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(Click Orlando)   Scientist admits Sweden could have handled the coronavirus outbreak better, possibly by doing something, anything   (clickorlando.com) divider line
    More: Followup, Denmark, Scandinavia, Sweden, Nordic countries, Europe, Sweden's chief epidemiologist, Norway, European Union  
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1458 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Jun 2020 at 3:10 PM (6 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-06-03 10:41:46 AM  
That's science for you. Not every experiment works. It's why we usually try things like this on rats.
 
2020-06-03 3:11:27 PM  
But herb munity.
 
2020-06-03 3:11:40 PM  
Nihilism in action.
 
2020-06-03 3:13:45 PM  
More deaths than their neighbors, nothing even remotely close to herd immunity, and their economy still sucks? As usual, should have listened to the smart people and shut shiat down.

What's Swedish for "MUH FREEDUMS!!"? "MURBY FURBYBORKBORKDUMS!!"?
 
2020-06-03 3:15:47 PM  
i.ytimg.comView Full Size

/oblig
 
2020-06-03 3:16:51 PM  
Impossible, I was told by all my anti-vaxxer and lockdowns are socialism friends that Sweden is the model to follow.
 
2020-06-03 3:17:03 PM  
They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.
 
2020-06-03 3:17:15 PM  
They tried to save the stonks. It did not work and now they have regrets.
 
2020-06-03 3:18:33 PM  
The guy in charge might end up dying not of natural causes
 
2020-06-03 3:18:58 PM  

Trocadero: [i.ytimg.com image 850x478]
/oblig


Cause we have to get back to defeat the evil uses?  STATION!
 
2020-06-03 3:19:23 PM  

FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.


Yeah, a few thousand people dying unnecessarily, just a slight imperfection.
 
2020-06-03 3:20:10 PM  
"If we were to encounter the same disease again, knowing precisely what we know about it today, I think we would settle on doing something in between what Sweden did and what the rest of the world has done," said Tegnell, considered the architect of the unique Swedish pandemic approach.

That's some absolutely breathtaking bureaucratic-speak. I'm sure the thousands of extra families are relieved to see you at least partially sticking to your guns there.
 
2020-06-03 3:20:20 PM  
More fodder for the crazy conspiracy that this was some sort of world government experiment in that Sweden acted as a control group.
 
2020-06-03 3:20:53 PM  
That's really up to the people. Nobody is telling you that you can't stay away from people and self-quarantine.
 
2020-06-03 3:21:11 PM  
I guess he's never heard of the saying "it's better to be safe than sorry"
 
2020-06-03 3:22:11 PM  
It's a good thing they have publicly-funded universal health care.
 
2020-06-03 3:22:38 PM  

FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.


but neighbors.
 
2020-06-03 3:22:55 PM  

lectos: Trocadero: [i.ytimg.com image 850x478]
/oblig

Cause we have to get back to defeat the evil uses?  STATION!


encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.comView Full Size
 
2020-06-03 3:24:33 PM  
Ah well live and learn

/to snarkfinity and beyond
 
2020-06-03 3:25:15 PM  

TheCubsFan: FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.

Yeah, a few thousand people dying unnecessarily, just a slight imperfection.


It seems the recent "don't get killed by cops" protests has supplanted the "don't get killed by a virus" in most people's minds. Look, I get it. People dying is no bueno, but people die every god damn day - most being preventable in some manner of speaking, but we've just accepted it as a part of reality. Diabetes is entirely preventable and yet people are content to have high A1Cs because cake is that damn good. Heart disease is preventable and yet people are content not being on statins (PS, statin use, even in healthy people, actually improves heart health), but I'm guessing if you haven't popped over 200 on a LDL test, you're not on one.

If live was perfect, we'd all live to be 150 years old and die when we decided it was time to jump off a cliff, but that isn't reality. Life comes with risks. Some of those risks present risks to other people.

For instance, protesting people getting killed by cops will kill thousands more people, but relative harm and statistics is a hard thing to understand so people say "hands up don't shoot" while killing people they are around with their mouths.

Sometimes, the right thing isn't the easy thing and the easy thing isn't the right thing. Risk is inherent. Make your own choices.
 
2020-06-03 3:26:24 PM  

FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.


On the other hand, similar European nations have a fraction as many deaths AND vastly less unemployment.

So weird when those social safety nets actually work.
 
2020-06-03 3:26:55 PM  
Swedish Exceptionalism is a lot like the American kind
 
2020-06-03 3:27:08 PM  
This is what socialism gets you.

Sad.
 
2020-06-03 3:29:48 PM  

JesseL: FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.

On the other hand, similar European nations have a fraction as many deaths AND vastly less unemployment.

So weird when those social safety nets actually work.


Decisions are made based on reality. You wishing we had social safety nets like many European nations do doesn't make it so. The thing that farks people up is making decisions based on some ideal characteristics that aren't based in reality.

IF we were more like Europe, sure, absolutely, some of the things we did might have made sense. But, we don't. So our decisions need to be based on our current reality not our dreamland. 

The steps the US did still resulted in one of the highest rates of unemployment, highest rates of economic contraction, and highest rates of deaths. Based on our current reality, our decisions made were not the best ones. Saving more people was never an option, but saving more people from economic destruction was an option and we decided to throw the bottom 25% of this nation to the wolves and hope they don't starve while the upper 75% worked from home and complained about how hockey and basketball and football games were cancelled.

Relativity.
 
2020-06-03 3:30:12 PM  
More than 76,000 people have been made redundant since the outbreak began

Is that like being a people person? Or using the ATM machine?
 
2020-06-03 3:34:28 PM  

FarkBucket18: JesseL: FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.

On the other hand, similar European nations have a fraction as many deaths AND vastly less unemployment.

So weird when those social safety nets actually work.

Decisions are made based on reality. You wishing we had social safety nets like many European nations do doesn't make it so. The thing that farks people up is making decisions based on some ideal characteristics that aren't based in reality.

IF we were more like Europe, sure, absolutely, some of the things we did might have made sense. But, we don't. So our decisions need to be based on our current reality not our dreamland. 

The steps the US did still resulted in one of the highest rates of unemployment, highest rates of economic contraction, and highest rates of deaths. Based on our current reality, our decisions made were not the best ones. Saving more people was never an option, but saving more people from economic destruction was an option and we decided to throw the bottom 25% of this nation to the wolves and hope they don't starve while the upper 75% worked from home and complained about how hockey and basketball and football games were cancelled.

Relativity.


the reality is....no one knows if any of these measures did squat. wanna use sweden as control group. fine. it doesn't look good right now. what about in the fall? how about belarus? how about maine or conneticutt compared to ny or nj? africa?

i don't think anybody can make sure comparisons on anything.

but here's the thing....sweden wasn't the country doing the experiment. it was all the other countries who locked down that were experimenting......
 
2020-06-03 3:35:28 PM  

FarkBucket18: Saving more people was never an option


...and you're an idiot.

It was always an option. It was an option long before we even bothered to consider options, never mind act on them. It takes about 30 seconds to realize that "saving more people" was always a goddamned option, and even saying that as part of your disingenuous spiel removes any credibility from the rest of your spiel.

Sheesh.
 
2020-06-03 3:35:44 PM  

whither_apophis: Swedish Exceptionalism is a lot like the American kind


american exceptionalism has no nude volleyball.
 
2020-06-03 3:39:00 PM  

flart blooger: FarkBucket18: JesseL: FarkBucket18: They have a quarter of the unemployment the US does and only a slightly higher death rate per 100k than the US and it didn't involve forcing 25% of the population into being laid off for 90+ days.

I mean, one would say maybe it was a success compared to the US, if not a perfect one.

On the other hand, similar European nations have a fraction as many deaths AND vastly less unemployment.

So weird when those social safety nets actually work.

Decisions are made based on reality. You wishing we had social safety nets like many European nations do doesn't make it so. The thing that farks people up is making decisions based on some ideal characteristics that aren't based in reality.

IF we were more like Europe, sure, absolutely, some of the things we did might have made sense. But, we don't. So our decisions need to be based on our current reality not our dreamland. 

The steps the US did still resulted in one of the highest rates of unemployment, highest rates of economic contraction, and highest rates of deaths. Based on our current reality, our decisions made were not the best ones. Saving more people was never an option, but saving more people from economic destruction was an option and we decided to throw the bottom 25% of this nation to the wolves and hope they don't starve while the upper 75% worked from home and complained about how hockey and basketball and football games were cancelled.

Relativity.

the reality is....no one knows if any of these measures did squat. wanna use sweden as control group. fine. it doesn't look good right now. what about in the fall? how about belarus? how about maine or conneticutt compared to ny or nj? africa?

i don't think anybody can make sure comparisons on anything.

but here's the thing....sweden wasn't the country doing the experiment. it was all the other countries who locked down that were experimenting......


China had regional lock downs, not national ones and it worked. Well. They also welded people in their homes. Why not lock down the coasts and leave the people in the center of the US alone and why not just weld people in their homes in those areas with outbreaks?

Again, if we're going after the least harms from the virus, it seems having soldiers stationed at your front door and shooting you for leaving would be pretty effective. 

Of course, people are like, well, no, you can't have police forcibly locking people in their apartments, so more people will die. How do you evaluate those kinds of decisions and why are those people who are against extreme measures also saddled with the reality that more people will die because we weren't extreme enough?
 
2020-06-03 3:40:07 PM  
What is the USA going to do next year if it turns out a 'vaccine' does not provide long-term protection and lockdowns that "buy for time" should have actually been lockdowns that choke the virus out, all along?

Sweden is a relatively small country. Let's look at the bigger picture.
 
2020-06-03 3:42:36 PM  

FormlessOne: FarkBucket18: Saving more people was never an option

...and you're an idiot.

It was always an option. It was an option long before we even bothered to consider options, never mind act on them. It takes about 30 seconds to realize that "saving more people" was always a goddamned option, and even saying that as part of your disingenuous spiel removes any credibility from the rest of your spiel.

Sheesh.


You know what would have worked better? Locking down all borders on January 1st when we saw it was farking contagious as all hell. I was in Beijing at that time and people were already freaking out. I landed back stateside on January 9th, stocked up on all the PPE I could find, stocked my freezer with food, and liquidated my stock holdings.

So, really, why not do that? 

Of course, the reaction was RACISM when we later tried to do just that. 

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The reality was that nobody knew anything and while everyone was picking their nose in early January, those of us who had a modicum of intelligence were already planning.

How about the current protests? Why are they suddenly fine and C19 is on the backburner. The protest of one man's injustice will cause thousands more to die.
 
2020-06-03 3:49:21 PM  

FarkBucket18: FormlessOne: FarkBucket18: Saving more people was never an option

...and you're an idiot.

It was always an option. It was an option long before we even bothered to consider options, never mind act on them. It takes about 30 seconds to realize that "saving more people" was always a goddamned option, and even saying that as part of your disingenuous spiel removes any credibility from the rest of your spiel.

Sheesh.

You know what would have worked better? Locking down all borders on January 1st when we saw it was farking contagious as all hell. I was in Beijing at that time and people were already freaking out. I landed back stateside on January 9th, stocked up on all the PPE I could find, stocked my freezer with food, and liquidated my stock holdings.

So, really, why not do that? 

Of course, the reaction was RACISM when we later tried to do just that. 

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The reality was that nobody knew anything and while everyone was picking their nose in early January, those of us who had a modicum of intelligence were already planning.

How about the current protests? Why are they suddenly fine and C19 is on the backburner. The protest of one man's injustice will cause thousands more to die.


so you were the doooooosh who took all the toilet paper?
 
2020-06-03 3:50:14 PM  

flart blooger: FarkBucket18: FormlessOne: FarkBucket18: Saving more people was never an option

...and you're an idiot.

It was always an option. It was an option long before we even bothered to consider options, never mind act on them. It takes about 30 seconds to realize that "saving more people" was always a goddamned option, and even saying that as part of your disingenuous spiel removes any credibility from the rest of your spiel.

Sheesh.

You know what would have worked better? Locking down all borders on January 1st when we saw it was farking contagious as all hell. I was in Beijing at that time and people were already freaking out. I landed back stateside on January 9th, stocked up on all the PPE I could find, stocked my freezer with food, and liquidated my stock holdings.

So, really, why not do that? 

Of course, the reaction was RACISM when we later tried to do just that. 

For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. The reality was that nobody knew anything and while everyone was picking their nose in early January, those of us who had a modicum of intelligence were already planning.

How about the current protests? Why are they suddenly fine and C19 is on the backburner. The protest of one man's injustice will cause thousands more to die.

so you were the doooooosh who took all the toilet paper?


No, I was the doooooosh that bought all the frozen chicken breasts.
 
2020-06-03 4:07:05 PM  

AngryDragon: This is what socialism gets you.

Sad.


Sweden isn't Socialist.
 
2020-06-03 4:08:45 PM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: More deaths than their neighbors, nothing even remotely close to herd immunity, and their economy still sucks? As usual, should have listened to the smart people and shut shiat down.

What's Swedish for "MUH FREEDUMS!!"? "MURBY FURBYBORKBORKDUMS!!"?


Right, I understand that you may be a bit angry and frustrated at  some of your locals approach government advice and regulations here. But you do need to understand that the partisan nature of the issue that you have in the US is not an international constant. So taking out your frustrations on people far away for your situation at home, well, it ain't quite nice so to say.

See around here not locking down wasn't decided upon by some Trump-wannabe screaming about how medical science is a deep state conspiracy or the result of the local MAGA hat equivalents staging massive protests. Instead it was decided upon as the state epidemiologist and our local equivalent to the CDC noted that locking down society would be massively invasive, have very serious side effects, and that there wasn't really any evidence that it'd do much good. Xi and his ilk aren't exactly people you want to unquestionably copy you know. So listening to the experts is just what we did. How good or bad a choice that was exactly remains to be seen, it'll be years for the scientists to untangle all the cause and effect here. For example just here in Sweden significant local variation appears to be tied to just which weeks exactly the schools had their winter vacation.

Now if we do want a pretty safe bet when it comes to failures of the system (least someone think it's been all puppies and roses and miscounts at the morgue here) I'll suggest the geriatric care around here. Despite a lot of the elderly there being somewhat isolated from the start they are the ones that have been dying. Meanwhile doctors and nurses who have had PPE along with the knowledge of how to properly use it and the time to do so have managed to not catch the disease in any greater numbers despite massive exposure (or so a doctor I know would have me believe at least). Now given what I know of geriatric care around here, the resources to provide the people working there with PPE, training and money is often a pipe dream.

If your neighbour won't follow advice or decrees from the authorities then that's between him, you and your local authorities. Don't drag us into it, and don't be upset because we weren't a useful bat to hit your neighbour over the head with this time around.
 
2020-06-03 4:19:33 PM  

FarkBucket18: If live was perfect, we'd all live to be 150 years old and die when we decided it was time to jump off a cliff, but that isn't reality. Life comes with risks. Some of those risks present risks to other people.
...
Sometimes, the right thing isn't the easy thing and the easy thing isn't the right thing. Risk is inherent. Make your own choices.


Says the person who loudly proclaimed that blood banks accepting donations from hetero porn stars (that is to say, professional sex workers) but not from any man who has had sex with a man in the last 12 (now, eventually, to be three, if paperwork clears) months was a well-founded policy that makes the right protections, because science and therefore.  Except that a much shorter ineligibility period is supported by science (again the porn industry leads the way!  You only need to test every 14 days!  And probably the window between infection and detection by PCR is much smaller).

But do tell us all about "life involves risks" and how possibly bad decisions affecting others' health is a risk you're willing to take.
 
2020-06-03 4:21:07 PM  

luckhasit: I guess he's never heard of the saying "it's better to be safe than sorry"


To use an example far more extreme than realistic but which may still illustrate things: You don't break out the the full range of oncological venoms and doomsday devices for every wart and mole, nor do we amputate the moment a wound gets a bit inflamed. It's a balancing act, even though not every attempt is a resounding success. If it was just about killing the virus at any cost then, well, drinking bleach and showing a hard UV light up your arse could actually do that. It's all the other concerns that make those things ill-advised to the point of lunacy.
 
2020-06-03 4:31:51 PM  
Fark headline untrue - shocker.

Norway's head came a couple of weeks ago saying they shouldn't have locked down.

Over 70% of Sweden's deaths occurred in nursing homes. Finland doesn't count deaths that occurred in nursing homes.

Under 500 people under the age of 70 died in Sweden.

Sweden has had flu seasons in the last several years more severe than COVID.
 
2020-06-03 4:49:57 PM  

Parrahs: See around here not locking down wasn't decided upon by some Trump-wannabe screaming about how medical science is a deep state conspiracy or the result of the local MAGA hat equivalents staging massive protests. Instead it was decided upon as the state epidemiologist and our local equivalent to the CDC noted that locking down society would be massively invasive, have very serious side effects, and that there wasn't really any evidence that it'd do much good. Xi and his ilk aren't exactly people you want to unquestionably copy you know. So listening to the experts is just what we did. How good or bad a choice that was exactly remains to be seen, it'll be years for the scientists to untangle all the cause and effect here. For example just here in Sweden significant local variation appears to be tied to just which weeks exactly the schools had their winter vacation.


Wayyy too much nuance for Fark.

Try removing some of that, and try adding some smug epithets like "Plague Rat," or "Covidiot" along with some condescending caricatures of people that just want a haircut.
 
2020-06-03 4:52:30 PM  
Cool. I just got to tag some more plague rats.
 
2020-06-03 5:05:04 PM  

AloysiusSnuffleupagus: Says the person who loudly proclaimed that blood banks accepting donations from hetero porn stars (that is to say, professional sex workers) but not from any man who has had sex with a man in the last 12 (now, eventually, to be three, if paperwork clears) months was a well-founded policy that makes the right protections, because science and therefore.  Except that a much shorter ineligibility period is supported by science (again the porn industry leads the way!  You only need to test every 14 days!  And probably the window between infection and detection by PCR is much smaller).

But do tell us all about "life involves risks" and how possibly bad decisions affecting others' health is a risk you're willing to take.


I think you have me confused with someone else ... lmao.
 
2020-06-03 5:26:38 PM  

MugzyBrown: Fark headline untrue - shocker.

Norway's head came a couple of weeks ago saying they shouldn't have locked down.

Over 70% of Sweden's deaths occurred in nursing homes. Finland doesn't count deaths that occurred in nursing homes.

Under 500 people under the age of 70 died in Sweden.

Sweden has had flu seasons in the last several years more severe than COVID.


"Now don't cry Inga, Grandma and Grandpa were hanging around too long anyway. They're were always such a downer to visit. At least now we get some inheritance"

/Inga puts vial of covid-19 in freezer for use in 10 years
 
2020-06-03 5:42:06 PM  
musicdirect.comView Full Size
 
2020-06-03 5:42:56 PM  
Sweden has done badly for deaths in care homes and pretty well for deaths otherwise, particularly given that a much higher proportion of the population has had COVID-19 and acquired some sort of immunity, for a while anyway. The policy everywhere is simply to slow the disease so that health services can cope and in that respect they have managed very well without major economic damage.

Apart from care homes, which could undoubtedly have been better protected with no major changes to the rest of the policy, Sweden's way of doing things is looking increasingly sensible. They'll be back to normal while many other countries (Hello, Kiwis) are hiding under the bed clothes and hoping that the boogie man goes away.
 
2020-06-03 6:20:30 PM  

FarkBucket18: AloysiusSnuffleupagus: Says the person who loudly proclaimed that blood banks accepting donations from hetero porn stars (that is to say, professional sex workers) but not from any man who has had sex with a man in the last 12 (now, eventually, to be three, if paperwork clears) months was a well-founded policy that makes the right protections, because science and therefore.  Except that a much shorter ineligibility period is supported by science (again the porn industry leads the way!  You only need to test every 14 days!  And probably the window between infection and detection by PCR is much smaller).

But do tell us all about "life involves risks" and how possibly bad decisions affecting others' health is a risk you're willing to take.

I think you have me confused with someone else ... lmao.


No I do not have you confused with someone else.  You (and Resident Muslim) asserted that indiscriminately rejecting blood donations (which a 3, or a 12, month waiting period effectively is) from teh gheys is a reasonable approach because "oh, gheys too risky, look at the numbers, just bar all of them."  Even when challenged with a monogamous gay couple vs promiscuous porn star scenario (asking who should be allowed to donate), your flippant response doubled down in implying porn stars are less risky.  Which defies logic, of course (it's hard to pick up a new STI if both partners are only having sex with the other partner), but that's the policy you agreed with.

So yeah, you're ok with restricting freedoms as long as it's other people's freedoms we're talking about, even if the reasoning isn't particularly sound or excessively risk-averse, but seem to be arguing here that the lockdowns were pointless because, LOL life is risky, man (in other words, you're ok with Sweden's not particularly scientifically sound and insufficiently risk-averse policy).  Which is a position one might take when it's your freedoms you resent being restricted.  Hmm, funny that.

https://www.fark.com/comments/1078109​2​/Same-as-it-ever-was?cpp=1
 
2020-06-03 6:58:47 PM  

orbister: Sweden has done badly for deaths in care homes and pretty well for deaths otherwise, particularly given that a much higher proportion of the population has had COVID-19 and acquired some sort of immunity, for a while anyway. The policy everywhere is simply to slow the disease so that health services can cope and in that respect they have managed very well without major economic damage.

Apart from care homes, which could undoubtedly have been better protected with no major changes to the rest of the policy, Sweden's way of doing things is looking increasingly sensible. They'll be back to normal while many other countries (Hello, Kiwis) are hiding under the bed clothes and hoping that the boogie man goes away.


https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/02/asia/n​e​w-zealand-restrictions-intl-scli/index​.html

https://www.worldometers.info/coronav​i​rus/country/new-zealand/

New Zealand, zero cases in 11 days, and they are preparing to lift restrictions

Sweden

775 new cases, curve still climbing

Fark user imageView Full Size


https://www.worldometers.info/coronav​i​rus/country/sweden/
 
2020-06-03 7:02:36 PM  

whither_apophis: orbister: Sweden has done badly for deaths in care homes and pretty well for deaths otherwise, particularly given that a much higher proportion of the population has had COVID-19 and acquired some sort of immunity, for a while anyway. The policy everywhere is simply to slow the disease so that health services can cope and in that respect they have managed very well without major economic damage.

Apart from care homes, which could undoubtedly have been better protected with no major changes to the rest of the policy, Sweden's way of doing things is looking increasingly sensible. They'll be back to normal while many other countries (Hello, Kiwis) are hiding under the bed clothes and hoping that the boogie man goes away.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/02/asia/ne​w-zealand-restrictions-intl-scli/index​.html

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavi​rus/country/new-zealand/

New Zealand, zero cases in 11 days, and they are preparing to lift restrictions

Sweden

775 new cases, curve still climbing

[Fark user image 646x591]

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavi​rus/country/sweden/


Gotta admit, worldometers sounds like something that just counts planets. Like kilometer.
 
2020-06-03 7:16:39 PM  

AloysiusSnuffleupagus: FarkBucket18: AloysiusSnuffleupagus: Says the person who loudly proclaimed that blood banks accepting donations from hetero porn stars (that is to say, professional sex workers) but not from any man who has had sex with a man in the last 12 (now, eventually, to be three, if paperwork clears) months was a well-founded policy that makes the right protections, because science and therefore.  Except that a much shorter ineligibility period is supported by science (again the porn industry leads the way!  You only need to test every 14 days!  And probably the window between infection and detection by PCR is much smaller).

But do tell us all about "life involves risks" and how possibly bad decisions affecting others' health is a risk you're willing to take.

I think you have me confused with someone else ... lmao.

No I do not have you confused with someone else.  You (and Resident Muslim) asserted that indiscriminately rejecting blood donations (which a 3, or a 12, month waiting period effectively is) from teh gheys is a reasonable approach because "oh, gheys too risky, look at the numbers, just bar all of them."  Even when challenged with a monogamous gay couple vs promiscuous porn star scenario (asking who should be allowed to donate), your flippant response doubled down in implying porn stars are less risky.  Which defies logic, of course (it's hard to pick up a new STI if both partners are only having sex with the other partner), but that's the policy you agreed with.

So yeah, you're ok with restricting freedoms as long as it's other people's freedoms we're talking about, even if the reasoning isn't particularly sound or excessively risk-averse, but seem to be arguing here that the lockdowns were pointless because, LOL life is risky, man (in other words, you're ok with Sweden's not particularly scientifically sound and insufficiently risk-averse policy).  Which is a position one might take when it's your freedoms you resent being restricted.  Hmm, funny that.

https://www.fark.com/comments/10781092​/Same-as-it-ever-was?cpp=1


You'll find nothing that I said in that thread was untrue.

The primary source of transmission of HIV on the United States is homosexual sex.

That is unarguable.

Your straw man about porn stars was just that ... a straw man.
 
2020-06-03 7:17:41 PM  

Trocadero: whither_apophis: orbister: Sweden has done badly for deaths in care homes and pretty well for deaths otherwise, particularly given that a much higher proportion of the population has had COVID-19 and acquired some sort of immunity, for a while anyway. The policy everywhere is simply to slow the disease so that health services can cope and in that respect they have managed very well without major economic damage.

Apart from care homes, which could undoubtedly have been better protected with no major changes to the rest of the policy, Sweden's way of doing things is looking increasingly sensible. They'll be back to normal while many other countries (Hello, Kiwis) are hiding under the bed clothes and hoping that the boogie man goes away.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/02/asia/ne​w-zealand-restrictions-intl-scli/index​.html

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavi​rus/country/new-zealand/

New Zealand, zero cases in 11 days, and they are preparing to lift restrictions

Sweden

775 new cases, curve still climbing

[Fark user image 646x591]

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavi​rus/country/sweden/

Gotta admit, worldometers sounds like something that just counts planets. Like kilometer.


Also, the Red Cross is a privately run organization.

If they wanted to make a rule saying that only people that could rub their bellies and tap their heads at the same time could donate blood, that is their right.
 
2020-06-03 7:32:22 PM  

whither_apophis: orbister: Sweden has done badly for deaths in care homes and pretty well for deaths otherwise, particularly given that a much higher proportion of the population has had COVID-19 and acquired some sort of immunity, for a while anyway. The policy everywhere is simply to slow the disease so that health services can cope and in that respect they have managed very well without major economic damage.

Apart from care homes, which could undoubtedly have been better protected with no major changes to the rest of the policy, Sweden's way of doing things is looking increasingly sensible. They'll be back to normal while many other countries (Hello, Kiwis) are hiding under the bed clothes and hoping that the boogie man goes away.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/02/asia/ne​w-zealand-restrictions-intl-scli/index​.html

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavi​rus/country/new-zealand/

New Zealand, zero cases in 11 days, and they are preparing to lift restrictions

Sweden

775 new cases, curve still climbing

[Fark user image 646x591]

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavi​rus/country/sweden/


I know which country I would prefer to be in, and that's corona free New Zealand.
 
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