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(The New York Times)   If money can buy happiness, then I don't have to rent it   (nytimes.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, Lottery, lottery winners, Swedish lottery winners, Lotteries in the United States, Mega Millions, lottery winnings, Lotteries, subjective well-being  
•       •       •

4413 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Aug 2018 at 1:39 AM (47 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



49 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2018-08-26 01:42:49 AM  
Mitt Romney, why can't you buy more money. Jpg
 
2018-08-26 01:44:47 AM  
It's just that being broke sucks.
 
2018-08-26 01:47:37 AM  
Surprisingly, the increase in wealth caused by winning the lottery has few effects on the physical health of the winners or their children. It seems possible that family wealth might have quite different effects in a less egalitarian society, like the United States.

.
Any chance they get.
 
2018-08-26 01:55:00 AM  
A wise man once said, if it flies, floats or f*cks, better to rent.
 
2018-08-26 01:55:48 AM  
It's almost like not having to worry about your basic survival would make you a bit less anxious. Weird.
 
2018-08-26 01:57:08 AM  
FTFA:  "In this paper, we study long-run e ects of wealth on well-being by leveraging the randomized
assignment of lottery prizes in a sample of Swedish lottery players. We surveyed lottery players about their well-being 5 to 22 years after the lottery event."

/Sucks being poor in Sweden.
//Film at 11
 
2018-08-26 01:58:32 AM  
I bet it depends on your outlook going in. Have you learned to value experience over possessions? Have you learned how the hedonic treadmill is a trap? Get those two things out of the way and you're already happier.
 
2018-08-26 01:58:40 AM  
Who doesn't want to stop having to constantly worry about how much money is left in their account when they just want their basic life necessities met?
 
2018-08-26 02:00:46 AM  
Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.
 
2018-08-26 02:04:34 AM  
I'll Cover You - Rent
Youtube gBo9L82LXf4
 
2018-08-26 02:06:50 AM  

Madman drummers bummers: Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.


The trick is to have enough that you can spend it at a satisfying rate without running out before you die.
 
2018-08-26 02:08:00 AM  

kayanlau: Who doesn't want to stop having to constantly worry about how much money is left in their account when they just want their basic life necessities met?


Define "basic life necessities?" Does that include cigarettes, lotto tickets, alcohol/drugs, heavily processed food, cable tv, massive amounts of meat, the latest smartphone, cars with significantly more than 200HP...?
 
2018-08-26 02:08:20 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-08-26 02:16:03 AM  

jtown: Madman drummers bummers: Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.

The trick is to have enough that you can spend it at a satisfying rate without running out before you die.


I seem to remember the $150,000 figure being thrown around here as the threshold of financial content.

Above that (assuming you don't live some place where 150k is chicken-feed), there's not much return in happiness.
 
2018-08-26 02:20:31 AM  
I'm not really shooting for consistent happiness, I just want to be buoyant enough to avoid the deep lows.
 
2018-08-26 02:21:09 AM  
If it floats, farks, or flies, RENT it...
 
2018-08-26 02:29:31 AM  

sex_and_drugs_for_ian: jtown: Madman drummers bummers: Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.

The trick is to have enough that you can spend it at a satisfying rate without running out before you die.

I seem to remember the $150,000 figure being thrown around here as the threshold of financial content.

Above that (assuming you don't live some place where 150k is chicken-feed), there's not much return in happiness.


Maybe if you're planning to die in the next few years.  I guess you could stretch it to a moderately comfortable 5.  That'd be a subsistence-level 10 years for me assuming I have no major medical problems and don't take vacations.  I own my home and have no debt but there's still food, property tax, insurances of various types, vehicle registration, gas, electricity, internet, phone, clothes, haircuts...

$150k ain't gonna get me to the end unless the end is nigher than I thought.
 
2018-08-26 02:32:42 AM  
Nice subby , here ya go.

'Weird Al' Yankovic - This Is The Life
Youtube N1n5XqwUkYw
 
2018-08-26 02:33:52 AM  

jtown: $150k ain't gonna get me to the end unless the end is nigher than I thought.


Sorry. I should have clarified that I meant those earning 150k/yr.
 
2018-08-26 02:36:11 AM  

sex_and_drugs_for_ian: jtown: Madman drummers bummers: Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.

The trick is to have enough that you can spend it at a satisfying rate without running out before you die.

I seem to remember the $150,000 figure being thrown around here as the threshold of financial content.

Above that (assuming you don't live some place where 150k is chicken-feed), there's not much return in happiness.


Yes, and no.
If I was to live individually, then sure, that is a number that is more than comfortable. I.e. have a personal enjoyable life and sustain that.
If I was married, and especially if with children and according to their number, that number can change (not saying it isn't enough, just that the expense might double or even triple).
That number I assume, doesn't include any expensive hobbies, and those can cost a pretty penny.
Now to take it even up a notch.
If you're someone like me and like to create things, including (hopefully one day soon) patents, that will cost you.

The reason I started this post with living individually, is that I aspire to have an impact on the world around me.
I'd love to have some kind of social venture as part of my retirement that improves the lives of people around the globe.
That won't be cheap.

/ps: If you aren't doing anything with what little you have, you won't do much when you have more
 
2018-08-26 02:38:36 AM  
I've got this town on its knobby little knees
 
2018-08-26 02:40:30 AM  
The power of money is that it provides a lot of peace of mind. You don't worry about your car breaking down, making the rent, losing your job. Those worries are corrosive and it's no surprise when it has an adverse effect on your health and your outlook.
 
2018-08-26 02:50:38 AM  

Resident Muslim: I'd love to have some kind of social venture as part of my retirement that improves the lives of people around the globe.
That won't be cheap.


No aspirations in old age here. My retirement will be basic and on the cheap.

I admire your ambition though.
 
2018-08-26 03:06:45 AM  

sex_and_drugs_for_ian: Resident Muslim: I'd love to have some kind of social venture as part of my retirement that improves the lives of people around the globe.
That won't be cheap.

No aspirations in old age here. My retirement will be basic and on the cheap.

I admire your ambition though.


Thank you.
And I pray that I have actual substance for people to admire (and get inspired by) instead of just thoughts right now.

I am blessed to be touching people's lives right now, but not at the scale and the way that I truly want it.

/I'll keep Fark posted :)
 
2018-08-26 03:17:53 AM  

Resident Muslim: sex_and_drugs_for_ian: Resident Muslim: I'd love to have some kind of social venture as part of my retirement that improves the lives of people around the globe.
That won't be cheap.

No aspirations in old age here. My retirement will be basic and on the cheap.

I admire your ambition though.

Thank you.
And I pray that I have actual substance for people to admire (and get inspired by) instead of just thoughts right now.

I am blessed to be touching people's lives right now, but not at the scale and the way that I truly want it.

/I'll keep Fark posted :)


And for the record, this isn't just altruistic. Part of that dream is to benefit myself.

My thoughts are for a social venture that:
1) excites the target audience
2) changes society for the better, including lifting up the poor
3) creates a positive growth spiral
4) excites investors/participants

Warmongers cannot imagine just how much money can be generated from prosperity under peace.

/hammer:nail
 
2018-08-26 03:44:04 AM  

jjorsett: The power of money is that it provides a lot of peace of mind. You don't worry about your car breaking down, making the rent, losing your job. Those worries are corrosive and it's no surprise when it has an adverse effect on your health and your outlook.


Money doesn't keep your car from breaking down at 2 am in Gary Indiana.  I have money and I love Gary, but I'd rather not be looking for a tow truck at 2 in the morning.
 
2018-08-26 04:02:56 AM  

MrSplifferton: It's almost like not having to worry about your basic survival would make you a bit less anxious. Weird.


The precarious proletariat. A new term.
 
2018-08-26 04:06:11 AM  

jjorsett: The power of money is that it provides a lot of peace of mind. You don't worry about your car breaking down, making the rent, losing your job. Those worries are corrosive and it's no surprise when it has an adverse effect on your health and your outlook.


True.  Also those with a boatload of money dont know who their friends are. Cant trust anyone. Spend alot of time worrying abt loosing it.
 
2018-08-26 04:08:24 AM  

jtown: sex_and_drugs_for_ian: jtown: Madman drummers bummers: Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.

The trick is to have enough that you can spend it at a satisfying rate without running out before you die.

I seem to remember the $150,000 figure being thrown around here as the threshold of financial content.

Above that (assuming you don't live some place where 150k is chicken-feed), there's not much return in happiness.

Maybe if you're planning to die in the next few years.  I guess you could stretch it to a moderately comfortable 5.  That'd be a subsistence-level 10 years for me assuming I have no major medical problems and don't take vacations.  I own my home and have no debt but there's still food, property tax, insurances of various types, vehicle registration, gas, electricity, internet, phone, clothes, haircuts...

$150k ain't gonna get me to the end unless the end is nigher than I thought.


For any decent amount of time thats mac and cheese territory.
 
2018-08-26 05:03:39 AM  
It is a common belief that money can buy happiness.  Many rich people are miserable because they are the only ones who know for a fact this is not true.  Some people have too much money to spend, but nobody has to much to lose.  Feeling you have invested in a sure thing can bring peace of mind, but this is true whether or not that feeling is based on reality.
 
2018-08-26 06:27:23 AM  
There are larger numbers of wealth events in the US through inheritance.  This would be a good study, since most people who regularly play the lottery here can least afford to, and don't know what to do with a big payout.  It would also be interesting to see how bulk single payout lottery winners do compared to those who choose annuity payments.  This should be compared to professional athletes, most of whom end up broke within 5 years of leaving the sport.
 
2018-08-26 06:38:07 AM  
Mind you, hapiness can't buy you money either. So it's actually like they were two different things altogether.
 
2018-08-26 06:59:23 AM  

jtown: sex_and_drugs_for_ian: jtown: Madman drummers bummers: Maybe it's better to be poor and happy than to be rich and miserable, but it's definitely better to be rich and happy.

Does money buy happiness? That would imply a trade - you spend money, you get happiness. I'd say no - it's having the money that leads to happiness, or at least a lot less stress. If you spend it, you don't have it anymore. Result: stress.

The trick is to have enough that you can spend it at a satisfying rate without running out before you die.

I seem to remember the $150,000 figure being thrown around here as the threshold of financial content.

Above that (assuming you don't live some place where 150k is chicken-feed), there's not much return in happiness.

Maybe if you're planning to die in the next few years.  I guess you could stretch it to a moderately comfortable 5.  That'd be a subsistence-level 10 years for me assuming I have no major medical problems and don't take vacations.  I own my home and have no debt but there's still food, property tax, insurances of various types, vehicle registration, gas, electricity, internet, phone, clothes, haircuts...

$150k ain't gonna get me to the end unless the end is nigher than I thought.


It was 150k per year income as the threshold.
 
2018-08-26 08:02:45 AM  

Straight Outta Hate: It is a common belief that money can buy happiness.  Many rich people are miserable because they are the only ones who know for a fact this is not true.  Some people have too much money to spend, but nobody has to much to lose.  Feeling you have invested in a sure thing can bring peace of mind, but this is true whether or not that feeling is based on reality.


Yes, money doesn't necessarily buy happiness but it does buy security, freedom and the resources needed to achieve your aims. Which, as the study suggests, can go quite a long way towards achieving happiness.
 
2018-08-26 08:51:10 AM  
Gordon Bennett:

Yes, money doesn't necessarily buy happiness but it does buy security, freedom and the resources needed to achieve your aims. Which, as the study suggests, can go quite a long way towards achieving happiness.

Money does buy some security, but the more you have, the more you need to secure.
If you have to pay to do something then it does not count as freedom.  However, you can pay other people to do pick up obligations on your behalf.  You can also pay people to allow you to do things that you would not be free to do.
You can be happy with no money what so ever, but money is useful in getting you things that make you and getting rid of things that make you unhappy. Bad experiences and depression are hard to deal with, but if you can overcome then happiness comes from within.
To paraphrase Buddha: There is no way to happiness.  Happiness is the way.
 
2018-08-26 09:28:02 AM  
CASH RULES EVERYTHING AROUND ME EXCEPT WHEN OTHER ASSETS PROVIDE HIGHER RISK ADJUSTED RETURNS CONTROLLING FOR LIQUIDITY PREFERENCES.

/from Wu-Tang Financial
 
2018-08-26 09:43:59 AM  
Yes money can make you happy. Just ask Anthony Bourdain.
 
2018-08-26 10:40:56 AM  
On a related note, this was always a topic that amused me back when I was doing online dating. On the one hand, I didn't really encounter any women crass enough to explicitly state that they were looking for someone with money, (even the ones who put obvious red flags like "no black guys" or "nobody under 6 feet tall" in their profiles.)

On the other hand, women who wrote that they were looking for a man with the accouterments were everywhere:

- "Looking for someone who likes to 'try new things'"
- "Someone who appreciates good food"
...and especially...
- "Someone who likes to travel."

There were also a few even more obvious ones, like

- "Is an adult" (which frequently means having an apartment with no roommates and a car)
- "Knows what he wants out of life" or "driven" (which frequently implies having a career where you're using a professional or postgraduate degree.)

The age bracket I was looking in didn't usually contain references to "secure" or "financially responsible," but I have to assume those are out there too.

To state the obvious, no, you don't need to be wealthy to have any one of those intrinsic immaterial qualities per se. However, in order to live what a lot of people consider a normal, healthy, adventurous middle-class lifestyle in a major city on the East Coast, you basically have to be well into the top 10% of earners on a national scale, and our a great deal of our media portrays this type of lifestyle as "normal" and everyone who makes less as "deficient."
 
2018-08-26 11:01:07 AM  

MrSplifferton: It's almost like not having to worry about your basic survival would make you a bit less anxious. Weird.


This was done in Sweden.  They already don't have to worry about basic survival.
 
2018-08-26 11:17:18 AM  

Martian_Astronomer: On a related note, this was always a topic that amused me back when I was doing online dating. On the one hand, I didn't really encounter any women crass enough to explicitly state that they were looking for someone with money, (even the ones who put obvious red flags like "no black guys" or "nobody under 6 feet tall" in their profiles.)

On the other hand, women who wrote that they were looking for a man with the accouterments were everywhere:

- "Looking for someone who likes to 'try new things'"
- "Someone who appreciates good food"
...and especially...
- "Someone who likes to travel."

There were also a few even more obvious ones, like

- "Is an adult" (which frequently means having an apartment with no roommates and a car)
- "Knows what he wants out of life" or "driven" (which frequently implies having a career where you're using a professional or postgraduate degree.)

The age bracket I was looking in didn't usually contain references to "secure" or "financially responsible," but I have to assume those are out there too.

To state the obvious, no, you don't need to be wealthy to have any one of those intrinsic immaterial qualities per se. However, in order to live what a lot of people consider a normal, healthy, adventurous middle-class lifestyle in a major city on the East Coast, you basically have to be well into the top 10% of earners on a national scale, and our a great deal of our media portrays this type of lifestyle as "normal" and everyone who makes less as "deficient."


I dated a girl just after graduating college.  She liked that I was 'mature'.  I honestly didn't understand, I have a baby face and looked like I could have been a high school senior.  Also, I was (an am) very immature.  I asked her to explain what she meant.

'Ya know, mature.  Like you do adult things.'

Did she mean legally drink alcohol?  Nah...

'Like having a real job and your own place'.

I'm not even saying it's a bad thing or whatever, but what she really meant was that she liked dating a guy who was reasonably well paid and had his own car/condo.  She just didn't feel comfortable saying that.  Which is stupid, imho.  Of all the qualities that a partner can posses, their income has one of the largest impacts on what day-to-day life will be like with them.  It's like the one thing people can't say they want, but one of the most reasonable things to look for.
 
2018-08-26 12:08:29 PM  

MrSplifferton: It's almost like not having to worry about your basic survival would make you a bit less anxious. Weird.


That's missing the point. Obviously being secure makes you happy. This is a direct refutation of the incorrect interpretation of past analysis that were taken to mean that part a certain point, more money doesn't make you happier.

In fact, more money always makes you happier. And significantly so.
 
2018-08-26 12:48:36 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Martian_Astronomer: On a related note, this was always a topic that amused me back when I was doing online dating. On the one hand, I didn't really encounter any women crass enough to explicitly state that they were looking for someone with money, (even the ones who put obvious red flags like "no black guys" or "nobody under 6 feet tall" in their profiles.)

On the other hand, women who wrote that they were looking for a man with the accouterments were everywhere:

- "Looking for someone who likes to 'try new things'"
- "Someone who appreciates good food"
...and especially...
- "Someone who likes to travel."

There were also a few even more obvious ones, like

- "Is an adult" (which frequently means having an apartment with no roommates and a car)
- "Knows what he wants out of life" or "driven" (which frequently implies having a career where you're using a professional or postgraduate degree.)

The age bracket I was looking in didn't usually contain references to "secure" or "financially responsible," but I have to assume those are out there too.

To state the obvious, no, you don't need to be wealthy to have any one of those intrinsic immaterial qualities per se. However, in order to live what a lot of people consider a normal, healthy, adventurous middle-class lifestyle in a major city on the East Coast, you basically have to be well into the top 10% of earners on a national scale, and our a great deal of our media portrays this type of lifestyle as "normal" and everyone who makes less as "deficient."

I dated a girl just after graduating college.  She liked that I was 'mature'.  I honestly didn't understand, I have a baby face and looked like I could have been a high school senior.  Also, I was (an am) very immature.  I asked her to explain what she meant.

'Ya know, mature.  Like you do adult things.'

Did she mean legally drink alcohol?  Nah...

'Like having a real job and your own place'.

I'm not even saying it's a bad thing or whatever, but what she really meant was that she liked dating a guy who was reasonably well paid and had his own car/condo.  She just didn't feel comfortable saying that.  Which is stupid, imho.  Of all the qualities that a partner can posses, their income has one of the largest impacts on what day-to-day life will be like with them.  It's like the one thing people can't say they want, but one of the most reasonable things to look for.


It seems like one could save a lot of awkwardness and words by just saying that they are seeking a professional man (or woman).
 
2018-08-26 01:31:23 PM  
The trick is to understand that this has nothing to do specifically with money.
Money is just the specific variable of today, where generically the happy equation variable is RESOURCE AVAILABILITY.

Do you have plenty of your needed resources? Do you know where the nexxt meal comes from? Do you have to worry, plan, fret , or struggle when it comes to just have the needed resources of life that lead to continued existence and decent probability of procreation?

Nothing else to it really, it is just that simple. If you do not have to regularly ask yourself the questions "when will I get to eat next?" "Where will i sleep tonight?" then life is just significantly less stressful.

The less on your plate where failure to resolve can lead to death(did not get food, did not get water, could not get medical aid, could not be safe when resting, refused opportunity to pass along genes). The happier you will be. The more on your plate that demands resolution provided by you immediately or potential death, the more stressed out you  will be.

Pretty fooking simple equation really. People not sure that their base needs of existence are able to be met into the foreseeable future, are gonna be under some amount of constant stress.
 
2018-08-26 04:28:34 PM  
PvtStash:
Money is just the specific variable of today, where generically the happy equation variable is RESOURCE AVAILABILITY.

There are pretty of unhappy people who are fat and have every material possession they need.  They just do not have what it takes to make them happy.  Happiness is just a healthy state of mind.  It does not even require the ability to reason.  Some of the poorest are happier than some of the richest.
 
2018-08-26 06:40:13 PM  

PvtStash: The trick is to understand that this has nothing to do specifically with money.
Money is just the specific variable of today, where generically the happy equation variable is RESOURCE AVAILABILITY.

Do you have plenty of your needed resources? Do you know where the nexxt meal comes from? Do you have to worry, plan, fret , or struggle when it comes to just have the needed resources of life that lead to continued existence and decent probability of procreation?

Nothing else to it really, it is just that simple. If you do not have to regularly ask yourself the questions "when will I get to eat next?" "Where will i sleep tonight?" then life is just significantly less stressful.

The less on your plate where failure to resolve can lead to death(did not get food, did not get water, could not get medical aid, could not be safe when resting, refused opportunity to pass along genes). The happier you will be. The more on your plate that demands resolution provided by you immediately or potential death, the more stressed out you  will be.

Pretty fooking simple equation really. People not sure that their base needs of existence are able to be met into the foreseeable future, are gonna be under some amount of constant stress.


Again, this is totally kidding the point. They're not comparing "broke and homeless" to "having enough." The point is that AFTER you have enough, money continues to buy happiness.
 
2018-08-26 07:42:59 PM  

Lusiphur: The point is that AFTER you have enough, money continues to buy happiness.


s/buy happiness/alleviate misery/ . My theoretical net worth is higher than most people's. What this means is that my car needing $900 of parts and labor to fix its worn-out evaporative emissions control system is an inconvenience. For someone living paycheck-to-paycheck, a sudden large expense like that means eating ramen for weeks. One day, I will quit my job, take all the money I've saved/invested, and spend the rest of my life doing whatever the fark I want, but today is not this day. This day, we debug python code and un-fsck MySQL databases!!1!

(Work problems meant I spent a lot of time ssh'ed and VPN'ed in instead of having a weekend. I will ask the bosses about taking Aug. 31 off because of that. They may listen.)
 
2018-08-26 08:59:50 PM  
danceswithcrows:
s/buy happiness/alleviate misery/

Counter point: 
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-08-26 11:48:09 PM  

Mitch Mitchell: jjorsett: The power of money is that it provides a lot of peace of mind. You don't worry about your car breaking down, making the rent, losing your job. Those worries are corrosive and it's no surprise when it has an adverse effect on your health and your outlook.

Money doesn't keep your car from breaking down at 2 am in Gary Indiana.  I have money and I love Gary, but I'd rather not be looking for a tow truck at 2 in the morning.


Money keeps you from being anywhere near Gary Indiana at 2am unless you are in the middle of an assisted suicide.
 
2018-08-26 11:49:38 PM  

Straight Outta Hate: It is a common belief that money can buy happiness.  Many rich people are miserable because they are the only ones who know for a fact this is not true.  Some people have too much money to spend, but nobody has to much to lose.  Feeling you have invested in a sure thing can bring peace of mind, but this is true whether or not that feeling is based on reality.


pics.me.meView Full Size
 
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