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(Financial Post)   That's a nice, round number, 300 million doses   (business.financialpost.com) divider line
    More: Spiffy, Vaccine, United States, FTSE 100 Index, United Kingdom, AstraZeneca's experimental COVID-19 vaccine, Clinical trial, Immune system, Federal government of the United States  
•       •       •

4716 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 22 May 2020 at 12:05 AM (8 days ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



101 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


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2020-05-21 9:55:32 PM  
So which of his task force members own stock in AstraZeneca?
 
2020-05-21 10:21:31 PM  
Population of USA
328.2 million (2019)
 
2020-05-21 11:03:04 PM  
What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.
 
2020-05-21 11:03:58 PM  
That actually sounds reasonable, for once. This is one of the leading vaccine candidates. 300 million doses is enough to treat a large chunk* of the US population but it also lets the rest of the world have access to the first batch. Maybe this vaccine will be a dud but there are worse ways that the government could spend $1.2 billion.

* Fraction TBD as we don't yet know whether it will take more than one dose per person for the vaccine to be effective
 
2020-05-21 11:28:02 PM  

Ivo Shandor: That actually sounds reasonable, for once. This is one of the leading vaccine candidates. 300 million doses is enough to treat a large chunk* of the US population but it also lets the rest of the world have access to the first batch. Maybe this vaccine will be a dud but there are worse ways that the government could spend $1.2 billion.

* Fraction TBD as we don't yet know whether it will take more than one dose per person for the vaccine to be effective


Yeah, it's pretty cheap insurance. Toss $10B at 5 different vaccines. If one works and you manage to get it produced at scale a year earlier - that's the best $10B you could spend. The damage to the economy over the course of a year is incredible.
 
2020-05-22 12:08:02 AM  
99% chance it aint gonna work.
 
2020-05-22 12:08:55 AM  
Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on
 
2020-05-22 12:10:52 AM  
Give it to Florida first just to see what happens.
 
2020-05-22 12:10:56 AM  

Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on


Capitalism is facing its biggest test in a century, and is failing it.
 
2020-05-22 12:11:27 AM  

Ivo Shandor: That actually sounds reasonable, for once. This is one of the leading vaccine candidates. 300 million doses is enough to treat a large chunk* of the US population but it also lets the rest of the world have access to the first batch. Maybe this vaccine will be a dud but there are worse ways that the government could spend $1.2 billion.

* Fraction TBD as we don't yet know whether it will take more than one dose per person for the vaccine to be effective


It's worth a shot.
 
2020-05-22 12:12:25 AM  
Thats assuming we can convince people it isn't a microchip.

A microchip....

OF SATAN!!!
 
2020-05-22 12:12:43 AM  

Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on


"Proving" anything new in science takes significantly longer than two months. They're sidestepping a lot of research and testing for the sake of "nobody has a better idea"
 
2020-05-22 12:12:55 AM  

Ivo Shandor: That actually sounds reasonable, for once. This is one of the leading vaccine candidates. 300 million doses is enough to treat a large chunk* of the US population but it also lets the rest of the world have access to the first batch. Maybe this vaccine will be a dud but there are worse ways that the government could spend $1.2 billion.

* Fraction TBD as we don't yet know whether it will take more than one dose per person for the vaccine to be effective


Okay I guess that makes sense. This is basically paying for the development.

The article sounded like someone said, WE NEED A VACCINE!!! and Jared thought, "Oh I saw one of those yesterday on tv!"
 
2020-05-22 12:13:50 AM  
While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus

What is H2O?
 
2020-05-22 12:14:04 AM  
$1.2 Billion for an unproven drug and we get $1200 .. Sounds about right ..
 
2020-05-22 12:14:38 AM  

kendelrio: Thats assuming we can convince people it isn't a microchip.

A microchip....

OF SATAN!!!


Shush!

I have yet to see a real picture of Bill Gates that even remotely suggests he has horns or a tail.
 
2020-05-22 12:15:31 AM  
This is just more grift BS
 
2020-05-22 12:15:44 AM  

LordJiro: Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on

Capitalism is facing its biggest test in a century, and is failing it.


Can you imagine what would happen retrospectively if a leader didn't snap up 300 million doses of a viable vaccine?

This may yet be the greatest year capitalism has ever seen.
 
2020-05-22 12:16:39 AM  

vudukungfu: Population of USA
328.2 million (2019)


I guess their projections show 28.2 million dead by the time this drug gets approved, if ever.  Optimistic.  How much AZ stonks does TrumpCo own?
 
2020-05-22 12:17:03 AM  
Jokes on you, I all ready smoked that monkey-blood concentrate.
 
2020-05-22 12:17:53 AM  

Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on


Smoke.
Mirrors.
Stonks.
 
2020-05-22 12:18:08 AM  

Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on


I pledge allegiance to the logo of the corporate states of America. And to the almighty dollar, for which we stand, one nation, under money, with fiduciary prospecting for our ceos.
 
2020-05-22 12:19:46 AM  

mikalmd: $1.2 Billion for an unproven drug and we get $1200 .. Sounds about right ..


What, you want an extra 4 bucks?
 
2020-05-22 12:20:01 AM  
farkin' shoot that stuff over the Florida beaches as chemtrails.  That should cause some panicky confusion among the more gullible Trumpanzees.  Maybe some of them would panic-run into the ocean and drown.
 
2020-05-22 12:21:32 AM  

mikalmd: $1.2 Billion for an unproven drug and we get $1200 .. Sounds about right ..


I'll take $1196 if there's a chance a $4 vaccine works...
 
2020-05-22 12:22:00 AM  

SoupGuru: What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.


Read the article. We are doing pretty much the same thing with three other companies.
 
2020-05-22 12:25:51 AM  
A stock market pump and dump?

/the vaccine won't work
//all political
 
2020-05-22 12:26:14 AM  
I asked a Nero pathologist I know
She said she wouldn't take any new vaccine for several years
She said there has been no "break through" in testing vaccines to know they are safe
It still takes years, so yeah, I'll wait
 
2020-05-22 12:26:32 AM  
This *might* be the first remotely intelligent thing the Trump administration has done.  It actually worked in a (very small) monkey study so the chances of it being legit are far better than hydroxychloroquine or injecting bleach.  $1.2B is chicken feed at this point- COVID-19 is doing literally trillions of dollars of damage to the economy and throwing a few billion around to fund vaccines that aren't absurd bullshiat is a reasonable strategy.

Of course, Trump probably knows nothing about it at all.
 
2020-05-22 12:27:12 AM  

lolmao500: This is just more grift BS


I'm kind of gathering that's the opinion around here.

There are few people who see a clever plan. If it's a clever plan then Fauci must have come up with it.
 
2020-05-22 12:31:20 AM  

fark'emfeed'emfish: LordJiro: Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on

Capitalism is facing its biggest test in a century, and is failing it.

Can you imagine what would happen retrospectively if a leader didn't snap up 300 million doses of a viable vaccine?

This may yet be the greatest year capitalism has ever seen.


This. Also, I don't see any socialist economies pumping out medicines at anywhere near the rate or volume the US does ... honestly, you know all those socialist Democracies buy their drugs from ... those evil capitalist pigs in the USA.

I wonder why they can't develop their own drugs ... mmmm ... maybe the profit motive is stronger than you think?
 
2020-05-22 12:36:32 AM  

SoupGuru: What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.


Azar was on the Sunday shows certainly suggesting that they intend to administer the vaccine regardless of safety or efficacy.

While some public health experts, including Dr. Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, have said it would be at least 12 to 18 months before a vaccine is ready, President Trump and Azar have put forth a more optimistic timeline of January 2021 for the entire U.S. population to begin receiving a vaccine.

"What we're doing is wringing the inefficiency out of the development process to make the development side faster to get to a safe and effective vaccine," Azar said Sunday. "And at the same time, we're going to scale up commercial-sized manufacturing to produce hundreds of millions of doses at risk. They may not pan out. They might not prove to be safe and effective, but we'll have it so we can begin administration right away."
 
2020-05-22 12:37:13 AM  

vudukungfu: Population of USA
328.2 million (2019)


How many of those are Real Americans though?
 
2020-05-22 12:37:24 AM  

DonkeyDixon: Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on

"Proving" anything new in science takes significantly longer than two months. They're sidestepping a lot of research and testing for the sake of "nobody has a better idea"


You're a farking idiot. No one needs to do a damned bit of research or testing to know that this will make AstroZeneca's stock go through the roof

THROUGH! THE! ROOF!

Why do you commies hate capitalism so much?
 
2020-05-22 12:39:07 AM  
How many people are going to take an unproven vaccine?
 
2020-05-22 12:40:53 AM  

Grungehamster: SoupGuru: What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.

Azar was on the Sunday shows certainly suggesting that they intend to administer the vaccine regardless of safety or efficacy.

While some public health experts, including Dr. Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, have said it would be at least 12 to 18 months before a vaccine is ready, President Trump and Azar have put forth a more optimistic timeline of January 2021 for the entire U.S. population to begin receiving a vaccine.

"What we're doing is wringing the inefficiency out of the development process to make the development side faster to get to a safe and effective vaccine," Azar said Sunday. "And at the same time, we're going to scale up commercial-sized manufacturing to produce hundreds of millions of doses at risk. They may not pan out. They might not prove to be safe and effective, but we'll have it so we can begin administration right away."


I don't think there's what they're saying. They're saying they're scaling up production now, so they can be ready to administer it as soon as it's proven safe and effective instead of having to wait for production after testing is done. It might not pan out and then they're out the money, but it's a risk they have to take to shorten the timeline.

I'll grant you that last sentence is poorly worded, but the intention is clear to me from the context.
 
2020-05-22 12:42:05 AM  

tinyarena: I asked a Nero pathologist I know
She said she wouldn't take any new vaccine for several years
She said there has been no "break through" in testing vaccines to know they are safe
It still takes years, so yeah, I'll wait


There's no sharp line between "safe" and "unsafe". It will be stuff like a 0.3% chance of mild side effect A, a 0.001% chance of serious side effect B, a warning to avoid the vaccination if you're taking immunosuppressive drug XYZ, etc. Those will be discovered progressively as time goes on and as an increasing number of people receive the vaccination. At some point you (both at the government level and individually) have to weigh those risks against the danger from the disease itself, which is significant in the case of COVID-19. Even if it doesn't kill you it can damage your organs and/or put you through a few weeks of hell in the ICU.

Feel free to wait a while (the second mouse does get the cheese, after all) but don't hold out for absolute safety.
 
2020-05-22 12:44:09 AM  
"Hey, you think you can make a vaccine that works?"
'Who knows?'
"It is *possible* it might work?"
'Beats me.'
"Good enough. Here's a billion dollars."
'Um, ok. But again, it may be completely ineffective.'
"Doesn't matter. People feel safer if you stick them with a needle. All that matters is people go back to work. And if that means injecting them with crap that does nothing but give them a headache, then that's still worth the money. Last time I went golfing, the bar was closed. Not a diet coke in sight. And if it takes a billion dollars of tax payer money to get my diet coke when I golf, then that's a price I'm willing to pay. "
 
2020-05-22 12:45:23 AM  

FarkBucket18: fark'emfeed'emfish: LordJiro: Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on

Capitalism is facing its biggest test in a century, and is failing it.

Can you imagine what would happen retrospectively if a leader didn't snap up 300 million doses of a viable vaccine?

This may yet be the greatest year capitalism has ever seen.

This. Also, I don't see any socialist economies pumping out medicines at anywhere near the rate or volume the US does ... honestly, you know all those socialist Democracies buy their drugs from ... those evil capitalist pigs in the USA.

I wonder why they can't develop their own drugs ... mmmm ... maybe the profit motive is stronger than you think?


I know.  Just look at this vaccine, developed by Astra Zeneca, a United States Kingdom company

Or the one that Pfizer is making buying from a German company

And of course, there's a *very* good chance the dozens of Chinese efforts to develop a vaccine will end up successful before anything from the US

The US does a lot of drug research, yes, but if you think we're hugely far ahead of the rest of the world you're nuts.  At this point it's so integrated and international deciding who is responsible for anything is impossible

Take a recently developed vaccine, Gardasil.  It's Merck product, and yes, they did the clinical trials.  But it was initially developed by Australian researchers before they partnered with folks at Georgetown University to further develop it.
 
2020-05-22 12:57:30 AM  

Grungehamster: SoupGuru: What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.

Azar was on the Sunday shows certainly suggesting that they intend to administer the vaccine regardless of safety or efficacy.

While some public health experts, including Dr. Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, have said it would be at least 12 to 18 months before a vaccine is ready, President Trump and Azar have put forth a more optimistic timeline of January 2021 for the entire U.S. population to begin receiving a vaccine.

"What we're doing is wringing the inefficiency out of the development process to make the development side faster to get to a safe and effective vaccine," Azar said Sunday. "And at the same time, we're going to scale up commercial-sized manufacturing to produce hundreds of millions of doses at risk. They may not pan out. They might not prove to be safe and effective, but we'll have it so we can begin administration right away."


Ok, that is farked if true.
 
zez
2020-05-22 12:57:55 AM  
Isn't this what Bill Gates is doing, or is it the same groups but they don't want to explain that to the anti-Gates crowd.  I thought he was throwing money at different groups and building labs to see who could come up with the smallest microchip possible
 
2020-05-22 12:58:44 AM  

tinyarena: I asked a Nero pathologist I know
She said she wouldn't take any new vaccine for several years
She said there has been no "break through" in testing vaccines to know they are safe
It still takes years, so yeah, I'll wait


The fastest vaccine yet developed was for mumps. It took 4 years.
 
2020-05-22 12:58:59 AM  

Grungehamster: SoupGuru: What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.

Azar was on the Sunday shows certainly suggesting that they intend to administer the vaccine regardless of safety or efficacy.

While some public health experts, including Dr. Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, have said it would be at least 12 to 18 months before a vaccine is ready, President Trump and Azar have put forth a more optimistic timeline of January 2021 for the entire U.S. population to begin receiving a vaccine.

"What we're doing is wringing the inefficiency out of the development process to make the development side faster to get to a safe and effective vaccine," Azar said Sunday. "And at the same time, we're going to scale up commercial-sized manufacturing to produce hundreds of millions of doses at risk. They may not pan out. They might not prove to be safe and effective, but we'll have it so we can begin administration right away."


I doubt he meant that the way you read it. It seems implied that we "can begin administration right away [upon finding out it is safe and effective]"  They are buying it so we'll have it manufactured if it works, not so we can administer it regardless.
 
2020-05-22 12:59:39 AM  

Bowen: Ivo Shandor: That actually sounds reasonable, for once. This is one of the leading vaccine candidates. 300 million doses is enough to treat a large chunk* of the US population but it also lets the rest of the world have access to the first batch. Maybe this vaccine will be a dud but there are worse ways that the government could spend $1.2 billion.

* Fraction TBD as we don't yet know whether it will take more than one dose per person for the vaccine to be effective

Yeah, it's pretty cheap insurance. Toss $10B at 5 different vaccines. If one works and you manage to get it produced at scale a year earlier - that's the best $10B you could spend. The damage to the economy over the course of a year is incredible.


The US GDP is over 20,000 billion a year -- and every week these shutdowns continue, countless billions of economic activity are lost. It's a smart move to hedge your bets and invest billions into multiple different vaccines in development for front-row seats to re-open your economy, even if only one of them pays off in the end.
 
2020-05-22 1:00:56 AM  

SoupGuru: What happens when the vaccine turns out to be shiat? Do we get our money back?

Oh right, Trump will force us to take it anyway, damn the side effects.


Um, dude, this is how it has to happen.  EVERY potential vaccine that has a glimmer of hope is going to have to be mass produced before it's completed clinical trials so that it will be available immediately if it happens to be The One.  Billions and billions of doses of potential vaccines that don't make the cut will be dumped.  If they wait until a vaccine is proven before beginning mass production, it will become a class war once one makes the cut.  And, yes, they better farking pay for it.
 
2020-05-22 1:04:15 AM  

LordJiro: Bennie Crabtree: Paragraph 2: While not proven to be effective against the coronavirus, vaccines are seen by world leaders as the only real way to restart their stalled economies, and even to get an edge over global competitors.

What
the
actual
fark
is
going
on

Capitalism is facing its biggest test in a century, and is failing it.


Meanwhile in communist Vietnam a positive Coronavirus test means you and possibly those you've been around get involuntary detained in sparse detention facilities for two weeks. You want to see your grandma carted off by the state?
 
2020-05-22 1:07:16 AM  

mikalmd: $1.2 Billion for an unproven drug and we get $1200 .. Sounds about right ..


Yeah, so it would have better if you got $1,203.63 and no funding went toward a potential solution?
 
2020-05-22 1:10:49 AM  

MythDragon: "Hey, you think you can make a vaccine that works?"
'Who knows?'
"It is *possible* it might work?"
'Beats me.'
"Good enough. Here's a billion dollars."
'Um, ok. But again, it may be completely ineffective.'
"Doesn't matter. People feel safer if you stick them with a needle. All that matters is people go back to work. And if that means injecting them with crap that does nothing but give them a headache, then that's still worth the money. Last time I went golfing, the bar was closed. Not a diet coke in sight. And if it takes a billion dollars of tax payer money to get my diet coke when I golf, then that's a price I'm willing to pay. "


"Hey, you think you can make a vaccine that works?"

"We think so. We have an existing framework to deliver viral proteins using a modified adenovirus vector. Although this one is novel it does share some aspects with previous coronaviruses like SARS and MERS, and we have full genetic sequences for all of its structural and non-structural proteins. Early experiments in cell culture and lab animals haven't hit any major roadblocks yet."

"It is *possible* it might work?"

"Well yes, the principles of vaccination in general are well established. It's down to details like picking the right bits of protein to induce a strong and durable immune response, without accidentally enhancing the disease severity by causing the virus to infect the patient's own white blood cells or something. It's also possible that it might only be partially effective, protecting that patient from severe symptoms but not providing full 'sterilizing immunity' to stop them from spreading the virus to others".

The Manhattan Project spent a lot of money to develop two different types of atomic bomb in parallel (one using highly enriched uranium, the other creating plutonium to be compressed in a spherical implosion). They didn't know up front whether either one would be successful, but the potential benefit was important enough to justify the extra expense. This principle also applies to early funding of multiple vaccine projects.
 
2020-05-22 1:11:08 AM  

jjwars1: How many people are going to take an unproven vaccine?


Considering how many aren't taking or giving their kids vaccines with decades of proven efficacy and safety...
 
2020-05-22 1:15:07 AM  
Lol, like the 300 million doses (if they even work) will go to Americans. They'll be auctioned off to the biggest bidder and be given to the wealthy, elite, and whichever country coughs up the money to Jared first. The rest of us can die for all they care.
 
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