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    More: Sad, minimum wage, Employment, Wage, minimum wage increase, old minimum wage, minimum wage rise, new minimum wage, minimum wage hikes  
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12803 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Jan 2018 at 1:00 AM (2 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2018-01-01 07:22:05 PM  
Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.
 
2018-01-01 07:33:06 PM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


Run a better restaurant, dumbass!
 
2018-01-01 07:43:02 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

Run a better restaurant, dumbass!


Why are you blaming the victim?
 
2018-01-01 07:46:22 PM  
"It seems to me to be equally plain that no business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country. By 'business' I mean the whole of commerce as well as the whole of industry; by workers I mean all workers, the white collar class as well as the men in overalls; and by living wages I mean more than a bare subsistence level -- I mean the wages of decent living." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt
 
2018-01-01 08:05:01 PM  
img.fark.netView Full Size


I see it's time for the annual "increasing minimum wage is hurting me" stories.
 
2018-01-01 08:05:48 PM  

Mike_LowELL: ecmoRandomNumbers: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

Run a better restaurant, dumbass!

Why are you blaming the victim?


I would be. The guy is running at 40% food cost. Holy crap, that's high! It's not his employees that's costing him it's his pricing. That needs to drop to maybe 30%.
 
2018-01-01 08:44:47 PM  
If he needs to raise his prices, he needs to raise his prices, that's not a big deal.  If I like a place and everything goes up by a dollar on the menu, I'm not going to stop going or go there less often, an extra buck or two here and there isn't a big deal.

Also, if he has that large a staff, why does he need to be there 90 hours per week?  Is he a chef-owner, or just an owner?  If someone else is doing the cooking, waiting, bartending, cleaning, etc, and he's just handling the books, he needs to trust his staff and delegate more, then he wouldn't have to put in those kids of hours.
 
2018-01-01 08:48:05 PM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-01-01 09:46:50 PM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


As near as I can tell, there has never been a financial incentive to own a non-chain restaurant.  It's nothing but heartbreak.
 
2018-01-01 09:48:57 PM  

flondrix: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

As near as I can tell, there has never been a financial incentive to own a non-chain restaurant.  It's nothing but heartbreak.


There's a guy who owns a local high end Italian place and drives around in a Lamborghini.  Then again, maybe he already had the money before he opened the restaurant and it's just a vanity project.
 
2018-01-01 11:03:13 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: flondrix: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

As near as I can tell, there has never been a financial incentive to own a non-chain restaurant.  It's nothing but heartbreak.

There's a guy who owns a local high end Italian place and drives around in a Lamborghini.  Then again, maybe he already had the money before he opened the restaurant and it's just a vanity project.


*cough*money-laundering*cough*
 
2018-01-02 12:13:53 AM  
One reason I wasn't a good manager of restaurants is because I did so much of the work myself. I never had a lot of employees that could work the way I did, and when I found one I wasn't allowed to pay them enough to keep them around.

So during a busy shift, I was taking orders and cooking the food. Other managers were just standing around. I never could bring myself to use scare and other immoral tactics to make the employees work harder for their $6 an hour.
 
2018-01-02 01:01:53 AM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


That must be one poorly run restaurant.
 
2018-01-02 01:03:50 AM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


Oh no, they're all going to go Galt on us! Fetch my fainting couch!
 
2018-01-02 01:05:12 AM  
The owner should get a second job. I know a restaurant where the servers make more than the owner!
 
2018-01-02 01:06:13 AM  
If it is no longer profitable to operate, the business will close.  Just because you own a business doesn't mean you are entitled to operate at given profit if you can't pay your staff or expenses while creating a given product.  If a minimum wage increase is the difference between opening and closing, chances are you were on the cusp of closure anyway and it was only a matter of time.  Either cut costs, reduce staff, increase prices, or close.  The choice is the business owners.
 
2018-01-02 01:08:33 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: If he needs to raise his prices, he needs to raise his prices, that's not a big deal.  If I like a place and everything goes up by a dollar on the menu, I'm not going to stop going or go there less often, an extra buck or two here and there isn't a big deal.

Also, if he has that large a staff, why does he need to be there 90 hours per week?  Is he a chef-owner, or just an owner?  If someone else is doing the cooking, waiting, bartending, cleaning, etc, and he's just handling the books, he needs to trust his staff and delegate more, then he wouldn't have to put in those kids of hours.


Seriously, if you're not there, your staff are stealing from you - not necessarily putting their hands in the till, but they're giving away drinks to their mates and having a few themselves, and they're helping themselves to stock.

It's a prick of a business - you can't trust anyone
 
2018-01-02 01:10:30 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: If he needs to raise his prices, he needs to raise his prices, that's not a big deal.  If I like a place and everything goes up by a dollar on the menu, I'm not going to stop going or go there less often, an extra buck or two here and there isn't a big deal.

Also, if he has that large a staff, why does he need to be there 90 hours per week?  Is he a chef-owner, or just an owner?  If someone else is doing the cooking, waiting, bartending, cleaning, etc, and he's just handling the books, he needs to trust his staff and delegate more, then he wouldn't have to put in those kids of hours.


Wage hike = price hike, this should surprise exactly no one. Wages are by far the biggest cost unless he's somewhere with a crazy rent, which he's not. Also, he's working 90 hours a week for 12.50 an hour and never seeing his kids? Yea he needs to delegate more. He should try upping the cost by 2 bucks instead of 50 cents to a dollar.
 
2018-01-02 01:11:29 AM  

Daedalus27: If it is no longer profitable to operate, the business will close.  Just because you own a business doesn't mean you are entitled to operate at given profit if you can't pay your staff or expenses while creating a given product.  If a minimum wage increase is the difference between opening and closing, chances are you were on the cusp of closure anyway and it was only a matter of time.  Either cut costs, reduce staff, increase prices, or close.  The choice is the business owners.


And all his competition is facing the same rules.

Swim or sink, I thought that was the capitalist mantra.
 
2018-01-02 01:11:33 AM  
If he's putting in 90hrs a week he's making time and a half on everything over 40 hrs  so technically he's still making more than his employees and if he's struggling this much he should fire the person he's paying the most ... himself
 
2018-01-02 01:12:01 AM  
 
2018-01-02 01:14:08 AM  

Mrtraveler01: That must be one poorly run restaurant.


If he is not fudging his math, definitely.  He says he is going to be taking a $150,000 a year hit with a raise from his current wage (12.50) to a new minimum of $15.  It says he has roughly two dozen workers in the article and the math would add up to 28 workers all getting 40 hours a week.  Why in God's name are you giving all of your server's full time hours when you have to pay them minimum wage PLUS tips.  In the USA servers are lucky to get 20-30 hours of split shift based on volume and the restaurant only pays them around $5 an hour due to tip credit.
 
2018-01-02 01:15:08 AM  
Because fark small business owners,  right subby?  fark you.
 
2018-01-02 01:16:58 AM  
Has the restaurant owner tried forcing foreign diplomats to dine at his restaurant as a condition of having their presence in the country formally recognized by the government? That business model seems to be working for that one shoddy 2-star motel in Washington -- you know, the one with the gold-plated plumbing fixtures and the smoke detectors that have "Сделано в другой стране" engraved on them.
 
2018-01-02 01:17:13 AM  

Daedalus27: If it is no longer profitable to operate, the business will close.  Just because you own a business doesn't mean you are entitled to operate at given profit if you can't pay your staff or expenses while creating a given product.  If a minimum wage increase is the difference between opening and closing, chances are you were on the cusp of closure anyway and it was only a matter of time.  Either cut costs, reduce staff, increase prices, or close.  The choice is the business owners.


This right here. We had a few businesses around town blame the minimum wage increase (AZ) to $10 per hour last year as the reason they had to close. Nevermind they were already barely functioning establishments on Dec 31, 2016.

There are some crying that this year's increase to $10.50 will do the same. It's a convenient scapegoat for people that have run their business into the ground already with poor service or shiatty food.
 
2018-01-02 01:17:17 AM  

Quantumbunny: Wage hike = price hike, this should surprise exactly no one. Wages are by far the biggest cost unless he's somewhere with a crazy rent, which he's not. Also, he's working 90 hours a week for 12.50 an hour and never seeing his kids? Yea he needs to delegate more. He should try upping the cost by 2 bucks instead of 50 cents to a dollar.


He claims he is paying about 30% to wages and 40% in food costs.  He needs to cut 5-8% of those food costs to bring them in line with industry averages and maybe he would not have to worry as much about wages.
 
2018-01-02 01:18:22 AM  
There's actually a decent amount of data in the article.

The guy claims to work 90 hours a week and will be making less than $14/hour.  I'm assuming his "earnings" are the restaurant's net profit.  90 * 52 * 14 = $66K profit.

He's got 2 dozen employees.  Let's assume they're all full time, minimum wage (under the old minimum wage rules).  24 * 40 * 52 * $11.60 = $580K labor cost.

Labor is 30% of his expenses, so his total expenses are 580K / .3 = $1.93M.  Let's assume this includes taxes and such as expenses, too.  Then, total revenue = profit + expenses = .066 + 1.93 = $2M annually.

His profit margin (66K out of 2M) is 3.3%.  I know restaurants tend to not be money makers, but that seems pretty bad for any business.  Maybe he's in the wrong line of work?

/No, you were never told there would be no math
 
2018-01-02 01:18:40 AM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


Riddle me this: how can a guy pay rent on a $2000 apartment if he only makes $1800 a month?
Can you believe that? Move out of the apartment he can't afford to stay in and probably should not have moved into?
And you actually like, need a place to live, unlike a restaurant owner, who, you know, provides a nice service and everything but is essentially replaced by a grocery store and a hot plate. And how does the apartment guy pay for a hot plate if he's losing $200 a month? Why isn't there a stove in the apartment? That's an expensive apartment, even in Canadian dollars.
 
2018-01-02 01:19:03 AM  

Jeff5: Daedalus27: If it is no longer profitable to operate, the business will close.  Just because you own a business doesn't mean you are entitled to operate at given profit if you can't pay your staff or expenses while creating a given product.  If a minimum wage increase is the difference between opening and closing, chances are you were on the cusp of closure anyway and it was only a matter of time.  Either cut costs, reduce staff, increase prices, or close.  The choice is the business owners.

And all his competition is facing the same rules.

Swim or sink, I thought that was the capitalist mantra.


It's much harder to break labor if you're forced to pay them more in the first place.
 
2018-01-02 01:19:32 AM  
Ah, the annual "farkers who have never run a restaurant commenting on how restaurants should be run"

I've run a restaurant, this guy isn't full of shiat. High wages were part of what ran me out of business. The mom and pop shop really can't make it anymore. Yes, there are exceptions but as a rule it's generally true.
 
2018-01-02 01:19:45 AM  
Dimakos says he's not opposed to the minimum wage going up but that it's too much to absorb overnight. "It doesn't give us time to slowly, gradually increase our prices and adjust," he says.

Employees are suffering while you "slowly, gradually" adjust. Just print new menus with 50-cent price increases (on top of what, he doesn't say) and deal with it.
 
2018-01-02 01:20:28 AM  

feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.


Well, he's saying that he will earn less per hour, based on his 90 hour work week.  Still, $14/hr @ 90 is $65k CDN pretty much sucks for no life outside work.  So he will need to raise prices.
 
2018-01-02 01:21:16 AM  
Also going to throw this part of the article out there - Every one of the major political parties in the article (Liberal, Progressive Conservative, and New Democratic) are mentioned as in favor of raising the minimum wage and just have differing opinions on how to roll it out.  It must be nice to live in a country where the none of the parties are actually PRO stagnant wages as a matter of policy.
 
2018-01-02 01:21:52 AM  

pgh9fan: Mike_LowELL: ecmoRandomNumbers: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

Run a better restaurant, dumbass!

Why are you blaming the victim?

I would be. The guy is running at 40% food cost. Holy crap, that's high! It's not his employees that's costing him it's his pricing. That needs to drop to maybe 30%.


The magic rule is 30% fixed overheads rent, permits, power & utilities etc) 30% food cost, 10% wages, theoretically leaving 30% profit. But show those numbers to a restaurateur and they'll roll into a ball and hide in the corner. The thing is, every week something 'unusual' happens to screw your budget.- something breaks, food gets wasted etc etc.

You have to be crazy to think you'll prosper running a restaurant. It's like high school jocks thinking they're going to be a football star - 1 in 10,000 make it to the ferrari stage, and all the rest go work in a shoe store
 
2018-01-02 01:22:34 AM  
After he pays employees, insures his business and personal/family health, pays the taxes on his businesses and properties.... How much does he make?
 
2018-01-02 01:23:38 AM  

wax_on: Ah, the annual "farkers who have never run a restaurant commenting on how restaurants should be run"

I've run a restaurant, this guy isn't full of shiat. High wages were part of what ran me out of business. The mom and pop shop really can't make it anymore. Yes, there are exceptions but as a rule it's generally true.


Now we have opinions from two people who don't know how to run a restaurant. Cool, cool.
 
2018-01-02 01:24:12 AM  

Bith Set Me Up: "It seems to me to be equally plain that no business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country. By 'business' I mean the whole of commerce as well as the whole of industry; by workers I mean all workers, the white collar class as well as the men in overalls; and by living wages I mean more than a bare subsistence level -- I mean the wages of decent living." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt


- FDR, former Canadian president.
 
2018-01-02 01:24:28 AM  

mjjt: pgh9fan: Mike_LowELL: ecmoRandomNumbers: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

Run a better restaurant, dumbass!

Why are you blaming the victim?

I would be. The guy is running at 40% food cost. Holy crap, that's high! It's not his employees that's costing him it's his pricing. That needs to drop to maybe 30%.

The magic rule is 30% fixed overheads rent, permits, power & utilities etc) 30% food cost, 10% wages, theoretically leaving 30% profit. But show those numbers to a restaurateur and they'll roll into a ball and hide in the corner. The thing is, every week something 'unusual' happens to screw your budget.- something breaks, food gets wasted etc etc.

You have to be crazy to think you'll prosper running a restaurant. It's like high school jocks thinking they're going to be a football star - 1 in 10,000 make it to the ferrari stage, and all the rest go work in a shoe store


I think your magic rule has swapped the wages and overhead percentages.  If you told any restaurant manager I know that you could get their labor down to 10% they would line up to throw money at you.
 
2018-01-02 01:24:43 AM  
i think running a restaurant is a best, a narrow minded persons way to make a living. Sue, dealing with rush times, ensuring your employees have enough hours, and dealin g with numerous day to day issues could lead you to drink or worse.
If you're "working" 90 hours a week, not just being there, something is inherently wrong.
I was thinking of buying a new franchise, and in addition to putting in a lot of hours, actually working, since I am older, would also like the opportunity to take a little time off for pet projects.  That might be put on hold now, that we're moving out of state this year. Kids are grown, they're not coming with. Just me and the missus.
 
2018-01-02 01:24:57 AM  

GDubDub: Bith Set Me Up: "It seems to me to be equally plain that no business which depends for existence on paying less than living wages to its workers has any right to continue in this country. By 'business' I mean the whole of commerce as well as the whole of industry; by workers I mean all workers, the white collar class as well as the men in overalls; and by living wages I mean more than a bare subsistence level -- I mean the wages of decent living." -- Franklin D. Roosevelt

- FDR, former Canadian president.


so did that guy's dick work or what
 
2018-01-02 01:25:22 AM  

wax_on: Ah, the annual "farkers who have never run a restaurant commenting on how restaurants should be run"

I've run a restaurant, this guy isn't full of shiat. High wages were part of what ran me out of business. The mom and pop shop really can't make it anymore. Yes, there are exceptions but as a rule it's generally true.


Restaurants around here adjust their hours and hire fewer people. Several places close at 2pm for the day.

There are ways to adjust. Sucky ways perhaps, but ways.
 
2018-01-02 01:25:41 AM  
If only he could convince someone that he deserves a raise.
 
2018-01-02 01:25:44 AM  
While in fairness a 20% wage hike *overnight* is a bit extreme, this business owner is either conveniently ignoring his company's profit (i.e his end of year pass-thru) or his business has extremely low revenue.

My guess: he's full of shiat.

/Owns a restaurant
 
2018-01-02 01:25:45 AM  
If you can't pay an employee a living wage, your business should fail because it is parasitic.
 
2018-01-02 01:26:11 AM  

omnimancer28: He needs to cut 5-8% of those food costs to bring them in line with industry averages


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-01-02 01:29:09 AM  

puffy999: Restaurants around here adjust their hours and hire fewer people. Several places close at 2pm for the day.

There are ways to adjust. Sucky ways perhaps, but ways.


Almost every decent place to eat near where I live only opens for peak hours.   Normally a 11am-230pm lunch and 530pm-10pm dinner service.  (some with breakfast if that is their thing)  It is almost a sure bet that any place that is open dawn til dusk is a crap chain or fast food joint.  No point being open when 90% of your customers are working.
 
2018-01-02 01:29:40 AM  
He should have restructured his business long before now possibly with an outside consultant or just sold it, let his employees have a jobless new year. He owes them nothing outside a paycheck and considering they have been above average and he's doing ninety hour weeks, perhaps whatvhe needs are employees who don't quake at the prospect of hard work.
 
2018-01-02 01:33:21 AM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: TuteTibiImperes: flondrix: feckingmorons: Figure this one out libs, if a guy an earn more working in someone else's restaurant than he can owning his own restaurant what is the incentive to own his own place and employ people.

As near as I can tell, there has never been a financial incentive to own a non-chain restaurant.  It's nothing but heartbreak.

There's a guy who owns a local high end Italian place and drives around in a Lamborghini.  Then again, maybe he already had the money before he opened the restaurant and it's just a vanity project.

*cough*money-laundering*cough*


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2018-01-02 01:33:32 AM  

King Something: omnimancer28: He needs to cut 5-8% of those food costs to bring them in line with industry averages

[img.fark.net image 512x384][View Full Size image _x_]


Ha, that.  Or get your employees to stop giving away free food.  I was brought on as an assistant manager at a local steakhouse with "unfixable" food costs.  I spent part of my first week busing tables before people knew who I was.  During some hours more food was leaving the kitchen for friends than for paying customers.  We are talking 20-30 tickets worth of unpaid food a day.
 
2018-01-02 01:36:18 AM  
The problem couldn't possibly be that low ordinary wages across the economy and senior executive rent-seeking have thinned out a once-wealthy middle class to a point where ordinary consumer businesses struggle to find enough customers with good disposable income?
No.  Let's blame the owner or his staff.  Doesn't matter which one.
 
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