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(Slate)   Elizabeth Holmes deserves to be in prison--but will it make a difference?   ( slate.com) divider line
    More: Unlikely, Silicon Valley, Lie, wire fraud, Criminal law, Jury, Holmes, Venture capital, Complaint  
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2335 clicks; posted to Business » on 18 Jun 2018 at 2:18 AM (4 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



36 Comments     (+0 »)
 
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2018-06-18 01:35:36 AM  
She's blond and cute and you might have a chance but not if you send her to prison.
 
2018-06-18 02:21:35 AM  
<i>but will it make a difference?</i>

To me it will. Defrauding private investors, even wealthy, is bad, but putting people's lives at risk for medical fraud is worse. She and her boyfriend "Sunny" should see the inside of a prison cell for a long time.
 
2018-06-18 02:22:00 AM  
When you steal from rich people you go to jail.  She should have followed the Wells Fargo model and stolen from poor people.
 
2018-06-18 02:28:34 AM  
As long as there are idiots with too much money, there will be those who know how to BS well enough to extract it from those idiots.
 
2018-06-18 02:45:10 AM  
What kind of difference? To dissuade others from doing the same thing or to convince her that what she did was wrong? Probably 'No' in both cases though.
 
2018-06-18 03:12:12 AM  
*reads article*

As long as folks keep dreaming that they will discover (or at least be among the first to know about) the panacea/technology/prospectus that lifts them above the rules of biology, physics and economics governing us mere peasants, because they are so much smarter than us...

No.

See fad diets, miracle cures, cold fusion, simony, magic, assorted "business models", going Galt...
 
2018-06-18 03:16:00 AM  

wax_on: What kind of difference? To dissuade others from doing the same thing or to convince her that what she did was wrong? Probably 'No' in both cases though.


You can argue the same thing about serial killers. Jail won't stop other killers or make the incarcerated one "see the light", but at least it keeps that one from causing any more damage.
 
2018-06-18 04:29:38 AM  

Incog_Neeto: When you steal from rich people you go to jail.  She should have followed the Wells Fargo model and stolen from poor people.


Martin Shkreli learned that lesson (well, it was taught to him, it remains to be seen if it sunk it). Screw over consumers all you want, you fark with investors and the hammer comes down.
 
2018-06-18 05:21:18 AM  
It would not take long prison sentences to make CEOs change their behavior, as long as the sentences are likely to actually happen.  What rich person wants to spend 30 days in jail, during which their ex and their ex's lawyer can do who knows what to their finances, they cannot call their broker then the market goes loopy, the people angling for their job can go digging for evidence and set up traps, etc.?
 
2018-06-18 06:07:23 AM  
I don't care if it makes a difference.
 
2018-06-18 06:26:01 AM  

Phocas: wax_on: What kind of difference? To dissuade others from doing the same thing or to convince her that what she did was wrong? Probably 'No' in both cases though.

You can argue the same thing about serial killers. Jail won't stop other killers or make the incarcerated one "see the light", but at least it keeps that one from causing any more damage.


The article missed the point.  The federal government de-regulated medical diagnostic devices.  Building and selling a fraudulent diagnostic box was not illegal, nor is it now. That's farking insane.  Because of the way diagnostics are sold, only big con artists like Theranos can get into the market by selling in bulk to the system.  This in turn is eroding public confidence for the industry and they should be heavily lobbying to reinstate it.  We are helped a little by the fact that the rest of the world does, and we buy their instruments.
And subby or the journalist should explain how Bill Gates committed wire fraud or any other violation of the securities and exchange act.
 
2018-06-18 06:40:56 AM  
Advertising vaporware isn't the same as operating blood tests at Walgreens.
 
2018-06-18 07:28:57 AM  

Confabulat: Advertising vaporware isn't the same as operating blood tests at Walgreens.


This.  I'm OK with healthcare fraud having a higher priority than "ordinary" fraud.
 
2018-06-18 07:41:25 AM  
That cross-dressing dude is a bit of a sociopath.
 
2018-06-18 07:53:14 AM  

edmo: She's blond and cute and you might have a chance but not if you send her to prison.


Blonde? Yes. Cute? Uh.....

Have you ever heard her speak?
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-06-18 08:28:27 AM  
Anybody who gave money to Theranos is an idiot.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm off to write a check to Uber so they can make electric quadrocopter taxis by 2020.  It's a real thing!
 
2018-06-18 08:31:32 AM  

fusillade762: Incog_Neeto: When you steal from rich people you go to jail.  She should have followed the Wells Fargo model and stolen from poor people.

Martin Shkreli learned that lesson (well, it was taught to him, it remains to be seen if it sunk it). Screw over consumers all you want, you fark with investors and the hammer comes down.


We need a 24 hour cell-cam on little Marty, just so we can further enjoy his misery.
 
2018-06-18 08:49:01 AM  

Incog_Neeto: When you steal from rich people you go to jail.  She should have followed the Wells Fargo model and stolen from poor people.


She kind of did steal from poor people. Direct-access testing was about to have a breakthrough; Abbott, Roche, Biorad, Siemens, along with others had been working on actual regulated machines to make the logistics of it a reality when Theranos stormed the scene with their derpy "dozens of tests with one drop" pseudo-science.

The model was set to go industry wide, where you could go to a lab and order your own screening tests (HIV, select cancer markers, lipid assessments, and others that you'd normally need a provider order for) and the *cost* would be cheaper too (like $5-20 for any of the above), and Theranos pulled the rug out on all of it.

If you want a complicated conspiracy theory, put together how one fraudulant laboratory instrument maker delayed half a dozen others from providing cheaper diagnostics direct to consumer patients (ie, insurance need not apply) by eroding public trust in the idea.
 
2018-06-18 09:04:24 AM  

Northern: Phocas: wax_on: What kind of difference? To dissuade others from doing the same thing or to convince her that what she did was wrong? Probably 'No' in both cases though.

You can argue the same thing about serial killers. Jail won't stop other killers or make the incarcerated one "see the light", but at least it keeps that one from causing any more damage.

The article missed the point.  The federal government de-regulated medical diagnostic devices.  Building and selling a fraudulent diagnostic box was not illegal, nor is it now. That's farking insane.  Because of the way diagnostics are sold, only big con artists like Theranos can get into the market by selling in bulk to the system.  This in turn is eroding public confidence for the industry and they should be heavily lobbying to reinstate it.  We are helped a little by the fact that the rest of the world does, and we buy their instruments.
And subby or the journalist should explain how Bill Gates committed wire fraud or any other violation of the securities and exchange act.


What are you talking about?
Medical devices have to be cleared by the FDA.  That has not changed.  They don't have the capability of putting people in prison.
 
2018-06-18 10:01:23 AM  
I listened to a fascinating interview on TWiT about this the other day. That woman's voice is totally fake, and she was trying to emulate Steve Jobs. It's quite cartoonish.
 
2018-06-18 10:23:47 AM  

killdawabbitt: Medical devices have to be cleared by the FDA.


Actually, diagnostic equipment does not need to be cleared by the FDA.
 
2018-06-18 10:34:16 AM  
img.fark.netView Full Size

"I'm here for your soul"
 
2018-06-18 10:47:11 AM  

Dick Gozinya: edmo: She's blond and cute and you might have a chance but not if you send her to prison.

Blonde? Yes. Cute? Uh.....

Have you ever heard her speak?
[img.fark.net image 400x400]


Oh Wow.... I had never listened to her talk before.  She sounds like Xerxes from 300.
 
2018-06-18 12:01:26 PM  

Alasastar: Dick Gozinya: edmo: She's blond and cute and you might have a chance but not if you send her to prison.

Blonde? Yes. Cute? Uh.....

Have you ever heard her speak?
[img.fark.net image 400x400]

Oh Wow.... I had never listened to her talk before.  She sounds like Xerxes from 300.


I read your post and looked for an interview online.  She sounds like who had their voice disguised to protect their identity.
 
2018-06-18 12:07:59 PM  

ltdanman44: [img.fark.net image 850x394]
"I'm here for your soul"


She has what they call in the pen "crazy eyes".
 
2018-06-18 12:09:49 PM  

Dick Gozinya: edmo: She's blond and cute and you might have a chance but not if you send her to prison.

Blonde? Yes. Cute? Uh.....

Have you ever heard her speak?
[img.fark.net image 400x400]


...Man, I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking that...
 
2018-06-18 12:23:00 PM  
She needs prison, but what drives me nuts is the huge VC/institutional investment that was being thrown at Theranos AFTER the due diligence people repeatedly made it crystal clear that the tech was complete bunk. It did not exist, it could not exist. End of story. These guys went in on a unicorn chase AFTER it was explained to them that no such creature exists!

She was a grifter, but her investors were amazingly willing and eager to be duped.  It's a great reminder any time one might think that these are uniquely intelligent or rational or fact-based people at these institutions.
 
2018-06-18 01:22:06 PM  

Rapmaster2000: Anybody who gave money to Theranos is an idiot.


Speaking of...

The Walton family, heirs to Walmart founder Sam Walton: $150 million
News Corporation and 21st Century Fox executive chairman Rupert Murdoch: $121 million
Education Secretary Betsy DeVos and her family: $100 million
The Cox family, a billionaire family from Atlanta: $100 million
Mexican businessman Carlos Slim: $30 million
Greek businessman Andreas Dracopoulos: $25 million
The Oppenheimer family, a South African family that once owned De Beers: $20 million
Former Bechtel Corp chairman Riley Bechtel: $6 million
Attorney Daniel Mosley: $6 million
Patriots owner Richard Kraft: $1 million
Venture funds: $70 million

The top 4 there?  I simply cannot post that many Nelson Ha-Ha's.
 
2018-06-18 01:26:44 PM  

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Rapmaster2000: Anybody who gave money to Theranos is an idiot.

Speaking of...

The Walton family, heirs to Walmart founder Sam Walton: $150 million
News Corporation and 21st Century Fox executive chairman Rupert Murdoch: $121 million
Education Secretary Betsy DeVos and her family: $100 million
The Cox family, a billionaire family from Atlanta: $100 million
Mexican businessman Carlos Slim: $30 million
Greek businessman Andreas Dracopoulos: $25 million
The Oppenheimer family, a South African family that once owned De Beers: $20 million
Former Bechtel Corp chairman Riley Bechtel: $6 million
Attorney Daniel Mosley: $6 million
Patriots owner Richard Kraft: $1 million
Venture funds: $70 million

The top 4 there?  I simply cannot post that many Nelson Ha-Ha's.


You think they care? They probably have that much money in their couch cushions.
 
2018-06-18 01:39:06 PM  

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Rapmaster2000: Anybody who gave money to Theranos is an idiot.


Speaking of...


We are at a time in the markets where the adage, "Picking up pennies in front of stream rollers" astutely applies. Just check out the yields on junk-rated corporate debt.
 
2018-06-18 02:23:26 PM  

Joafu: Incog_Neeto: When you steal from rich people you go to jail.  She should have followed the Wells Fargo model and stolen from poor people.

She kind of did steal from poor people. Direct-access testing was about to have a breakthrough; Abbott, Roche, Biorad, Siemens, along with others had been working on actual regulated machines to make the logistics of it a reality when Theranos stormed the scene with their derpy "dozens of tests with one drop" pseudo-science.

The model was set to go industry wide, where you could go to a lab and order your own screening tests (HIV, select cancer markers, lipid assessments, and others that you'd normally need a provider order for) and the *cost* would be cheaper too (like $5-20 for any of the above), and Theranos pulled the rug out on all of it.


You can't really "pull the rug out on all of it" when there was no rug to begin with.
 
2018-06-18 06:18:59 PM  
How about starting with all the banks that tanked the economy, what about those 'guys and gals'., no one went down for that, why screw around with this person who tried to do something, didn't work our, and moved to the 'a fool and their money...'  methodology.
We now have a congress who are getting rid of the regulations (dodd/frank) that get in there way of once again flagrant and unreprentent fraud. These prosecutions are deliberate distractions from the public seeing who the really big crooks are, the ones who don't need business plans, profit/loss statements, laws etc. they just take our money using bailouts, corporate welfare, hell the congress does not even right there own bills these tasks are farmed out to corporate lobbyists and then used as templates for state congress as well,  Fark them and fark this obvious schadenfreude,
 
2018-06-18 07:30:20 PM  

fusillade762: Martin Shkreli learned that lesson (well, it was taught to him, it remains to be seen if it sunk it). Screw over consumers all you want, you fark with investors and the hammer comes down.


Martin's investors all go their money back and then some, so they weren't actually screwed over.  He got the hammer because he was a unrepentant douche.
 
2018-06-18 10:48:39 PM  

degenerate-afro: fusillade762: Martin Shkreli learned that lesson (well, it was taught to him, it remains to be seen if it sunk it). Screw over consumers all you want, you fark with investors and the hammer comes down.

Martin's investors all go their money back and then some, so they weren't actually screwed over.  He got the hammer because he was a unrepentant douche.


He got it because he stole their money and then bet he could use it to make more money. He happened to be right. But if you rob a bank and return the money latter, you still robbed a bank.
 
2018-06-19 10:02:04 AM  

degenerate-afro: fusillade762: Martin Shkreli learned that lesson (well, it was taught to him, it remains to be seen if it sunk it). Screw over consumers all you want, you fark with investors and the hammer comes down.

Martin's investors all go their money back and then some, so they weren't actually screwed over.  He got the hammer because he was a unrepentant douche.


Free Pharma Bro!
 
2018-06-19 10:12:58 AM  
Whole thread is REPORTED
 
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