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(My Fox 8 Greensboro)   People are having 'COVID-19 parties' to build up immunity. Stupid, Asinine and Facepalm tags all on ventilators, Dumbass tag in ICU   (myfox8.com) divider line
    More: Murica, Infection, Existential quantification, deadly virus, Monday, health expert FOX8, Immunity, Immune system, Universal quantification  
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2491 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 May 2020 at 10:20 AM (7 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-05-19 11:56:20 AM  

corn-bread: I wondered how long before chicken pox thinking would be applied to Covid-19.  The old ways were not always the best.


Like bringing a knife to a gunfight.
 
2020-05-19 11:56:53 AM  

middlewaytao: Coronavirus survivors banned from joining the military

"During the medical history interview or examination, a history of COVID-19, confirmed by either a laboratory test or a clinician diagnosis, is permanently disqualifying ..."


Makes sense.  Catching a disease means there is a decent chance of it remaining in a person even after the person feels well, like Typhoid Mary.
 
2020-05-19 11:57:41 AM  

Tommy Moo: Their model was to protect the old and sick and allow the young and healthy to do exactly what this article is talking about.have a health system that was adequate enough for the spike in infections, unlike New York City, Lombardy, Wuhan, and various other places that were overwhelmed because they were underprepared and/or underresourced.


ftfy
 
2020-05-19 11:58:06 AM  

xanadian: AnEasyTarget: There is no science on prior infected being able to transmit the virus. Yes you may have the antibodies and may be immune but we don't if you can also be a transmitter.

Therefore you may be intentionally harming others. There hasn't been enough time to research these things.

/ I blame lack of scientific knowledge.

I blame antipathy towards scientific knowledge.


Antipathy? Try outright hostility because you can use science to show that profitable business practices with large externalities are bad. The GOP has become the party of plutocracy and so anything that might harm businessmen's interests is now the enemy.
 
2020-05-19 11:58:42 AM  

falkone32: While this would probably "work", the fact remains that getting infected so that you don't get infected kind of defeats the purpose.


It's usually right wingers doing this--you know, the kind of people who think if the government takes in less revenue it will take in more revenue.
 
2020-05-19 11:58:46 AM  

jso2897: corn-bread: I wondered how long before chicken pox thinking would be applied to Covid-19.  The old ways were not always the best.

Like bringing a knife to a gunfight.


More like bringing a grenade to a chess tournament.  Because waiting it out, taking safe hygiene precautions, and not getting sick until a vaccine is available is worlds better than rolling the dice and hoping the virus does not cause death or permanent organ damage.
 
2020-05-19 11:59:50 AM  

huntercr: Tommy Moo: [...]. Does anyone else remember their parents bringing them to chicken pox parties when they were kids?

All of the boomers and Gen Xers who will be getting shingles later in life remember the chicken pox parties


Shingrix. Learn it. Love it. Get the shots.
 
2020-05-19 12:02:12 PM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: falkone32: While this would probably "work", the fact remains that getting infected so that you don't get infected kind of defeats the purpose.

It's usually right wingers doing this--you know, the kind of people who think if the government takes in less revenue it will take in more revenue.


It's the sort of idiots who say "we're all going to get HIV anyway, so I might as well stick that random needle that I found in the park into my arm".  It's a stupid, fatalist belief that everybody will have COVID-19, because the people who create conservative talking points have no understanding of viruses or diseases.
 
2020-05-19 12:06:40 PM  
"I know! Lets get Old Frida to give them immunity from The Corrola!

vignette.wikia.nocookie.netView Full Size
 
2020-05-19 12:13:06 PM  

RussianPotato: After that they'll have some form of immunity, which is our only hope at the moment.


Citation needed.
 
2020-05-19 12:16:23 PM  

FormlessOne: Because of assholes like those having "COVID-19 parties," the measures and hardship we've gone through for the last three months is largely wasted. I'm going to have to stay home for months past this, because assholes couldn't stay home when they were asked.


We're like an entire first grade class that keeps getting denied recess because That One Kid can't or won't follow directions.
 
2020-05-19 12:19:05 PM  

geekbikerskum: FormlessOne: Because of assholes like those having "COVID-19 parties," the measures and hardship we've gone through for the last three months is largely wasted. I'm going to have to stay home for months past this, because assholes couldn't stay home when they were asked.

We're like an entire first grade class that keeps getting denied recess because That One Kid can't or won't follow directions.


Makes you wanna use blankets to hold down a few state governors, then let the rest of the states beat them with bars of soap in towels, a la Full Metal Jacket (NSFW).
 
2020-05-19 12:22:52 PM  

middlewaytao: Coronavirus survivors banned from joining the military

"During the medical history interview or examination, a history of COVID-19, confirmed by either a laboratory test or a clinician diagnosis, is permanently disqualifying ..."


Long-term or permanent organ damage is a concern with COVID-19 survivors.
 
2020-05-19 12:28:07 PM  

rebelyell2006: Well, I can see you are misusing the phrase "herd immunity", so it is safe to conclude that you have no idea what you are talking about.


No I'm not. You don't have to get to the point of not a single person ever contracting the disease again to see benefits from herd immunity. You are obtuse as all hell.
 
2020-05-19 12:31:14 PM  

falkone32: While this would probably "work", the fact remains that getting infected so that you don't get infected kind of defeats the purpose. There is a decent chance that getting sick with this will require hospitalization to save your life . The virus spreads just fine on its own and doesn't need extra help. Not to mention Im pretty sure these people will end up spreading the virus to others.


The idea is that if you get infected in an uncontrolled fashion, from someone sneezing in your face, you might get much, MUCH sicker than if you just kind of hang around someone infected and breath the same air they are breathing for a few minutes. But the latter might give you enough immunity to fight off infection from the former should it happen later on.

It's risky, for sure. Very difficult to control. "Do I need to stay in the room for five minutes or ten? What's the minimum number of minutes in order to get antibodies? How many minutes until I might start to get sick?" We just don't know these things. But you are taking a risk either way.
 
2020-05-19 12:31:47 PM  

Tommy Moo: rebelyell2006: Well, I can see you are misusing the phrase "herd immunity", so it is safe to conclude that you have no idea what you are talking about.

No I'm not. You don't have to get to the point of not a single person ever contracting the disease again to see benefits from herd immunity. You are obtuse as all hell.


I'm not the one misusing "herd immunity", it's you.  You know nothing about viruses and contagious diseases.  And you seem to have little understanding of COVID-19 and how bodies react to viruses, and what happens to bodies after they fight off viruses.
 
2020-05-19 12:33:33 PM  

Tommy Moo: falkone32: While this would probably "work", the fact remains that getting infected so that you don't get infected kind of defeats the purpose. There is a decent chance that getting sick with this will require hospitalization to save your life . The virus spreads just fine on its own and doesn't need extra help. Not to mention Im pretty sure these people will end up spreading the virus to others.

The idea is that if you get infected in an uncontrolled fashion, from someone sneezing in your face, you might get much, MUCH sicker than if you just kind of hang around someone infected and breath the same air they are breathing for a few minutes. But the latter might give you enough immunity to fight off infection from the former should it happen later on.

It's risky, for sure. Very difficult to control. "Do I need to stay in the room for five minutes or ten? What's the minimum number of minutes in order to get antibodies? How many minutes until I might start to get sick?" We just don't know these things. But you are taking a risk either way.


Viruses replicate as they infest host organisms.  It isn't radiation, where limiting exposure can limit damage.  You should step back and think about the stupid things you are posting.
 
2020-05-19 12:37:14 PM  
Plus COVID-19 parties create the risk of asymptomatic spreaders, like Typhoid Mary, infecting others while not getting sick.
 
2020-05-19 12:39:06 PM  
Did anyone see this? I think six or seven million dead means trying this path to herd immunity is beyond stupid. The math is done for you and you get to set your own variables. Give it a shot. You can tell a Republican they haven't done their math homework.
 
2020-05-19 12:40:38 PM  

Huggermugger: Yeah, that reminds me of the time that Empress Maria Theresa visited the coffin of her daughter-in-law who had just died of smallpox, and forced several of her daughters to accompany her.  And then some of the daughters caught smallpox from that exposure, and some of them died, and some of them lived but were so facially disfigured from the pox that no one would marry them.


Not that anyone cares or will even read this 6 miles down the thread from the original comment, but....

She only forced one daughter to accompany her, Archduchess Maria Josepha.  She developed the rash 2 days later.  While Maria Theresa blamed herself the rest of her life for her daughters death, it was only because she did not know about the incubation period of smallpox.  Maria Josepha would have been exposed to the virus well before her visit to the crypt.

I know nothing of other daughters having smallpox.
 
2020-05-19 12:41:59 PM  
The worst part about this is that these farkwits drive, vote and reproduce. We would all be better off if they did none of those.
The best part about this is that they are almost as physically far away from me in the US as possible.

Go die on your own, you farking morons!
 
2020-05-19 12:43:52 PM  

rebelyell2006: middlewaytao: Coronavirus survivors banned from joining the military

"During the medical history interview or examination, a history of COVID-19, confirmed by either a laboratory test or a clinician diagnosis, is permanently disqualifying ..."

Makes sense.  Catching a disease means there is a decent chance of it remaining in a person even after the person feels well, like Typhoid Mary.


i'm pretty sure it's because they fear permanent lung/heart/other systems damage that could appear years after the infection, and the first symptom may be dropping dead at your post. not good for a critical soldier position.

not some kind of "beware the life-long super-spreader" hyper-cautionary approach.
 
2020-05-19 12:43:55 PM  
I'm guessing none of these people ever got the flu more than once.
 
2020-05-19 12:46:23 PM  

rebelyell2006: Tommy Moo: rebelyell2006: Well, I can see you are misusing the phrase "herd immunity", so it is safe to conclude that you have no idea what you are talking about.

No I'm not. You don't have to get to the point of not a single person ever contracting the disease again to see benefits from herd immunity. You are obtuse as all hell.

I'm not the one misusing "herd immunity", it's you.  You know nothing about viruses and contagious diseases.  And you seem to have little understanding of COVID-19 and how bodies react to viruses, and what happens to bodies after they fight off viruses.


He's a moronic GamerGater, which makes his being a total idiot about most other things not as surprising.
 
2020-05-19 12:49:54 PM  

Tommy Moo: rebelyell2006: No, just an older idiot with no understanding of how viruses work. Look at his reference to chicken pox parties.

AKA literally a virus. I'm here providing sources and historical citations. What's your f_c%king plan, to sit home jacking off for months and then catch the virus in the fall when someone coughs in your face? This isn't going away just because we "sheltered in place" for a few months. It's going to be there, waiting for you, when you emerge. And you will emerge someday.


Someone ran out of lotion long ago and now is miserable with a severe case of callouses.

Look, Mr It's-just-the-flu... your state absolutely botched the handling of C-19 and were stacking bodies like cord wood for weeks, more than a thousand a day, and you want to go out and party like it is No-Covid-1999.
All I can say is knock yourself out champ, you obviously know far better than the professionals...

Can I have your stuff?
 
2020-05-19 12:52:35 PM  

SoundOfOneHandWanking: I'm guessing none of these people ever got the flu more than once.


It's only "just like the flu" when it convenient for it to be.
 
2020-05-19 12:55:13 PM  

jso2897: The idea that "everybody's gonig to get it" is sub-stupid.
yakmans_dad: I went to a bar in Germany that was down in some second basement. Until your comment, that was the lowest bar I'd ever seen.


How so? Am I wrong? Can you prove it?
Protip: You can't.


Well, our exchange is already jam-packed with cliches, so I'll just say that a demand for proof wasn't part of my criticism.
 
2020-05-19 1:02:00 PM  

rebelyell2006: Tommy Moo: falkone32: While this would probably "work", the fact remains that getting infected so that you don't get infected kind of defeats the purpose. There is a decent chance that getting sick with this will require hospitalization to save your life . The virus spreads just fine on its own and doesn't need extra help. Not to mention Im pretty sure these people will end up spreading the virus to others.

The idea is that if you get infected in an uncontrolled fashion, from someone sneezing in your face, you might get much, MUCH sicker than if you just kind of hang around someone infected and breath the same air they are breathing for a few minutes. But the latter might give you enough immunity to fight off infection from the former should it happen later on.

It's risky, for sure. Very difficult to control. "Do I need to stay in the room for five minutes or ten? What's the minimum number of minutes in order to get antibodies? How many minutes until I might start to get sick?" We just don't know these things. But you are taking a risk either way.

Viruses replicate as they infest host organisms.  It isn't radiation, where limiting exposure can limit damage.  You should step back and think about the stupid things you are posting.


Angrily repeating yourself doesn't make you right, you arrogant warthog. Read this:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/op​i​nion/coronavirus-viral-dose.html

For over a century controlling viral load was exactly how we inoculated people against disease. You are just plain wrong and I'm done arguing with you about it.
 
2020-05-19 1:02:55 PM  

ValisIV: rebelyell2006: Tommy Moo: rebelyell2006: Well, I can see you are misusing the phrase "herd immunity", so it is safe to conclude that you have no idea what you are talking about.

No I'm not. You don't have to get to the point of not a single person ever contracting the disease again to see benefits from herd immunity. You are obtuse as all hell.

I'm not the one misusing "herd immunity", it's you.  You know nothing about viruses and contagious diseases.  And you seem to have little understanding of COVID-19 and how bodies react to viruses, and what happens to bodies after they fight off viruses.

He's a moronic GamerGater, which makes his being a total idiot about most other things not as surprising.


Where the fark do you get that idea from? I haven't even heard the term GamerGater in years. I barely even play video games.
 
2020-05-19 1:06:35 PM  

huntercr: Tommy Moo: [...]. Does anyone else remember their parents bringing them to chicken pox parties when they were kids?

All of the boomers and Gen Xers who will be getting shingles later in life remember the chicken pox parties


Well there wasn't a vaccine, so chicken pox parties were a net good. Getting chicken pox as a six year old is infinitely preferable to catching it as an adult. It's not like people sat around and said "You know what would be fun? Making my children miserable for a two to three week period."

I got it in 1977, along with every single other kid on my street. I think my parents were relieved, like it was another thing they could cross off the checklist.
 
2020-05-19 1:07:52 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-05-19 1:10:49 PM  

Tommy Moo: rebelyell2006: Tommy Moo: falkone32: While this would probably "work", the fact remains that getting infected so that you don't get infected kind of defeats the purpose. There is a decent chance that getting sick with this will require hospitalization to save your life . The virus spreads just fine on its own and doesn't need extra help. Not to mention Im pretty sure these people will end up spreading the virus to others.

The idea is that if you get infected in an uncontrolled fashion, from someone sneezing in your face, you might get much, MUCH sicker than if you just kind of hang around someone infected and breath the same air they are breathing for a few minutes. But the latter might give you enough immunity to fight off infection from the former should it happen later on.

It's risky, for sure. Very difficult to control. "Do I need to stay in the room for five minutes or ten? What's the minimum number of minutes in order to get antibodies? How many minutes until I might start to get sick?" We just don't know these things. But you are taking a risk either way.

Viruses replicate as they infest host organisms.  It isn't radiation, where limiting exposure can limit damage.  You should step back and think about the stupid things you are posting.

Angrily repeating yourself doesn't make you right, you arrogant warthog. Read this:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/opi​nion/coronavirus-viral-dose.html

For over a century controlling viral load was exactly how we inoculated people against disease. You are just plain wrong and I'm done arguing with you about it.


I'm glad you are walking away and giving up, because you know nothing about the topic at hand and linking to an opinion article on the New York Times is not a magic spell that automatically makes you right.  If you can't see reason, then shutting up is the next best thing.
 
2020-05-19 1:16:01 PM  
It appears that people being diagnosed as being reinfected are actually false positives and cannot make others sick.

See: https://www.livescience.com/coro​naviru​s-reinfections-were-false-positives.ht​ml
 
2020-05-19 1:21:13 PM  
eddie_irvine:

Except the fact that scientists aren't certain that that having Covid antibodies make you immune. There is some evidence to the contrary, that several people who have tested positive again after having had Covid. Covid parties are a bad idea.


There is some evidence to the contrary - That's what they should have named this virus.
 
2020-05-19 1:29:54 PM  
i.redd.itView Full Size
 
2020-05-19 1:33:55 PM  

Psychopusher: I wonder how many of them will die from this? Death is the ultimate immunity, after all.


some will, some won't
 
2020-05-19 1:41:59 PM  

jso2897: corn-bread: I wondered how long before chicken pox thinking would be applied to Covid-19.  The old ways were not always the best.

Like bringing a knife to a gunfight.


knife in hand beats a gun in the holster
 
2020-05-19 1:46:38 PM  

xanadian: Just as long as they stay faaaaaaaar away from me (and the rest of us sane folk) and isolate amongst each other, we can just let Darwin sort this out.


But those that survive with permanent disability will be on us to support.
 
2020-05-19 2:17:26 PM  

nanim: That gov apparently needs to give them concrete examples - show how the 'Smith family birthday party ended up w/ Grandma Smith dead 14 days later'.


Ok, we've got that in New Jersey.

"Four people in the same family have died from coronavirus in the US state of New Jersey, with three more relatives in hospital.

Grace Fusco, 73, and six of her adult children fell ill after attending a large family gathering.
...
New Jersey health officials said Ms Fusco-Jackson was the second person to die from Covid-19 in the state, and the first fatality had also recently attended a Fusco family gathering.

Carmine Fusco died on Wednesday [March 18], followed hours later by his mother, Grace Fusco."
 
2020-05-19 2:17:51 PM  

AnEasyTarget: There is no science on prior infected being able to transmit the virus. Yes you may have the antibodies and may be immune but we don't if you can also be a transmitter.

Therefore you may be intentionally harming others. There hasn't been enough time to research these things.

/ I blame lack of scientific knowledge.


I have no specific scientific knowledge, but im not a complete dumbass. The ways some people react to this mess confounds me.
 
2020-05-19 2:26:49 PM  

Tommy Moo: eddie_irvine: Except the fact that scientists aren't certain that that having Covid antibodies make you immune. There is some evidence to the contrary, that several people who have tested positive again after having had Covid. Covid parties are a bad idea.

If COVID antibodies didn't confer immunity, there would be literally thousands of documented cases of people getting the virus twice. There have been, at most, a few anecdotes, with several of them possibly being due to false positive tests. There is no way that SARS-COV-2 is suddenly the first magical virus in our billion year history with viruses to not engender any immunity from future infections.


Sweden says the same thing.  They have no reinfection cases.
 
2020-05-19 2:30:12 PM  

yakmans_dad: jso2897: The idea that "everybody's gonig to get it" is sub-stupid.
yakmans_dad: I went to a bar in Germany that was down in some second basement. Until your comment, that was the lowest bar I'd ever seen.


How so? Am I wrong? Can you prove it?
Protip: You can't.

Well, our exchange is already jam-packed with cliches, so I'll just say that a demand for proof wasn't part of my criticism.


Was anything? It was just a baseless slur, with no informational content.
 
2020-05-19 2:30:23 PM  

Tommy Moo: They intentionally exposed people to levels of the virus that the body could fight off.


One hole here... both smallpox and cowpox - the other virus that humans had already been in contact with since they domesticated livestock - had already been with people for a long, long, long time. Cowpox was also the less lethal form that humans were inoculated with that stimulated their antibody response. It was just a serendipitous happenstance that the human body's reaction to the cowpox virus was close enough to also ward off smallpox.

This is a NOVELVIRUS. Know what means? Means "humans have never seen anything like this before". There is no known analogue that can stimulate the human immune response for this or has in the past. There is no "close enough" as there was for smallpox, just as there was no "close enough" for poliomyelitis. Two vaccines had to be created for that, one with dead viruses and one with weakened viruses. Otherwise there is no immunity. You get polio, you're f'ked.

People will just have to get used to the idea that, like polio, there is no immunity through exposure - as has been shown in our own United States Navy. The only way is through a vaccine, which is being explored, and through controlling physical contact that spreads the virus.

There is no "fight off" with this, and people who purposely expose themselves to it without medical supervision (as in vaccine trials) are f'king morons. There are no easy answers. There are no shortcuts. Life has and will change. Every once in awhile nature just throws sh*t and we have to deal with it.
 
2020-05-19 2:31:06 PM  

zepillin: jso2897: corn-bread: I wondered how long before chicken pox thinking would be applied to Covid-19.  The old ways were not always the best.

Like bringing a knife to a gunfight.

knife in hand beats a gun in the holster


Famous last words.
 
2020-05-19 2:54:33 PM  

rewind2846: Tommy Moo: They intentionally exposed people to levels of the virus that the body could fight off.

One hole here... both smallpox and cowpox - the other virus that humans had already been in contact with since they domesticated livestock - had already been with people for a long, long, long time. Cowpox was also the less lethal form that humans were inoculated with that stimulated their antibody response. It was just a serendipitous happenstance that the human body's reaction to the cowpox virus was close enough to also ward off smallpox.

This is a NOVELVIRUS. Know what means? Means "humans have never seen anything like this before". There is no known analogue that can stimulate the human immune response for this or has in the past. There is no "close enough" as there was for smallpox, just as there was no "close enough" for poliomyelitis. Two vaccines had to be created for that, one with dead viruses and one with weakened viruses. Otherwise there is no immunity. You get polio, you're f'ked.

People will just have to get used to the idea that, like polio, there is no immunity through exposure - as has been shown in our own United States Navy. The only way is through a vaccine, which is being explored, and through controlling physical contact that spreads the virus.

There is no "fight off" with this, and people who purposely expose themselves to it without medical supervision (as in vaccine trials) are f'king morons. There are no easy answers. There are no shortcuts. Life has and will change. Every once in awhile nature just throws sh*t and we have to deal with it.


People who had polio got immunity.  Seriously, you talk of history you know nothing of.  The problem is they also wound up with paralysis for the rest of their lives.
 
2020-05-19 3:01:31 PM  

AnEasyTarget: There is no science on prior infected being able to transmit the virus. Yes you may have the antibodies and may be immune but we don't if you can also be a transmitter.

Therefore you may be intentionally harming others. There hasn't been enough time to research these things.

/ I blame lack of scientific knowledge.


We do know that infected people can be asymptomatic for up to 14 days, while some infected people never develop symptoms all while spreading the disease.  Someone stupid and selfish enough to go to a COVID-19 party is probably not wearing a mask to protect people after getting himself/herself infected.
 
2020-05-19 3:12:33 PM  

RussianPotato: People who had polio got immunity.


"Immunity" in this case is not like the immunity these morons think they will get from intentionally exposing themselves to this virus. You can still get f'ked up.
And my maternal grandfather had polio at the age of 31 in 1960, spent the rest of his life in a wheelchair. He was vaccinated later in his 30s.
 
2020-05-19 3:16:50 PM  

Sean M: NOT prevent people from getting infected.  I'm not sure where people get the idea that the lockdowns were to stop infections.


That's only partly true.  The other purpose of the lockdowns were to reduce the R factor (transmissibility) of the virus to less than 1.  If you can do that for long enough the virus can't find enough new hosts and it dies out.

New Zealand did that, and Germany thinks it's there.  Us USAmericans, though, love haircuts more than life itself.
 
2020-05-19 3:18:58 PM  
So, basically the modern equivalent of chickenpox parties?

/see, back before there was a chickenpox vaccine, parents would basically get their kids together and make sure they were exposed to Chickenpox early, since having it as a kid was far less dangerous than if you had it as an adult.
//DNRTFA/TFT.
 
2020-05-19 3:19:40 PM  

Sean M: FormlessOne: Because of assholes like those having "COVID-19 parties," the measures and hardship we've gone through for the last three months is largely wasted.

I hate to break it to you, but the lockdowns have NOT been effective and were largely a waste.   The whole point of them was to "flatten the curve", a.k.a. make sure the hospitals weren't overwhelmed. NOT prevent people from getting infected.  I'm not sure where people get the idea that the lockdowns were to stop infections.

The mathematical modelling "science" ended up being flat-out wrong.  The hospitals weren't overwhelmed, not even close.  Field hospitals were set up all around the country.  None of them saw actual use.   It was predicted that Florida would need 460,000 hospital beds at the peak.  It saw 2,100 beds used at the peak.

In many (most?) areas, nursing home residents make up about 50% of the deaths.   These people aren't exactly moving around town.  Lockdowns did nothing to protect them.  Even a recent article in a British medical journal, The Lancet, stated as much and properly concludes that the majority of the population will be infected, with lockdown measures not making one fark's worth of difference to the number of deaths.

As far as COVID parties, there isn't any support for that on any grounds at this point.  Is it dangerous?  Not really.  The CFR for seasonal influenza is ~0.0025-0.001.   CFR for COVID seems to be around 0.004-0.00004.  Most epidemiologists would agree that 0.004 is higher than what it really is due to the limited number of tests done so far.   So realistically, the seasonal flu is more deadly.  High CFR #s are common in the initial stages of a pandemic, as all you're testing are symptomatic people, so the true infection rates aren't known.

/yes, I attended medical school.
//yes, I hated the public health/epidemiology courses.   As does just about every other nurse/doctor who went through them.


Please tell me you don't practice medicine.
 
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