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(The Hill)   Captain Crozier's reinstatement is now bogged down with the top brass at the Pentagon. Enjoy your retirement, Captain   (thehill.com) divider line
    More: Followup, United States Department of Defense, United States Navy, Capt. Brett Crozier, Theodore Roosevelt, Top Pentagon officials, Navy's recommendation Friday, Joint Chiefs of Staff, former commander of the USS Theodore Roosevelt  
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4543 clicks; posted to Main » and Politics » on 26 Apr 2020 at 2:11 PM (9 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-04-26 2:13:14 PM  
Optics is a biatch.
 
2020-04-26 2:14:58 PM  
The ship that was his career as an aircraft carrier captain and a future admiral has sailed, all puns intended.  The lack of trust on both sides that resulted from this can't be undone.  If he were to be re-instated, every move he made would be held under a microscope, and that would destroy him further.  It's a shiatty situation, but there's no way to undo it.
 
2020-04-26 2:17:02 PM  
Top. Brass.
encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.comView Full Size
 
2020-04-26 2:18:18 PM  
Do it. In this timeline I've always fully expected to see Trump berating active military commanders via tweet on a daily basis.
 
2020-04-26 2:18:24 PM  
Crozier will be fine, but I think the full investigation will reveal a lot more about Modly's unsuitability to be SECNAV more than it would show anything about Crozier. TBH, I think a full investigation into this would be rather embarassing for the political appointees of the administration, and not at all embarrassing for senior officers in the Navy.
 
2020-04-26 2:19:21 PM  
Anything to avoid embarrassing King Baby.
 
2020-04-26 2:19:55 PM  
 
2020-04-26 2:24:11 PM  

firefly212: Crozier will be fine, but I think the full investigation will reveal a lot more about Modly's unsuitability to be SECNAV more than it would show anything about Crozier. TBH, I think a full investigation into this would be rather embarassing for the political appointees of the administration, and not at all embarrassing for senior officers in the Navy.


The problem with that theory is  it assumes that there aren't a lot of senior officers in the Navy who aren't full blown Derpers. If nothing else, this administration has shown that high office doesn't make you immune to drinking kool aide.
 
2020-04-26 2:26:47 PM  
I think the bigger investigation ought to be into how unconfirmed "acting" secretaries should be allowed to be anywhere close to military ops. Captain Crozier probably will end up retiring. I'm not in his shoes but a reinstatement would not be a return to glory. Retire and come back as SecNav next year.
 
2020-04-26 2:26:58 PM  

firefly212: Crozier will be fine, but I think the full investigation will reveal a lot more about Modly's unsuitability to be SECNAV more than it would show anything about Crozier. TBH, I think a full investigation into this would be rather embarassing for the political appointees of the administration, and not at all embarrassing for senior officers in the Navy.


Whoch is why there will be no ll investigation.

And whyit will always be on Crozier's head, not Moldy's.
 
2020-04-26 2:27:01 PM  

Mukster: Anything to avoid embarrassing King Baby.


Yep. The only hold up is the guy who loves the military more than anyone else, knows more than the generals, and always wanted a purple heart of his very own.

Extra difficulty: The good captain was never shot down and captured and certainly, as a POW, didn't have the opportunity to refuse early release.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2020-04-26 2:28:04 PM  
I'm sure he's quite employable in retirement, both on the merits and as another talking head on a network that doesn't like Trump.
 
2020-04-26 2:29:45 PM  
Again, commit some war crimes. Trump will be on your side in a jiffy
 
2020-04-26 2:29:47 PM  

Bslim: Because this is who heads the Joint Chiefs

https://www.defenseone.com/politics/20​19/09/milley-trump-joint-chiefs-chair-​savvy-political-operator/160232/


Esper is under the general's thumbs. He will pass back through the revolving door to his defense contractor gig in less than a year and doesn't want to piss these senior flag officers off.
 
2020-04-26 2:31:10 PM  
Serious question: I know they determined that instead of 20-30 people like Ronald McDonald said the Captain sent the email to, it was three admirals and seven captains...did they ever figure where the "leak" to the press came from?
 
2020-04-26 2:31:45 PM  
Modly never updated his LinkedIn account for his position as acting SECNAV.

Fark user imageView Full Size


I'm guessing he's not having any difficulty finding a job and doesn't need to bother with LinkedIn?
 
2020-04-26 2:31:53 PM  

firefly212: Crozier will be fine, but I think the full investigation will reveal a lot more about Modly's unsuitability to be SECNAV more than it would show anything about Crozier. TBH, I think a full investigation into this would be rather embarassing for the political appointees of the administration, and not at all embarrassing for senior officers in the Navy.


I wonder if that's why the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff wants one.
 
2020-04-26 2:32:46 PM  

ZAZ: I'm sure he's quite employable in retirement, both on the merits and as another talking head on a network that doesn't like Trump.


With that level of experience, there will be defense contractors foaming at the mouth to hire him in some capacity.
 
2020-04-26 2:35:20 PM  
He opened his "Yap" once now the Navy can't trust him not to do it again.....So Captain Crunch you're on your own there son!!! 
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-04-26 2:35:41 PM  

firefly212: Crozier will be fine, but I think the full investigation will reveal a lot more about Modly's unsuitability to be SECNAV more than it would show anything about Crozier. TBH, I think a full investigation into this would be rather embarassing for the political appointees of the administration, and not at all embarrassing for senior officers in the Navy.


The results will likely be that a political appointee overstepped massively in an attempt to impress his boss and created the controversy where none existed.

This will be one of the many legacies and cautionary tales that stem from this Administration.

Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2020-04-26 2:35:50 PM  
The captain should absolutely be reinstated, but doing so quickly almost sweeps this whole mess under the rug. A full investigation will throw some daylight on the political nonsense and lay bare the facts. If political shenanigans put operational effectiveness or crew safety in jeopardy, having that come out is important and totally worth the delay of his reinstatement.
 
2020-04-26 2:38:40 PM  
He took command 17 months ago.  They should just credit him with a successful command tour and let him move on without prejudice
 
2020-04-26 2:39:59 PM  

Some Farking Lurker: The captain should absolutely be reinstated, but doing so quickly almost sweeps this whole mess under the rug. A full investigation will throw some daylight on the political nonsense and lay bare the facts. If political shenanigans put operational effectiveness or crew safety in jeopardy, having that come out is important and totally worth the delay of his reinstatement.


Yes, that would be ideal.

B.ut it would have to be an independent investigation, outside the Navy and the Executive in order for it to actually be useful, since the Navy and the Executive are responsibile for the shiatshow that caused this.

But, that would have to be approved by the Navy and/or Executive...

Are you seeing why such an investigation would never be allowed yet?
 
2020-04-26 2:43:09 PM  
Go ahead and retire, Capt Crozier. These asswipes have shown exactly how much respect for you they have by throwing you under the keel of your own ship just because your truth hurt the Tangerine Tyrant's fee-fees and made him look bad. The only reason anyone is even considering this is because they know they f'ked up and will pay for it long after 45* has slithered out of the oval office.

You have 28 years of service. Retire to a fat civilian paycheck with a hearty "f'k all of y'all" and be happy knowing that you did the right thing for the Navy, for your crew, and for your country.
 
2020-04-26 2:43:45 PM  
I don't think he should be reinstated. I think he should be given the job of the person who relieved him of his command.
 
2020-04-26 2:44:47 PM  

johnny_vegas: He took command 17 months ago.  They should just credit him with a successful command tour and let him move on without prejudice


Never mind, math is hard apparently.  He took command 5 months ago.  So he should be offered the opportunity to command again, also without prejudice
 
2020-04-26 2:45:08 PM  

Insain2: He opened his "Yap" once now the Navy can't trust him not to do it again.....So Captain Crunch you're on your own there son!!! [Fark user image 425x576]


That's not quite how I'd describe sending an email up the chain of command but then again, I was Air Force.
 
2020-04-26 2:45:36 PM  

Hallows_Eve: Serious question: I know they determined that instead of 20-30 people like Ronald McDonald said the Captain sent the email to, it was three admirals and seven captains...did they ever figure where the "leak" to the press came from?


Depends. Did all the copies of his letter have an odd punctuation or random capital letter in a weird spot to make them unique?
 
2020-04-26 2:47:20 PM  
Modly pulled a Trump political move  and put the Navy brass in a bind.   To put him back in position just makes the fark up look worse for them.  This is what you get for putting a bunch of bunch of political sycophants in these positions (ie, practically the entire administration) rather than competent, respected, intelligent and savvy people.
 
2020-04-26 2:47:39 PM  

johnny_vegas: He took command 17 months ago.  They should just credit him with a successful command tour and let him move on without prejudice


I agree, but the difficulty is that a successful post-carrier command generally comes with a star. The military will have a hard time with a promotion after removal from command, regardless of the reasons for removal. That's why I personally think he will retire.
 
2020-04-26 2:47:48 PM  

GrogSmash: Some Farking Lurker: The captain should absolutely be reinstated, but doing so quickly almost sweeps this whole mess under the rug. A full investigation will throw some daylight on the political nonsense and lay bare the facts. If political shenanigans put operational effectiveness or crew safety in jeopardy, having that come out is important and totally worth the delay of his reinstatement.

Yes, that would be ideal.

B.ut it would have to be an independent investigation, outside the Navy and the Executive in order for it to actually be useful, since the Navy and the Executive are responsibile for the shiatshow that caused this.

But, that would have to be approved by the Navy and/or Executive...

Are you seeing why such an investigation would never be allowed yet?


Never be allowed in 2020. Fingers crossed for 2021 - if there's anyone left.
 
2020-04-26 2:47:59 PM  

edmo: Insain2: He opened his "Yap" once now the Navy can't trust him not to do it again.....So Captain Crunch you're on your own there son!!! [Fark user image 425x576]

That's not quite how I'd describe sending an email up the chain of command but then again, I was Air Force.


More specefically, I think what happened is he sent a request for help up the CoC and was throughly ignored.

So he had to send a second request, jumping the chain of command, and included people who would be damned interested in why he was being ignored.  And one of them leaked it.
 
2020-04-26 2:48:12 PM  

Hallows_Eve: Serious question: I know they determined that instead of 20-30 people like Ronald McDonald said the Captain sent the email to, it was three admirals and seven captains...did they ever figure where the "leak" to the press came from?


That's the person who should be strung up.

Captain Crozier did what he was supposed to do: communicate a serious problem to his superiors and other interested military parties.  Some asshole decided to throw him under the bus.  Whether for political reasons or for a "scoop" is irrelevant.  Someone in the military leaked it.  That person should be punished.
 
2020-04-26 2:50:03 PM  
Can we get a hot take on this from FLYNAVY, please?
 
2020-04-26 2:54:54 PM  
These straighten people would seem to be a significant distraction to our armed forces. Is this drama really worth it during a pandemic?
 
2020-04-26 3:02:21 PM  
Loose lips sink ships.
 
2020-04-26 3:06:27 PM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: Modly never updated his LinkedIn account for his position as acting SECNAV.

[Fark user image image 812x418]

I'm guessing he's not having any difficulty finding a job and doesn't need to bother with LinkedIn?


No updating LinkedIn is probably the smartest thing he did.

LinkedIn is hot garbage at best and a complete waste of time.

The more evidence I see that someone spends time and effort there, the less I respect that person.  Even if they're a "social influencer".
 
2020-04-26 3:11:57 PM  

scott4long: The ship that was his career as an aircraft carrier captain and a future admiral has sailed, all puns intended.  The lack of trust on both sides that resulted from this can't be undone.  If he were to be re-instated, every move he made would be held under a microscope, and that would destroy him further.  It's a shiatty situation, but there's no way to undo it.


I think you are right. There is just no way to unfark this pig.
 
2020-04-26 3:18:35 PM  

Insain2: He opened his "Yap" once now the Navy can't trust him not to do it again.....So Captain Crunch you're on your own there son!!! [Fark user image 425x576]


Nice to see you support the needless deaths of our service members if it's politically expedient
 
2020-04-26 3:20:22 PM  
Give him the Ford.
 
2020-04-26 3:21:47 PM  

GrogSmash: More specefically, I think what happened is he sent a request for help up the CoC and was throughly ignored.

So he had to send a second request, jumping the chain of command, and included people who would be damned interested in why he was being ignored.  And one of them leaked it.


This whole story is everything wrong with the Navy. So many senior and flag officers who are more afraid of being wrong than doing wrong. Crozier should be given a medal and a new command. End of story.
 
2020-04-26 3:24:10 PM  

scott4long: The ship that was his career as an aircraft carrier captain and a future admiral has sailed, all puns intended.  The lack of trust on both sides that resulted from this can't be undone.  If he were to be re-instated, every move he made would be held under a microscope, and that would destroy him further.  It's a shiatty situation, but there's no way to undo it.


Wrong. It's called, brass having some balls, and just reinstating him and telling people to do their job and take orders. If they did that, it would blow over and be forgotten.

If Trump orders him fired, then he's fired, with a reference to the chain of command as the sole reason for firing. And then he wins his civil lawsuit.

The reality is the brass don't have the balls for a bunfight. They're conditioned to fight big fights, so of course they end up eating Trump's microbullshiat all the time. Really? Quit over minutia? Trump's psyche knows this. That's how he recruits people. They just keep eating the microbullshiat, and eventually become one of the cult.
 
2020-04-26 3:27:35 PM  

Schlubbe: Give him the Ford.


You want to throw him to the wolves?
 
2020-04-26 3:31:18 PM  
How can anyone serve with honor when they look up their chain of command, and see President Bonespurs sitting atop it? Time for all honorable military personel to resign.
Who wants to serve under a man who endorses and pardons the Eddie Gallaghers of the world?
 
2020-04-26 3:31:27 PM  

IDefineWhatIsPC: GrogSmash: More specefically, I think what happened is he sent a request for help up the CoC and was throughly ignored.

So he had to send a second request, jumping the chain of command, and included people who would be damned interested in why he was being ignored.  And one of them leaked it.

This whole story is everything wrong with the Navy. So many senior and flag officers who are more afraid of being wrong than doing wrong. Crozier should be given a medal and a new command. End of story.


A new command wouldn't do much for him.  He already had the one of the most prestigious commands in the Navy, if not the most prestigious.

The Big Stick IS the big prize, isn't it?
 
2020-04-26 3:31:32 PM  

GrogSmash: edmo: Insain2: He opened his "Yap" once now the Navy can't trust him not to do it again.....So Captain Crunch you're on your own there son!!! [Fark user image 425x576]

That's not quite how I'd describe sending an email up the chain of command but then again, I was Air Force.

More specefically, I think what happened is he sent a request for help up the CoC and was throughly ignored.

So he had to send a second request, jumping the chain of command, and included people who would be damned interested in why he was being ignored.  And one of them leaked it.


He wasn't he did not agree with the plan that was being worked (rightly so, IMO).  So he sent another request.  He didn't jump the chain of command either.  He sent it to his direct boss and copied it to several others.
 
2020-04-26 3:40:01 PM  

jso2897: How can anyone serve with honor when they look up their chain of command, and see President Bonespurs sitting atop it? Time for all honorable military personel to resign.
Who wants to serve under a man who endorses and pardons the Eddie Gallaghers of the world?


Civilian leadership is transient and temporary. The oath, and need, to protect the nation is permanent.
 
2020-04-26 3:40:08 PM  
He should wait for the next administration and become Sec of Def
 
2020-04-26 3:41:08 PM  

GrogSmash: Some Farking Lurker: The captain should absolutely be reinstated, but doing so quickly almost sweeps this whole mess under the rug. A full investigation will throw some daylight on the political nonsense and lay bare the facts. If political shenanigans put operational effectiveness or crew safety in jeopardy, having that come out is important and totally worth the delay of his reinstatement.

Yes, that would be ideal.

B.ut it would have to be an independent investigation, outside the Navy and the Executive in order for it to actually be useful, since the Navy and the Executive are responsibile for the shiatshow that caused this.

But, that would have to be approved by the Navy and/or Executive...

Are you seeing why such an investigation would never be allowed yet?


A) Congress investigates things from time to time (stop laughing back there).
B) Does the Judicial Branch have their own investigation body? I know we do adversarial trial instead of inquisitorial trial, but you'd think the farking court would want their own goddamn eyes on stuff when it's painfully obvious the people in charge of gathering facts have a huge farking conflict of interests.
 
2020-04-26 3:41:48 PM  

scott4long: The ship that was his career as an aircraft carrier captain and a future admiral has sailed, all puns intended.  The lack of trust on both sides that resulted from this can't be undone.  If he were to be re-instated, every move he made would be held under a microscope, and that would destroy him further.  It's a shiatty situation, but there's no way to undo it.


Ugh. Being "under the microscope" is soul crushing.

When things like this happen, no matter what you do or how valiantly you act, if you win an appeal or are narrowly reinstated, you will have proven them wrong by your success and resilience. And whether they realize it or not, any future failure or misfortune will be extremely validating to them and probably trigger some deeper feelings of comeuppance or cosmic justice.
 
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