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(ABC News)   Geez, one little mistake and suddenly everyone's all over your ass. OK, I fibbed to get a search warrant that got four cops shot and two citizens killed, but why rake a guy over the coals for something trivial like that?   (abcnews.go.com) divider line
    More: Followup, ABC News, Houston police, American Broadcasting Company, Good Morning America, knock warrant, Privacy policy, Internet privacy, Diane Sawyer  
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12954 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Feb 2019 at 4:35 PM (9 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2019-02-17 01:14:57 PM  
So when will the cop that lied and caused the death of 2 and 4 police officers to be shot be charged with murder and attempted murder of police?
 
2019-02-17 01:16:29 PM  
WTF?! It's a shame the homeowner only had a revolver.
 
2019-02-17 01:23:14 PM  
No no no - I have been assured on this very site that the police would never railroad someone who wasn't guilty just to close a case.  An actual officer told me himself that police are interested in solving cases, not closing them, and would never ever EVER put forward truthful evidence that leads to a wrong conviction - and certainly would never make a false statement.

He also called me down for being distrustful of the police.  I have no idea why I would have cause to think the police are dishonest, heavily armed, state-sponsored gang members with poor impulse control.
 
2019-02-17 01:49:22 PM  
Name the most prominent street gang that wears blue?  nope .... yesssss

/The seldom used option (B) vacation time vehicle.
 
2019-02-17 03:39:20 PM  
Even if the house did contain black tar heroin, what the fark is the need of a no-knock raid for that?  Unless someone inside is in imminent danger, you can afford to properly announce your presence.
 
2019-02-17 03:43:29 PM  

eurotrader: So when will the cop that lied and caused the death of 2 and 4 police officers to be shot be charged with murder and attempted murder of police?


Any
Day
Now
 
2019-02-17 04:14:11 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: An actual officer told me himself that police are interested in solving cases, not closing them, and would never ever EVER put forward truthful evidence that leads to a wrong conviction - and certainly would never make a false statement.


If you're talking about me I suggest you go back and re-read the other thread.
 
2019-02-17 04:21:43 PM  
oh man, if only there were some sort of 2A rights organization that could speak out against these kinds of police shootings
 
2019-02-17 04:41:11 PM  

eurotrader: So when will the cop that lied and caused the death of 2 and 4 police officers to be shot be charged with murder and attempted murder of police?


I think you mean to say will be investigated, given a long paid vacation then found to be absolved of all wrongdoing once the public eye is elsewhere and then given a promotion for the hardship of a paid vacation.
 
2019-02-17 04:45:16 PM  

NeoCortex42: Even if the house did contain black tar heroin, what the fark is the need of a no-knock raid for that?  Unless someone inside is in imminent danger, you can afford to properly announce your presence.


ok wait a minute.  I'm not down with the lying officer by any stretch, but for the rest of them that thought this was legit, my guess is this was not the first time they'd become aware of this house and they likely knew these were unsavory characters.

That was backed up by both the pit bull rushing the door (yeah I get it, stand your ground), and her coming out firing.

All in all just a bad situation, but let's not go overboard with the outrage here.  They were not model citizens.

Again, not justifying the dude lying AT ALL, but there were other officers there that may not have known about the bullshiat premise and were trying to protect themselves.
 
2019-02-17 04:45:29 PM  
Remember, police are not there to serve and protect. They have absolutely no legal requirement to do so, and the Supreme Court has affirmed this. Police should never be seen as anything but the largest game in town.

They can and will lie to you, this is basic police investigation procedure, but lying to them is a crime. They can take your stuff and force you to prove it wasn't used illegally. A shoot that would send you or I to jail for life won't even make warrant an arrest for Police. Ignorance of the law is no excuse for a defendant, but an officer is not required to know the law to enforce it and can grossly violate the law and still be covered by qualified immunity.

Don't ever trust or put your safety in the hands of the police, because neither are safe in their hands nor any of their concern.
 
2019-02-17 04:48:18 PM  
Hang the bastard,  hang him high.

Hoist his body up to the sky.

And when his tongue sicks out we'll know

That's the end of him (The end of him!)

And the end of the shoooooooooooow!


-Tres Parker
 
2019-02-17 04:49:04 PM  

PawisBetlog: NeoCortex42: Even if the house did contain black tar heroin, what the fark is the need of a no-knock raid for that?  Unless someone inside is in imminent danger, you can afford to properly announce your presence.

ok wait a minute.  I'm not down with the lying officer by any stretch, but for the rest of them that thought this was legit, my guess is this was not the first time they'd become aware of this house and they likely knew these were unsavory characters.

That was backed up by both the pit bull rushing the door (yeah I get it, stand your ground), and her coming out firing.

All in all just a bad situation, but let's not go overboard with the outrage here.  They were not model citizens.

Again, not justifying the dude lying AT ALL, but there were other officers there that may not have known about the bullshiat premise and were trying to protect themselves.


And? 

We have rules of engagement and laws because we expect to behave better than "not model citizens".

Half of our bill of rights deals with "criminal justice reform".

We also expect our government to do things "the right way".
 
2019-02-17 04:49:14 PM  
My experience with Houston cops, from a long time ago, is that there are good ones and bad ones, like anywhere, but to the bad ones, anyone can be a criminal with deadly intent, including the victims. Because citizens aren't cops.  So never assume that the cop is there to help you.  He sure as hell isn't assuming that.
 
2019-02-17 04:50:08 PM  

eurotrader: So when will the cop that lied and caused the death of 2 and 4 police officers to be shot be charged with murder and attempted murder of police?


Considering how the Chief is reacting, and how he's already been relieved of duties while his whole unit is under investigation?  Probably very soon.  Chief Acevedo isn't acting like the cops that normally cover up stuff like this.  Usually, if they're going to pull some Thin Blue Line bullshiat, the chief of police doesn't hold a major press conference walking back what he had said and then announce that one of his cops falsified a warrant.

He seems to have realized how much damage Goines has done, and is trying to salvage the situation by doing what every cop SHOULD do when corruption like this is exposed.

/I'll eat my words if I'm wrong, but this seems completely different from the normal fare we get in situations like this.
 
2019-02-17 04:52:22 PM  
Cops lie.
 
2019-02-17 04:53:57 PM  
Funny how an officer gets shot and all of a sudden the police are so Concerned about cops lying to get warrants.

The question never even would've come up if they hadn't f*cked up the entry.

/LOL this farking schmuck of a cop couldn't even get one of his CIs to take one for the team
//enjoy the underside of that bus
 
2019-02-17 04:54:01 PM  

studebaker hoch: Cops lie.


And kill people
 
2019-02-17 04:55:02 PM  
The way I read the article nothing nefarious happened.

There might be more to the story, granted.

Assuming the police had the wrong house, or whatever, and you come out shooting, you better expect your ass to get shot.

/I live by, and taught my kids, to just lay down and do what cops say--you can sue them later if they went off the rails.
//Wife is a former cop and agrees.
///Son is a Marine MP and agrees.
 
2019-02-17 04:57:44 PM  
"We weren't there willy nilly," Acevedo said.

If all you peasants didn't look like criminals to begin with, we wouldn't have to violate your constitutional rights.
 
2019-02-17 04:58:06 PM  

fickenchucker: The way I read the article nothing nefarious happened.


The guy lied in an affidavit to get a warrant under false pretenses. That's one of the most nefarious things the police can do.
 
2019-02-17 04:58:49 PM  

PawisBetlog: They were not model citizens.


If you ever find yourself saying these words, you're probably saying something horrible.
 
2019-02-17 04:59:01 PM  

PawisBetlog: NeoCortex42: Even if the house did contain black tar heroin, what the fark is the need of a no-knock raid for that?  Unless someone inside is in imminent danger, you can afford to properly announce your presence.

ok wait a minute.  I'm not down with the lying officer by any stretch, but for the rest of them that thought this was legit, my guess is this was not the first time they'd become aware of this house and they likely knew these were unsavory characters.

That was backed up by both the pit bull rushing the door (yeah I get it, stand your ground), and her coming out firing.

All in all just a bad situation, but let's not go overboard with the outrage here.  They were not model citizens.

Again, not justifying the dude lying AT ALL, but there were other officers there that may not have known about the bullshiat premise and were trying to protect themselves.


Dude you are entirely farking wrong. Their neighbours say they were normal people, they were in their late 50s without criminal records, apart from the wife who had a bad check 30 years prior they'd been living in this house for 20 years. Guy was an honorably discharged vet. fark off with your bullshiat.
 
2019-02-17 05:00:04 PM  

fickenchucker: The way I read the article nothing nefarious happened.

There might be more to the story, granted.

Assuming the police had the wrong house, or whatever, and you come out shooting, you better expect your ass to get shot.

/I live by, and taught my kids, to just lay down and do what cops say--you can sue them later if they went off the rails.
//Wife is a former cop and agrees.
///Son is a Marine MP and agrees.


Seriously? There was no probable cause to raid that house. And it was a no-knock raid. Hard to tell it's the police if they come in unannounced and shoot your dog right off the bat. Yeah, maybe the homeowners were tweakers, but this isn't on them. They're dead because the cops f*cked up.
 
2019-02-17 05:00:45 PM  

eurotrader: So when will the cop that lied and caused the death of 2 and 4 police officers to be shot be charged with murder and attempted murder of police?


Well this almost exact situation happened a few years ago, I believe it was in Houston, The homeowner survived and a few cops were wounded. The homeowner ended up getting jail time for the whole thing
 
2019-02-17 05:00:54 PM  

fickenchucker: The way I read the article nothing nefarious happened.

There might be more to the story, granted.

Assuming the police had the wrong house, or whatever, and you come out shooting, you better expect your ass to get shot.

/I live by, and taught my kids, to just lay down and do what cops say--you can sue them later if they went off the rails.
//Wife is a former cop and agrees.
///Son is a Marine MP and agrees.


A no knock warrent means they didn't announce themselves. A normal homeowner would not know they were cops especially when they start shooting family members with shotguns.
 
2019-02-17 05:02:04 PM  

vudukungfu: eurotrader: So when will the cop that lied and caused the death of 2 and 4 police officers to be shot be charged with murder and attempted murder of police?

Any
Day
Now



If you could be bothered to read the story, instead of making a knee-jerk statements based on a Fark headline, you would know the police say the cop committed a crime by submitting a false affidavit and the chief expects an indictment.

Also, they are looking at all other cases based on the lying cop's affidavits.

/ The liar also got himself shot. So we have that going for us. Which is nice.
 
2019-02-17 05:02:51 PM  
The guy's been on the force for 34 years, so it isn't likely to be his first time breaking the rules, and now they're going to "audit" his prior cases, meaning, I presume, asking all his informants, "Hey, did you REALLY do what he said you did in the warrant application?". Oh yeah, he's screwed.
 
2019-02-17 05:03:12 PM  

CruiserTwelve: Benevolent Misanthrope: An actual officer told me himself that police are interested in solving cases, not closing them, and would never ever EVER put forward truthful evidence that leads to a wrong conviction - and certainly would never make a false statement.

If you're talking about me I suggest you go back and re-read the other thread.


How about 
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2019-02-17 05:03:58 PM  

PawisBetlog: All in all just a bad situation, but let's not go overboard with the outrage here.  They were not model citizens.


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2019-02-17 05:04:02 PM  

mathamagical: Dude you are entirely farking wrong. Their neighbours say they were normal people, they were in their late 50s without criminal records, apart from the wife who had a bad check 30 years prior they'd been living in this house for 20 years. Guy was an honorably discharged vet. fark off with your bullshiat.


To be fair to both sides, the article is a dumpster fire.  It's easy to get the impression that this was a minor paperwork glitch on a raid aimed at people who needed raiding.
 
2019-02-17 05:05:01 PM  
They were supposed to be raiding the Buttle household, not the Tuttle household.

Damn typos!
 
2019-02-17 05:05:37 PM  

Monkeyfark Ridiculous: Funny how an officer gets shot and all of a sudden the police are so Concerned about cops lying to get warrants.

The question never even would've come up if they hadn't f*cked up the entry.

/LOL this farking schmuck of a cop couldn't even get one of his CIs to take one for the team
//enjoy the underside of that bus


I'm sure the CI would have backed him up if it had gone smoothly, but now there's nothing the cop can do for or to him, and there's the whiff of homicide charges in the air, so that relationship went right out the window.
 
2019-02-17 05:05:52 PM  
troubling actions of one veteran narcotics officer.

aka your basic scumbag
 
2019-02-17 05:06:56 PM  

LesserEvil: They were supposed to be raiding the Buttle household, not the Tuttle household.

Damn typos!


Other way round.
 
2019-02-17 05:06:57 PM  
So this time they bothered to ask the CIs if they actually bought drugs

Anonymous "mother " called the tip in 2 weeks prior.

For all we know these cops bust in, never announced who they were and the homeowners got shot thinking they were getting home invaded. They had some weed and some white "powder" they think might be something

So farking dumb.

And they kill the wife reaching for a gun ? Sure
 
2019-02-17 05:07:04 PM  

CruiserTwelve: Benevolent Misanthrope: An actual officer told me himself that police are interested in solving cases, not closing them, and would never ever EVER put forward truthful evidence that leads to a wrong conviction - and certainly would never make a false statement.

If you're talking about me I suggest you go back and re-read the other thread.


Maybe don't defend injustice like wrongful convictions so often and people talking about random cops won't feel like a personal attack.
 
2019-02-17 05:07:30 PM  
Meh. Not sorry gun toting drug dealers were shot dead. Prosecute the cop for the false warrant and call it a day.
 
2019-02-17 05:08:28 PM  

PaulWellstoneII: Meh. Not sorry gun toting drug dealers were shot dead. Prosecute the cop for the false warrant and call it a day.


Felony murder.
 
2019-02-17 05:08:34 PM  

Man On Pink Corner: mathamagical: Dude you are entirely farking wrong. Their neighbours say they were normal people, they were in their late 50s without criminal records, apart from the wife who had a bad check 30 years prior they'd been living in this house for 20 years. Guy was an honorably discharged vet. fark off with your bullshiat.

To be fair to both sides, the article is a dumpster fire.  It's easy to get the impression that this was a minor paperwork glitch on a raid aimed at people who needed raiding.


Then it's a shame it's a bad article I've been following this for a while. The cop in question has a previous incident of chasing someone in an unmarked squad car and shooting them to death because they didn't let him merge. The couple by any accounts are pretty much normal. There was no heroin recovered Bor does any source corroborate the idea that they deserved raiding. This isn't cutting corners on police work this was a straight up clusterFark that killed two innocent people.
 
2019-02-17 05:09:45 PM  

PaulWellstoneII: Meh. Not sorry gun toting drug dealers were shot dead. Prosecute the cop for the false warrant and call it a day.


They weren't drug dealers. There is no evidence they were drug dealers. The raid recovered no evidence of drug dealing.
 
2019-02-17 05:11:04 PM  

PawisBetlog: NeoCortex42: Even if the house did contain black tar heroin, what the fark is the need of a no-knock raid for that?  Unless someone inside is in imminent danger, you can afford to properly announce your presence.

ok wait a minute.  I'm not down with the lying officer by any stretch, but for the rest of them that thought this was legit, my guess is this was not the first time they'd become aware of this house and they likely knew these were unsavory characters.

That was backed up by both the pit bull rushing the door (yeah I get it, stand your ground), and her coming out firing.

All in all just a bad situation, but let's not go overboard with the outrage here.  They were not model citizens.

Again, not justifying the dude lying AT ALL, but there were other officers there that may not have known about the bullshiat premise and were trying to protect themselves.


"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects,[a] against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized"; except in the instance of unsavory people with canines commonly referred to as "pit bulls", or if in in the professional opinion of a police officer there is cause to fabricate evidence that can convince a judge or magistrate to issue a 'no knock' warrant.
We don't need no stinking Bill of Rights to interfere with police actions including the right to break into your house and kill all living beings therein and confiscate anything of value.
 
2019-02-17 05:14:12 PM  
Expanding on my other post, if this was playing out like most other police misconduct cases (or like the headline is trying to say it is), HPD would be trying to bullshiat up some other justification for the warrant ("Oh, we had other intelligence that said they were dealing so this lie doesn't matter") or trying to slander them by just casually mentioning what they did find in the house ("Totally germane to them being shot by police, we found some fentanyl and Oxy in their house.  They weren't Good People and might have earned their shooting").  Compare and contrast that to "The affidavit was falsified, and we already know that a serious crime has been committed because of the massive violation of the public's trust so I'm expecting serious charges".

I might be a hopeless naive idealist, but from what's happened and what Chief Avecado said now, I think they're going to throw the book at him.  Just run him up on two counts of murder to start and work their way down.  The chief seems to have grasped how serious the situation is, and realizes how much trust this erodes in his department if he lets it go unpunished, unlike a lot of other police chiefs.
 
2019-02-17 05:15:03 PM  
I can't imagine the intensity of a no-knock raid. It seems like the bar should be pretty high for these -- like, imminent danger to the community (a bomb or something), hostage situations, etc. Putting a bunch of people's lives at risk to take a minuscule quantity of drugs off the street doesn't seem like a reasonable trade-off.
 
2019-02-17 05:15:53 PM  

PawisBetlog: They were not model citizens.


Neither is your president, and no one's gunning for him. These  'not model citizens' had rights that were violated - Illegally obtained warrant and all that, and they were just standing their ground, which in Texas is allowable by law.

Damn you sound jack-booty.
 
2019-02-17 05:16:04 PM  

fickenchucker: The way I read the article nothing nefarious happened.

There might be more to the story, granted.

Assuming the police had the wrong house, or whatever, and you come out shooting, you better expect your ass to get shot.

/I live by, and taught my kids, to just lay down and do what cops say--you can sue them later if they went off the rails.
//Wife is a former cop and agrees.
///Son is a Marine MP and agrees.


I know it's already been pointed out to you that the cop who wrote the affidavit for the warrant out and out LIED, which cops aren't supposed to do (ask your wife and son).  But also ask your wife and son what they would do if almost a dozen people, armed with shotguns, barged into their home in the middle of the night and shot their dog.  Would they just lay down and hope these guys who broke down their front door and blew away their dog were good guys?  Or, being ex-police an ex-military would they grab some weapons to defend themselves and their property?

My father and brother were cops. I was always taught to respect police. But I'm a grown up now.  I'm also white.  My odds of surviving a police encounter are way the hell higher than any non-white.  And it's nice that you teach your kids to just lay down and let authoritarian figures just walk all over them and sue wrongdoers later. But, surely you must know that not everybody has the resources, or skin color, you do.
 
2019-02-17 05:16:21 PM  

mathamagical: This isn't cutting corners on police work this was a straight up clusterFark that killed two innocent people.


I assume there is some technical reason why this isn't felony murder on the part of the law enforcement involved.
 
2019-02-17 05:16:38 PM  
Killed in the Jan. 28 raid were homeowners Dennis TButtle, 59,

FTFY

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2019-02-17 05:18:18 PM  
Acevedo, who asked the public not to paint the 5,200 members of his department "in a broad brush" over the actions of a single officer

Good luck with that.

When the presidential mantra is "all Mexicans sell drugs and are rapists", painting with a broad brush is normal and accepted behavior.
 
2019-02-17 05:19:58 PM  

Keith Dudemeister: I can't imagine the intensity of a no-knock raid. It seems like the bar should be pretty high for these -- like, imminent danger to the community (a bomb or something), hostage situations, etc. Putting a bunch of people's lives at risk to take a minuscule quantity of drugs off the street doesn't seem like a reasonable trade-off.


But violating civil rights of unarmed citizens in order enrich yourself by stealing their property and selling them into slavery gives you a big ol' curly* Q in your indigo undies, so you execute no knock raids and kill anyone who resists for at least two decades because you are the houston PD gabdummit. Yeeeee Haw!

* watch Drawn Together or something, you'll figure it out
 
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