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(Wired)   San Francisco residents have divided into four castes: the Inner Party, the Outer Party, the Service Class, and the Untouchables   ( wired.com) divider line
    More: Scary, San Francisco, San Francisco Bay, United States, Outer Party, San Jose, California, San Francisco Bay Area, California, Social class  
•       •       •

3947 clicks; posted to Geek » on 10 Jul 2018 at 7:59 AM (5 days ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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5 days ago  
Feudalism, you mean.
 
5 days ago  
Uber Drivers.
 
5 days ago  
You mean Inner Party, Outer Party, the Proles, and the Untouchables.

If you're going to make 1984 allusions, you should make the correct ones.
 
5 days ago  
All social systems transition into other systems in the fullness of time. They knew that back in Plato's day.
 
5 days ago  
"CALIFORNIA IS THE future of the United States"

My.... we think highly of ourselves, don't we?
 
5 days ago  

Commander Lysdexic: Feudalism, you mean.


Gee, I wonder how San Francisco and the surrounding areas voted in the last election......

upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size


Hmmmm.  That's odd.  There must be some kind of mistake, because this map has most of that area colored dark blue, meaning that it's heavily Democratic.  But that's not possible, having such a regressive social stratification amongst The Enlightened.

Maybe the data is wrong.
 
5 days ago  
People really need to read the foundational classics of Western civilization. Plato's The Republic is something I find more and more validity in, if you ignore his thoughts on the afterlife and reincarnation. Defensor Pacis is one I refer to when it comes time to discuss theocracies-- a 14th century theologian arguing for secular rule, observing that the tendency toward heterodoxy within a religious institution leads to war which is bad for humanity. Written by someone who was witnessing such calls for war.

There are a lot of fine books that trace all of the previous civics lessons learned by man, but society has seen fit to retain the Bronte sisters instead in our education.
 
5 days ago  

LaChanz: "CALIFORNIA IS THE future of the United States"

My.... we think highly of ourselves, don't we?


Well, they are something like the 6th largest economy in the world.
 
5 days ago  

dittybopper: Commander Lysdexic: Feudalism, you mean.

Gee, I wonder how San Francisco and the surrounding areas voted in the last election......

Hmmmm.  That's odd.  There must be some kind of mistake, because this map has most of that area colored dark blue, meaning that it's heavily Democratic.  But that's not possible, having such a regressive social stratification amongst The Enlightened.

Maybe the data is wrong.


The data is actually perfectly understandable.

The Inner Party is heavily Liberal. Donating money, organizing parties and issuing pithy soundbites lets them feel absolved of any further responsibility to the world around them. This fits what we see from the 'giants' of today.

The Outer Party is also heavily Liberal. In a world of constant corporate surveillance, particular in the tech monsters of Silicon Valley (and Hollywood) your party affiliation is not only known to everyone around you based on what you drive, what you eat, what you wear and what you say, but trying to be contrary -will- negatively impact your income. The Outer Party hangs on to their pseudo-Middle Class purely at the whim of the Inner Party, so dares not change.

The Proles (Service Class) just try to hang on. They are often more Conservative, as they do not have the monetary resources or security to avoid consequences for their actions - so to survive they must work, work and work more. There is no energy for activism. They have jobs that don't give them time off for rallys and events.

And then the Untouchables. They were once Proles and, sometimes, Outer Party members but life took a bad turn. The Inner Party feels righteous about 'helping' them, even though the situation only ever gets worse. The Outer Party contributes through Payroll Deduction to 'help', and takes paid time off for Rallys and Parades to 'help', but accomplishes little or nothing. And the Proles just come along to cater the Rallys and Parades and to pick up the trash afterwards.

This is the Liberal Utopia. People are just too blinded by the dazzle from the Inner Party (millions of dollars jetting off around the world with a tin can to 'help' stranded boys who actually got help from worker drone Proles, gourmet cafeterias of free food in the workplace, private jets, beach bodies, snarky soundbites) to see it.
 
5 days ago  

zgrizz: The data is actually perfectly understandable.


I was being sarcastic.
 
5 days ago  
It was the best of times, It was the worst of times. It was an age of everyone's million dollar home, it was an age of millions of homeless.  It was an epoch of robotic wonders, it was an epoch of immigrants doing menial work.  It had the shine of multiculturalism, it had the dull patina of supremacist rhetoric.  It was a wave of fine restaurants on every corner, it was a placid pool of children starving in their homes.   We were surrounded by beautiful people, we were enveloped with face tattoos and piercings.  More people lived longer than ever, and more people than ever feared imminent doom.  In short, the period was like nothing before it, and entirely like another period in each uncanny particular.

A president with a red face and a loud mouth ruled in the West, and a president with a bald head and a long arm ruled in the East. In both places it was clear that a new order was at hand, but the sequence of that order was obscure to all.
 
5 days ago  

zgrizz: dittybopper: Commander Lysdexic: Feudalism, you mean.

Gee, I wonder how San Francisco and the surrounding areas voted in the last election......

Hmmmm.  That's odd.  There must be some kind of mistake, because this map has most of that area colored dark blue, meaning that it's heavily Democratic.  But that's not possible, having such a regressive social stratification amongst The Enlightened.

Maybe the data is wrong.

The data is actually perfectly understandable.

The Inner Party is heavily Liberal. Donating money, organizing parties and issuing pithy soundbites lets them feel absolved of any further responsibility to the world around them. This fits what we see from the 'giants' of today.

The Outer Party is also heavily Liberal. In a world of constant corporate surveillance, particular in the tech monsters of Silicon Valley (and Hollywood) your party affiliation is not only known to everyone around you based on what you drive, what you eat, what you wear and what you say, but trying to be contrary -will- negatively impact your income. The Outer Party hangs on to their pseudo-Middle Class purely at the whim of the Inner Party, so dares not change.

The Proles (Service Class) just try to hang on. They are often more Conservative, as they do not have the monetary resources or security to avoid consequences for their actions - so to survive they must work, work and work more. There is no energy for activism. They have jobs that don't give them time off for rallys and events.

And then the Untouchables. They were once Proles and, sometimes, Outer Party members but life took a bad turn. The Inner Party feels righteous about 'helping' them, even though the situation only ever gets worse. The Outer Party contributes through Payroll Deduction to 'help', and takes paid time off for Rallys and Parades to 'help', but accomplishes little or nothing. And the Proles just come along to cater the Rallys and Parades and to pick up the trash afterwards.

This is the Liberal Utop ...


And who keep cutting the Proles and Outer Party safety net while giving themselves tax breaks?  Oh right the people who claim to be the party of fiscal responsibility but regularly institute nonsensical deficit spending and service reduction.
 
5 days ago  

Splinthar: And who keep cutting the Proles and Outer Party safety net while giving themselves tax breaks?


You do know who controls the government in San Francisco and in California, right?
 
5 days ago  
They aren't wrong. This is the future. Either debt slavery or neo-feudalism is the path we're heading on.
It's going to get worse, before it gets better. Soon some labor jobs will be replaced with machines. That'll make those with only a high school diploma virtually unemployable. Combine that with the soaring costs of buying a home and I envision a lot more homeless camps.
 
5 days ago  
Clearly, San Francisco isn't progressive enough.
 
5 days ago  
Well, our 2 way view screens have microphones, camera that catch everything we do, so we might be in a dystopian timeline.

Subby, did you take your Soma today? You need to take a holiday.

Come to think of it, maybe this is a brave new utopian timeline
 
5 days ago  
++good
 
5 days ago  

Tyrone Slothrop: LaChanz: "CALIFORNIA IS THE future of the United States"

My.... we think highly of ourselves, don't we?

Well, they are something like the 6th largest economy in the world.


Fifth.
 
5 days ago  

FLMountainMan: Clearly, San Francisco isn't progressive enough.


Economically, it's leaned right for a looooong time.  Free-wheeling gold rush capitalism 24/7/365.
 
5 days ago  

BolloxReader: People really need to read the foundational classics of Western civilization. Plato's The Republic is something I find more and more validity in, if you ignore his thoughts on the afterlife and reincarnation. Defensor Pacis is one I refer to when it comes time to discuss theocracies-- a 14th century theologian arguing for secular rule, observing that the tendency toward heterodoxy within a religious institution leads to war which is bad for humanity. Written by someone who was witnessing such calls for war.

There are a lot of fine books that trace all of the previous civics lessons learned by man, but society has seen fit to retain the Bronte sisters instead in our education.


You just referenced political history books from 1324 and 380 BC, and you're complaining the libraries also preserve the Brontes?

It seems like we don't lack for antique political theory books, either.
 
5 days ago  

dittybopper: zgrizz: The data is actually perfectly understandable.

I was being sarcastic.


His answer was perfectly cromulent, no matter how rhetorical the question.
 
5 days ago  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
5 days ago  

dittybopper: Splinthar: And who keep cutting the Proles and Outer Party safety net while giving themselves tax breaks?

You do know who controls the government in San Francisco and in California, right?


Master Blaster?
 
5 days ago  
You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

I'm guilty of plenty of this myself. I try to be better about it. But I'm probably doing it right now.
 
5 days ago  
Hang on, taking notes.

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
5 days ago  

Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

I'm guilty of plenty of this myself. I try to be better about it. But I'm probably doing it right now.


It's always funny to see techies pontificating about shiat they don't know anything about.  "Oh, this is easy!  I could write an app to eliminate this job in 20 minutes!  Why hasn't anyone else thought of this?"

Narrator:  Everyone else had thought of this, and it's not easy.

/the example that sticks out most in my mind was a thread on Fark about a harbor pilot being filled with people outright declaring the profession was obsolete and that you could get rid of it with an autopilot app that ties in to google maps
 
5 days ago  

Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

I'm guilty of plenty of this myself. I try to be better about it. But I'm probably doing it right now.


I recently saw this on Quora where someone confused 'reasoning' with 'logic.' The problem is that logic is purely structural and does the same thing regardless of the content. So while the logic of an argument may be valid (or 'valid enough' for inductive arguments), it'll return unsound conclusions where the premises are incomplete, incorrect, or nonsense.

Part of the problem with these sorts of appeals to 'LOGIC' is that they presume too much about the axiology of the premises of the argument, that they're from the appropriate universe of discourse, etc. That a conclusion follows from the premises gives terrible arguments the gloss of being logically correct when they're completely unreasonable.
 
5 days ago  

Bonzo_1116: FLMountainMan: Clearly, San Francisco isn't progressive enough.

Economically, it's leaned right for a looooong time.  Free-wheeling gold rush capitalism 24/7/365.


The shiat you guys believe.  It's unreal.

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanfranci​s​co/blog/real-estate/2016/02/millenials​-taxes-san-francisco.html
A new study from financial advisory firm SmartAsset has found that Millennials in San Francisco pay a whopping 26.84 percent in taxes, the highest rate of any city in the nation.

In what way does the city "lean right" economically?
 
5 days ago  

NEDM: Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

I'm guilty of plenty of this myself. I try to be better about it. But I'm probably doing it right now.

It's always funny to see techies pontificating about shiat they don't know anything about.  "Oh, this is easy!  I could write an app to eliminate this job in 20 minutes!  Why hasn't anyone else thought of this?"

Narrator:  Everyone else had thought of this, and it's not easy.

/the example that sticks out most in my mind was a thread on Fark about a harbor pilot being filled with people outright declaring the profession was obsolete and that you could get rid of it with an autopilot app that ties in to google maps


Hah. For me its been the "Every truck driver in the country will be made obsolete by automation in 5 years" pontificating.
 
5 days ago  

FLMountainMan: In what way does the city "lean right"


Looking at a map, it has to lean right.  If it leans left it'll fall into the ocean.
 
5 days ago  

Nurglitch: Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.


Great!  So you would agree that affirmative action polices based on placing people into two or three gender categories, a yes/no disability category, and four or five racial/ethnic categories should be done eliminated, right?
 
5 days ago  
Ya'll are reading way too much into this article, yeesh people in here are acting like its a return to the Middle Ages
 
5 days ago  
Ænima - Tool (With lyrics)
Youtube FYRldZsVO9I

I am just going to leave this here.
 
5 days ago  
It's easy to target San Francisco - and lord knows they're at the extreme in terms of exclusivity - but this is how all major cities are becoming. It's the end result of total gentrification. And it won't stop in just SF or NY or London or other "cosmopolitan" metropolises, though those are the obvious first steps. You can see it in any large urban area, where even the professional class that started the trend gets priced out by the business class. City centers that get too trendy and price their residents out so you're left with nothing but lofts for millionaires and flagship storefronts.
And what of the people? Do they go to the exurbs, or maybe gentrify the newly low-class suburbs? A triumphant return of khakis and minivans, white flight v2.0? And in that case, do the exurbs then become the new spillage area for the poors? Jesus, as if the suburbs weren't bad enough for them. May as well be mutants in the wasteland if they're pushed any farther out.
But I digress. What's happening in San Francisco is gross, but it's just the most striking example of what's been happening to (and getting progressively worse in) nearly every large city in the last 40 years.
 
5 days ago  

Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

I'm guilty of plenty of this myself. I try to be better about it. But I'm probably doing it right now.



This. It's like there's no civil service and city jobs... teachers at schools and universities... or an entire tourism sector...
 
5 days ago  

LaChanz: "CALIFORNIA IS THE future of the United States"

My.... we think highly of ourselves, don't we?


The same thing is happening in other big cities. In Boston it's primarily fueled by biotech money. I'm just hopeful it doesn't come crashing down before I'm old as fark.
 
5 days ago  

kbronsito: Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

I'm guilty of plenty of this myself. I try to be better about it. But I'm probably doing it right now.


This. It's like there's no civil service and city jobs... teachers at schools and universities... or an entire tourism sector...


But that's not where gentrification is happening. My boss has a joke about his neighbors in Southie. He made sure his wife (a nurse) took the lead on meeting the neighbors. Nurse. Good. I like you. Good people. My grandma was a nurse. Meanwhile my boss sneaks out the side door in his Burberry raincoat.
 
5 days ago  

dittybopper: Commander Lysdexic: Feudalism, you mean.

Gee, I wonder how San Francisco and the surrounding areas voted in the last election......

[upload.wikimedia.org image 300x354]

Hmmmm.  That's odd.  There must be some kind of mistake, because this map has most of that area colored dark blue, meaning that it's heavily Democratic.  But that's not possible, having such a regressive social stratification amongst The Enlightened.

Maybe the data is wrong.


Overlay that with a satellite map and you'll see that the desert, dirt, and overall not-a-whole-lot-except-farms-and-rubes are in the red, and the places where people are and things are actually happening are in the blue.

Nice try, though.
 
5 days ago  
I don't know how the various companies in the SF/Bay Area can find new hires given that housing in all of the Bay Area has gone insane. Not everyone gets hired on as a first tier employee, capable of affording housing. All of the various support personnel don't make enough to live here.
 
5 days ago  
Title: "Silicon Valley"
Article: "San Francisco"
 
5 days ago  

FLMountainMan: In what way does the city "lean right" economically?


img.fark.netView Full Size

Even their buildings lean left.
 
5 days ago  

swahnhennessy: It's easy to target San Francisco - and lord knows they're at the extreme in terms of exclusivity - but this is how all major cities are becoming. It's the end result of total gentrification. And it won't stop in just SF or NY or London or other "cosmopolitan" metropolises, though those are the obvious first steps. You can see it in any large urban area, where even the professional class that started the trend gets priced out by the business class. City centers that get too trendy and price their residents out so you're left with nothing but lofts for millionaires and flagship storefronts.
And what of the people? Do they go to the exurbs, or maybe gentrify the newly low-class suburbs? A triumphant return of khakis and minivans, white flight v2.0? And in that case, do the exurbs then become the new spillage area for the poors? Jesus, as if the suburbs weren't bad enough for them. May as well be mutants in the wasteland if they're pushed any farther out.
But I digress. What's happening in San Francisco is gross, but it's just the most striking example of what's been happening to (and getting progressively worse in) nearly every large city in the last 40 years.


Many of the most economically, and racially, segregated areas in the country are in cities that have been controlled by democrats for decades.
 
5 days ago  

swahnhennessy: And what of the people? Do they go to the exurbs, or maybe gentrify the newly low-class suburbs? A triumphant return of khakis and minivans, white flight v2.0? And in that case, do the exurbs then become the new spillage area for the poors?


Europe will show you what that model becomes.
 
5 days ago  

dittybopper: You mean Inner Party, Outer Party, the Proles, and the Untouchables.

If you're going to make 1984 allusions, you should make the correct ones.



1984 did not include a group/caste called 'Untouchables'. There were only the proles, the Inner party, and the Outer Party.

Maybe you could get your own act together before you try to correct someone else.
 
5 days ago  

dittybopper: Commander Lysdexic: Feudalism, you mean.

Gee, I wonder how San Francisco and the surrounding areas voted in the last election......

[upload.wikimedia.org image 300x354]

Hmmmm.  That's odd.  There must be some kind of mistake, because this map has most of that area colored dark blue, meaning that it's heavily Democratic.  But that's not possible, having such a regressive social stratification amongst The Enlightened.

Maybe the data is wrong.


More likely the filter you plopped on that demographic map to force it to fit your preconceived notions is wrong.
 
5 days ago  

FLMountainMan: Nurglitch: Jclark666: You can tell the author works in tech because he writes off the 3/4 of the population who aren't in tech, homeless, or Uber drivers as afterthoughts. This sort of thing seems to happen a lot when smart people (especially techies "on the spectrum") write about shiat they actually know nothing about, particularly social issues - they produce what they believe to be perfectly sound "logical" arguments that minimize or ignore facts that contradict their biases. It's the same sort of fallacious thinking that produces things like the James Damore "diversity" memo. The author's narrow worldview puts people into these four categories, and the fact that the vast majority of people don't fit into that worldview makes them unimportant, because there's no way his worldview could be wrong - he's too smart for that to be possible.

Great!  So you would agree that affirmative action polices based on placing people into two or three gender categories, a yes/no disability category, and four or five racial/ethnic categories should be done eliminated, right?


I have no idea what point you're trying to make, nor how you got to that point from what you've quoted.  Please show your work.
 
5 days ago  

MugzyBrown: Many of the most economically, and racially, segregated areas in the country are in cities that have been controlled by democrats for decades.


The issue you are referring to is way beyond what a city leader can solve. Fixing the stratification due to the lack of affordable housing would take a national effort because of the costs involved. But don't let that stop you in your partisan rant.
 
5 days ago  
The only true solution is one nobody is willing to execute.

A cap on personal wealth and remove the ability for a business to own anything.

Then any business will be forced to be a cooperative where all the people who are part of the business own it as well because they are forced to in order for the business to capitalise.

Every worker will be a shareholder by necessity and will be able to vote on the future of the business, including how much they get paid and how much management get paid.

When the workers have a say in how much they get paid it will remove the ability of a small minority to just take all the money.

Of course everyone is Fry and thinks that they will be the CEO of an international company and as such does not want to put a cap on the money a person can have.

This keeps them poor and worrying about their job.
 
5 days ago  
i.kym-cdn.comView Full Size
 
5 days ago  

FLMountainMan: Bonzo_1116: FLMountainMan: Clearly, San Francisco isn't progressive enough.

Economically, it's leaned right for a looooong time.  Free-wheeling gold rush capitalism 24/7/365.

The shiat you guys believe.  It's unreal.

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanfrancis​co/blog/real-estate/2016/02/millenials​-taxes-san-francisco.html
A new study from financial advisory firm SmartAsset has found that Millennials in San Francisco pay a whopping 26.84 percent in taxes, the highest rate of any city in the nation.

In what way does the city "lean right" economically?


It's less leaning more listing and it's the entire country.  It's the idea that all of the money you earn is yours and that nothing is owed to society, like you imply in pointing out the tax rate.  In san fran itiis the traditional Tweed jacked liberalism that pats itself on the back for paying it's taxes or donating to it's pet causes or posting on the internet - at best it is the cheapest bilge pump keeping the whole thing barely afloat, after all, if you spend too much on the pump how can you afford the bently.  It has filled in the edges around a very selfish system that seeks to centralize wealth as much as possible and in doing so empoverishes everyone who isn't lucky enough to avoid it.  And then you have the vultures who are convinced earning as much as you can from anything, like apartment rent, is the ultimate sign of virtue.
 
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