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(Newsweek)   The Last Dance will honor Kobe Bryant, the true heir to Jordan's legacy   (newsweek.com) divider line
    More: Cool, Michael Jordan, National Basketball Association, Kobe Bryant, late Kobe Bryant, Shaquille O'Neal, Los Angeles Lakers, Kobe Bryant episode, final season of Michael Jordan  
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179 clicks; posted to Sports » on 04 May 2020 at 5:25 AM (20 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



41 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2020-05-04 6:54:51 AM  
I'm really liking the show, now I'm watching the third episode, I think it's good idea to honor Kobe
 
2020-05-04 6:55:44 AM  
Game of Zones - Bonus Scene: 'MJ on Kobe's Rings'
Youtube SMLnA8_fjcI
 
2020-05-04 7:00:48 AM  
wwwcache.wralsportsfan.comView Full Size
 
2020-05-04 7:29:09 AM  
Tim Duncan has 5 rings that nobody seems to know or care about
 
2020-05-04 7:41:13 AM  
People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.
 
2020-05-04 8:07:25 AM  

natural316: Tim Duncan has 5 rings that nobody seems to know or care about


Hi there.

d219s82bmpe0qh.cloudfront.netView Full Size
 
2020-05-04 8:37:58 AM  
Kobe kinda raped someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Jordan. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Jordan but failed as a human?"
 
2020-05-04 8:46:40 AM  
Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?
 
2020-05-04 8:49:59 AM  

LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?


Wait, what?
 
2020-05-04 9:16:15 AM  

swankywanky: LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?

Wait, what?


It's "MJs gambling led to murder of his father" legend. #2 here https://www.thesportster.com/basketba​l​l/top-11-head-scratching-nba-urban-leg​ends-you-wont-beleive/

Still interesting story with some "funny" things happening
http://graphics.chicagotribune.com/ja​m​es-jordan-murder/index.html
 
2020-05-04 9:23:30 AM  

IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.


Fark user imageView Full Size


You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.
 
2020-05-04 9:35:34 AM  

LewDux: swankywanky: LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?

Wait, what?

It's "MJs gambling led to murder of his father" legend. #2 here https://www.thesportster.com/basketbal​l/top-11-head-scratching-nba-urban-leg​ends-you-wont-beleive/

Still interesting story with some "funny" things happening
http://graphics.chicagotribune.com/jam​es-jordan-murder/index.html


Wow.  You're peddling this bullshiate.  I'm surprised.
 
2020-05-04 9:40:36 AM  

Magnus: LewDux: swankywanky: LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?

Wait, what?

It's "MJs gambling led to murder of his father" legend. #2 here https://www.thesportster.com/basketbal​l/top-11-head-scratching-nba-urban-leg​ends-you-wont-beleive/

Still interesting story with some "funny" things happening
http://graphics.chicagotribune.com/jam​es-jordan-murder/index.html

Wow.  You're peddling this bullshiate.  I'm surprised.


You should be, calling it legend and linking to article that calls it legend is not peddling
 
2020-05-04 9:51:46 AM  

LewDux: Magnus: LewDux: swankywanky: LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?

Wait, what?

It's "MJs gambling led to murder of his father" legend. #2 here https://www.thesportster.com/basketbal​l/top-11-head-scratching-nba-urban-leg​ends-you-wont-beleive/

Still interesting story with some "funny" things happening
http://graphics.chicagotribune.com/jam​es-jordan-murder/index.html

Wow.  You're peddling this bullshiate.  I'm surprised.

You should be, calling it legend and linking to article that calls it legend is not peddling


yes, I am totally surprised at you.
 
2020-05-04 10:02:05 AM  

phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.


Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".
 
2020-05-04 10:07:39 AM  

meanmutton: phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.

Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".


Also he highlighted FGA when Jordan had a higher FG%...
 
2020-05-04 10:17:32 AM  

meanmutton: phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.

Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".


And? You can't just say that people "pretend" that Kobe is one of the best in the league. It's pretty definitive that he is.
 
2020-05-04 10:22:36 AM  

phimuskapsi: And? You can't just say that people "pretend" that Kobe is one of the best in the league. It's pretty definitive that he is.


To be clear, I am not arguing that Kobe is better than Jordan, he isn't.
 
2020-05-04 10:49:24 AM  

LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?


Its almost as if the article you linked showed you to be the fool you are:

"After an investigation it was concluded that two teenagers killed Jordan's father in a random act, with nothing to do with Jordan's gambling, but that hasn't stopped conspiracy theorists... "
 
2020-05-04 11:12:48 AM  

tical: LewDux: Jordan kinda killed someone, which means his name should never be mentioned in the same sentence as Kobe. Except maybe "You know who wanted to be the next Julius Erving but failed as a human?

Its almost as if the article you linked showed you to be the fool you are:

"After an investigation it was concluded that two teenagers killed Jordan's father in a random act, with nothing to do with Jordan's gambling, but that hasn't stopped conspiracy theorists... "


LewDux: legend

LewDux: urban-legends

LewDux: legend

LewDux: urban-legends

/

LewDux: legend

LewDux:
urban-legends
 
2020-05-04 11:15:28 AM  
Jordan, for better or for worse, opened the NBA to a global audience, that largely didn't care that much for the NBA prior to that. Yes there was global attention, but no where near what Jordan opened it up to.

Honestly, if you want to compare anyone to Jordan, based on that alone, you'd have to look to Yao Ming and what he did with the Chinese market and audience ( much to the chagrin of GM's everywhere named Darryl Morey). While basketball was popular there, the NBA wasn't exactly popular, then it exploded.

Kobe was great and one of the greatest, but he didn't change the game. LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Nobody was sipping on a coke and singing that they wana be like Kobe or LBJ. Tho, ill give credit to LBJ, ask anyone who wasn't born in the last 15 or so years who LBJ is, your likely going to get an earful about some old dead white guy.
 
2020-05-04 11:42:24 AM  

brizzle365: Jordan, for better or for worse, opened the NBA to a global audience, that largely didn't care that much for the NBA prior to that. Yes there was global attention, but no where near what Jordan opened it up to.


I blame Rimas Kurtinaitis
https://archive.fiba.com/pages/eng/fa​/​game/p/gid/A/grid/2/rid/918/sid/2942/_​/1988_Olympic_Games_Tournament_for_Men​/statistic.html
 
2020-05-04 11:46:47 AM  

natural316: Tim Duncan has 5 rings that nobody seems to know or care about


Duncan didn't have a personality like Jordan or Kobe.  He did his thing and he was great at it.
 
2020-05-04 11:54:13 AM  

brizzle365: LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.


Well, he sort of did. When he went to the Heat that was sort of the beginning of stacked, loaded, super teams.

Kobe, LBJ are all on the same level of visibility of Jordan as well. They are names known throughout the world for their play and endorsements. They just owe a lot of that to Jordan for really kicking off endorsements for NBA players.
 
2020-05-04 12:04:14 PM  

phimuskapsi: brizzle365: LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Well, he sort of did. When he went to the Heat that was sort of the beginning of stacked, loaded, super teams.



Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-05-04 12:04:42 PM  
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-05-04 12:20:51 PM  

phimuskapsi: brizzle365: LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Well, he sort of did. When he went to the Heat that was sort of the beginning of stacked, loaded, super teams.

Kobe, LBJ are all on the same level of visibility of Jordan as well. They are names known throughout the world for their play and endorsements. They just owe a lot of that to Jordan for really kicking off endorsements for NBA players.


The reason that they have that kind of global recognition, is because of Jordan, no in spite of him. He laid the groundwork for those guys to be able to reach a global market.

phimuskapsi: brizzle365: LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Well, he sort of did. When he went to the Heat that was sort of the beginning of stacked, loaded, super teams.

Kobe, LBJ are all on the same level of visibility of Jordan as well. They are names known throughout the world for their play and endorsements. They just owe a lot of that to Jordan for really kicking off endorsements for NBA players.


That's debatable.
 
2020-05-04 2:15:29 PM  

natural316: Tim Duncan has 5 rings that nobody seems to know or care about


Yeah, flopping your way to a title or five kinda does that to one's legacy.
 
2020-05-04 2:28:36 PM  

brizzle365: Jordan, for better or for worse, opened the NBA to a global audience, that largely didn't care that much for the NBA prior to that. Yes there was global attention, but no where near what Jordan opened it up to.

Honestly, if you want to compare anyone to Jordan, based on that alone, you'd have to look to Yao Ming and what he did with the Chinese market and audience ( much to the chagrin of GM's everywhere named Darryl Morey). While basketball was popular there, the NBA wasn't exactly popular, then it exploded.

Kobe was great and one of the greatest, but he didn't change the game. LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Nobody was sipping on a coke and singing that they wana be like Kobe or LBJ. Tho, ill give credit to LBJ, ask anyone who wasn't born in the last 15 or so years who LBJ is, your likely going to get an earful about some old dead white guy.


Lebron's initials aren't "LBJ", they're simply "LJ". "Lebron" is one word. So, yeah... no "LBJ" confusion.
 
2020-05-04 2:50:07 PM  

darch: brizzle365: Jordan, for better or for worse, opened the NBA to a global audience, that largely didn't care that much for the NBA prior to that. Yes there was global attention, but no where near what Jordan opened it up to.

Honestly, if you want to compare anyone to Jordan, based on that alone, you'd have to look to Yao Ming and what he did with the Chinese market and audience ( much to the chagrin of GM's everywhere named Darryl Morey). While basketball was popular there, the NBA wasn't exactly popular, then it exploded.

Kobe was great and one of the greatest, but he didn't change the game. LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Nobody was sipping on a coke and singing that they wana be like Kobe or LBJ. Tho, ill give credit to LBJ, ask anyone who wasn't born in the last 15 or so years who LBJ is, your likely going to get an earful about some old dead white guy.

LebBron's initials aren't "LBJ", they're simply "LJ". "Lebron" is one word. So, yeah... no "LBJ" confusion.


You are incorrect. Its ok to be wrong once in a while, its what you do after that matters lol
 
2020-05-04 3:19:06 PM  

phimuskapsi: brizzle365: LBJ is great and in the conversation as one of the greatest, but he also did not change the game.

Well, he sort of did. When he went to the Heat that was sort of the beginning of stacked, loaded, super teams.

Kobe, LBJ are all on the same level of visibility of Jordan as well. They are names known throughout the world for their play and endorsements. They just owe a lot of that to Jordan for really kicking off endorsements for NBA players.


Lol @ "it was the beginning of..."

Every multi-championship team has been a "super team", either from excellent drafting or acquiring free agents. Luckily for Mike, he came up in an era where people didn't have to listen to superstar players on player acquisition, because if he had, he probably wouldn't have won any championships (he wouldn't have had Scottie, Grant, Kukoc, etc).

The '60s Celtics and Lakers were superteams. The '70s didn't really have one, but the ABA kinda messed shiat up back then.

The 80s Lakers and Celtics were superteams. The Bulls were a superteam, with 3+ Hall of Famers for every title. The Shaq/Kobe Lakers were a superteam. The Spurs? Superteam. The Rockets, you could say that since they acquired Drexler for '95, were a superteam that year.

You wanna go with teams that were all about FA? The Celtics were a superteam (the ones that inspired the Heat to be what they became). The Lakers were kind of a superteam.

Anyone who thinks LeBron invented forming a good team with multiple stars doesn't know even a rudimentary history of the NBA.
 
2020-05-04 3:25:09 PM  

phimuskapsi: meanmutton: phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.

Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".

And? You can't just say that people "pretend" that Kobe is one of the best in the league. It's pretty definitive that he is.


He's one of the top 50 or so, maybe. He's not a top 10 player, though. People pretend like he's in the conversation with Jordan and LeBron.

You could easily make the case that he's not in the Top 5 Lakers of all time.

/And if you count non-Laker careers, it's not even debatable, he's barely a top 10 Laker.
//Kareem, Magic, Wilt, LeBron, Malone, Shaq, West...he's only arguable top-5 if you're only counting Laker careers (and therefore leave out LeBron and Malone, for sure).
///all I'm saying here is that holy sh*t, the Lakers' all-time team is a killer
 
2020-05-04 3:47:49 PM  

IAmRight: He's one of the top 50 or so, maybe. He's not a top 10 player, though. People pretend like he's in the conversation with Jordan and LeBron.


As I showed you above, he's literally 4th in the league in points, So you can take this comment:

IAmRight: Anyone who thinks LeBron invented forming a good team with multiple stars doesn't know even a rudimentary history of the NBA.


And shove it right up your ass.

It's not just the formation of super teams, but how they are formed. The players suddenly had a lot more control over where they wanted to go and what offers they would accept in order to construct the teams. Back then most of the 'supers' came from some blind luck, even for the Bulls.

Using the Bulls as an example:
- Jordan was the #3 pick (should have been #2)
- Rodman was a risky trade from the Spurs
- Pippen was drafted by Seatle and traded to Chicago the same day

In fact a lot of the players on that magical Bulls run were there through a network of trades and teams. They just all happened to be there at the same time. There was no guarantee to any of it.
 
2020-05-04 3:50:58 PM  

IAmRight: phimuskapsi: meanmutton: phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.

Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".

And? You can't just say that people "pretend" that Kobe is one of the best in the league. It's pretty definitive that he is.

He's one of the top 50 or so, maybe. He's not a top 10 player, though. People pretend like he's in the conversation with Jordan and LeBron.

You could easily make the case that he's not in the Top 5 Lakers of all time.

/And if you count non-Laker careers, it's not even debatable, he's barely a top 10 Laker.
//Kareem, Magic, Wilt, LeBron, Malone, Shaq, West...he's only arguable top-5 if you're only counting Laker careers (and therefore leave out LeBron and Malone, for sure).
///all I'm saying here is that holy sh*t, the Lakers' all-time team is a killer


Wait, so your telling me that lbj belongs as an all time great in the NBA, and top 10 for the Lakers, but Kobe isn't even on your radar?
At this stage of their careers with the Lakers, Lonzo Ball and LBJ would be virtually tied as a top Laker, neither has nor will bring a ring to the Lakers. And I rank about as high as Lonzo, on the Lakers all-time greats list.

Ok, thats a bit hyperbolic, but you are insane if you think Kobe doesn't rank higer than lbj as a top Laker.

not being a rapist? OK LBJ ranks higher than Kobe, so far.

Malone...really? WTF are you thinking?
 
2020-05-04 4:04:31 PM  
Trigger warning: advanced stats
Laker leaders by career win shares
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-05-04 4:05:04 PM  
from https://www.basketball-reference.com/t​eams/LAL/
 
2020-05-04 7:39:55 PM  

brizzle365: IAmRight: phimuskapsi: meanmutton: phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.

Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".

And? You can't just say that people "pretend" that Kobe is one of the best in the league. It's pretty definitive that he is.

He's one of the top 50 or so, maybe. He's not a top 10 player, though. People pretend like he's in the conversation with Jordan and LeBron.

You could easily make the case that he's not in the Top 5 Lakers of all time.

/And if you count non-Laker careers, it's not even debatable, he's barely a top 10 Laker.
//Kareem, Magic, Wilt, LeBron, Malone, Shaq, West...he's only arguable top-5 if you're only counting Laker careers (and therefore leave out LeBron and Malone, for sure).
///all I'm saying here is that holy sh*t, the Lakers' all-time team is a killer

Wait, so your telling me that lbj belongs as an all time great in the NBA, and top 10 for the Lakers, but Kobe isn't even on your radar?
At this stage of their careers with the Lakers, Lonzo Ball and LBJ would be virtually tied as a top Laker, neither has nor will bring a ring to the Lakers. And I rank about as high as Lonzo, on the Lakers all-time greats list.

Ok, thats a bit hyperbolic, but you are insane if you think Kobe doesn't rank higer than lbj as a top Laker.

not being a rapist? OK LBJ ranks higher than Kobe, so far.

Malone...really? WTF are you thinking?


Oh, I'm saying best NBA players who were Lakers. Obviously if you only count accomplishments AS a Laker then you drop LeBron and Malone...and Kobe's still a borderline Top 5 Laker.

As for most points...yeah, you play 19 years and shoot the 3rd-most shots, good job having the 4th-most points.

(He's 10 shots from having the 2nd-most shots, too. He'd have to have scored a mere 3285 points on those 10 shots to tie Karl Malone's efficiency, though.)

Kobe isn't a top 25 player by career PER, he's #19 by win shares. He doesn't belong in the GOAT conversation at all, but gets shoved in there because he's "like" Jordan.
 
2020-05-04 8:06:28 PM  

LewDux: Trigger warning: advanced stats
Laker leaders by career win shares
[Fark user image image 850x129]


Guys who have played for the Lakers with more career win shares than Kobe:

Kareem
Wilt
LeBron
K. Malone
Shaq

Not that they did a great job of keeping stats in the long, long ago, so that data may affect the old-timers negatively.
 
2020-05-04 8:09:34 PM  
Admittedly I'm putting Jerry West over Kobe because their playing careers were of similar value, but West was a hell of a GM.

Anyone putting Kobe ahead of Kareem or Magic...well, we can ignore their stupid opinions immediately.

Maybe try earning multiple MVPs.

/honestly, though, you wanna talk stats, and Jordan himself is trash compared to Kareem, Wilt, and Russell.
 
2020-05-04 10:48:49 PM  

brizzle365: IAmRight: phimuskapsi: meanmutton: phimuskapsi: IAmRight: People jock Jordan so damn hard they pretend Kobe's one of the top players in NBA history just because he played exactly like Jordan.

[Fark user image 850x139]

You couldn't be more wrong. 

All highlighted fields are where Kobe beat Jordan statistically. Oh and he had 5 championships to Jordan's 6.

Those are all career total stats. You could have just highlighted the "games played" column if your point was "Kobe played more games than Jordan".

And? You can't just say that people "pretend" that Kobe is one of the best in the league. It's pretty definitive that he is.

He's one of the top 50 or so, maybe. He's not a top 10 player, though. People pretend like he's in the conversation with Jordan and LeBron.

You could easily make the case that he's not in the Top 5 Lakers of all time.

/And if you count non-Laker careers, it's not even debatable, he's barely a top 10 Laker.
//Kareem, Magic, Wilt, LeBron, Malone, Shaq, West...he's only arguable top-5 if you're only counting Laker careers (and therefore leave out LeBron and Malone, for sure).
///all I'm saying here is that holy sh*t, the Lakers' all-time team is a killer

Wait, so your telling me that lbj belongs as an all time great in the NBA, and top 10 for the Lakers, but Kobe isn't even on your radar?
At this stage of their careers with the Lakers, Lonzo Ball and LBJ would be virtually tied as a top Laker, neither has nor will bring a ring to the Lakers. And I rank about as high as Lonzo, on the Lakers all-time greats list.

Ok, thats a bit hyperbolic, but you are insane if you think Kobe doesn't rank higer than lbj as a top Laker.

not being a rapist? OK LBJ ranks higher than Kobe, so far.

Malone...really? WTF are you thinking?



Malone belongs in the same conversation as Kobe, as long as that conversation is about guys who raped someone.
 
2020-05-05 8:58:12 AM  

phimuskapsi: IAmRight: He's one of the top 50 or so, maybe. He's not a top 10 player, though. People pretend like he's in the conversation with Jordan and LeBron.

As I showed you above, he's literally 4th in the league in points, So you can take this comment:

IAmRight: Anyone who thinks LeBron invented forming a good team with multiple stars doesn't know even a rudimentary history of the NBA.

And shove it right up your ass.

It's not just the formation of super teams, but how they are formed. The players suddenly had a lot more control over where they wanted to go and what offers they would accept in order to construct the teams. Back then most of the 'supers' came from some blind luck, even for the Bulls.

Using the Bulls as an example:
- Jordan was the #3 pick (should have been #2)
- Rodman was a risky trade from the Spurs
- Pippen was drafted by Seatle and traded to Chicago the same day

In fact a lot of the players on that magical Bulls run were there through a network of trades and teams. They just all happened to be there at the same time. There was no guarantee to any of it.


Yep, lots of blind luck when the Celtics added Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett, still in their primes, to a playoff team in order to defeat LeBron + squad of benchwarmers.

Meanwhile, the Heat were GUARANTEED to win, which is why they lost in 2011 and everyone was saying "See? You can't just throw talent together and expect to win."

Just because you feel the need to defend Durant's COMPLETE b*tch move of "I choked against the top team when I had them on the ropes, so I'll just join them next year" does not mean that superteams started with LeBron.

/we'll also point out that Jordan never had the opportunity to join up with any greats, so we'll never have an honest answer about whether or not he would've
//everyone who was at/anywhere close to his level was in decline as he rose; everyone who contended his entire career was older than he was (Malone, Stockton, Barkley, Ewing, etc) or too young to really be a force (Shaq, Kobe, etc). The NBA had very little talent entering the league for a decade after Jordan joined.
 
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