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(The New York Times)   NYTimes: Tulsi Gabbard smells like borscht   (nytimes.com) divider line
    More: Strange, Democratic Party, Barack Obama, Ms. Gabbard, Representative Tulsi Gabbard, Twitter, Ms. Gabbard's qualification, Hillary Rodham Clinton, Russian news media  
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2047 clicks; posted to Politics » on 12 Oct 2019 at 4:12 PM (38 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2019-10-12 3:06:49 PM  
Tastes like it too.
 
2019-10-12 3:14:02 PM  
No shiat.

/take that any way you want
 
2019-10-12 3:16:57 PM  
As has been said before, she's the new Jill Stein.  She's being funded by the Russians to siphon votes from the Democrats.
 
2019-10-12 3:23:49 PM  
"This whole thing the Democratic Party has done by putting forward this false idea that there was collusion between Russia and Trump has hurt our relations in a huge way with the Russians," Mr. Graham said. "I can't speak for Tulsi, but I think she feels kind of the same way on some of these things."

Sounds familiar.
 
2019-10-12 3:25:58 PM  
Obvious useful tool is obvious.
 
2019-10-12 3:54:40 PM  
Blanche defending you is a sure sign you're a piece of shiat, like him.
 
2019-10-12 3:57:57 PM  
What exactly is her rigging theory? (I apologise if it's in the article, but I used my monthly allotment already.)

For whom is the DNC rigging and how? In 2016, it was for Clinton and by limiting debates. What is she saying is happening now? What specifics can she point to?
 
2019-10-12 4:14:28 PM  

GardenWeasel: Obvious useful tool is obvious.


But is it intentional?  There's no evidence of that so far, but I'm glad that folks like the NY Times are being vigilant in looking for it.

Seems like much ado about nothing; she ain't gonna win.  But frankly, there's a large population of Americans, many of them veterans, who have a taste for isolationism, and a distaste for neoliberal adventurism.   Someone is going to court those voters, whose interests happen to align with Russia's.  Right or wrong, a vast majority of Americans right now have no idea why we should be taking risks in defense of the Kurds
 
2019-10-12 4:24:09 PM  
Her handler prematurely awoke her sleeper cell.
 
2019-10-12 4:24:22 PM  
I see one critical weak point to this plan.

Nobody on the left likes her. Her support (financial and otherwise) comes from the right/Russia/what's the f*cking difference.
 
2019-10-12 4:26:30 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: As has been said before, she's the new Jill Stein.  She's being funded by the Russians to siphon votes from the Democrats.


How the heck does this logic even work? She's running in the Democratic primary, not in the general election as a third party candidate. She's not siphoning votes from anyone.

I'm frankly a bit surprised that an anti-war Democrat (like a certain past senator from Illinois used to be) apparently is a Russian stooge rather than a great patriot now that Trump is the face of the GOP instead of GWB.

In any case, her campaign is going nowhere. If she's backed by Russian resources, they're not getting much return on their investment.
 
2019-10-12 4:26:53 PM  
Tulsi Gabbard, or Build Ratbags?
 
2019-10-12 4:27:48 PM  
Spenser, Bannon, Ron Paul, and Graham in the opening paragraph.  What -- was Satan too busy to return the phone call?
 
2019-10-12 4:30:10 PM  
She won't shut up about being in the military, and she loves her some Assad.
Quick! Someone ask her about the situation in Turkey! I'm sure she'll have a clear, concise answer that won't make her collapse in a puddle of battery acid and random grievances.
 
2019-10-12 4:32:39 PM  

holdmybones: I see one critical weak point to this plan.

Nobody on the left likes her. Her support (financial and otherwise) comes from the right/Russia/what's the f*cking difference.


I know at least 2 actual liberals (as in I've known them for 20 years) who have her on their short list, though she's in 3rd place for both.  There really are longtime liberals who are isolationists, it used to be a pretty standard liberal position, and prioritized drug decriminalization, another pretty standard liberal belief.  A lot of liberals have turned against isolationism merely because Trump is *for* it.  But a lot of, again, longtime liberals have always believed that *any* intervention in the Middle East is a proxy conflict for the oil-grabbers.  There's a significant market for this and most candidates aren't courting it
 
2019-10-12 4:33:56 PM  
Corydon:

I'm frankly a bit surprised that an anti-war Democrat (like a certain past senator from Illinois used to be) apparently is a Russian stooge rather than a great patriot now that Trump is the face of the GOP instead of GWB.

This.  Again, there's a lot of 'if Trump's fer it, I'm agin it' going on here
 
2019-10-12 4:36:56 PM  
But she's so pretty, she can't be a Russian tool.  This is my father's opinion.
Honestly, I don't think she's compromised so much as just stupid.  Gullible tools are useful, too.  That's how we got Veep Quayle.
 
2019-10-12 4:41:47 PM  

Corydon: Marcus Aurelius: As has been said before, she's the new Jill Stein.  She's being funded by the Russians to siphon votes from the Democrats.

How the heck does this logic even work? She's running in the Democratic primary, not in the general election as a third party candidate. She's not siphoning votes from anyone.


not siphoning votes from anyone yet

The narrative is already in place- the evil DNC is biased against candidates like her and is cheating (not quite sure how) to make sure she can't be the nominee.  When the primary is done she can proudly declare third party and mysteriously have lots and lots of funding to run endless TV ads encouraging anti-war democrats to take a stand
 
2019-10-12 4:42:27 PM  

Naido: GardenWeasel: Obvious useful tool is obvious.

But is it intentional?  There's no evidence of that so far, but I'm glad that folks like the NY Times are being vigilant in looking for it.

Seems like much ado about nothing; she ain't gonna win.  But frankly, there's a large population of Americans, many of them veterans, who have a taste for isolationism, and a distaste for neoliberal adventurism.   Someone is going to court those voters, whose interests happen to align with Russia's.  Right or wrong, a vast majority of Americans right now have no idea why we should be taking risks in defense of the Kurds


Lol.  "Neoliberal adventurism".
 
2019-10-12 4:42:27 PM  
The Tulsi Gabbard campaign is just very elaborate Selina Meyer LARPing.
 
2019-10-12 4:43:13 PM  
"You feel like this is just a serious person," Mr. Cernovich said. "She seems very Trumpian."
Fark user imageView Full Size
 
2019-10-12 4:45:48 PM  

Naido: holdmybones: I see one critical weak point to this plan.

Nobody on the left likes her. Her support (financial and otherwise) comes from the right/Russia/what's the f*cking difference.

I know at least 2 actual liberals (as in I've known them for 20 years) who have her on their short list, though she's in 3rd place for both.  There really are longtime liberals who are isolationists, it used to be a pretty standard liberal position, and prioritized drug decriminalization, another pretty standard liberal belief.  A lot of liberals have turned against isolationism merely because Trump is *for* it.  But a lot of, again, longtime liberals have always believed that *any* intervention in the Middle East is a proxy conflict for the oil-grabbers.  There's a significant market for this and most candidates aren't courting it


Full disclosure, my mom actually liked her at first. My mom is definitely moderate dem, and probably puts too much stock in appearance. I sent her a few articles and hinted at her being Stein2.0 and she seems to have cooled on it.

Other than her and the trolls around here, I've never heard anyone speak of her irl.
 
2019-10-12 4:51:16 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: As has been said before, she's the new Jill Stein.  She's being funded by the Russians to siphon votes from the Democrats.


TBH I can't imagine any Dems who would vote for her if she ran third party anyway.
 
2019-10-12 4:52:53 PM  
She (or I should say, her cult leader and handlers) is not good at this. I honestly think she'd rather be surfing. There's not much to her. She was never given the freedom to develop a personality.

Her handlers are authoritarians and opportunists. They'll get nowhere running her as a Republican or an Independent. Dems are more likely to vote for a brown woman.

But her handlers also seem to think that, amongst Dems and maybe the world, women of color get an unfair advantage. That they're handed everything and can't be criticized. That they're somehow untouchable. They were banking on this, and much to their surprise, it's not working. Because these ideas are the fantasies of the privileged and aggrieved. They are not the thought processes  of progressives.

Tulsi is effectively the Black Friend of the alt-right.
 
2019-10-12 4:52:54 PM  
Does anyone know how her antics are playing in Hawaii? Is she flying under the radar there so there's zero chance of a primary challenger? Because she really should be voted out of office.
 
2019-10-12 4:57:36 PM  
Russia drank the last beer in my fridge. They also killed Robert Forster, fixed last year's Super Bowl, produced that Kardashian show, made iPhones entirely from glass, cancelled Firefly, directed The Last Jedi, put vitamin E acetate in weed vape cartridges, got Phil Hartman's wife back on cocaine, broke up Motley Crue, discontinued PB Crisps, and farked up my last haircut.

Fark user imageView Full Size


And for those of you whom have been on the internet since the mid-90s, Russia did, in fact, eat my balls.
 
2019-10-12 5:04:36 PM  

Glockenspiel Hero: The narrative is already in place- the evil DNC is biased against candidates like her and is cheating (not quite sure how) to make sure she can't be the nominee.  When the primary is done she can proudly declare third party and mysteriously have lots and lots of funding to run endless TV ads encouraging anti-war democrats to take a stand


Which third party?

I can't see her making it very far with either Greens or Libertarians.   She is far too socially conservative for both of them.

I don't see a chance of her making it on the ballot in more than one state otherwise, and I don't see her making any significant impact on the outcome as a general election candidate unless she can make it onto the ballot more than a handful of states.

But things are screwy this year; I could totally see something happen that we'd never expect.
 
2019-10-12 5:04:51 PM  

Skeleton Man: Russia drank the last beer in my fridge. They also killed Robert Forster, fixed last year's Super Bowl, produced that Kardashian show, made iPhones entirely from glass, cancelled Firefly, directed The Last Jedi, put vitamin E acetate in weed vape cartridges, got Phil Hartman's wife back on cocaine, broke up Motley Crue, discontinued PB Crisps, and farked up my last haircut.

[Fark user image 425x533]

And for those of you whom have been on the internet since the mid-90s, Russia did, in fact, eat my balls.


Looks like they stole your ability to be funny too.
 
2019-10-12 5:06:07 PM  

Naido: holdmybones: I see one critical weak point to this plan.

Nobody on the left likes her. Her support (financial and otherwise) comes from the right/Russia/what's the f*cking difference.

I know at least 2 actual liberals (as in I've known them for 20 years) who have her on their short list, though she's in 3rd place for both.  There really are longtime liberals who are isolationists, it used to be a pretty standard liberal position, and prioritized drug decriminalization, another pretty standard liberal belief.  A lot of liberals have turned against isolationism merely because Trump is *for* it.  But a lot of, again, longtime liberals have always believed that *any* intervention in the Middle East is a proxy conflict for the oil-grabbers.  There's a significant market for this and most candidates aren't courting it


Isolationism historically isn't a left/right thing so much as it's the policy of whomever is not in power during times of conflict.

Not getting into war is probably the one single thing I think Trump was honest about. Not for any altruistic purposes mind you, but mainly because he's a coward that knows that his bluster doesn't mean shiat to world leaders beyond US soil. The real war is stigginit to the libs with the MAGA base.
 
2019-10-12 5:06:36 PM  

Skeleton Man: Russia drank the last beer in my fridge. They also killed Robert Forster, fixed last year's Super Bowl, produced that Kardashian show, made iPhones entirely from glass, cancelled Firefly, directed The Last Jedi, put vitamin E acetate in weed vape cartridges, got Phil Hartman's wife back on cocaine, broke up Motley Crue, discontinued PB Crisps, and farked up my last haircut.

[Fark user image image 425x533]

And for those of you whom have been on the internet since the mid-90s, Russia did, in fact, eat my balls.


I've been on the internet since the mid-90s and it sounds like I owe you an apology
 
2019-10-12 5:10:54 PM  
while others worry about supportive signs from online bot activity and the Russian news media.

Or we just mark them in Red 1 and mock them relentlessly.
 
2019-10-12 5:12:35 PM  
I see the dude who's been labeled a 4chan style GOP troll, at some point in the way too long I've been on Fark, is pimping Tulsi in comments. "Umm, cuz some dems dont like neoliberalism?" Nice talking points for the fark crowd, glad to see most of us aren't idiots.

Also, most of us don't have a problem with muslims, or gay people, and think people who hate them for stupid reasons (plenty of good reasons to hate someone, they eat ur sandwich out of the work fridge, they like Nickelback, but cuz they're Muslim or gay isn't one. I'll kick your ass out of the weed circle so fast), are pieces of shiat. If there's genocide against Muslims, Tulsi is there. In fact, she could have her very own TV show, called "Tulsi's Place", where every episode is just catching her whacky adventures in foreign lands, where she spends 20 minutes slobbing all over a dictators knob who enforces genocide against Muslims, then spends the rest of the show catting around, finding HILARIOUS ways to spend the briefcases full of cash they hand her for her outstanding Muslim genocide patriotism. Paying cooks to slip pork in sandwiches and catching the "reveal"? WHO KNOWS.

The weird family cult shiat and soothsayer is right out there in the open. "Don't believe your eyes!!!" My ass, she's still racist as fark against Muslims but she totes dropped her entire life militant hatred against others, drilled into her from birth, yeah okay. She just knows, like everyone else, she can't say it in public. Her and her crazy ass father probably support indoctrination sessions for other vulnerable children.

The fact that she's gotten all this weird online following from the usual cast of dipshiats is just the cherry on top. She actually persists their talking points, which to any sane rational human being who hasn't had their head up their ass for 3 years, realizes her interests are probably not ours. When you actually see her actions, and then realize her biggest fans in the media are Bannon, RT, and alt-right nutjobs, you just go, "Yeah, okay that makes sense."

It's been a literal Jill Stein -> Gabbard shift. I wouldn't be surprised at all if she ran as an Indy. I mentioned it on Fark like 6 months ago. Maybe not, but the stream of complete bullshiat in online media that spewed continuously about Stein, basically just scratched out the name in the template and wrote in Gabbard. And made sure to cmd+ctrl f (or whatever the command to find all instances of a name), and change Stein -> "Gabbard. Veteran." to every farking one.

Did I mention she sucks? She sucks.
 
2019-10-12 5:12:35 PM  
I don't like Gabbard.  I hope she loses and drops out soon.  However, this:

"Richard B. Spencer, the white nationalist leader, says he could vote for her."

Is just bullshiat stunts nazis do/say to get media time and see relevant.  Don't take the bait.
 
2019-10-12 5:28:12 PM  

mrshowrules: I don't like Gabbard.  I hope she loses and drops out soon.  However, this:

"Richard B. Spencer, the white nationalist leader, says he could vote for her."

Is just bullshiat stunts nazis do/say to get media time and see relevant.  Don't take the bait.


Why would that particular "stunt" be of any worth? She wasn't a front-runner. She wasn't going to win, so "smearing" her by having Nazis endorse her doesn't really make any sense. If you're going to have Nazis throw their support behind someone to screw up the election, have them support someone like Warren or Biden. Someone who has a chance to be in the General. Not Gabbard. That's just pointless.

No... They like her because she echoes their sentiments, and they think that if the have to deal with a "Democrat" being elected, they might be able to get her in there and then after she's sworn in she'll turn to the camera and say "SUCKERS! I'm really a conservative, and I'm going to ban Muslims, gays, and Jews! Black people can fark right off, too! And my running mate is fired! I changed my mind! I'm going to appoint Donald Trump my new Vice President! Suck it libulardos!!!!!"
 
2019-10-12 5:29:45 PM  
My wife's family was sitting around talking politics a week or two ago. (They're all pretty liberal). My hippie lib sister-in-law says "I kind of like that woman from Hawaii."  She was also a fan of Jill Stein.  Make of that what you will.
 
2019-10-12 5:29:53 PM  
Stephen K. Bannon, President Trump's former chief strategist, is impressed with her political talent. Richard B. Spencer, the white nationalist leader, says he could vote for her. Former Representative Ron Paul praises her "libertarian instincts," while Franklin Graham, the influential evangelist, finds her "refreshing."
And far-right conspiracy theorists like Mike Cernovich see a certain MAGA sais quoi.


That's a Voltron of GFY.
 
2019-10-12 5:32:11 PM  

enry: Stephen K. Bannon, President Trump's former chief strategist, is impressed with her political talent. Richard B. Spencer, the white nationalist leader, says he could vote for her. Former Representative Ron Paul praises her "libertarian instincts," while Franklin Graham, the influential evangelist, finds her "refreshing."
And far-right conspiracy theorists like Mike Cernovich see a certain MAGA sais quoi.

That's a Voltron of GFY.


If something attracts that many flies, it's probably rotten.
 
2019-10-12 5:32:19 PM  
Here's her GOVTRACK scorecard, including ideological comparison to other members of congress and legislation she's been a part of.
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/memb​e​rs/tulsi_gabbard/412532

She looks to be left of center with legislation favoring vets and pot (however, she is mostly known as a Sanders-style anti-war progressive. Interestingly, she sponsored a bill to reintroduce the Fairness Doctrine a couple weeks ago, but there's not much language attached to the bill.

My take is that she's run so hard on anti-war that she's found herself defending Assad and pushed herself into isolationism. Contrary to what Naido proclaimed above, dems have never really been against foreign military intervention, just as repubs haven't either. It depends on the circumstances for both parties in determining support. It might be too much of a generality, but dems support defending preyed upon groups and repubs support wars that protect perceived national interests. Gabbard supports none of those.

Because of that isolationist stance, populists are attracted to her, which includes support on the right. It also may be that she has been an intermittent Fox News guest, because she was a critic of Obama with respect to prosecuting middleeastern wars. Maybe the alt-right cynically supports her (for division purposes) or maybe it's a case of "if I had to choose", but for whatever reason, it's vocal and noticed by the Gabbard camp. And THAT is reflected in her pivots on position and framing of her speeches.

So, cynically, she takes the support she can get. She knows she won't be president in 2020, but the longer she stays in the race, the bigger her name recognition and war chest, regardless of who supports her (maybe she justifies her rightward support as being a bipartisan attraction to her values).
 
2019-10-12 5:52:47 PM  

mrshowrules: I don't like Gabbard.  I hope she loses and drops out soon.  However, this:

"Richard B. Spencer, the white nationalist leader, says he could vote for her."

Is just bullshiat stunts nazis do/say to get media time and see relevant.  Don't take the bait.


There is literally no bait to take. I'm not voting for Gabbard, and Spencer is a nob.
 
2019-10-12 6:03:09 PM  
The only person I've run into that vocal supports her Is mrs. firesign's uncle.

/he voted for Jill Stein in 2016
//in Michigan
///god damn it
 
2019-10-12 6:04:31 PM  

WilderKWight: mrshowrules: I don't like Gabbard.  I hope she loses and drops out soon.  However, this:

"Richard B. Spencer, the white nationalist leader, says he could vote for her."

Is just bullshiat stunts nazis do/say to get media time and see relevant.  Don't take the bait.

Why would that particular "stunt" be of any worth? She wasn't a front-runner. She wasn't going to win, so "smearing" her by having Nazis endorse her doesn't really make any sense. If you're going to have Nazis throw their support behind someone to screw up the election, have them support someone like Warren or Biden. Someone who has a chance to be in the General. Not Gabbard. That's just pointless.

No... They like her because she echoes their sentiments, and they think that if the have to deal with a "Democrat" being elected, they might be able to get her in there and then after she's sworn in she'll turn to the camera and say "SUCKERS! I'm really a conservative, and I'm going to ban Muslims, gays, and Jews! Black people can fark right off, too! And my running mate is fired! I changed my mind! I'm going to appoint Donald Trump my new Vice President! Suck it libulardos!!!!!"


Next week he will be endorsing someone else just for the attention.  I
 
2019-10-12 6:08:06 PM  

JohnnyApocalypse: Here's her GOVTRACK scorecard, including ideological comparison to other members of congress and legislation she's been a part of.
https://www.govtrack.us/congress/membe​rs/tulsi_gabbard/412532

She looks to be left of center with legislation favoring vets and pot (however, she is mostly known as a Sanders-style anti-war progressive. Interestingly, she sponsored a bill to reintroduce the Fairness Doctrine a couple weeks ago, but there's not much language attached to the bill.

My take is that she's run so hard on anti-war that she's found herself defending Assad and pushed herself into isolationism. Contrary to what Naido proclaimed above, dems have never really been against foreign military intervention, just as repubs haven't either. It depends on the circumstances for both parties in determining support. It might be too much of a generality, but dems support defending preyed upon groups and repubs support wars that protect perceived national interests. Gabbard supports none of those.

Because of that isolationist stance, populists are attracted to her, which includes support on the right. It also may be that she has been an intermittent Fox News guest, because she was a critic of Obama with respect to prosecuting middleeastern wars. Maybe the alt-right cynically supports her (for division purposes) or maybe it's a case of "if I had to choose", but for whatever reason, it's vocal and noticed by the Gabbard camp. And THAT is reflected in her pivots on position and framing of her speeches.

So, cynically, she takes the support she can get. She knows she won't be president in 2020, but the longer she stays in the race, the bigger her name recognition and war chest, regardless of who supports her (maybe she justifies her rightward support as being a bipartisan attraction to her values).


Oh I didn't say Dems, I said liberals, and I did it advisedly.  In my lifetime, Dems have mostly been pro-war *in spite* of how liberals feel, mostly so Republicans won't beat them in elections by calling them 'soft on national security'.   The vast majority of liberals I've known in life opposed Vietnam and both Iraq interventions (though less adamantly with the first one).  The only one that very few people opposed was Afghanistan after 9/11.
 
2019-10-12 6:09:37 PM  

firesign: The only person I've run into that vocal supports her Is mrs. firesign's uncle.

/he voted for Jill Stein in 2016
//in Michigan
///god damn it


Jesus that's horrible.  I don't know anyone in real life who would confess such a thing

/anywhere that it matters, anyway.  I know a Stein supporter in TN, but who cares
 
2019-10-12 6:10:55 PM  
I see the Record! here has been Corrected!.  🏆
 
2019-10-12 6:21:00 PM  
And what's wrong with Borscht?  It's a fantastic soup that is rich in flavor and very satisfying.
 
2019-10-12 6:22:51 PM  

RussianPotato: And what's wrong with Borscht?  It's a fantastic soup that is rich in flavor and very satisfying.


Username checks out.

A Russian lady made one for a work get-together once and it was godawful.  I've forced down a lot of lousy food in the name of being polite, but that was one of the worst
 
2019-10-12 6:23:41 PM  
Don't let pesky facts get in the way of a good DNC propaganda piece

Tulsi Gabbard Smears Debunked
Youtube lWfwqxwSUF8
 
2019-10-12 6:25:34 PM  

Corydon: Marcus Aurelius: As has been said before, she's the new Jill Stein.  She's being funded by the Russians to siphon votes from the Democrats.

How the heck does this logic even work? She's running in the Democratic primary, not in the general election as a third party candidate. She's not siphoning votes from anyone.

I'm frankly a bit surprised that an anti-war Democrat (like a certain past senator from Illinois used to be) apparently is a Russian stooge rather than a great patriot now that Trump is the face of the GOP instead of GWB.

In any case, her campaign is going nowhere. If she's backed by Russian resources, they're not getting much return on their investment.


Perhaps if RT wasn't making such obvious attempts to fluff her up, people wouldn't think she's a Russian stooge.
 
2019-10-12 6:28:37 PM  
In before a certain Farker white-knights her...
 
2019-10-12 6:31:06 PM  

FlashHarry: In before a certain Farker white-knights her...


Which one?  There's already one zombie troll in here pimping her.
 
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