because, that is what I'm paying for.

But, that said, if I'm going to pay, most sites aren't worth paying for.
10 years ago I would have paid for Gawker. I loved arguing with people on there. But, they got killed. And bought up. I would not pay for that now. Hell I don't even read on there anymore. They have become censors of comments. F++k that.
I'd pay for email, but, none of them are good enough to pay for. All their interfaces and functioning have gone to hell.
I'd pay for Fark if I got something for my money, like a green light a month?
There was a an amazing form called AllSexResource. ASR for short. I'd pay for that, but back then, not now. Their no where as informative as they was once.  I'm willing to pay for content. But there are caveats. And sadly, I'd not be able to buy content for everyone. I can free read a lot or I can only read one or 3 sites. Why any specific site thinks they are worth being one of those 3, is a giant gamble for any website to make. So lol good luck with that.  Also, over time it gets easier and easier to just walk away.  I had a subscription to Suicide Girls for 8 months took a break was back on for 3 months took another break was on for a month and now haven't been back in 3 years.  If not longer
Is that what you want?
you'll have to constantly be bating people to join you knowing you're going to lose them eventually.
 
2020-06-27 2:59:29 AM  

Stibium: Plumbers would be the new burger flippers.


Maybe that needs to happen to a lot of jobs?
My mom did all kinds of handy man stuff, just fallowing directions in a book. And she can't actually read. Not well. She even fixed a under ground pipe the city water had weaseled out of fixing. she dug up the yard her self and replaced the pipeline from the city to her house.
 
2020-06-27 3:01:20 AM  

waxbeans: you'll have to constantly be bating people to join you knowing you're going to lose them eventually


scifiinterfaces.comView Full Size
 
2020-06-27 3:02:05 AM  

puffy999: waxbeans: you'll have to constantly be bating people to join you knowing you're going to lose them eventually

[scifiinterfaces.com image 850x478]


Yep.
 
2020-06-27 3:09:53 AM  

puffy999: Can Rapepublicans act like adults ever?


Not with those little tiny baby hands...
 
2020-06-27 3:30:34 AM  

doomjesse: puffy999: Can Rapepublicans act like adults ever?

Not with those little tiny baby hands...


"You'd need boxing gloves to fist me. "
 
2020-06-27 3:31:25 AM  
I realize you are (probably) just trolling; but try to remember that many people only took out the loans because these programs existed.
This would be like getting a mortgage with no early repayment penalty because you don't intended to repay early, then after four years, the announce that the terms you agree to have changed.

I would not have taken the loans I did if not for these programs; and I also wouldn't have spent four years following the repayment rules which have considerably lowered my income and employment opportunities.
 
2020-06-27 3:31:45 AM  

pedrop357: You took the loan, now you to get pay it off.


Unless you're a Trump-run business, in which case you declare bankruptcy and your creditors take the hit.
 
2020-06-27 3:34:35 AM  

GrinzGrimly: puffy999: Can Rapepublicans act like adults ever?

"Just act like an adult" says the party begging to be coddled like children by a high-tax/big-government/nanny-state that will act responsibly on their behalf since they can't be expected to.


How is that mask-wearing going? I mean, since bootstrappy Americans are so tough and wise and don't need the Federal Government telling them what to do.
Is the death toll as bad as the flu yet?
 
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