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(Guardian)   Standup comedy is probably doomed thanks to Kevin Hart and Louis CK   (theguardian.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, Comedy, Stand-up comedy, The Comedy Network, Hannah Gadsby, political comedy, new world, last year, death of traditional comedy  
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2973 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 21 Jan 2019 at 12:35 PM (21 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2019-01-21 12:29:48 PM  
TFA: "When comedians say: 'Oh you can't say ANYTHING these days!', what they are actually saying is, 'I don't know how to be funny without stomping on people.' Which is fair enough: not everyone has those skills," says Danish standup and podcaster Sofie Hagen.

Comic James Meehan agrees. "The thing about standup is you can joke about absolutely anything. Nothing is off limits. It's just how well you can write and frame the joke. I know lazy comics who only complain about political correctness because they don't want to update their material. The other people who complain are those who want a platform to spout hateful rhetoric."


Yeah, pretty much, Sofie and James. The comedians complaining about how Kids These Days are "ruining comedy" are actually upset about the fact that they don't know how to make younger people laugh any more. They're out of touch, they aren't relevant to anyone but the slowly-dwindling pool of older fans they've already got, and they're scared to face the long slide downhill.

Kids These Days are pretty much immersed in comedy 24/7. Their diet is like 60% funny memes, 30% funny YouTubers and podcasters, and 10% comedy shows on TV. They don't respond to ads that aren't funny. Burgers and frozen beef can only be sold to Kids These Days if the advertisement is nestled in ironic appropriation of semi-dadaist art-brut memery. They like Jon-Stewart-derived topical-comedy shows better than news shows. Nobody can say that Kids These Days don't like humor. If you can't make them laugh, that's on you.

You used to be able to make Boomers laugh by being racist/sexist, fine. You used to be able to make Gen-Xers laugh by being "ironically" racist/sexist, also fine. You can't make anyone under 35 laugh because they don't think that slurs are "laugh now" buttons, and now you're angry and feel like their stonefaced silence -- or, worse, their failure to buy tickets to your shows -- is taking something away from you, something you're entitled to? Well, no, that's not fine, that's sad.

This is nothing new. Bob Hope started out his career as a quick-witted joke cracker, but basically kept the same routines and the same jokes even as the decades rolled on. Then, as younger audiences stopped laughing, he got increasingly resentful of those same audiences, letting his sets become flabby rants about how kids these days were all smelly hippies until he started getting booed off the stage. Then he started to resent the rest of the industry that stopped seeing him as relevant, mocking the Academy Awards for postponing after King's assassination, and dismissively insulting even actors in their 30s as children, getting angrier and angrier as he found fewer and fewer audiences. Then, at some point in the '70s he shuffled off the stage just started playing golf, to pretty much everyone's general relief.

Comedy is not dying. It is not even close to dying. I can turn on Netflix and find more stand-up sets instantly available than I would have been likely to find in an entire decade before the internet. My phone's podcast app can automatically deliver a hundred fresh hours of comedy from professional comedians every single day. And those are just scratching the surface of what's available on Youtube! We are drowning in comedy. If some middle-aged dude with a tired-ass set can't stay afloat, that's on him.
 
2019-01-21 12:31:29 PM  
So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?
 
2019-01-21 12:33:04 PM  

Mugato: So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?


After all these years, it's still amusing to imagine if Mr. T were gay.
 
2019-01-21 12:35:30 PM  

The_Sponge: Mugato: So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?

After all these years, it's still amusing to imagine if Mr. T were gay.


Or Ralph and Norton from the Honeymooners.
 
2019-01-21 12:39:56 PM  

Mugato: The_Sponge: Mugato: So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?

After all these years, it's still amusing to imagine if Mr. T were gay.

Or Ralph and Norton from the Honeymooners.



Heh.

"Homina homina homina."
 
2019-01-21 12:40:55 PM  

Mugato: So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?


Andrew Dice Clay has been getting a lot of critical notice as an actor recently. I think he's more than ready to put the Dice persona away. The loudmouth greaser routine loses its charm when you're 60 and have a wife and kids.
 
2019-01-21 12:41:36 PM  
lol comparing kevin hart to louis ck
 
2019-01-21 12:42:17 PM  
i.ytimg.comView Full Size

This guy made some very good points in his last Netflix specials about this subject.  And he'll end up disappearing from public view again, not because of any disparaging remarks, but that he can't be reeled in and made to obey.
 
2019-01-21 12:42:54 PM  
Rice is great if you're hungry and want 2000 of something.
 
2019-01-21 12:43:31 PM  
CK and Hart still sell out shows effortlessly and will continue to do so.
 
2019-01-21 12:44:43 PM  
I think Brendon Schaub getting a special is what's going to kill stand-up.

Not anything in this article.

That and that Joe Mande one.
 
2019-01-21 12:44:54 PM  
Do you want Seinfeld and Jay Leno? Because this is how you get Seinfeld and Jay Leno.
 
2019-01-21 12:45:57 PM  
The Fast Show - Arthur Atkinson Complete Part 1
Youtube 6_h0_OUSScc
 
2019-01-21 12:46:17 PM  
People are *still* trying to make the Aziz Ansari thing into a BFD? Ok then, that's so helpful to the #MeToo movement... great idea, turning one person's perspective of a bad date into a public hanging.

/we get it. he's brown.
 
2019-01-21 12:46:54 PM  
'Nanette' should have gone with 'Pat'.
 
2019-01-21 12:48:09 PM  
The comedy audience has changed, and comics will adapt or go fail like always. Comics need to understand this. I'm a Gen-Xer and I thought Louie's new set was hysterical. Millennials take things more seriously than we do, because they actually care about, you know, things. At least it seems that way. Gen-Xer, so I wouldn't know what that feels like.
 
2019-01-21 12:53:06 PM  

pkjun: TFA: "When comedians say: 'Oh you can't say ANYTHING these days!', what they are actually saying is, 'I don't know how to be funny without stomping on people.' Which is fair enough: not everyone has those skills," says Danish standup and podcaster Sofie Hagen.

Comic James Meehan agrees. "The thing about standup is you can joke about absolutely anything. Nothing is off limits. It's just how well you can write and frame the joke. I know lazy comics who only complain about political correctness because they don't want to update their material. The other people who complain are those who want a platform to spout hateful rhetoric."


Yeah, pretty much, Sofie and James. The comedians complaining about how Kids These Days are "ruining comedy" are actually upset about the fact that they don't know how to make younger people laugh any more. They're out of touch, they aren't relevant to anyone but the slowly-dwindling pool of older fans they've already got, and they're scared to face the long slide downhill.

Kids These Days are pretty much immersed in comedy 24/7. Their diet is like 60% funny memes, 30% funny YouTubers and podcasters, and 10% comedy shows on TV. They don't respond to ads that aren't funny. Burgers and frozen beef can only be sold to Kids These Days if the advertisement is nestled in ironic appropriation of semi-dadaist art-brut memery. They like Jon-Stewart-derived topical-comedy shows better than news shows. Nobody can say that Kids These Days don't like humor. If you can't make them laugh, that's on you.

You used to be able to make Boomers laugh by being racist/sexist, fine. You used to be able to make Gen-Xers laugh by being "ironically" racist/sexist, also fine. You can't make anyone under 35 laugh because they don't think that slurs are "laugh now" buttons, and now you're angry and feel like their stonefaced silence -- or, worse, their failure to buy tickets to your shows -- is taking something away from you, something you're entitled to? Well, no, that's not fine, that's sad.

This is nothing new. Bob Hope started out his career as a quick-witted joke cracker, but basically kept the same routines and the same jokes even as the decades rolled on. Then, as younger audiences stopped laughing, he got increasingly resentful of those same audiences, letting his sets become flabby rants about how kids these days were all smelly hippies until he started getting booed off the stage. Then he started to resent the rest of the industry that stopped seeing him as relevant, mocking the Academy Awards for postponing after King's assassination, and dismissively insulting even actors in their 30s as children, getting angrier and angrier as he found fewer and fewer audiences. Then, at some point in the '70s he shuffled off the stage just started playing golf, to pretty much everyone's general relief.

Comedy is not dying. It is not even close to dying. I can turn on Netflix and find more stand-up sets instantly available than I would have been likely to find in an entire decade before the internet. My phone's podcast app can automatically deliver a hundred fresh hours of comedy from professional comedians every single day. And those are just scratching the surface of what's available on Youtube! We are drowning in comedy. If some middle-aged dude with a tired-ass set can't stay afloat, that's on him.


While things are trending the right direction until this is zero you can put your soapbox somewhere decidedly non-politically correct.

https://www.rollcall.com/news/politic​s​/poll-millennial-support-democrats-sli​ps-9-points-two-years
 
2019-01-21 12:55:15 PM  
 
2019-01-21 12:55:56 PM  
FTA: "According to reports, at a recent New York show CK made jokes"

the set is up on youtube. If you actually care to know the tone and context of the jokes, you don't need to rely on "reports"

FTA: It was as ifark had reacted to the new wave of wokeness by indicting political correctness; he became an almost Trump-like figure, amplifying for shock value and catering to an audience who probably felt as if accusations about him were false or insignificant.

That's a hell of a lot of speculation about a hell of a lot of people for someone who hasn't watched the set on youtube where it is readily available to view.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWam-​w​GoRbY

BTW, most of the jokes that made headlines are really him making fun of himself and white male wealth privilege by making petty insults about self evidently virtuous people and acts, which has been his primary schtick for about 10 years.
 
2019-01-21 12:57:29 PM  
Those that can adapt will, those who can't will fade away.  And a new generation of comics will rise in the current landscape.
Want to know the shocking part, this has all happened before and will happen again
 
2019-01-21 12:58:30 PM  
That just means more money for Patton Oswalt.
 
2019-01-21 12:58:36 PM  
Basing your whole act about how "un-PC" you are was stale in 1993.
 
2019-01-21 12:59:01 PM  

lolmao500: lol comparing kevin hart to louis ck


as comedians or offensive people?
[why-not-both.jpg]
 
2019-01-21 01:00:27 PM  
CK and Hart are NOT who define stand-up comedy by any stretch of the imagination. As for Anzari, is he supposed to be a comedian? Yikes.
 
2019-01-21 01:00:31 PM  
I see this is the thread where the people who indiscriminately share pictures and memes of individuals in order to mock some aspect of their appearance or lifestyle proceed to talk about concepts like "punching down" or "empathy".

I sure hope this is true, and even though the article is entirely offensive to nonliterate cultures for its use of writing as a medium to communicate ideas, there's a reason that I am taking the Mike Lowell persona in wild new directions, as I explore the human condition with a series of characters based on geometric shapes.

I mean, let's be honest here, there's only so many ways you can make fun of our 45th (and greatest) President, or Elizabeth from Bioshock Infinite, or my deadbeat dad who refuses to pay child support, before one realizes they can learn so much more by removing humans from the picture and exploring the adventures of the square, the triangle, and the pentagon.

So in one particular post, I'll be talking about an incident where the square kicks a round circle -- later revealed to be a "ball" -- right into the face of the pentagon.  Pentagon is very angry about this, but they also understands this is an opportunity to express his feelings and that if he was to give in to "toxic masculinity", he would potentially stunt his emotional and physical development.

That's when square realizes the stupidity and ignorance of their ways and runs over quickly to apologize.  During this sequence, square runs into triangle and falls to the ground, and a short sequence ensues in which both square and triangle make their way back up to their feet.  This sequence tested incredibly well at focus groups for the University of Kill All Men when it was revealed that square and triangle were not hurt.

So once I got enough practice and I realized the complex and dynamic potential of comedy with the heroes from my fourth-grade math book, I just gradually lost interest in any sort of comedy that would come at the expense of human beings or tangible concepts rooted in a natural understanding of the world.  It's just flat-out funnier this way.

If you have any questions about my post, please recognize that the question mark is an offensive character that represents an exchange and transfer of knowledge and information in a society, a subset of written and verbal communication that has undoubtedly benefited certain groups at the expense of others.
 
2019-01-21 01:01:10 PM  

sirrerun: lolmao500: lol comparing kevin hart to louis ck

as comedians or offensive people?
[why-not-both.jpg]


Not many options until Hart whips it out
 
2019-01-21 01:02:14 PM  

Mike_LowELL: he


GODDAMMIT I BLEW IT
 
2019-01-21 01:02:36 PM  

Mike_LowELL: I see this is the thread where the people who indiscriminately share pictures and memes of individuals in order to mock some aspect of their appearance or lifestyle proceed to talk about concepts like "punching down" or "empathy".

I sure hope this is true, and even though the article is entirely offensive to nonliterate cultures for its use of writing as a medium to communicate ideas, there's a reason that I am taking the Mike Lowell persona in wild new directions, as I explore the human condition with a series of characters based on geometric shapes.

I mean, let's be honest here, there's only so many ways you can make fun of our 45th (and greatest) President, or Elizabeth from Bioshock Infinite, or my deadbeat dad who refuses to pay child support, before one realizes they can learn so much more by removing humans from the picture and exploring the adventures of the square, the triangle, and the pentagon.

So in one particular post, I'll be talking about an incident where the square kicks a round circle -- later revealed to be a "ball" -- right into the face of the pentagon.  Pentagon is very angry about this, but they also understands this is an opportunity to express his feelings and that if he was to give in to "toxic masculinity", he would potentially stunt his emotional and physical development.

That's when square realizes the stupidity and ignorance of their ways and runs over quickly to apologize.  During this sequence, square runs into triangle and falls to the ground, and a short sequence ensues in which both square and triangle make their way back up to their feet.  This sequence tested incredibly well at focus groups for the University of Kill All Men when it was revealed that square and triangle were not hurt.

So once I got enough practice and I realized the complex and dynamic potential of comedy with the heroes from my fourth-grade math book, I just gradually lost interest in any sort of comedy that would come at the expense of human beings or tangible concepts rooted in a natural understanding of the world.  It's just flat-out funnier this way.

If you have any questions about my post, please recognize that the question mark is an offensive character that represents an exchange and transfer of knowledge and information in a society, a subset of written and verbal communication that has undoubtedly benefited certain groups at the expense of others.


Your dad doesn't pay child support because you're in your thirties. Get a job.
 
2019-01-21 01:03:21 PM  
The first thing we need to realize as a nation is that chicks aren't funny.

They can be.

But they're not.
 
2019-01-21 01:04:25 PM  

stoli n coke: Your dad doesn't pay child support because you're in your thirties. Get a job.


IM TRYING MY BEST MOM
 
2019-01-21 01:05:35 PM  

Snapper Carr: That just means more money for Patton Oswalt.


One of his best bits is when he talked about performing at one of our local Indian casinos (Tulalip):

Sellout
Youtube j7r83DLU7oA
 
2019-01-21 01:07:09 PM  

Trik: 'Nanette' should have gone with 'Pat'.


You should write for Mike Huckabee

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2019-01-21 01:08:45 PM  
 
2019-01-21 01:08:49 PM  

stoli n coke: Mugato: So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?

Andrew Dice Clay has been getting a lot of critical notice as an actor recently. I think he's more than ready to put the Dice persona away. The loudmouth greaser routine loses its charm when you're 60 and have a wife and kids.


He dropped the persona quite some time ago.  Has he gone back to it?
 
2019-01-21 01:09:24 PM  
"CK made jokes about survivors of gun violence and minorities such as non-binary teens. When some listeners appeared shocked, he allegedly responded: 'fark it, what are you going to take away, my birthday? My life is over, I don't give a shiat.'"

Thank you for defining comedy.

Two laughs there, actually The first one came at "minorities such as non-binary teens".
 
2019-01-21 01:09:54 PM  
Ron Funches just had a great stand-up special Giggle Fit that kept things quite positive and upbeat.
 
2019-01-21 01:14:06 PM  

gameshowhost: People are *still* trying to make the Aziz Ansari thing into a BFD? Ok then, that's so helpful to the #MeToo movement... great idea, turning one person's perspective of a bad date into a public hanging.

/we get it. he's brown.


Agreed... the main thing I got from that is that he acted maybe a little inappropriately with one specific woman, and was almost more of a misunderstanding than anything else, especially considering unless I missed something, nobody else came forward with their horror stories about Aziz.  Generally, if one comes out, and if they had repeated behavior, then, more come out.

To couch something like that with a Cosby or Weinstein or Louie or Spacey (all with multiple or multiple of multiples of accusations) is stupid.
 
2019-01-21 01:14:06 PM  
"When comedians say: 'Oh you can't say ANYTHING these days!', what they are actually saying is, 'I don't know how to be funny without stomping on people.' Which is fair enough: not everyone has those skills," says Danish standup and podcaster Sofie Hagen."

Now Sophie is punching down at other entertainers. I haven't heard any of her material to know whether she's funny or not, but I've decided to be offended by that remark. See how easy and stupid that is?
 
2019-01-21 01:15:39 PM  
Think about some of the greats through the years, Don Rickles, Bill Cosby, Sam Kinison, Jerry Seinfeld, Richard Pryor, Chris Rock, Mitch Hedberg, Stephen Wright, Jonathan Winters, George Carlin...

All these guys have one thing in common. Charisma

Whether it's understated, or in-your-face, they have "IT". You can have the funniest brain in the world, but if you lack charisma your jokes will fall flat. Even the raunchiest, most offensive jokes have a purpose when they're delivered with purpose
 
2019-01-21 01:18:32 PM  

The Silver Mullet: Rice is great if you're hungry and want 2000 of something.


Saved by the buoyancy of citrus!
 
2019-01-21 01:20:14 PM  

Mr.Poops: Think about some of the greats through the years, Don Rickles, Bill Cosby, Sam Kinison, Jerry Seinfeld, Richard Pryor, Chris Rock, Mitch Hedberg, Stephen Wright, Jonathan Winters, George Carlin...

All these guys have one thing in common. Charisma

Whether it's understated, or in-your-face, they have "IT". You can have the funniest brain in the world, but if you lack charisma your jokes will fall flat. Even the raunchiest, most offensive jokes have a purpose when they're delivered with purpose



Seeing him perform in Vegas back in '98 was probably the first thing I crossed off my "bucket list".

/Glad I had the chance to see him again at a local Indian casino 6 years ago.
 
2019-01-21 01:21:00 PM  
The backlash to the current attempt to neuter comedy is going to be huge and ugly.

Dead baby jokes on the Disney channel. New insults and triggering words will be invented by the score. And yeah, whitey will likely get his due, but it's going to be fun to see the "everything must be inclusive and we must end the set with everyone holding hands and singing kumbaya" group now get, well, stomped on.
 
2019-01-21 01:22:46 PM  

Mr.Poops: Think about some of the greats through the years, Don Rickles, Bill Cosby, Sam Kinison, Jerry Seinfeld, Richard Pryor, Chris Rock, Mitch Hedberg, Stephen Wright, Jonathan Winters, George Carlin...

All these guys have one thing in common. Charisma

Whether it's understated, or in-your-face, they have "IT". You can have the funniest brain in the world, but if you lack charisma your jokes will fall flat. Even the raunchiest, most offensive jokes have a purpose when they're delivered with purpose


i580.photobucket.comView Full Size

/and I like Stephen Wright
 
2019-01-21 01:23:21 PM  

Mr.Poops: Think about some of the greats through the years, Don Rickles, Bill Cosby, Sam Kinison, Jerry Seinfeld, Richard Pryor, Chris Rock, Mitch Hedberg, Stephen Wright, Jonathan Winters, George Carlin...

All these guys have one thing in common. Charisma

Whether it's understated, or in-your-face, they have "IT". You can have the funniest brain in the world, but if you lack charisma your jokes will fall flat. Even the raunchiest, most offensive jokes have a purpose when they're delivered with purpose


Because they adhere to comedy's #1 rule: Funny first. The profanity or offensive tag was most often a punctuation on an already solid joke. Every comedian you mentioned could do a set for network TV with minimal edits, and still have a very solid set.
 
2019-01-21 01:27:39 PM  

stoli n coke: Mugato: So no Andrew Dice Clay, 1980s Eddie Murphy or Zombie Sam Kinison comebacks?

Andrew Dice Clay has been getting a lot of critical notice as an actor recently. I think he's more than ready to put the Dice persona away. The loudmouth greaser routine loses its charm when you're 60 and have a wife and kids.


Always thought he was a bit of a dick - confirmed it when he said he doesn't like Jews being made fun of in comedy. What a farkin' comedic snowflake.
Yes, he's Jewish.
 
2019-01-21 01:28:34 PM  
Standup is fine. It's just the lazy futs who're either too old or too rich to write anything relatable to modern audiences who think it's dying. Seinfeld's "Who are these people?" shtick is as relevant to today's audiences as jokes about airline food was to audiences back when he was at his peak. Adapt or get out of the way.
 
2019-01-21 01:28:38 PM  

stoli n coke: Mr.Poops: Think about some of the greats through the years, Don Rickles, Bill Cosby, Sam Kinison, Jerry Seinfeld, Richard Pryor, Chris Rock, Mitch Hedberg, Stephen Wright, Jonathan Winters, George Carlin...

All these guys have one thing in common. Charisma

Whether it's understated, or in-your-face, they have "IT". You can have the funniest brain in the world, but if you lack charisma your jokes will fall flat. Even the raunchiest, most offensive jokes have a purpose when they're delivered with purpose

Because they adhere to comedy's #1 rule: Funny first. The profanity or offensive tag was most often a punctuation on an already solid joke. Every comedian you mentioned could do a set for network TV with minimal edits, and still have a very solid set.


It's always weird watching a standup set from somebody who you've only seen on 8PM network sitcoms. Billy Gardell genuinely surprised me when I stumbled on a blue set he did for Showtime a few years ago.
 
2019-01-21 01:31:36 PM  
So I ran into a straight white conservative male the other day
[audience boos]
And I told him "why don't you build a wall around your house and stay in there"
[audience cheers]
But I felt bad about saying that. Because if we just wall people like that off, no one can punch that Nazi right in the face!
[audience gives standing applause]

There, waiting for my Oscar hosting invite. I can punch up higher than anyone else.
 
2019-01-21 01:32:02 PM  
Look all I want to know is who is on first. Is that so much to ask?
 
2019-01-21 01:33:23 PM  
Wtf did Louis do wrong? He asked if he could jerk off in front of people. He didn't rape anyone or do anything non consentual. Geez
 
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