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(Washington Post)   Someone forgot to ask the insurance companies if they could arm teachers   (washingtonpost.com) divider line
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4939 clicks; posted to Politics » and Main » on 27 May 2018 at 1:50 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook



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2018-05-27 10:26:28 AM  
The company "has concluded that concealed handguns on school premises poses a heightened liability risk."

It's almost as if we need to find some way to control how individuals acquire guns so easily before we attempt giving people who don't need them more guns.
 
2018-05-27 10:29:10 AM  
The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2018-05-27 10:43:51 AM  
Not sure about tort claim laws there, but around here the government is generally not financially liable for failure to prevent harm. A dozen dead kids, that's the gunman's fault. One injured bystander when a teacher blows a shooter away, that's the school's fault. The financial calculation says let school shootings happen.

If the legislature really cares it can ban gun discrimination in insurance policies.
 
2018-05-27 10:52:16 AM  
I never thought I'd be cheering for insurance companies. We really are living in interesting times.
 
2018-05-27 11:03:48 AM  

Unobtanium: The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.


I said before, if the NRA is so anxious to have armed teachers in classrooms, they should be more than happy to supply all those guns themselves.
 
2018-05-27 11:10:44 AM  

Ambivalence: I never thought I'd be cheering for insurance companies. We really are living in interesting times.


The accountants and bean counters of this world can be annoying at my job... but I'll take actuarial statistics over NRA fantasies any day of the week.
 
2018-05-27 11:12:12 AM  

gopher321: Unobtanium: The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.

I said before, if the NRA is so anxious to have armed teachers in classrooms, they should be more than happy to supply all those guns themselves.


I'm 100% sure they'd be fine with supplying the actual guns.

Training salaries, insurance, medical costs... that's someone else's problem
 
2018-05-27 11:19:52 AM  

gopher321: Unobtanium: The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.

I said before, if the NRA is so anxious to have armed teachers in classrooms, they should be more than happy to supply all those guns themselves.


They'd get bogged down in arguments over caliber, action type, barrel length, and ammo.
 
2018-05-27 11:24:13 AM  

gopher321: Unobtanium: The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.

I said before, if the NRA is so anxious to have armed teachers in classrooms, they should be more than happy to supply all those guns themselves.


It's like you don't even know how a grift works.

/smdh
 
2018-05-27 11:31:44 AM  
I know only only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

Sante Fe had two armed officers and yet it was a teach with one of these that stopped the shooter:
upload.wikimedia.orgView Full Size
 
2018-05-27 11:46:22 AM  
Give Teachers Guns - The Trump Beatles
Youtube GNhB0URF0bk
 
2018-05-27 12:01:10 PM  
The invisible hand of the free market.
 
2018-05-27 12:10:31 PM  
 
2018-05-27 12:24:58 PM  
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-05-27 12:27:02 PM  

elkboy: Ambivalence: I never thought I'd be cheering for insurance companies. We really are living in interesting times.

The accountants and bean counters of this world can be annoying at my job... but I'll take actuarial statistics over NRA fantasies any day of the week.


I wonder if they offer accounting degrees at Bob Jones or Liberty University.
And if so, do they come with official "There will be no math" disclosures.
 
2018-05-27 1:52:52 PM  
I'm sure they can, but why would they?
 
2018-05-27 1:54:14 PM  
When insurance companies are the sane ones you might have a problem.
 
2018-05-27 1:54:22 PM  
Here's the thing:  no one's actually in favor of arming teachers.  They're just saying that because the more popular option removes money from their pocketbooks.
 
2018-05-27 1:56:05 PM  
Just don't insure anything. Problem solved.

Wasn't there a talking point floating around about how insurance is just socialism? Those right-wingers think of everything.
 
2018-05-27 1:56:41 PM  

ZAZ: Not sure about tort claim laws there, but around here the government is generally not financially liable for failure to prevent harm. A dozen dead kids, that's the gunman's fault. One injured bystander when a teacher blows a shooter away, that's the school's fault. The financial calculation says let school shootings happen.

If the legislature really cares it can ban gun discrimination in insurance policies.


It has nothing to do with preventing or limiting shootings it's about all the accidents that will happen when all of a sudden there are a shiat ton more guns in schools.
 
2018-05-27 1:57:56 PM  

Unobtanium: The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.


This. Just put a tax on guns and ammunition to cover the extra liability costs for schools. And any extra security costs like guards, cameras, new doors, and training. And not just for public schools.  Private schools should get grants for the same measures. As should movie theaters, outdoor concerts, and any other potential targets.  Oh and shooting victims should have their medical bills covered along with any funeral expenses. Society is currently subsidizing the true cost of gun culture in this country. Let them pay their fair share like smokers do, and then we can listen to their stance on gun control.
 
2018-05-27 1:57:59 PM  
Ralphpointinghaha.gif
 
2018-05-27 1:58:03 PM  
Been waiting for this outcome.  Having worked in the insurance field (on the IT side), I didn't expect this was going to go over with them.
 
2018-05-27 1:58:27 PM  
I'm beginning to think guns could pose a danger to others.
 
2018-05-27 1:59:05 PM  

ZAZ: Not sure about tort claim laws there, but around here the government is generally not financially liable for failure to prevent harm. A dozen dead kids, that's the gunman's fault. One injured bystander when a teacher blows a shooter away, that's the school's fault. The financial calculation says let school shootings happen.

If the legislature really cares it can ban gun discrimination in insurance policies.


They tried that. What will happen is those insurers will just exit the school market all together. Also fark conservatives for trying to ban insurance companies from not underwriting guns. They all crow about distorting the health care markets because insurers had to conver pre existing conditions and the like. So it's only ok when it's your pet project. Fark you conservatives.
 
2018-05-27 1:59:35 PM  
"Putting in more resource officers - that's additional security - we feel that makes it safer," said Paul Marshall, of McGowan Program Administrators. "It's different when you start pushing it to arming teachers, volunteers, voluntary security."

And there's the whole crux behind the 'arm the teachers' plan.  Conservatives think schools need more people there to respond to crimes, but would really, really like to not have to pay for it.

He pointed to the common preference among insurers that nightclub bouncers remain unarmed, while off-duty police officers working security are usually allowed to carry firearms.

There's an idea.  Every town has to have at least a couple cops who work the night shift; to answer the phones at the office if nothing else.  Why pay those guys to moonlight as school security.

Mississippi considered such a bill this year, leading the state's largest public school district to ask its insurer how much that would cost.
But the bill failed before the district received its cost projection, Nelson said.

You're asking an insurance company how much money they will charge you to cover the risk of something with no historical precedent or data.  The answer is going to be "all the money".
 
2018-05-27 2:00:19 PM  
If you want truth, don't go to a politician, a priest or a journalist.

You go to an actuary.
 
2018-05-27 2:00:29 PM  

mrshowrules: I know only only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

Sante Fe had two armed officers and yet it was a teach with one of these that stopped the shooter:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 170x170]


Also remember the kid shot one of the trained police officers and hospitalized him. Kinda defeating a trained officer can stop a kid every time argument.
 
2018-05-27 2:01:29 PM  
Requiring all gun owners to carry liability insurance for shootings involving their guns could be a good way to help reduce the number of guns in circulation.
 
2018-05-27 2:01:38 PM  

mrshowrules: I know only only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

Sante Fe had two armed officers and yet it was a teach with one of these that stopped the shooter:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 170x170]


Forget guns.  If people were really serious about arming teachers, they'd be handing out dodgeballs.
 
2018-05-27 2:01:51 PM  

Russ1642: When insurance companies are the sane ones you might have a problem.


Insurance companies are very sane and they will crunch the numbers and insure damn near anything if you are willing to pay the premium. If insurance companies are balking at insuring armed teachers in the classroom it's because they have put some serious thought into it and think this is going to be a nightmare.
 
2018-05-27 2:01:56 PM  

ZAZ: Not sure about tort claim laws there, but around here the government is generally not financially liable for failure to prevent harm. A dozen dead kids, that's the gunman's fault. One injured bystander when a teacher blows a shooter away, that's the school's fault. The financial calculation says let school shootings happen.

If the legislature really cares it can ban gun discrimination in insurance policies.


Did you notice that sworn LE is allowed to carry on-campus?  Do you think that there might be a subtle difference between that and letting the Home-Ec teacher pack heavy?

Tell the truth now, no BS about about how Miss Klein the 63 year old art teacher is really an expert in Krav Maga and served with the SAS in The Falklands or some such shiate.
 
2018-05-27 2:02:52 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: Requiring all gun owners to carry liability insurance for shootings involving their guns could be a good way to help reduce the number of guns in circulation.


Per Bullet insurance
 
2018-05-27 2:03:20 PM  
Teachers and other staff who want to be armed can sign a waiver, stating that they personally assume any and all responsibility for any and all incidents involving use of their firearms.

Then they can purchase insurance to cover themselves. The NRA offers such products.

https://mynrainsurance.com/home

There. Freedom. Personal responsibility. Non-government, free market solutions.
 
2018-05-27 2:04:58 PM  
The dark humor I see in all of this is watching Republicans realize every idea they push instead of restricting nutjobs from getting guns is going to be very expensive to try and probably not very effective either.  Still waiting on that mental healthcare access bill by the way...
 
2018-05-27 2:05:25 PM  

Virulency: TuteTibiImperes: Requiring all gun owners to carry liability insurance for shootings involving their guns could be a good way to help reduce the number of guns in circulation.

Per Bullet insurance


Because someone doesn't know how recreational shooting works.
 
2018-05-27 2:06:43 PM  

Karac: mrshowrules: I know only only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun.

Sante Fe had two armed officers and yet it was a teach with one of these that stopped the shooter:
[upload.wikimedia.org image 170x170]

Forget guns.  If people were really serious about arming teachers, they'd be handing out dodgeballs.


media.giphy.comView Full Size

/oblig
 
2018-05-27 2:07:16 PM  
BTW, who's curating the LOLCATGOPATA roster?

Insurance companies need to be added.
 
2018-05-27 2:07:48 PM  

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Virulency: TuteTibiImperes: Requiring all gun owners to carry liability insurance for shootings involving their guns could be a good way to help reduce the number of guns in circulation.

Per Bullet insurance

Because someone doesn't know how recreational shooting works.


Or how rediculous it would be ?
 
2018-05-27 2:08:34 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Just don't insure anything. Problem solved.

Wasn't there a talking point floating around about how insurance is just socialism? Those right-wingers think of everything.


Most local government is self-insured so I don't see the distinction.  They may have a reinsurer like Lloyd's or BH cover extraordinary risk, but for the most part they are all in for the risk.
 
2018-05-27 2:08:59 PM  
"I don't think insurance companies are notorious anti-gun liberals," said Mark Tallman, associate executive director for the Kansas Association of School Boards, "so we think they've got good reasons for not doing it."

This guy is basing his decisions on what he thinks the insurance industry's politics are instead of any arguments being presented.  That's quality leadership, GOP style, right there.  I'm so proud to be a Kansan.
 
2018-05-27 2:10:05 PM  

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: Virulency: TuteTibiImperes: Requiring all gun owners to carry liability insurance for shootings involving their guns could be a good way to help reduce the number of guns in circulation.

Per Bullet insurance

Because someone doesn't know how recreational shooting works.


I've seen people flag the line at military shooting ranges.  If it can happen there I have to imagine it can happen at civilian ones.

And then there's that time someone thought it'd be a good idea to give their nine year old a full auto uzi to try out and she ended up killing one of the range instructors.  That was supposed to be recreational.
 
2018-05-27 2:11:40 PM  

ElwoodCuse: ZAZ: Not sure about tort claim laws there, but around here the government is generally not financially liable for failure to prevent harm. A dozen dead kids, that's the gunman's fault. One injured bystander when a teacher blows a shooter away, that's the school's fault. The financial calculation says let school shootings happen.

If the legislature really cares it can ban gun discrimination in insurance policies.

It has nothing to do with preventing or limiting shootings it's about all the accidents that will happen when all of a sudden there are a shiat ton more guns in schools.


And this again. Liability insuance is for accidents, not criminal acts.
 
2018-05-27 2:12:27 PM  
I saw this story on Facebook from my local paper this morning.

'Kansas has a problem: It has a law allowing teachers to carry guns in the classroom, but almost no schools are using it because insurance companies refuse to provide coverage if they do. '

I said 'Sounds like the problem solved itself.'
 
2018-05-27 2:13:17 PM  

Unobtanium: gopher321: Unobtanium: The NRA is soooo in favor of this. Let them underwrite the insurance.

I said before, if the NRA is so anxious to have armed teachers in classrooms, they should be more than happy to supply all those guns themselves.

They'd get bogged down in arguments over caliber, action type, barrel length, and ammo.


You forgot one. The size of the clips.
 
2018-05-27 2:13:55 PM  

asimplescribe: The dark humor I see in all of this is watching Republicans realize every idea they push instead of restricting nutjobs from getting guns is going to be very expensive to try and probably not very effective either.  Still waiting on that mental healthcare access bill by the way...


They'll just pull money from some other aspect of education to finance it whether it makes sense or not. They just haven't figured out which of the legislators has the largest portfolio of insurance company holdings yet.
 
2018-05-27 2:14:25 PM  

Parthenogenetic: Teachers and other staff who want to be armed can sign a waiver, stating that they personally assume any and all responsibility for any and all incidents involving use of their firearms.

Then they can purchase insurance to cover themselves. The NRA offers such products.

https://mynrainsurance.com/home

There. Freedom. Personal responsibility. Non-government, free market solutions.


Teachers, particularly Kansas teachers, are known to be very well paid and can easily afford such things.
 
2018-05-27 2:15:23 PM  
Once again reality + math proves it's liberal bias.

/farking actuaries
 
2018-05-27 2:17:55 PM  
I'll bet the insurance companies are looking forward to the kid, who's a would be school shooter, but doesn't have access to a weapon,  stealing a firearm from the gym teacher and going on a rampage
 
2018-05-27 2:18:23 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Just don't insure anything. Problem solved.

Wasn't there a talking point floating around about how insurance is just socialism? Those right-wingers think of everything.


Insurance spreads the risk, which sounds pretty damn socialist to me.  It's so socialist Ben Franklin started an insurance company before the US was even a country and before socialism was even a thing.  He's a crazy hippy bastard, that Ben Franklin.
 
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