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(Re/code)   US companies are moving tech jobs to Canada rather than deal with Trump's immigration policies   (recode.net) divider line
    More: Interesting, Immigration to the United States, Toronto, Immigration, US companies, Employment, foreign tech workers, percent increase, The Envoy  
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698 clicks; posted to Business » on 20 Mar 2019 at 10:29 PM (12 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



23 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2019-03-20 06:15:35 PM  
I thought this was going to happen. I think manufacturing is going to move as well because of tarriffs. We'll see.
 
2019-03-20 06:30:53 PM  
See how philanthropic Trump is? He's helping our neighbors. What a swell guy.
 
2019-03-20 09:56:00 PM  
i.imgur.comView Full Size
 
2019-03-20 10:11:11 PM  
President Unintended Consequences strikes again.
 
2019-03-20 10:18:58 PM  
MCGA.
 
2019-03-20 10:33:20 PM  
Thanks, Trudeau.
 
2019-03-20 10:44:29 PM  
Some of my favorite people are immigrants, but the H1B program is pretty much a scam to keep wages down. I'd be happier if those workers were all just given full citizenship - they'd be in a better position to demand fair wages, which is good for them as well as many of the US tech workers who would suddenly be adequate for many of the same jobs.

Even a broken president is right twice a term?
 
2019-03-20 10:45:28 PM  
Good we don't want jobs and money circulating in our economy if it means we have to listen to foreign speak in the line at costco.

/you speak english so we eavesdrop on you like a god damn American!
//I'm scared this won't be recognize as sarcasm.
 
2019-03-20 10:56:06 PM  

OccamsWhiskers: Some of my favorite people are immigrants, but the H1B program is pretty much a scam to keep wages down. I'd be happier if those workers were all just given full citizenship - they'd be in a better position to demand fair wages, which is good for them as well as many of the US tech workers who would suddenly be adequate for many of the same jobs.

Even a broken president is right twice a term?


Are you sure about that? (Keeping wages down?)

From what I can find on pay scales for H1B workers, they make MORE than US tech workers.

img.fark.netView Full Size


"The 2016 median salary reported for H-1B visa applicants was higher than the median salary paid to some U.S. workers in similar high-skill occupations. For example, U.S. workers in computer and mathematical occupations had a median salary of $75,036 in fiscal 2016, a slight increase from 2007, when the median salary was $73,979 (adjusted to 2016 dollars), according to U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics data on all U.S. workers." (H1Bs made $80,000, according to government data).

img.fark.netView Full Size


https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank​/​2017/08/16/salaries-have-risen-for-hig​h-skilled-foreign-workers-in-u-s-on-h-​1b-visas/
 
2019-03-20 10:56:52 PM  
So President Harris and the Democrats in Congress will drastically increase the number of H1-B visas and that'll help American workers because ... ?
 
2019-03-20 11:01:07 PM  

OccamsWhiskers: Some of my favorite people are immigrants, but the H1B program is pretty much a scam to keep wages down. I'd be happier if those workers were all just given full citizenship - they'd be in a better position to demand fair wages, which is good for them as well as many of the US tech workers who would suddenly be adequate for many of the same jobs.

Even a broken president is right twice a term?


The only change that needs to be made is not tie the H1-b visa to a specific company. Let the worker move freely to what ever company needs the most help and is willing to pay.
 
2019-03-20 11:04:19 PM  

sithon: I thought this was going to happen. I think manufacturing is going to move as well because of tarriffs. We'll see.


One of the reasons Tesla is building a factory in Singapore.
 
2019-03-20 11:12:16 PM  

GrailOfThunder: Are you sure about that? (Keeping wages down?)


Pretty sure, yes. I understand many of them are paid well, and the tech field salaries are generally well paid for everyone. I have no doubt the salaries would be even higher without the pool of H1B workers who are very beholden to their sponsor employer. That the H1B's are often doing work well above entry level really doesn't give me any doubts about that. And isn't much of a surprise, many are very sharp and like most immigrants, work their asses off.

Some of the highest-paying companies in your graphic were colluding to keep employee costs lower (anti-poaching agreements), paid a big settlement about it. They were still paying very high salaries, but that doesn't mean they weren't cheating to keep them from being even higher.
 
2019-03-20 11:13:24 PM  

jjorsett: So President Harris and the Democrats in Congress will drastically increase the number of H1-B visas and that'll help American workers because ... ?


Because the money stays in your economy buddy. It's trickle up. They will want to stay guy, because it's nicer to live here than there.
So they will become americans. You would only see this as bad if you were a racist friend.
 
2019-03-20 11:14:38 PM  

GrailOfThunder: OccamsWhiskers: Some of my favorite people are immigrants, but the H1B program is pretty much a scam to keep wages down. I'd be happier if those workers were all just given full citizenship - they'd be in a better position to demand fair wages, which is good for them as well as many of the US tech workers who would suddenly be adequate for many of the same jobs.

Even a broken president is right twice a term?

Are you sure about that? (Keeping wages down?)

From what I can find on pay scales for H1B workers, they make MORE than US tech workers.

[img.fark.net image 443x766]

"The 2016 median salary reported for H-1B visa applicants was higher than the median salary paid to some U.S. workers in similar high-skill occupations. For example, U.S. workers in computer and mathematical occupations had a median salary of $75,036 in fiscal 2016, a slight increase from 2007, when the median salary was $73,979 (adjusted to 2016 dollars), according to U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics data on all U.S. workers." (H1Bs made $80,000, according to government data).

[img.fark.net image 438x498]

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/​2017/08/16/salaries-have-risen-for-hig​h-skilled-foreign-workers-in-u-s-on-h-​1b-visas/



I'm not sure how anyone can live in Silicon Valley on that salary.
img.fark.netView Full Size


And in alarming news, the US is in desperate need of accountants!!!
 
2019-03-20 11:16:03 PM  

OccamsWhiskers: Some of my favorite people are immigrants, but the H1B program is pretty much a scam to keep wages down.


We should pass a law requiring H1B visa employees to be paid a salary that is triple the prevailing wage for the job. I want to see if Fortune 500 companies with more money than God still insist that they can only find the talent they need from overseas.
 
2019-03-20 11:44:27 PM  

GrailOfThunder: Are you sure about that? (Keeping wages down?)


Yes, when they hire those employees they dont have to provide benefits since its through a 3rd party.

The issue isnt with the visas or foreign workers, its about companies not wanting to hire fully capable american workers since they wind up paying more in the long run, its always funny that even as companies like ATT scream for more workers on these visas they are laying off people every quarter.

And this is more about companies using still open tax loopholes to avoid paying yet again
 
2019-03-20 11:45:39 PM  
I work with lots of people from overseas.  They are all young, smart, educated and motivated to succeed.  They are a net positive and most of them are very nice.
 
2019-03-21 12:24:56 AM  

mrmopar5287: OccamsWhiskers: Some of my favorite people are immigrants, but the H1B program is pretty much a scam to keep wages down.

We should pass a law requiring H1B visa employees to be paid a salary that is triple the prevailing wage for the job. I want to see if Fortune 500 companies with more money than God still insist that they can only find the talent they need from overseas.


Then we just come full circle back to this story, with companies moving tech operations to Canada (or another country) and hire the H1Bs there. Cheaper, Easier. That's why many companies moved their calls centers, help desks, data entry, and web design jobs to India. It has nothing to do with "hiring people in the US because they can't find qualified people to fill the jobs" (which is supposed to be one of the requirements to hiring an H-1B in the first place), but "we can't find qualified people to fill the jobs at the salary level we want to pay."
 
2019-03-21 02:47:21 AM  
Of course there's a skills shortage. Back in the day, when workers didn't have the skills a company needed, they were forced to invest time and money into training them. Now they invest that money into lobbying for their allotment of indentured servants from overseas to be increased instead.

We decided to manufacture all our products elsewhere and then ship them back to America because the lower standard of living overseas means lower costs. Now we've applied the same logic to our workforce. And just like with outsourcing production of goods, economists say this is an overall net positive, as they always have, but the middle class has been hollowing out for more than forty years now with no signs of stopping.
 
2019-03-21 09:14:57 AM  
I wish I were dumb enough to believe that in a nation of 340 million people, there's no way to find people to do tech jobs.

Imagine being so gullible, naive, and stupid.  You'd just mindlessly wander through life, not a thought in your head, with nothing to bother you.  Like a cow or an oak tree.  That would be great.
 
2019-03-21 12:32:12 PM  

steamingpile: GrailOfThunder: Are you sure about that? (Keeping wages down?)

Yes, when they hire those employees they dont have to provide benefits since its through a 3rd party.

The issue isnt with the visas or foreign workers, its about companies not wanting to hire fully capable american workers since they wind up paying more in the long run, its always funny that even as companies like ATT scream for more workers on these visas they are laying off people every quarter.

And this is more about companies using still open tax loopholes to avoid paying yet again


Companies do not have to pay the matching Social Security tax, so H1-b employees will always be cheaper. B
 
2019-03-21 01:45:01 PM  

2chris2: I wish I were dumb enough to believe that in a nation of 340 million people, there's no way to find people to do tech jobs.

Imagine being so gullible, naive, and stupid.  You'd just mindlessly wander through life, not a thought in your head, with nothing to bother you.  Like a cow or an oak tree.  That would be great.


Donald trump is your president. Maybe it's reasonable to think you couldn't find intelligent people in a country that allowed that to happen.
 
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