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(NPR)   With mortgage rates at near-record lows, could now be the time for you to take the plunge into home ownership? NPR explores the question. Short answer: No. Long answer: Hahahahahahahahaha, no   (npr.org) divider line
    More: Obvious, Real estate, Property, Wealth, average net worth of a homeowner, Money, Mortgage, Renting, monthly mortgage payment  
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1302 clicks; posted to Business » and Main » on 04 Mar 2020 at 10:35 AM (18 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2020-03-04 9:32:38 AM  
Zero percent interest right?

and

7. Housing prices are in a big bubble right now.
 
2020-03-04 10:44:45 AM  
1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth.
The average net worth of a homeowner is much larger than that of a renter,


Ummmm.......you think homeowners have a higher net wealth than renters because they bought the home? Not because, maybe, you need more net wealth to purchase a home?
 
2020-03-04 10:47:41 AM  
Things to remember : 

1. You'll be asked to pay a whole year of taxes AND a whole year of insurance up front. Check on what the previous years' taxes were and double that  - about 3.5%

2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

3. So if we add these together, you're going to need to pay at least 6% of the value of the home UP FRONT AT THE CLOSING ...

4. FHA and PMI fees can cost you up to 10k a year, so your ability to pay down more quickly will be compromised. And while they're "deductable" that only means you won't pay taxes on the money that you earn to pay that money off.

5. The Mortgage interest deduction is not your friend. It just means that you don't pay taxes on the money that you've promised to pay to the mortgage lender. You still have to earn it.

6. When (not if) something goes wrong in your home, you will have to either fix it, or buy all the tools and spend the time fixing it, which can get old very, very quickly.

So whether or not interest rates are low, you're still being asked to cough up several thousand dollars just to conduct the transaction, without gaining any equity at all... You're going to be house-poor paying the insurance and taxes on your property, and unless you're stupid-rich, you're probably adding 5-10 hours a week in commuting time (along with gas and parking costs) that you just lose.
 
2020-03-04 10:49:45 AM  

eKonk: 1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth.
The average net worth of a homeowner is much larger than that of a renter,

Ummmm.......you think homeowners have a higher net wealth than renters because they bought the home? Not because, maybe, you need more net wealth to purchase a home?


When I bought my first home, I'm sure my net worth was very low. It'd been just whatever meager 401k I had at the time and some cash savings.

14 years later, of course my 401k continued to rise, my cash savings has held about steady and I have ~$120k of equity in my home.

So to answer your question, my net worth would likely be about $100k less if I didn't purchase a home.
 
2020-03-04 10:51:46 AM  
If you actually read the article, it says nothing of the sort subby. It's just your basic rent vs buy pros and cons article. Common sense stuff like if you want the flexibility of moving often and don't want to deal with home repairs, then renting is for you. With the caveat that over time your costs will go up due to inflation. However if you can settle in one place, want to build wealth and save money over the long haul, then buying is the way to go.
 
2020-03-04 10:54:46 AM  

MugzyBrown: eKonk: 1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth.
The average net worth of a homeowner is much larger than that of a renter,

Ummmm.......you think homeowners have a higher net wealth than renters because they bought the home? Not because, maybe, you need more net wealth to purchase a home?

When I bought my first home, I'm sure my net worth was very low. It'd been just whatever meager 401k I had at the time and some cash savings.

14 years later, of course my 401k continued to rise, my cash savings has held about steady and I have ~$120k of equity in my home.

So to answer your question, my net worth would likely be about $100k less if I didn't purchase a home.


And maybe an even bigger gap than that, because your housing costs have been more stable than if you were renting the whole time.
 
2020-03-04 10:55:04 AM  
There are homes listed where I live for less than their sale price before the bubble.
 
2020-03-04 10:55:49 AM  

rubi_con_man: 4. FHA and PMI fees can cost you up to 10k a year, so your ability to pay down more quickly will be compromised. And while they're "deductable" that only means you won't pay taxes on the money that you earn to pay that money off.

5. The Mortgage interest deduction is not your friend. It just means that you don't pay taxes on the money that you've promised to pay to the mortgage lender. You still have to earn it.


Also worth noting: with the recent tax reforms it's harder to take these deductions and you'll likely forgo them for the standard deduction instead.

rubi_con_man: 6. When (not if) something goes wrong in your home, you will have to either fix it, or buy all the tools and spend the time fixing it, which can get old very, very quickly.


Kudos to Bob Villa for keeping it clean. If it were up to me the show would've been named This Damn House 😏
 
2020-03-04 10:56:41 AM  
For anyone imminently considering buying.... forget the article for a few days. Wait until 8:30 AM EST this Friday. That's when the jobs report comes out, and we know if the world is ending, a la 2008, or if all is well.

Unless you're buying what I'm selling, then, of course, sign here, because the deal I'm giving you today is only available for 36 hours.
 
2020-03-04 10:58:29 AM  
Always have at least 25% down (possibly excepting California, or similar crazy expensive areas)
 
2020-03-04 11:04:13 AM  

rubi_con_man: Things to remember : 

1. You'll be asked to pay a whole year of taxes AND a whole year of insurance up front. Check on what the previous years' taxes were and double that  - about 3.5%

2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

3. So if we add these together, you're going to need to pay at least 6% of the value of the home UP FRONT AT THE CLOSING ...

4. FHA and PMI fees can cost you up to 10k a year, so your ability to pay down more quickly will be compromised. And while they're "deductable" that only means you won't pay taxes on the money that you earn to pay that money off.

5. The Mortgage interest deduction is not your friend. It just means that you don't pay taxes on the money that you've promised to pay to the mortgage lender. You still have to earn it.

6. When (not if) something goes wrong in your home, you will have to either fix it, or buy all the tools and spend the time fixing it, which can get old very, very quickly.

So whether or not interest rates are low, you're still being asked to cough up several thousand dollars just to conduct the transaction, without gaining any equity at all... You're going to be house-poor paying the insurance and taxes on your property, and unless you're stupid-rich, you're probably adding 5-10 hours a week in commuting time (along with gas and parking costs) that you just lose.


I'd also add that what you pay in interest is substantial - with a 4 percent APR you'll pay the bank a little more than half the house's sale price in interest. And then if you sell the house within the first 5 years, you'll have little equity in it - you were mostly paying interesting, essentially paying rent to the bank.

An upside to renting when you get older and have more money is that you can easily negotiate on the price, such as paying a year up front or signing a two-year lease to secure a lower rent.
 
2020-03-04 11:06:49 AM  

inglixthemad: Always have at least 25% down (possibly excepting California, or similar crazy expensive areas)


Median US home price is $226,800, so 25% down would be $56,700 in the bank. That's more than a year's gross salary for most people and quite unrealistic for a first time home buyer.
 
2020-03-04 11:06:55 AM  

inglixthemad: Always have at least 25% down (possibly excepting California, or similar crazy expensive areas)


Those are all the places worth living, buddy.
 
2020-03-04 11:09:37 AM  
MusicMakeMyHeadPound:
Kudos to Bob Villa for keeping it clean. If it were up to me the show would've been named This Damn House 😏

My dad always called it "This farking Old House."
 
2020-03-04 11:09:57 AM  

rubi_con_man: Things to remember : 

1. You'll be asked to pay a whole year of taxes AND a whole year of insurance up front. Check on what the previous years' taxes were and double that  - about 3.5%

2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

3. So if we add these together, you're going to need to pay at least 6% of the value of the home UP FRONT AT THE CLOSING ...

4. FHA and PMI fees can cost you up to 10k a year, so your ability to pay down more quickly will be compromised. And while they're "deductable" that only means you won't pay taxes on the money that you earn to pay that money off.

5. The Mortgage interest deduction is not your friend. It just means that you don't pay taxes on the money that you've promised to pay to the mortgage lender. You still have to earn it.

6. When (not if) something goes wrong in your home, you will have to either fix it, or buy all the tools and spend the time fixing it, which can get old very, very quickly.

So whether or not interest rates are low, you're still being asked to cough up several thousand dollars just to conduct the transaction, without gaining any equity at all... You're going to be house-poor paying the insurance and taxes on your property, and unless you're stupid-rich, you're probably adding 5-10 hours a week in commuting time (along with gas and parking costs) that you just lose.


On my first home I put down 5% and got the buyer to pay the closing costs.  You can also roll the closing costs into the mortgage so you don't have to pay those up front.  I brought 5% and put down 5%.  Nothing extra.  It's not like the FHA is running some scam where they promise you 3.5% down and then go "Ah ha!" at closing and start sticking you with extra bills to make you pay 6%.

I avoided PMI at the time by taking on mortgage for 80% and a HELOC for the other 15%.  All of this was deductible at the time.
 
2020-03-04 11:19:06 AM  

ReapTheChaos: If you actually read the article, it says nothing of the sort subby. It's just your basic rent vs buy pros and cons article. Common sense stuff like if you want the flexibility of moving often and don't want to deal with home repairs, then renting is for you. With the caveat that over time your costs will go up due to inflation. However if you can settle in one place, want to build wealth and save money over the long haul, then buying is the way to go.


Not to mention, even if it netted out a $0 over your life, some of the non-monetary benefits of owning a home need to be taken into account.

Not having adjoining neighbors
Having your own green space for kids/dog
Guaranteed parking spot
Not having your whole family always on top of you
Having space to host friends/family
 
2020-03-04 11:22:14 AM  

thornhill: An upside to renting when you get older and have more money is that you can easily negotiate on the price, such as paying a year up front or signing a two-year lease to secure a lower rent.


Have you done this? There's no way I'd entertain a lease deal like that, and I'd warn renter friends that while it's a good deal for them, their landlord probably doesn't know wtf he's doing. That can be OK, unless there are problems and the landlord needs an education on his responsibilities too.

It varies by location, but renters generally have an advantage in breaking leases. So that "2 year commitment" is not especially secure for a landlord. And prepaying rent will often make an eviction especially difficult.

There are advantages to renting, but I would not count on these negotiation options, or be entirely comfortable with a landlord who is open to them.
 
2020-03-04 11:29:28 AM  

MugzyBrown: eKonk: 1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth.
The average net worth of a homeowner is much larger than that of a renter,

Ummmm.......you think homeowners have a higher net wealth than renters because they bought the home? Not because, maybe, you need more net wealth to purchase a home?

When I bought my first home, I'm sure my net worth was very low. It'd been just whatever meager 401k I had at the time and some cash savings.

14 years later, of course my 401k continued to rise, my cash savings has held about steady and I have ~$120k of equity in my home.

So to answer your question, my net worth would likely be about $100k less if I didn't purchase a home.


Don't get me wrong - owning a house definitely can be a big positive in terms of long term wealth.  Not in all cases, of course, but much of the time.

I'm just calling out TFA for comparing average net worth of renters vs. home owners when, by definition, home owners consist entirely of people with enough net worth to own a house.
 
2020-03-04 11:29:57 AM  

Rapmaster2000: On my first home I put down 5% and got the buyer to pay the closing costs.  You can also roll the closing costs into the mortgage so you don't have to pay those up front.  I brought 5% and put down 5%.  Nothing extra.  It's not like the FHA is running some scam where they promise you 3.5% down and then go "Ah ha!" at closing and start sticking you with extra bills to make you pay 6%.

I avoided PMI at the time by taking on mortgage for 80% and a HELOC for the other 15%.  All of this was deductible at the time.


... and when was this ?
 
2020-03-04 11:33:40 AM  

rubi_con_man: 6. When (not if) something goes wrong in your home, you will have to either fix it, or buy all the tools and spend the time fixing it, which can get old very, very quickly.


My house was built in 1949, I spend most days working/tinkering around on it, I'm basically gutting and remodeling everything one room at a time as I can afford it. That being said, the last time I had to make an unplanned repair was in December when the handle on the shower hot water faucet broke off, it was just a cheap plastic knob that wore out with time. The repair was just a $5 part from Lowes. Last spring I had to replace the front porch light, another $25 cost. The year before that the kitchen faucet started dripping and needed a new cartridge, that was free because Moen guarantees their faucets for life. So in two years I've had to make three repairs at a cost of $30.

My daughter rents a house. In the last year she's had to replace a dripping kitchen faucet, fix a drawer face that fell off the a kitchen drawer, replace a dozen mini-blinds that were old, yellowed and falling apart, repair the front door that wasn't closing right because the hinge screw holes were stripped out, replace a hinge on her bathroom cabinet that broke, and remove the P trap on the bathroom sink when it became clogged. This is all out of her own pocket because like most landlords, hers doesn't give a shiat about minor of cosmetic repairs unless they're costing them money.
 
2020-03-04 11:35:46 AM  

OccamsWhiskers: It varies by location, but renters generally have an advantage in breaking leases. So that "2 year commitment" is not especially secure for a landlord. And prepaying rent will often make an eviction especially difficult.


Almost certainly illegal in New York State too. Maximum lease term here is one year (it's meant to protect renters from landlords).

If you (as either renter or landlord) really want to do something like this it might be worth the consultation fee with a lawyer to discuss what would happen if the lease ever went in front of a judge.
 
2020-03-04 11:53:31 AM  
Deceptive headline, like so much of Fark!

From the article

"1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth."

That's the long and short of it. You can pay rent to someone else, or you can pay rent to yourself. At the end of the day you will have a higher net worth paying rent to yourself.
 
2020-03-04 11:54:45 AM  

OccamsWhiskers: thornhill: An upside to renting when you get older and have more money is that you can easily negotiate on the price, such as paying a year up front or signing a two-year lease to secure a lower rent.

Have you done this? There's no way I'd entertain a lease deal like that, and I'd warn renter friends that while it's a good deal for them, their landlord probably doesn't know wtf he's doing. That can be OK, unless there are problems and the landlord needs an education on his responsibilities too.

It varies by location, but renters generally have an advantage in breaking leases. So that "2 year commitment" is not especially secure for a landlord. And prepaying rent will often make an eviction especially difficult.

There are advantages to renting, but I would not count on these negotiation options, or be entirely comfortable with a landlord who is open to them.


Yes and so do many people. The biggest mistake renters make is not realizing that they can negotiate and they have many points of leverage.

2-year lease: It's already pretty common for landlords to offer discounts if you sign a lease more than 12 months - a lot of corporate owned hi-rise towers offer 12 to 16 month leases. Landlords rather have someone locked in for a long time than make a little extra money from an annual rent increase because they can lose a lot more money when there is turnover. I have no problem signing a long lease so long as I can sublease, or at least do it in a way that I won't violate the lease.

Prepay: You just put language in lease about them returning the money if they kick you out for some reason or you break the lease. Landlords with lots of rental properties usually won't go for this because they don't want to do special contracts - they want all of their tenants on the same one - but people with a few properties will gladly take all of that cash up front.
 
2020-03-04 11:56:37 AM  

MugzyBrown: Not to mention, even if it netted out a $0 over your life, some of the non-monetary benefits of owning a home need to be taken into account.

Not having adjoining neighbors
Having your own green space for kids/dog
Guaranteed parking spot
Not having your whole family always on top of you
Having space to host friends/family


This is perhaps the most "suburban" definition of a "home" I have ever read.

Owns home.
Has adjoining neighbors, and actually enjoys it.
Green space is the shared courtyard and the park down the street.
I have a car that I don't even keep in the city because it's so difficult to find parking.
850 square feet, family of three.  You do the math.
See above.
 
2020-03-04 12:05:29 PM  

brap: This is perhaps the most "suburban" definition of a "home" I have ever read.

Owns home.
Has adjoining neighbors, and actually enjoys it.
Green space is the shared courtyard and the park down the street.
I have a car that I don't even keep in the city because it's so difficult to find parking.
850 square feet, family of three.  You do the math.
See above.


Sucks for you.
 
2020-03-04 12:05:51 PM  
Um, with record low interest rates, I am thinking about refinancing my current mortgage (which is already pretty low), and switching to a 15 year to pay it off faster.

Either that or I'm looking at income property -- where one of you renting farkers will be paying my mortgage.
 
2020-03-04 12:06:05 PM  

ReapTheChaos: This is all out of her own pocket because like most landlords, hers doesn't give a shiat about minor of cosmetic repairs unless they're costing them money.


Did she notify the landlord that the repairs were needed?

Unless your daughter and the landlord have agreed to periodic inspections, the landlord is obligated to respect privacy and can claim they were unaware the repairs were needed. Your daughter also needs to be able to argue that these are not cosmetic improvements but repairs which affect the quality of living in the apartment (I think all of the examples you gave qualify) and that she gave reasonable time for a response from the landlord.

If she did notify the landlord that repairs were needed and they ignored her then she can move to sue under right of quiet enjoyment and it's fairly simple:

1) Keep the receipts for repair materials and document everything (Written requests and responses, if any. Cellphone pictures of before and after)
2) invoice the landlord for the amount
3) file in small claims court if they ignore or reject the invoice

I'm not a lawyer but that's what I would do in that situation.
 
2020-03-04 12:07:31 PM  

rubi_con_man: 2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.


Huh?
 
2020-03-04 12:10:18 PM  

zgrizz: Deceptive headline, like so much of Fark!

From the article

"1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth."

That's the long and short of it. You can pay rent to someone else, or you can pay rent to yourself. At the end of the day you will have a higher net worth paying rent to yourself.


This.

In addition to the wealth building, I figure I'm going to need a roof over my house for the rest of my life, which will hopefully be well in excess of the 15-30 year terms of mortgages. 

Plus towards the end of the term your mortgage payment is the same as it was in the beginning (assuming an FRM), while all the renters are paying significantly more (even with just rent increases that are matching inflation).

All the homes I've bought, the monthly housing payment without the mortgage (so, just taxes & insurance) is a few hundred a month.  In my area, You might be able to get a studio apartment near a corn field for double that amount.
 
2020-03-04 12:11:28 PM  

rubi_con_man: 5. The Mortgage interest deduction is not your friend. It just means that you don't pay taxes on the money that you've promised to pay to the mortgage lender. You still have to earn it.


We're comparing buying to renting. One is partially deductible, one is not. A deduction is good. The mortgage interest deduction is very much your friend. (Although, with the recent increase of the standard deduction, you might or might not benefit from it, depending on how big your overall itemized deductions are.)
 
2020-03-04 12:12:02 PM  
FYI you're not just paying your landlord's mortgage, you're paying their property taxes, insurance (which is skyrocketing for multifamily), corporate income taxes, payroll, and dividends to the investors.
 
2020-03-04 12:13:22 PM  

akya: zgrizz: Deceptive headline, like so much of Fark!

From the article

"1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth."

That's the long and short of it. You can pay rent to someone else, or you can pay rent to yourself. At the end of the day you will have a higher net worth paying rent to yourself.

This.

In addition to the wealth building, I figure I'm going to need a roof over my headhouse for the rest of my life, which will hopefully be well in excess of the 15-30 year terms of mortgages. 

Plus towards the end of the term your mortgage payment is the same as it was in the beginning (assuming an FRM), while all the renters are paying significantly more (even with just rent increases that are matching inflation).

All the homes I've bought, the monthly housing payment without the mortgage (so, just taxes & insurance) is a few hundred a month.  In my area, You might be able to get a studio apartment near a corn field for double that amount.

FTFM..

/Although I'll need a roof over my house too..
 
kab
2020-03-04 12:25:58 PM  
Current housing prices can eat shiat.  You'd have to pay me to buy right now.
 
2020-03-04 12:27:17 PM  

Super Chronic: rubi_con_man: 2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

Huh?


Georgia's got some big fee on mortgages (including refinancing). I don't think it was 2.5%, but it was enough to stop me from recommending a relative refinance her mortgage. Her rate is now above market, but the balance is well under $100k. The standard costs plus bonus GA tax meant a lower rate wouldn't have paid off for almost 10 years.
 
2020-03-04 12:27:21 PM  

rubi_con_man: The Mortgage interest deduction is not your friend. It just means that you don't pay taxes on the money that you've promised to pay to the mortgage lender. You still have to earn it.


LOL, I remember that thing.
 
2020-03-04 12:30:18 PM  

brap: Owns home.
Has adjoining neighbors, and actually enjoys it.


Ugh, I always hated that. The moment Mrs. PCoC and I bought a house and no longer had somebody on the side/above us was the day I finally felt like an adult.
 
2020-03-04 12:33:45 PM  
I own a home and I'm putting it up for sale shortly. I'm hoping to hit the sweet spot of ridiculously low interest rate and not collapsed home price. It's going to take crackerjack timing, Wang.
 
2020-03-04 12:35:06 PM  

OccamsWhiskers: Super Chronic: rubi_con_man: 2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

Huh?

Georgia's got some big fee on mortgages (including refinancing). I don't think it was 2.5%, but it was enough to stop me from recommending a relative refinance her mortgage. Her rate is now above market, but the balance is well under $100k. The standard costs plus bonus GA tax meant a lower rate wouldn't have paid off for almost 10 years.


There are mortgage recording fees. A quick Google search indicates that Georgia's is $1.50 per $500 (or 0.3%). I have a hard time seeing that being a huge factor. Another Google search indicates that the national average is about $125 total (not sure how that's calculated).

I don't think there's any place where it is as much as 2.5%. Or even 1%. Voters would revolt. Voters like to be pro-homeowner.
 
2020-03-04 12:35:31 PM  
Wait 2-4 years for when the housing market crashes again, then buy and make loads of $.
 
2020-03-04 12:39:03 PM  

MugzyBrown: Sucks for you.


It actually is quite nice, I'm happier than I was growing up in the midwest in surroundings like what you described.

Make sure you give us a ringadingy next time you're in the Bronx.  We can have tacos.
 
2020-03-04 12:40:53 PM  

Super Chronic: OccamsWhiskers: Super Chronic: rubi_con_man: 2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

Huh?

Georgia's got some big fee on mortgages (including refinancing). I don't think it was 2.5%, but it was enough to stop me from recommending a relative refinance her mortgage. Her rate is now above market, but the balance is well under $100k. The standard costs plus bonus GA tax meant a lower rate wouldn't have paid off for almost 10 years.

There are mortgage recording fees. A quick Google search indicates that Georgia's is $1.50 per $500 (or 0.3%). I have a hard time seeing that being a huge factor. Another Google search indicates that the national average is about $125 total (not sure how that's calculated).

I don't think there's any place where it is as much as 2.5%. Or even 1%. Voters would revolt. Voters like to be pro-homeowner.


New York requires that you pay then 1$ on every 100$ you borrow on a mortgage.
 
2020-03-04 12:41:30 PM  

akya: zgrizz: Deceptive headline, like so much of Fark!From the article"1. Keep in mind: Owning a home is the No. 1 way most Americans build wealth."That's the long and short of it. You can pay rent to someone else, or you can pay rent to yourself. At the end of the day you will have a higher net worth paying rent to yourself.

This.

In addition to the wealth building, I figure I'm going to need a roof over my house for the rest of my life, which will hopefully be well in excess of the 15-30 year terms of mortgages.


This x2. Look housing is a cost you cannot avoid. Every month someone is going to be earning equity. It can be you or someone else its your call. Also somethin you cannot avoid is growing old (or dying but then who cares in rent vs buy). Owning a house and paying off the mortgage means you have $1k+ in less bills to have to worry about.
 
2020-03-04 12:43:51 PM  

akya: n addition to the wealth building, I figure I'm going to need a roof over my house for the rest of my life, which will hopefully be well in excess of the 15-30 year terms of mortgages.


You sound like you're in your 20s. 

Many people can't afford a home until their 40s... 

.. and it sops up their late savings ... until they have to move out in their 60s ...
 
2020-03-04 12:44:47 PM  

brap: MugzyBrown: Sucks for you.

It actually is quite nice, I'm happier than I was growing up in the midwest in surroundings like what you described.

Make sure you give us a ringadingy next time you're in the Bronx.  We can have tacos.


There's a happy medium. I'm a 20min train ride from center city but still get my privacy and a 2 car driveway.

The idea of having to find a parking spot everyday is a nightmare
 
2020-03-04 12:49:44 PM  

MugzyBrown: brap: This is perhaps the most "suburban" definition of a "home" I have ever read.

Owns home.
Has adjoining neighbors, and actually enjoys it.
Green space is the shared courtyard and the park down the street.
I have a car that I don't even keep in the city because it's so difficult to find parking.
850 square feet, family of three.  You do the math.
See above.

Sucks for you.


He can't hear the neighbors over the sound of how awesome he is.
 
2020-03-04 12:50:23 PM  

ThighsofGlory: He can't hear the neighbors over the sound of how awesome he is.


Just a pretty good neighborhood just outside the city.
 
2020-03-04 1:01:53 PM  

kab: Current housing prices can eat shiat.  You'd have to pay me to buy right now.


*In your area maybe. I can still go but a house for under 100k here.
 
2020-03-04 1:04:23 PM  
Well... there's two possibilities:

1.) China's impending economic collapse results in a mass exodus from US real estate due to a liquidity crush, causing a housing market crash.
2.) China's impending economic collapse results in further investment in US real estate as a safe haven, maintaining or accelerating the ongoing boom.
 
2020-03-04 1:07:11 PM  

rubi_con_man: Super Chronic: OccamsWhiskers: Super Chronic: rubi_con_man: 2. Your state may have fees or taxes on things like borrowed money. add in 2.5% of the house price to cover these.

Huh?

Georgia's got some big fee on mortgages (including refinancing). I don't think it was 2.5%, but it was enough to stop me from recommending a relative refinance her mortgage. Her rate is now above market, but the balance is well under $100k. The standard costs plus bonus GA tax meant a lower rate wouldn't have paid off for almost 10 years.

There are mortgage recording fees. A quick Google search indicates that Georgia's is $1.50 per $500 (or 0.3%). I have a hard time seeing that being a huge factor. Another Google search indicates that the national average is about $125 total (not sure how that's calculated).

I don't think there's any place where it is as much as 2.5%. Or even 1%. Voters would revolt. Voters like to be pro-homeowner.

New York requires that you pay then 1$ on every 100$ you borrow on a mortgage.


Oh yes, a rule probably created to try and squeeze money out of rich people that take large loans and slowly pay it back because the interest is lower than the higher tax brackets. Who cares if it farks the middle class?
 
2020-03-04 1:12:28 PM  

Super Chronic: There are mortgage recording fees. A quick Google search indicates that Georgia's is $1.50 per $500 (or 0.3%). I have a hard time seeing that being a huge factor. Another Google search indicates that the national average is about $125 total (not sure how that's calculated).

I don't think there's any place where it is as much as 2.5%. Or even 1%. Voters would revolt. Voters like to be pro-homeowner.


I think you are mixing transfer taxes and recording fees.

Recording fees are what you pay the court house to make a record of the mortgage in their books for liens and as well as your deed. These fees are usually decided by the local court house at county or city level (sometimes a city is a county like Philadelphia)

This is usually a per page price. If it's 20 pages and a dollar a page you pay $20. I could actually look it up with tools I have here but "effort".
 
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