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(Ars Technica)   Musk to fix Flint's water supply and raise the Edmund Fitzgerald. Because once you have a submarine, anything is possible   ( arstechnica.com) divider line
    More: Cool, CEO Elon Musk, Waterborne diseases, Desalination, Water crisis, Flint water scandal, Water supply network, contaminated water supplies, water filters  
•       •       •

4968 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Jul 2018 at 4:59 AM (18 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2018-07-12 01:54:12 AM  
38 votes:
2018-07-12 05:31:20 AM  
33 votes:
I don't live in Flint, and neither do most of you other assholes, but don't demonize those that are trying to help.
2018-07-12 05:03:23 AM  
24 votes:
^^
Yeah, fawk that guy for even trying, right?
2018-07-12 05:53:07 AM  
20 votes:
Oh, and at least Musk is sending more than just 'Thoughts and Prayers', unlike a certain other 'person in power'.
2018-07-12 05:18:42 AM  
15 votes:
Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?
2018-07-12 07:01:30 AM  
14 votes:
What?!? The guy is just offering water filters to people who can show they need them. Jeez.

img.fark.netView Full Size
2018-07-12 05:01:25 AM  
11 votes:
Gas-powered cars also have a tendency to explode, not just burn.
2018-07-12 06:04:39 AM  
9 votes:

alice_600: Dave2042: Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?

I hate him and his PR campaign trying to make him seem like he's some goddamn Tony Stark.


why do you hate him?
You work for an oil company or something?
2018-07-12 09:46:30 AM  
8 votes:
Haters going to hate

img.fark.netView Full Size
2018-07-12 08:13:06 AM  
8 votes:

Riche: What?!? The guy is just offering water filters to people who can show they need them. Jeez.

[img.fark.net image 541x531]


This.  "Ooh, everything is going to be fixed in a year...or three...maybe four, he should just butt out."  Well, guessing the people at the shiat end of the list who are going to be waiting 4 years PROBABLY are the ones who qualify as needing a water filter.

Jesus fark people.  Judging by all of the links (and the duplicate 5 threads up from this one) someone is REALLY invested in telling people that rich people shouldn't ever do anything for anyone and we should all just know our place and be patient.
2018-07-12 08:22:33 AM  
7 votes:

alice_600: LowbrowDeluxe: Riche: What?!? The guy is just offering water filters to people who can show they need them. Jeez.

[img.fark.net image 541x531]

This.  "Ooh, everything is going to be fixed in a year...or three...maybe four, he should just butt out."  Well, guessing the people at the shiat end of the list who are going to be waiting 4 years PROBABLY are the ones who qualify as needing a water filter.

Jesus fark people.  Judging by all of the links (and the duplicate 5 threads up from this one) someone is REALLY invested in telling people that rich people shouldn't ever do anything for anyone and we should all just know our place and be patient.

Everyone the past three years of this mess has by now a water filter. What's going on now is the wait and no I don't need a rich guy to help us.


You do realize we're not talking about a 1 gallon Brita?  If no one at all anywhere in the city needs it, well all well and good, then.  They don't.  Not sure how the offer is a problem, but if it's not needed it's not needed.  Hell of thing to speak for every other single person and tell him to fark off if any of them do, though.
2018-07-12 06:46:06 AM  
7 votes:
The need for charity is a symptom of wealth inequity, not a solution.

Of course things should not be ignored, but leaving it at just that simply glosses over the larger problems.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpAMb​p​Q8J7g&t=21s
2018-07-12 06:29:51 AM  
7 votes:

mr lawson: alice_600: Dave2042: Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?

I hate him and his PR campaign trying to make him seem like he's some goddamn Tony Stark.

why do you hate him?
You work for an oil company or something?


No I used to work in local t.v. and radio. I also studied media's behind the scenes workings and dramas since I was 8 years old. So I know when someone is being an attention whore for a PR photo op. I also learned to not follow the crowd and question all I am handed to me as information.

Flint has made a lot of progress and all those celebrities who are showing up now with filters and bottled water are kinda just jerks who want to look like they're charitable. The problems done with just need to fix the piping and bring the crooks involved to justice that's just like all things going to take time.
2018-07-12 06:01:05 AM  
7 votes:

Dave2042: Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?


I hate him and his PR campaign trying to make him seem like he's some goddamn Tony Stark.
2018-07-12 01:56:12 PM  
6 votes:

alice_600: mrshowrules: This text is now purple: mrshowrules: Haters going to hate

[img.fark.net image 480x270]

Ben Carson is a competent brain surgeon. Would you trust him with your water supply?

Elon Musk is successful across diverse areas of science and entrepreneurship.   If I knew I was going to draw a random problem from a bag and had to pick 1 person beforehand to deal with it.  Musk would be on my short list.

It wouldn't work. Musk is not a inventor he's a businessman who has other people do things for him once he gets the he gets the cash.


Other than the half-dozen of things he has patents on (as in, his name is on the patent, not that he owns the rights).  And, you know, the first thing he did to make money was build a preview of modern directory systems; he wrote the initial code for it himself, then brought in his brother and a friend.  He's still listed a a co-creator on that one and two others; he's also got 3 design patents related to the Tesla.

Granted, he's mostly what I would call a hub: he has ideas and finds people to work with him to implement them.  That's a bit more than just being a good businessman, though.
2018-07-12 08:29:01 AM  
6 votes:

dittybopper: MrScruffles: What I want to know is how the Flint Michigan officials haven't been voted out.  Did the water contaminate their brain to the point of no longer being able to vote?  Maybe I'm wrong, but this issue has been going on for years now hasn't it?

Take a look at the politics of the Flint, MI area:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flint,_M​ichigan#Politics

Most politicians are affiliated with the Democratic party despite the city's elections being nonpartisan.[85] In 2006, Flint was the 10th most liberal city in the United States, according to a nationwide study by the non-partisan Bay Area Center for Voting Research which examined the voting patterns of 237 cities with a population over 100,000. Flint placed just after San Francisco (9) and before Seattle (16) and New York City (21).[93]

Despite that fact, Democrats have been blaming the Republicans for the lead contamination crisis in Flint, MI.  Democrats were in charge, and didn't provide proper oversight and assure that corrosion inhibitors were used when they switched water supplies, and then proceeded to blame the *STATE* government for the problem, when in fact it was wholly a local issue.

This is the sort of thing you get when you have a political monoculture (either left or right, Democrat or Republican).  You get corruption, finger-pointing, and no one has any incentive to actually fix the problem (or prevent it in the first place) because they don't have to worry about the "other side" using it as a campaign issue and losing elections, because the morons keep re-electing them.


It's weird that you're leaving out the actions of the state government that lead to this result and their efforts to cover it up.
2018-07-12 08:25:02 AM  
6 votes:
It's nice that he's simply offering to buy filtration systems instead of demoing some branded gadget.

Still though, we shouldn't really get comfortable waiting for Musk ex Machina to arrive and solve problems, we should be forcing local politicians to drink the unfiltered water until they provide a solution for the problem they caused.
2018-07-12 08:11:30 AM  
6 votes:
Haters gonna hate.  Keep doing you, Elon.
2018-07-12 06:25:26 AM  
6 votes:

alice_600: Again Flints water crisis is ending It just needs time to replace all the pipes in Flint so go away we're getting there we don't need you coming in and pretending to help.


Please explain how it is ending and how people don't need good water until it does especially considering the free bottled water program is being cut off?  What would you suggest for the next few years that it will take to replace 'all the pipes'?
2018-07-12 09:14:11 AM  
5 votes:

alice_600: Munden: Haters gonna hate.  Keep doing you, Elon.

I rather he go away. He's just another Edison disguised as Nicolas Tesla.


I don't particularly care if his motives are altruistic or self serving. When wealthy people want to help, and actually go through the motions of delivering on that help, there's little reason to turn their offers down.  The people in need aren't exactly in a position to choose their saviors.
Why should they?  To support the notion that only a government is allowed to help them?

Governments are just as self serving as the wealthy if not more so. In many cases a government is incapable of fulfilling its promises, despite having plenty of resources and time to do so, simply because it's more interested in milking a problem than solving it.
I mean, flint's water has been a problem for multiple election cycles and it shouldn't even be a discussion at this point. The fact that Elon even has a faucet left to put a filter on is a shame on every local official.

Maybe he's only doing it to feel good, but that is his right. Four years into an ongoing disaster he should be given every brownie point he earns for putting a final end to it.
2018-07-12 08:34:56 AM  
5 votes:

dittybopper: If the reaction of Fark to Donald Trump is any indication, the answer is an emphatic "No, we can not".


So now you are comparing a man who has actually accomplished real things in his life with Donald Trump?
Do you think people should hold accomplished men and hollow frauds in the same level of esteem?
Donald Trump has never had a real job, or been in a real fight. He is not a man, by any reasonable definition, at all, let alone an accomplished one
Comparing him to Musk insults Musk, and human intelligence in general.
2018-07-12 08:19:20 AM  
5 votes:

MrScruffles: What I want to know is how the Flint Michigan officials haven't been voted out.  Did the water contaminate their brain to the point of no longer being able to vote?  Maybe I'm wrong, but this issue has been going on for years now hasn't it?


Take a look at the politics of the Flint, MI area:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flint,_​M​ichigan#Politics

Most politicians are affiliated with the Democratic party despite the city's elections being nonpartisan.[85] In 2006, Flint was the 10th most liberal city in the United States, according to a nationwide study by the non-partisan Bay Area Center for Voting Research which examined the voting patterns of 237 cities with a population over 100,000. Flint placed just after San Francisco (9) and before Seattle (16) and New York City (21).[93]

Despite that fact, Democrats have been blaming the Republicans for the lead contamination crisis in Flint, MI.  Democrats were in charge, and didn't provide proper oversight and assure that corrosion inhibitors were used when they switched water supplies, and then proceeded to blame the *STATE* government for the problem, when in fact it was wholly a local issue.

This is the sort of thing you get when you have a political monoculture (either left or right, Democrat or Republican).  You get corruption, finger-pointing, and no one has any incentive to actually fix the problem (or prevent it in the first place) because they don't have to worry about the "other side" using it as a campaign issue and losing elections, because the morons keep re-electing them.
2018-07-12 08:08:07 AM  
5 votes:

Dave2042: Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?


If the reaction of Fark to Donald Trump is any indication, the answer is an emphatic "No, we can not".
2018-07-12 07:13:19 AM  
5 votes:

Riche: What?!? The guy is just offering water filters to people who can show they need them. Jeez.

[img.fark.net image 541x531]

Oh no this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.
Snyder is responsible for replacing Flint's locally elected government with an Emergency Manager, who in turn is the one who made the decision to switch water supplies from the Detroit system, used without problem for decades, to the Flint River. And who also decided to skip anti-corrosion treatment, which led directly to pipe damage and lead leaching into the water.
The GOP owns this one.
2018-07-12 05:57:40 AM  
5 votes:
Again Flints water crisis is ending It just needs time to replace all the pipes in Flint so go away we're getting there we don't need you coming in and pretending to help.
2018-07-12 05:11:27 AM  
5 votes:

lindseyp: Gas-powered cars also have a tendency to explode, not just burn.


That statement seems dubious. I've witnessed the tendency of many cars to experience oxidation, but never at a rate that could be characterized as either combustion or explosion.
2018-07-11 08:55:10 PM  
5 votes:
He can't keep his cars from catching fire. He's not doing shiat for Flint.
2018-07-12 10:46:26 AM  
4 votes:

eiger: This dude is attention whore personified.


True but that is not what pisses people off.  He's like the poster child of pissing of anti-intellectuals.  He has an optimism about the future and thinks intellectualism and technology can help.  That pisses off certain people for some reason.
2018-07-12 09:36:04 AM  
4 votes:

alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.


This must be really important to you, having posted this here and on Ars Technica.
2018-07-12 09:31:04 AM  
4 votes:

WTFDYW: He can't keep his cars from catching fire. He's not doing shiat for Flint.

img.fark.netView Full Size
2018-07-12 08:39:03 AM  
4 votes:

jso2897: dittybopper: If the reaction of Fark to Donald Trump is any indication, the answer is an emphatic "No, we can not".

So now you are comparing a man who has actually accomplished real things in his life with Donald Trump?
Do you think people should hold accomplished men and hollow frauds in the same level of esteem?
Donald Trump has never had a real job, or been in a real fight. He is not a man, by any reasonable definition, at all, let alone an accomplished one
Comparing him to Musk insults Musk, and human intelligence in general.


You just proved ditty's point.
2018-07-12 08:32:36 AM  
4 votes:

LowbrowDeluxe: alice_600: LowbrowDeluxe: Riche: What?!? The guy is just offering water filters to people who can show they need them. Jeez.

[img.fark.net image 541x531]

This.  "Ooh, everything is going to be fixed in a year...or three...maybe four, he should just butt out."  Well, guessing the people at the shiat end of the list who are going to be waiting 4 years PROBABLY are the ones who qualify as needing a water filter.

Jesus fark people.  Judging by all of the links (and the duplicate 5 threads up from this one) someone is REALLY invested in telling people that rich people shouldn't ever do anything for anyone and we should all just know our place and be patient.

Everyone the past three years of this mess has by now a water filter. What's going on now is the wait and no I don't need a rich guy to help us.

You do realize we're not talking about a 1 gallon Brita?  If no one at all anywhere in the city needs it, well all well and good, then.  They don't.  Not sure how the offer is a problem, but if it's not needed it's not needed.  Hell of thing to speak for every other single person and tell him to fark off if any of them do, though.


It will be years before all of the lines are replaced and the city is ending it's free bottled water program as we speak.  But y'know fark more help.  Alice is good.
2018-07-12 06:05:09 AM  
4 votes:
If this works you can expect to see more of this shiat in Red States around the country.

1. GOP state government engineers or ignores a problem by citing monetary issues that are somehow TOTALLY UNRELATED to their tax cuts for fatcats
2. Problem festers
3. Billionaire "savior" swoops in to save the day on his own terms. Praise be upon the Holy Job Creators (TM)!
2018-07-12 05:34:43 AM  
4 votes:

drew8895: Farking Clown Shoes: I hope he can help put out that raging dumpster fire in the White House, too, while he's at it.

He can navigate his submarine directly through Melanie's escape tunnel.

Musk for pres? 2020 Musk vs. Oprah? Who do I vote for?


Oprah, because the South African national is ineligible to run for President.
2018-07-12 05:33:55 AM  
4 votes:

drew8895: Farking Clown Shoes: I hope he can help put out that raging dumpster fire in the White House, too, while he's at it.

He can navigate his submarine directly through Melanie's escape tunnel.

Musk for pres? 2020 Musk vs. Oprah? Who do I vote for?


errr..i guess Oprah since Musk is ineligible.
2018-07-12 05:24:31 AM  
4 votes:
Oh let him fly his submarine into Flint and do it! Don't be a hater. Who else is going to do it after four years have gone by.
2018-07-12 12:34:00 PM  
3 votes:
If we have reached the point the we the society that needs a water supply, can only think to beg for some wealthy outsider to come save us.
If we the society of people make ourselves so powerless to see to any of our basic needs of life on our own, and we can only image our own lives as a means to provide profit to someone else.

Then we deserve the enslavement we ask for, and death if we do not serve our masters well enough.
2018-07-12 09:41:54 AM  
3 votes:

ThreadSinger: alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.

This must be really important to you, having posted this here and on Ars Technica.


Why do you not want factual information to be posted?
2018-07-12 09:40:42 AM  
3 votes:

mr lawson: alice_600: Dave2042: Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?

I hate him and his PR campaign trying to make him seem like he's some goddamn Tony Stark.

why do you hate him?
You work for an oil company or something?


I hate him because he lies to investors, treats his workers like garbage, builds crappy cars, refused to use the car charger standard that literally every other plug-in car in the US uses, built a giant charging network that other cars can't use - even if they pay for it - in an attempt to create a monopoly on car charging and thus on electric cars, and for making pretend that he's helping by doing absolutely nothing - both in Thailand and here in Flint.

He committed nothing in both cases. He knew the minisub idea wouldn't be practical. He knows that Flint's water has met Federal guidelines for a WHILE now. But he gets people thinking that he's done something.
2018-07-12 09:14:50 AM  
3 votes:

HotWingConspiracy: It's nice that he's simply offering to buy filtration systems instead of demoing some branded gadget.

Still though, we shouldn't really get comfortable waiting for Musk ex Machina to arrive and solve problems, we should be forcing local politicians to drink the unfiltered water until they provide a solution for the problem they caused.


I think the takeaway should be more 'as rich as he is, it's a drop in the bucket compared to the US budget.  shiat ain't hard, it just needs to be done.'  It's not a replacement for government doing it's job, it's a scathing indictment.
2018-07-12 08:37:35 AM  
3 votes:

This text is now purple: Mitch Mitchell: I don't live in Flint, and neither do most of you other assholes, but don't demonize those that are trying to help.

The solution is Flint is simple, it's just prohibitively expensive.

You need to repipe the interior of half the houses in flint, because either the pipes themselves or (much more commonly) their solder joints contain lead.

It's mostly not an issue with the lead in the source water or leeching from the municipal piping.

Repiping is simple. It's just about $20-30k per house.


Ever heard of PEX? Plumbers hate it cause it seriously takes 1/10th the labor for a considerably more reliable product, especially with the modern expansion fittings that never fail as opposed to old compression ones. Materials are about 1/4 cost of copper too.
2018-07-12 08:33:23 AM  
3 votes:

LowbrowDeluxe: alice_600: LowbrowDeluxe: Riche: What?!? The guy is just offering water filters to people who can show they need them. Jeez.

[img.fark.net image 541x531]

This.  "Ooh, everything is going to be fixed in a year...or three...maybe four, he should just butt out."  Well, guessing the people at the shiat end of the list who are going to be waiting 4 years PROBABLY are the ones who qualify as needing a water filter.

Jesus fark people.  Judging by all of the links (and the duplicate 5 threads up from this one) someone is REALLY invested in telling people that rich people shouldn't ever do anything for anyone and we should all just know our place and be patient.

Everyone the past three years of this mess has by now a water filter. What's going on now is the wait and no I don't need a rich guy to help us.

You do realize we're not talking about a 1 gallon Brita?  If no one at all anywhere in the city needs it, well all well and good, then.  They don't.  Not sure how the offer is a problem, but if it's not needed it's not needed.  Hell of thing to speak for every other single person and tell him to fark off if any of them do, though.


Neoliberalism is characterized by austerity measures that are so drastic they convince people they have to do the things themselves that they were paying taxes for.

As a result, they praise Musk for doing what we should have had done already. And people filling in their own road potholes are heroes because it absolves the State from failing its citizens. That is what I'm against when it comes to Flint.
2018-07-12 08:08:37 AM  
3 votes:

Vtimlin: fusillade762: WTFDYW: He can't keep his cars from catching fire. He's not doing shiat for Flint.

a driver is 5 times more likely to experience a fire in a conventional gas-powered car than in an electric car

Of course, there are 1000000x more gas powered cars.


I'm not a rocket surgeon, but I'm pretty sure that's not how statistics work.
2018-07-12 06:31:29 AM  
3 votes:
Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.
2018-07-12 01:10:15 PM  
2 votes:

drxym: mrshowrules: True but that is not what pisses people off. He's like the poster child of pissing of anti-intellectuals. He has an optimism about the future and thinks intellectualism and technology can help. That pisses off certain people for some reason.

A more likely reason is that many of his ideas are pretty stupid.  He's certainly a visionary with ideas ranging achievable to wishful thinking. But even a visionary needs to run their ideas through some kind of sanity filter and not just blurt them out.


Alexander Graham Bell tried to invent a machine that read people's thoughts. His dumb ideas are not why they dislike him.  They will like him more if he was a crazy/foolish inventor/entrepreneur.

Blurting out ideas first so other people in a team can consider them is actually a pretty smart process.  Discuss it afterwards.  Sometimes a foolish idea is only flawed in one and could be adjusted into a pretty good idea.
2018-07-12 12:29:33 PM  
2 votes:
If he actually follows through with this, that will be cool. Has he, yet?

People announce shiat all the time. Announcing you're going to do something and actually doing it are two different things.

Let us know when he actually does it. Until then, it's just PR.
2018-07-12 12:03:20 PM  
2 votes:

mrshowrules: True but that is not what pisses people off. He's like the poster child of pissing of anti-intellectuals. He has an optimism about the future and thinks intellectualism and technology can help. That pisses off certain people for some reason.


A more likely reason is that many of his ideas are pretty stupid.  He's certainly a visionary with ideas ranging achievable to wishful thinking. But even a visionary needs to run their ideas through some kind of sanity filter and not just blurt them out.
2018-07-12 10:49:38 AM  
2 votes:

Mitch Mitchell: I don't live in Flint, and neither do most of you other assholes, but don't demonize those that are trying to help.


FOR THE LOVE OF FSM THIS.
2018-07-12 10:38:59 AM  
2 votes:

alice_600: ThreadSinger: alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.

This must be really important to you, having posted this here and on Ars Technica.

Yeah because I live there.


So Obama-appointed Gina McCarthy resigned for no particular reason?

The Virginia Tech researchers who originally found the high lead levels (and tried to publish them), indicated that the failure was at the local, state, and federal levels.

/If we relied on Democratic appointees alone, the public still wouldn't know about the lead problem.
2018-07-12 10:18:17 AM  
2 votes:

mrshowrules: This text is now purple: mrshowrules: Haters going to hate

[img.fark.net image 480x270]

Ben Carson is a competent brain surgeon. Would you trust him with your water supply?

Elon Musk is successful across diverse areas of science and entrepreneurship.   If I knew I was going to draw a random problem from a bag and had to pick 1 person beforehand to deal with it.  Musk would be on my short list.


It wouldn't work. Musk is not a inventor he's a businessman who has other people do things for him once he gets the he gets the cash.
2018-07-12 10:11:43 AM  
2 votes:

ThreadSinger: alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.

This must be really important to you, having posted this here and on Ars Technica.


Yeah because I live there.
2018-07-12 10:10:21 AM  
2 votes:

This text is now purple: mrshowrules: Haters going to hate

[img.fark.net image 480x270]

Ben Carson is a competent brain surgeon. Would you trust him with your water supply?


Elon Musk is successful across diverse areas of science and entrepreneurship.   If I knew I was going to draw a random problem from a bag and had to pick 1 person beforehand to deal with it.  Musk would be on my short list.
2018-07-12 09:58:15 AM  
2 votes:

mrshowrules: Haters going to hate

[img.fark.net image 480x270]


Ben Carson is a competent brain surgeon. Would you trust him with your water supply?
2018-07-12 09:34:26 AM  
2 votes:

dittybopper: MrScruffles: What I want to know is how the Flint Michigan officials haven't been voted out.  Did the water contaminate their brain to the point of no longer being able to vote?  Maybe I'm wrong, but this issue has been going on for years now hasn't it?

Take a look at the politics of the Flint, MI area:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flint,_M​ichigan#Politics

Most politicians are affiliated with the Democratic party despite the city's elections being nonpartisan.[85] In 2006, Flint was the 10th most liberal city in the United States, according to a nationwide study by the non-partisan Bay Area Center for Voting Research which examined the voting patterns of 237 cities with a population over 100,000. Flint placed just after San Francisco (9) and before Seattle (16) and New York City (21).[93]

Despite that fact, Democrats have been blaming the Republicans for the lead contamination crisis in Flint, MI.  Democrats were in charge, and didn't provide proper oversight and assure that corrosion inhibitors were used when they switched water supplies, and then proceeded to blame the *STATE* government for the problem, when in fact it was wholly a local issue.

This is the sort of thing you get when you have a political monoculture (either left or right, Democrat or Republican).  You get corruption, finger-pointing, and no one has any incentive to actually fix the problem (or prevent it in the first place) because they don't have to worry about the "other side" using it as a campaign issue and losing elections, because the morons keep re-electing them.


Lying right-wingers will lie. The Flint water crisis was caused by state officials (NOT local), all solidly Republican.
2018-07-12 09:27:19 AM  
2 votes:

lindseyp: Gas-powered cars also have a tendency to explode, not just burn.


Explode?  

Gasoline doesn't work that way.
2018-07-12 08:31:31 AM  
2 votes:

Rapmaster2000: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

Who are you working for?  Is it Big Oil? Big Water? Big Lead?  Mr. Big?  Mr. Mister?


Do you think you have to pay mediocrities to rag on men who have actually accomplished something?
2018-07-12 08:29:50 AM  
2 votes:

Mitch Mitchell: I don't live in Flint, and neither do most of you other assholes, but don't demonize those that are trying to help.


The solution is Flint is simple, it's just prohibitively expensive.

You need to repipe the interior of half the houses in flint, because either the pipes themselves or (much more commonly) their solder joints contain lead.

It's mostly not an issue with the lead in the source water or leeching from the municipal piping.

Repiping is simple. It's just about $20-30k per house.
2018-07-12 08:24:57 AM  
2 votes:

Vtimlin: alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.

Darnell Early was apointed by Jennifer Granholm (D).


I can't call you a liar, but you are lying by omission. Granholm appointed him to the state Natural Resource Commission in 2005. He didn't have anything to do with Flint until 2011 when he was appointed by Snyder (R) to the Flint Review Board. He then went on to become the Emergency Manager in 2013.

The actual decision to switch from DWSD to KWA (the decision which ultimately poisoned Flint's water supply) was made by Ed Kurtz.. Who has since gone on record to say his job "did not include ensuring safe drinking water." He was a real PoS.
2018-07-12 08:13:35 AM  
2 votes:

Munden: Haters gonna hate.  Keep doing you, Elon.


I rather he go away. He's just another Edison disguised as Nicolas Tesla.
2018-07-12 08:10:10 AM  
2 votes:

Vtimlin: alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.

Darnell Early was apointed by Jennifer Granholm (D).


Snyder still started this mess with the emergency managers he appointed.
2018-07-12 07:47:25 AM  
2 votes:
Where's all the black inventors? Maybe they can invent some awesome stuff.
2018-07-12 07:37:02 AM  
2 votes:

alice_600: Dave2042: Yes he's a dickhead, but can we stick to hating him for real stuff that he actually does wrong?

I hate him and his PR campaign trying to make him seem like he's some goddamn Tony Stark.


img.fark.netView Full Size
As far as the Thai are concerned, he IS Iron Man.

/On the wrong side of the universe during the climactic battle. . .
2018-07-12 06:54:10 AM  
2 votes:

drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.


This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.
2018-07-12 06:38:20 AM  
2 votes:

fusillade762: WTFDYW: He can't keep his cars from catching fire. He's not doing shiat for Flint.

a driver is 5 times more likely to experience a fire in a conventional gas-powered car than in an electric car


Of course, there are 1000000x more gas powered cars.
2018-07-12 06:32:21 AM  
2 votes:
I applaud Mr. Musk for doing these things but I have to wonder that if he experiences enough frustration will he turn to evil and become a super villain?

What is the market like for volcano lairs anyway?
2018-07-12 06:17:57 AM  
2 votes:

drew8895: uttertosh: NEDM: drew8895: Farking Clown Shoes: I hope he can help put out that raging dumpster fire in the White House, too, while he's at it.

He can navigate his submarine directly through Melanie's escape tunnel.

Musk for pres? 2020 Musk vs. Oprah? Who do I vote for?

Oprah, because the South African national is ineligible to run for President.

Also Oprah, because of the current bee-shortage crisis.

My brother is a bee keeper! He had 200-300 hives some years ago but they are suffering heavy now with 20% per year bear attacks and heavy bee mite losses. Maybe he's just messing something up, who knows?


Nah, it's kinda globally happening. There's even a movement here in Sweden to help restore our wild bee populations, in case a catastrophic event happens in the 'tame' population. (which is starting to look like it may happen within a decade) It's actually driving a criminal element to steal whole hives over here, too.

/VOTE OPRAH 2020!!!
2018-07-13 10:46:34 AM  
1 vote:

CheatCommando: hariseldon: dittybopper: Despite that fact, Democrats have been blaming the Republicans for the lead contamination crisis in Flint, MI.  Democrats were in charge, and didn't provide proper oversight and assure that corrosion inhibitors were used when they switched water supplies, and then proceeded to blame the *STATE* government for the problem, when in fact it was wholly a local issue.

Indeed, and it ought to be pointed out that the Flint Water Crises happened because the City of Detroit (also predominantly Black and Democrat like Flint) charges out the arse for water, since the city barely has any tax base and thus tries to rape surrounding communities to make up for it and since Flint also has barely any tax base, they couldn't pay the exorbitant fees so the city council decided to switch to the old and busted Flint water system, poisoning all kinda people in the process.

[img.fark.net image 600x340]

I know that Conservatives hate the truth and love to vote up each other's lies, but I am sick of your lying asses getting away with it.

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-wa​y/2016/04/20/465545378/lead-laced-wate​r-in-flint-a-step-by-step-look-at-the-​makings-of-a-crisis


MDEQ Director Dan Wyant and spokesperson Brad Wurfel resign, MLive reports. This comes a day after the Flint Water Advisory Task Force, created by the governor, releases a preliminary report on the crisis and concludes that primary responsibility rests with the MDEQ.


Also from MLive:
the city disregarded federal rules requiring it to seek out homes with lead plumbing for testing, potentially leading the city and state to underestimate for months the extent of toxic lead leaching into Flint's tap water

From the Virginia Tech researchers who first discovered the lead problem in Flint.
Del Toral, gagged and effectively placed under house arrest by EPA Region 5 Administrator and political appointee Susan Hedman . . . Hedman worked hand in hand with MDEQ to cover up Flint's water woes and evade accountability for the growing disaster. EPA knew about MDEQ's illegal actions since at least April 2015, and did nothing to protect Flint residents. EPA has also known about blatant misrepresentations on water lead safety since 2004 across the United States, and has repeatedly helped cover up more recent problems in other cities such as New Orleans.

/Quick side note: Officials in DC didn't do any better than the officials involved in Flint when it came to high lead levels in the water. This is relevant, because the Michigan officials cited the DC report:
When confronted with decades of peer reviewed articles demonstrating that lead in water exposures could cause lead poisoning, especially amongst infants less than 1 year old, Michigan health officials repeatedly cited new research by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control (CDC) that indicated there was nothing to worry about.
The CDC had concluded that exposure to astronomical levels of lead in Washington D.C. drinking water, did not elevate the blood lead of any children over CDC levels of concern even in the "worst case" exposures. It took 6 years of volunteer work by scientists, D.C. citizens and a bi-partisan Congressional Investigation to reveal that this 2004 CDC report was "scientifically indefensible."
2018-07-12 03:01:05 PM  
1 vote:

alice_600: I hate him and his PR campaign trying to make him seem like he's some goddamn Tony Stark.


Tony was an alcoholic and didn't give a rat's arse about philanthropy.

A far better comparison would be Adrian Veidt.

img.fark.netView Full Size
2018-07-12 01:53:37 PM  
1 vote:

dittybopper: Despite that fact, Democrats have been blaming the Republicans for the lead contamination crisis in Flint, MI.  Democrats were in charge, and didn't provide proper oversight and assure that corrosion inhibitors were used when they switched water supplies, and then proceeded to blame the *STATE* government for the problem, when in fact it was wholly a local issue.


Indeed, and it ought to be pointed out that the Flint Water Crises happened because the City of Detroit (also predominantly Black and Democrat like Flint) charges out the arse for water, since the city barely has any tax base and thus tries to rape surrounding communities to make up for it and since Flint also has barely any tax base, they couldn't pay the exorbitant fees so the city council decided to switch to the old and busted Flint water system, poisoning all kinda people in the process.

img.fark.netView Full Size
2018-07-12 01:28:13 PM  
1 vote:

LouisZepher: drew8895: Oh let him fly his submarine into Flint and do it! Don't be a hater. Who else is going to do it after four years have gone by.

Fly his submarine? What is this, Final Fantasy? Does Cid work for him?

img.fark.netView Full Size


Here's hoping he don't suggest storing all of the worlds nuclear waste on the moon.
2018-07-12 12:32:09 PM  
1 vote:

Mitch Mitchell: I don't live in Flint, and neither do most of you other assholes, but don't demonize those that are trying to help.


Yeah, we should demonize the democrats who created the situation...
2018-07-12 12:01:27 PM  
1 vote:

srb68: Elon "Bruce Wayne" Musk


The more general consensus is that Musk is Tony Stark - not Bruce Wayne.
2018-07-12 11:41:15 AM  
1 vote:

WTFDYW: He can't keep his cars from catching fire. He's not doing shiat for Flint.


Do you normally walk into a room asshole first?
2018-07-12 10:13:01 AM  
1 vote:
Did he want to buy Flint as well?  I'm sure no one in Michigan would object to that.   I wouldn't.
2018-07-12 10:10:28 AM  
1 vote:
This dude is attention whore personified.
2018-07-12 09:47:56 AM  
1 vote:
Once you have a submarine, the sky's the limit!
2018-07-12 09:44:56 AM  
1 vote:

BafflerMeal: alice_600: Again Flints water crisis is ending It just needs time to replace all the pipes in Flint so go away we're getting there we don't need you coming in and pretending to help.

Please explain how it is ending and how people don't need good water until it does especially considering the free bottled water program is being cut off?  What would you suggest for the next few years that it will take to replace 'all the pipes'?


The water has passed Federal standards for over two years.
2018-07-12 09:13:54 AM  
1 vote:
How's Elon  doing in Puerto Rico?
2018-07-12 08:53:22 AM  
1 vote:

astelmaszek: This text is now purple: Mitch Mitchell: I don't live in Flint, and neither do most of you other assholes, but don't demonize those that are trying to help.

The solution is Flint is simple, it's just prohibitively expensive.

You need to repipe the interior of half the houses in flint, because either the pipes themselves or (much more commonly) their solder joints contain lead.

It's mostly not an issue with the lead in the source water or leeching from the municipal piping.

Repiping is simple. It's just about $20-30k per house.

Ever heard of PEX? Plumbers hate it cause it seriously takes 1/10th the labor for a considerably more reliable product, especially with the modern expansion fittings that never fail as opposed to old compression ones. Materials are about 1/4 cost of copper too.


This DIY guy right here loves the stuff. I can see why they hate it.
2018-07-12 08:44:55 AM  
1 vote:

lindseyp: Gas-powered cars also have a tendency to explode, not just burn.


The burning battery problem has been fixed.  The new lithium polymer batteries won't have that problem.
2018-07-12 08:36:12 AM  
1 vote:
Bezos should run for president in 20'.
For shiats and giggles
2018-07-12 07:42:09 AM  
1 vote:

alice_600: drxym: Replacing the pipes is the proper way to fix the problem for everyone, not sticking water filters onto the end of the pipes for the handful who ask for it. Besides, the problem is apparently nearly resolved. Seems like just another ill-thought out publicity stunt by Musk who has been on a roll with them recently.

This is why I don't like Musk.His massive ego is not helpful. It seems like all of the Silicon Valley has a Hero complex. If he wants to prove hes the good guy he should just leave things be. Nice gesture, and all but it's a short-term fix that treats the symptoms rather than the cause. What needs to happen is that thousands of miles of old pipe needs to be replaced, from mains all the way to interior fixtures. Children and families need funding for long term care from special education to medical and psychiatric care for the symptoms of lead poisoning for the rest of their lives. This will all take time and reopening old wounds won't help calm uneasy nerves.

So before we go all blaming the DEMS this problem was caused by the GOP-appointed Emergency Manager who was put in place to replace the elected city officials due to financial mismanagement. They're the ones who decided that saving a few shekels by switching water supplies would be the city's salvation; they're also the ones who saved a few more shekels by skipping the anti-corrosion water treatment that kept the existing lead pipe surfaces from leaching lead into the water in the first place.

There are certainly other players in this tragedy, but this one lies squarely on the state GOP and what's turning out to be a very, very bad policy of exerting centralized control over what were formerly locally elected positions.


Darnell Early was apointed by Jennifer Granholm (D).
2018-07-12 07:12:49 AM  
1 vote:

lindseyp: Gas-powered cars also have a tendency to explode, not just burn.


Yeah, I loved those cheesy 1980's TV action shows too.

My favorite ones were the car would go careening off a cliff and blow up BEFORE actually hitting anything. Apparently zero G makes gasoline cares go BOOM! Unlike, say, a rather famous electric powered roadster.

Honestly, I bet the effects teams had great fun setting up and filming those scenes.
2018-07-12 05:23:58 AM  
1 vote:
Enjoy the show
2018-07-12 05:07:49 AM  
1 vote:
TSLA up half % premarket :)
2018-07-12 05:06:35 AM  
1 vote:
I hope he can help put out that raging dumpster fire in the White House, too, while he's at it.

He can navigate his submarine directly through Melanie's escape tunnel.
2018-07-12 05:05:17 AM  
1 vote:
Timely.
 
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