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(NYPost)   AOC admits the progressive movement had 'tough night' after Biden wins it all on mini Super Tuesday, ponders going back and picking up the pieces of Bernie to try and put back the movement   (nypost.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Joe Biden, Vice President of the United States, Hillary Rodham Clinton, Democratic Party, United States Senate, primary rival Joe Biden, progressive movement, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez  
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635 clicks; posted to Politics » on 11 Mar 2020 at 10:16 AM (16 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-03-11 9:42:30 AM  
Let's deal with the reality in front of us and see that the battle is now to help Biden beat Trump and put serious effort into taking the Senate.

Then, perhaps by erasing the last 8 years of an obstructionist Congress that has only moved backwards, we can put some new programs into play that benefit people. Perhaps the American people can get some renewed faith in government. So many Americans despair that their government is capable of doing anything.  So plan to make a start and then an actually progressive agenda can be put forward in 2024.

Let's adopt Progressiveness in a way that admits it will take some actual progress as a required first step in order to inspire enough voters to join the cause. That's far better than going backwards like we have been. And again, with some tangible results, we can take the bigger steps in 2024 and beyond.
 
2020-03-11 9:45:50 AM  
I've said all along that if Bernie wants the Democratic nomination, he really should join the party.  You're fighting with one arm behind your back otherwise.

He had a good run.  Now get me some health care, dammit!
 
2020-03-11 9:47:14 AM  

wademh: Let's deal with the reality in front of us


I have to make Biden's campaign signage work with my house's exterior color scheme?
 
2020-03-11 9:48:42 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!


Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.
 
2020-03-11 9:49:20 AM  
AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.
 
2020-03-11 9:49:51 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: wademh: Let's deal with the reality in front of us

I have to make Biden's campaign signage work with my house's exterior color scheme?


Other way. You must now repaint your house.

\ you've got a house? We lived in a cardboard box.
 
2020-03-11 9:53:33 AM  

FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.


I'm not for radical change only because I'm realistic and know we don't have the votes or support for it, but I love that she is trying her hardest and totally support her in what she does. She has grown into the position quite well and I look forward to her being around for a good long time. When America is ready for a few things to change, she'll be right there.
 
2020-03-11 9:53:39 AM  

FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.


Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.
 
2020-03-11 9:55:47 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.


"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"
 
2020-03-11 9:59:42 AM  

FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"


That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.
 
2020-03-11 10:00:23 AM  

wademh: Marcus Aurelius: wademh: Let's deal with the reality in front of us

I have to make Biden's campaign signage work with my house's exterior color scheme?

Other way. You must now repaint your house.


I bet if I painted it up as a Biden campaign sign, that I'd attract some attention.  My Trumper neighbors don't have that level of commitment.  I have to think about this now.
 
2020-03-11 10:01:36 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.


Sure, so what percentage of the population needs to die for the glorious revolution?
 
2020-03-11 10:02:01 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.


They do. The issue isn't that Democratic voters don't want progressive policies -- hell, by issue polling most GOP voters want progressive policies! -- nor even that most Democratic voters don't like Bernie personally. They do.

The issues are (1) that most older voters don't trust radicals to actually accomplish any of the things they say they want to accomplish, and (2) most younger people don't bother to vote.

If you're over 50, you're probably not impressed with a guy who has been shouting for decades that he has all the solutions, but who can only point to a couple of post-office renamings as evidence he's able to successfully put his ideas into practice. If you're under 40, you probably like Bernie quite a bit and think he'd do great if anyone gave him a chance, but eh, Netflix has a new season of Altered Carbon and it's cold out and uh, the corrupt DNC probably wouldn't even count it so might as well just stay in with a pizza.
 
2020-03-11 10:02:04 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.


You could have noticed that back in the 1990's when the Fed decided to back everyone's risky bets so the Boomers would have all the protection they needed in retirement, wars in the middle east after promising they'd never repeat Vietnam, tax policies that make no goddamn sense.

They've been doing this for 30 f*cking years.
 
2020-03-11 10:05:25 AM  

NewportBarGuy: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.

You could have noticed that back in the 1990's when the Fed decided to back everyone's risky bets so the Boomers would have all the protection they needed in retirement, wars in the middle east after promising they'd never repeat Vietnam, tax policies that make no goddamn sense.

They've been doing this for 30 f*cking years.


Yup, and they're going to continue to do it because the money is on their side, because 50 years ago they started voting to ensure that wages would stagnate and quality of life for their children, grandchildren, and great-grandchildren would decrease. They voted to fark us and now they expect us to be happy about it and support them.
 
2020-03-11 10:13:15 AM  
If you are a right winger... and don't vote for Trump this year, then you will indirectly help Biden win.  If you are a left winger... and don't vote for Biden, then you will indirectly help Trump win.

The right will show up and vote for Trump this year.  Let's see what the left voters do this Nov.
 
2020-03-11 10:13:43 AM  

NewportBarGuy: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.

You could have noticed that back in the 1990's when the Fed decided to back everyone's risky bets so the Boomers would have all the protection they needed in retirement, wars in the middle east after promising they'd never repeat Vietnam, tax policies that make no goddamn sense.

They've been doing this for 30 f*cking years.


Reagan was 1980s, so more like 40 years.
 
2020-03-11 10:18:45 AM  
It's still going to be a minor miracle that Biden, Sanders and Trump are still even alive when the election takes place.
 
2020-03-11 10:19:10 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.


Yes they do.
 
2020-03-11 10:20:02 AM  

raerae1980: NewportBarGuy: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.

You could have noticed that back in the 1990's when the Fed decided to back everyone's risky bets so the Boomers would have all the protection they needed in retirement, wars in the middle east after promising they'd never repeat Vietnam, tax policies that make no goddamn sense.

They've been doing this for 30 f*cking years.

Reagan was 1980s, so more like 40 years.


Good point, he got it rolling and the foundation of the modern conservative movement with Limbaugh and Hannity was born under him.
 
2020-03-11 10:21:10 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.


Can't argue with you there, but I think the change will happen sooner than you do. Sorry it didn't happen this year, but it's inevitable.
 
2020-03-11 10:21:52 AM  

WhackingDay: It's still going to be a minor miracle that Biden, Sanders and Trump are still even alive when the election takes place.


It's not like there is a major worldwide pandemic and campaign events are a potential disease vector and all three continue the grand tradition that all presidents must be born in or before 1946 (with Obama as the exception).
 
2020-03-11 10:22:21 AM  
Please, New York State Democrats, do the country a solid and eliminate her seat in 2021. the sooner she's back to tending bar and "WoRkInG fOr TipPs!1!1" the better off we all are.

//At some point will she say something stupid enough that Boston College revokes her degrees because it's obvious she learned nothing? Hopefully.
 
2020-03-11 10:22:33 AM  
Just give up this battle. The good guys won't win this, the rich have all went all in on Biden. It's pretty much impossible at this point to get a true president that understands technology and conservatism don't mix.

You CANNOT pull yourself up by your bootstraps when everything requires a degree, cert, or years of experience. Is it admirable for those who do this? Sure. But look at who invested in them. They never got off the ground until they had an investment. Which is the *exact same* as UBI, someone invested and they got free money, their payment plans back to the investors are more expensive than the taxes for UBI would be.

But no. Gotta get bootstraps. gotta struggle to live, if you didn't want to struggle, die. At least heaven isn't a struggle, right? Oh you believe you'll basically cease to exist when you die? Well that's your problem, should've gotten with the programming.

Freaking morons with their ass backwards philosophy.
 
2020-03-11 10:22:58 AM  
It might have not panned out this election, but progressive momentum is definitely building.  It's a way different environment than it was even 10 years ago.
 
2020-03-11 10:23:10 AM  

FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.

Sure, so what percentage of the population needs to die for the glorious revolution?


At the moment, it's looking like 3.7 percent.
 
2020-03-11 10:23:21 AM  

raerae1980: NewportBarGuy: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.

"She's right, [Crazy unhelpful shiat she never said or would say]"

That's why she's a politician and I'm just a guy on the internet, noticing how badly the nation has been doing since Boomers took over.

You could have noticed that back in the 1990's when the Fed decided to back everyone's risky bets so the Boomers would have all the protection they needed in retirement, wars in the middle east after promising they'd never repeat Vietnam, tax policies that make no goddamn sense.

They've been doing this for 30 f*cking years.

Reagan was 1980s, so more like 40 years.


Wayback machine time!

Take it even further into the past to the 70s when the Silent Generation began deregulating industries.  That's when wealth and income inequality really started to grow.  Beginning with Reagan the neocons took over foreign policy and drove the economy through military spending, deficit spending, and tax cuts for the rich but it was all the follow up to deregulation.
 
2020-03-11 10:23:31 AM  

MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.


Then why didn't they vote for it?
 
2020-03-11 10:24:48 AM  

MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.


The underlying problems of this country will not be addressed under Biden.  You think income inequality will loosen up?    It didn't under Obama.    You think corporations will be reigned in?    Well, Biden is from Delaware, so.......
I will vote in November, I will color in my dot for Biden.   But I am mad, and severely disappointed because no one wants to take a goddamn risk to improve things.

My opinion, of course  :-)
 
2020-03-11 10:25:21 AM  

Bloomin Bloomberg: Please, New York State Democrats, do the country a solid and eliminate her seat in 2021. the sooner she's back to tending bar and "WoRkInG fOr TipPs!1!1" the better off we all are.

//At some point will she say something stupid enough that Boston College revokes her degrees because it's obvious she learned nothing? Hopefully.


End this cringe schtick. It's ran its course a while ago.
 
2020-03-11 10:25:32 AM  
At least if Biden gets the nod, with Biden vs Trump every billionaire can rest easy as, no matter who wins, 'their' money will be safe for another four years.
 
2020-03-11 10:26:19 AM  
You lost.
Get over it, and yourselves.
Keep your eyes on the prize, and carry on.
 
2020-03-11 10:26:38 AM  

raerae1980: MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.

The underlying problems of this country will not be addressed under Biden.  You think income inequality will loosen up?    It didn't under Obama.    You think corporations will be reigned in?    Well, Biden is from Delaware, so.......
I will vote in November, I will color in my dot for Biden.   But I am mad, and severely disappointed because no one wants to take a goddamn risk to improve things.

My opinion, of course  :-)


This is likely the last vote I will ever make for a Democrat. If this is the best they can do there's just no point in supporting them anymore.
 
2020-03-11 10:27:21 AM  
The problem is not so much the "progressive" movement. The problem is Bernie's attitude that democrats are his enemies not his friends.
 
2020-03-11 10:27:47 AM  

raerae1980: MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.

The underlying problems of this country will not be addressed under Biden.  You think income inequality will loosen up?    It didn't under Obama.    You think corporations will be reigned in?    Well, Biden is from Delaware, so.......
I will vote in November, I will color in my dot for Biden.   But I am mad, and severely disappointed because no one wants to take a goddamn risk to improve things.

My opinion, of course  :-)


Obama was hamstrung because his first act out of the gate was met with unprecedented opposition and obstruction, and that led to the Tea Party taking control of Congress in 2010.

What was he supposed to do for the following 6 years?  Do people think that based on what happened from 2009-2010 an even MORE progressive agenda out of the gate will be adopted without even harsher opposition?

People who don't understand "incremental change" are just impatient and unrealistic.  Yes, we all see the problem from this side of the aisle.  But you can't force the other side to change without the POWER to do so.

How do you get that power without winning elections first?  And if you can't win a primary because you're too leftist for the lefties, what's going to happen in the General?
 
2020-03-11 10:29:09 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.


Yes we do. We already have over 90% now. By expanding on the ACA we can can get to universal.

Universal and single payer is not the same thing.
 
2020-03-11 10:29:24 AM  

adj_m: MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.

Then why didn't they vote for it?



Because Democrats are all Very Smart People who choose "electability" over the policies they actually want (see: the "dated Dean, married Kerry" phenomenon) and then lose the general because nobody wants to vote for the generic, meaningless person they've chosen.

The only Democrat not chosen and supported by the Very Smart People in my adult lifetime is - by some wacky coincidence! - also the only one who won.
 
2020-03-11 10:29:45 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: wademh: Marcus Aurelius: wademh: Let's deal with the reality in front of us

I have to make Biden's campaign signage work with my house's exterior color scheme?

Other way. You must now repaint your house.

I bet if I painted it up as a Biden campaign sign, that I'd attract some attention.  My Trumper neighbors don't have that level of commitment.  I have to think about this now.


the reddit karma would farm itself
 
2020-03-11 10:29:50 AM  
Right now getting rid of Trump is a priority for most people, and the Democrats are willing to compromise to get that done. All I'm saying is after that's done what will be the excuse then?

If people want things (health care, legal marijuana, etc.) they need to vote for the individuals who will propose real common sense solutions to getting those things done. Progressives need to get rid of that wishful thinking label and start showing those centrists that they're not here to chew up the scenery.
 
2020-03-11 10:30:02 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: FortyHams: AOC has been characteristically level headed through this whole thing.

Yeah, and she's right. Once all the old people die off we can actually get good things for the country.


The problem is is that they are then replaced by new older people.
 
2020-03-11 10:30:14 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.


Gods but I'm sick of hearing this

Here's a hint: moderate Democrats want the same things you do. We want people to be able to go to the doctor when they are sick without going bankrupt.  We want climate change tackled.  We want equal rights for everyone, we want....

We just disagree about how to do it.  Most of us are pragmatists- we want *actual* solutions, not some scheme that relies on happy rainbow unicorn farts to get it passed.  M4A is one way to get people health care.  *But it's not possible in the current political state*. I'm sorry, but it simply isn't, and pretending that you can shame Trump party members into voting for it is ludicrous.  M4A would need 65-70 Democrats in the Senate to pass.

Is reinforced Obamacare + a public option viable?  Honestly, probably not either, but there's at least a path where it might be.

Ditto climate change.  Biden has a quite comprehensive plan- it's not as radical as the Green New Deal, but to pretend it doesn't exist or that it won't work is absurd.

Stop pretending that we're some sort of ogres who hate everything you want.

We aren't
 
2020-03-11 10:30:52 AM  
I get all my AOC and progressive news updates from the NY Post, Fox News and OAN.
 
2020-03-11 10:32:56 AM  

wademh: Let's deal with the reality in front of us and see that the battle is now to help Biden beat Trump and put serious effort into taking the Senate.

Then, perhaps by erasing the last 8 years of an obstructionist Congress that has only moved backwards, we can put some new programs into play that benefit people. Perhaps the American people can get some renewed faith in government. So many Americans despair that their government is capable of doing anything.  So plan to make a start and then an actually progressive agenda can be put forward in 2024.

Let's adopt Progressiveness in a way that admits it will take some actual progress as a required first step in order to inspire enough voters to join the cause. That's far better than going backwards like we have been. And again, with some tangible results, we can take the bigger steps in 2024 and beyond.


thatsabingo.gif

Let's get to work, people.
 
2020-03-11 10:33:34 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: I've said all along that if Bernie wants the Democratic nomination, he really should join the party.  You're fighting with one arm behind your back otherwise.

He had a good run.  Now get me some health care, dammit!


This is actually one of the major issues with me for supporting Bernie. Running in and winning the Dem Primary, then dropping out to run as an "Independent" once no Dem can run in the race is just a jerk move to me.

The policies are mostly fine, even though I think trying to get them done in a few years is a bit pie in the sky. But the way he handles "being a Democrat vs Independent" does not give me hope that if he did win the primaries he wouldn't just drop out and run as an Independent.

And for someone who is going to say "well it doesn't matter if he wins the Dem and then runs as a dem, he still wins" that's my point. Why go through this whole process? Is he a Democrat or not?
 
2020-03-11 10:34:30 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: I've said all along that if Bernie wants the Democratic nomination, he really should join the party.  You're fighting with one arm behind your back otherwise.

He had a good run.  Now get me some health care, dammit!


Probably true, but I don't think Biden will win. The guy is fading fast. I think if Biden has any chance with voters like me, he needs to pick a really good VP, maybe 2. Cause he is clearly not going to last 4 years.

At least Bernie can string together an entire night of argument, without once doing the old man finger wag and anger explosion full of word salad.
 
2020-03-11 10:34:38 AM  

lordjupiter: raerae1980: MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.

The underlying problems of this country will not be addressed under Biden.  You think income inequality will loosen up?    It didn't under Obama.    You think corporations will be reigned in?    Well, Biden is from Delaware, so.......
I will vote in November, I will color in my dot for Biden.   But I am mad, and severely disappointed because no one wants to take a goddamn risk to improve things.

My opinion, of course  :-)

Obama was hamstrung because his first act out of the gate was met with unprecedented opposition and obstruction, and that led to the Tea Party taking control of Congress in 2010.

What was he supposed to do for the following 6 years?  Do people think that based on what happened from 2009-2010 an even MORE progressive agenda out of the gate will be adopted without even harsher opposition?

People who don't understand "incremental change" are just impatient and unrealistic.  Yes, we all see the problem from this side of the aisle.  But you can't force the other side to change without the POWER to do so.

How do you get that power without winning elections first?  And if you can't win a primary because you're too leftist for the lefties, what's going to happen in the General?


I want to see my leaders fight for me.   Even if it's a loss, they still put up a fight.  Obama......I feel like he just rolled over and let the Republicans establish the talking points and agenda.    He should have been screaming about Merrick Garland's seat.   All the Dems in Congress should have been screaming.   /sighs
Dems could have sold a solid, comprehensive plan for the future.   The folks without medical insurance want M4A.  The folks strangled under student loan debt want relief.   Our planet is getting more f*cked every day.
Yet Dems played it safe...again.
(._. )
 
2020-03-11 10:35:01 AM  

lordjupiter: raerae1980: MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.

The underlying problems of this country will not be addressed under Biden.  You think income inequality will loosen up?    It didn't under Obama.    You think corporations will be reigned in?    Well, Biden is from Delaware, so.......
I will vote in November, I will color in my dot for Biden.   But I am mad, and severely disappointed because no one wants to take a goddamn risk to improve things.

My opinion, of course  :-)

Obama was hamstrung because his first act out of the gate was met with unprecedented opposition and obstruction, and that led to the Tea Party taking control of Congress in 2010.

What was he supposed to do for the following 6 years?  Do people think that based on what happened from 2009-2010 an even MORE progressive agenda out of the gate will be adopted without even harsher opposition?

People who don't understand "incremental change" are just impatient and unrealistic.  Yes, we all see the problem from this side of the aisle.  But you can't force the other side to change without the POWER to do so.

How do you get that power without winning elections first?  And if you can't win a primary because you're too leftist for the lefties, what's going to happen in the General?


In a healthy system incremental change for the better is natural.  When you radically change for the worse roughly every other decade however, incremental positive change is not going to save your country. Radical negative change requires radical positive change to counterbalance.

Warren or Bernie would not have brought the US to a radically progressive place that was the envy of countries like Canada and Denmark, it would have only caught you up a little to those places.
 
2020-03-11 10:35:03 AM  

AdmirableSnackbar: raerae1980: MrBallou: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes they do.

The underlying problems of this country will not be addressed under Biden.  You think income inequality will loosen up?    It didn't under Obama.    You think corporations will be reigned in?    Well, Biden is from Delaware, so.......
I will vote in November, I will color in my dot for Biden.   But I am mad, and severely disappointed because no one wants to take a goddamn risk to improve things.

My opinion, of course  :-)

This is likely the last vote I will ever make for a Democrat. If this is the best they can do there's just no point in supporting them anymore.


The nominee wasn't inspiring enough so I'm supporting republicans from now one.

Class act.
 
2020-03-11 10:36:13 AM  

Corvus: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Yes we do. We already have over 90% now. By expanding on the ACA we can can get to universal.

Universal and single payer is not the same thing.


And note that there are countries out there that have universal insurance that is completely, or partially, provided by private companies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_​c​are_systems_by_country#Countries_with_​universal_public-private_insurance_sys​tem

That may be the only politically possible way to get to universal coverage in the US.  Again, remember that the Senate and its filibuster are things that exist.

I'm personally in favor of a full Medicare For All plan, but the votes for it simply aren't there and probably won't be for decades.
 
2020-03-11 10:37:17 AM  

Glockenspiel Hero: AdmirableSnackbar: Marcus Aurelius: Now get me some health care, dammit!

Sorry, that won't happen for another 50 years or so, if we're lucky. Democratic voters don't want universal health care and modern policies.

Gods but I'm sick of hearing this

Here's a hint: moderate Democrats want the same things you do. We want people to be able to go to the doctor when they are sick without going bankrupt.  We want climate change tackled.  We want equal rights for everyone, we want....

We just disagree about how to do it.  Most of us are pragmatists- we want *actual* solutions, not some scheme that relies on happy rainbow unicorn farts to get it passed.  M4A is one way to get people health care.  *But it's not possible in the current political state*. I'm sorry, but it simply isn't, and pretending that you can shame Trump party members into voting for it is ludicrous.  M4A would need 65-70 Democrats in the Senate to pass.

Is reinforced Obamacare + a public option viable?  Honestly, probably not either, but there's at least a path where it might be.

Ditto climate change.  Biden has a quite comprehensive plan- it's not as radical as the Green New Deal, but to pretend it doesn't exist or that it won't work is absurd.

Stop pretending that we're some sort of ogres who hate everything you want.

We aren't


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