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(The Atlantic)   "In a moment focused on rectifying power imbalances, it would be irresponsible to forget that white women have often cast the fight against sexism and the fight against racism in a zero-sum game, from suffrage to the present day." #wypipo   ( theatlantic.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, women, Race, Black people, Racism, white women, White people, Colored, Person of color  
•       •       •

1982 clicks; posted to Politics » on 23 Nov 2017 at 1:19 AM (12 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-11-22 08:33:01 PM  
I'll sum up the article:

Lena Dunham is an idiot


Let me explain: People like to have strong beliefs about things, until their friend gets accused of rape.  Then women lie about rape AND what they are for lunch.
 
2017-11-22 08:45:24 PM  
Mmmm, brown women
 
2017-11-22 08:48:46 PM  
None of this is easy to unpack

Oh no, there's that liberal word again
 
2017-11-23 01:38:57 AM  

spamdog: None of this is easy to unpack

Oh no, there's that liberal word again

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-11-23 01:42:29 AM  
Where the white women at?
 
2017-11-23 01:44:45 AM  
*lena dunham doing pant suit rap, volume II*

my name is lena dunham and I'm here to say, I like believing women in a feminist way

[CHORUS]
Having said that
Having said that
Having said that

Dunham seems to have made some monkey's paw wish of being able to bring attention to herself in relation to any hot button issue she feels is important but only gets that attention for how monumentally bad she is about it. Between her at-minimum creepy behavior with her little sister (even casting aside the finding a rock incident as too young to be sexual, the bribing her for kisses stuff was into her teens), her sexual objectification and harassment of Odell Beckham Jr, her comments about how she was disappointed at never having had an abortion to show pride in it, and now this... just stop Lena. You are not good at this.

I'm currently ready to believe the theory that someone got the ticket from Last Action Hero and used it to pull the atheist woman from a PureFlix film, and that is how we got Lena Dunham.
 
2017-11-23 01:47:17 AM  

hobbes0022: Lena Dunham is an idiot


Because she has a history of speaking out for women, she thinks that she's this "woke" activist and any criticism of her must be misogyny rearing it's ugly head. This blinds her to the absolutely enormous privilege she's enjoyed in her life and makes her unable to understand any issue that doesn't personally affect her, e.g., race or someone being assaulted by someone *she* likes.

So, yes, she's an idiot.
 
2017-11-23 01:52:18 AM  

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: hobbes0022: Lena Dunham is an idiot

Because she has a history of speaking out for women, she thinks that she's this "woke" activist and any criticism of her must be misogyny rearing it's ugly head. This blinds her to the absolutely enormous privilege she's enjoyed in her life and makes her unable to understand any issue that doesn't personally affect her, e.g., race or someone being assaulted by someone *she* likes.

So, yes, she's an idiot.


Yes.  For all the talk of privilege, the greatest privilege of all still comes from having money.  Virtually no one living on a median family income of 50K/yr or less gives a damn how many angels can dance on the head of this pin
 
2017-11-23 01:55:46 AM  

hobbes0022: I'll sum up the article:

Lena Dunham is an idiot


Let me explain: People like to have strong beliefs about things, until their friend gets accused of rape.  Then women lie about rape AND what they are for lunch.


This is the main problem with relying on hashtag activism to solve problems: today's trendy social cause celebres are tomorrow's exclusionary and insensitive assholes. When in reality, they were still the same person yesterday as they were today, it's just that they espoused one particular belief you all had in common and took that to be something more than it actually was.
 
2017-11-23 01:56:50 AM  
And here I thought the article was going to be about how Frederick Douglass and Elizabeth Cady Stanton argued about who had suffered more under white men and who should get the vote first at the Seneca Falls conference in 1871.
 
2017-11-23 02:00:23 AM  
Girls was a bad show
 
2017-11-23 02:03:17 AM  
The hardest thing to be in this country, I honestly believe, is a Black woman. My Sisters out there doing work and most people not only wouldn't care, but seem to be waiting for them to screw something up.

This article also goes back to something a lot of black writers and pundits remark on, that the left is not immune to race-blindness (and in a few cases, outright racism).
 
2017-11-23 02:11:45 AM  
Aw jeez, not this shiat again. Can't that dumb ass take her megaphone and stuff it where the sun don't shine? We're all so tired of hearing any of the cow flop that falls from her lips.

/I say from my pedestal of white man privledge.
 
2017-11-23 02:13:47 AM  

BlueDWarrior: The hardest thing to be in this country, I honestly believe, is a Black woman. My Sisters out there doing work and most people not only wouldn't care, but seem to be waiting for them to screw something up.

This article also goes back to something a lot of black writers and pundits remark on, that the left is not immune to race-blindness (and in a few cases, outright racism).


While this is undoubtedly true I'm not of the opinion Dunham's moronic response would have been any different should you alter the race of the accuser. This seems to be textbook not wanting the cause to be applicable to someone close so they deny it in contrast to their usual stance on said issue. This reads as opportunism for another social talking point, albeit one that would generally be true.
 
2017-11-23 02:16:17 AM  
Why does Fark hate women?
 
kab
2017-11-23 02:18:46 AM  
Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-11-23 02:21:16 AM  

BlueDWarrior: The hardest thing to be in this country, I honestly believe, is a Black woman. My Sisters out there doing work and most people not only wouldn't care, but seem to be waiting for them to screw something up.

This article also goes back to something a lot of black writers and pundits remark on, that the left is not immune to race-blindness (and in a few cases, outright racism).


I am simultaneously agreeing and not knowing what the fark the author of TFA is on about. Other than colored women don't count as much as white women when it comes to media portrayal of crimes against them. There, did that really take so many words to speak the truth?

/white dude
//preach on, sista
 
2017-11-23 02:25:55 AM  

Conservative Evangelical Millennial Cyclist: Where the white women at?


Keeping minority males, in particular African American and Native American males, out of medical school with their white entitlement.
 
2017-11-23 02:27:01 AM  

Stibium: BlueDWarrior: The hardest thing to be in this country, I honestly believe, is a Black woman. My Sisters out there doing work and most people not only wouldn't care, but seem to be waiting for them to screw something up.

This article also goes back to something a lot of black writers and pundits remark on, that the left is not immune to race-blindness (and in a few cases, outright racism).

I am simultaneously agreeing and not knowing what the fark the author of TFA is on about. Other than colored women don't count as much as white women when it comes to media portrayal of crimes against them. There, did that really take so many words to speak the truth?

/white dude
//preach on, sista


It's more or less a long, and probably overly worded way of saying "Don't let the #metoo movement become solely a movement for white, professional women"

/ a lot of The Atlantic's writers apparently get paid by the word.
 
2017-11-23 02:27:12 AM  

BlazeTrailer: BlueDWarrior: The hardest thing to be in this country, I honestly believe, is a Black woman. My Sisters out there doing work and most people not only wouldn't care, but seem to be waiting for them to screw something up.

This article also goes back to something a lot of black writers and pundits remark on, that the left is not immune to race-blindness (and in a few cases, outright racism).

While this is undoubtedly true I'm not of the opinion Dunham's moronic response would have been any different should you alter the race of the accuser. This seems to be textbook not wanting the cause to be applicable to someone close so they deny it in contrast to their usual stance on said issue. This reads as opportunism for another social talking point, albeit one that would generally be true.


Hey, my wife and I were talking about Franken tonight and I was defending him.

Then he went out and grabbed two more butts.

Goddammit.
 
2017-11-23 02:27:38 AM  

kab: Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

[img.fark.net image 565x399]


She's had the decency to delete that hot take since then. She tried arguing that innocent women have had to suffer from unjust results so having the pendulum swing back somewhat for a little while is worth resolving the issue quicker, but that isn't what justice means and it looks like she was pursuaded (hopefully).
 
2017-11-23 02:28:56 AM  

kab: Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

[img.fark.net image 565x399][View Full Size image _x_]


Right here on Fark, too.
 
2017-11-23 02:29:34 AM  

Grungehamster: kab: Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

[img.fark.net image 565x399]

She's had the decency to delete that hot take since then. She tried arguing that innocent women have had to suffer from unjust results so having the pendulum swing back somewhat for a little while is worth resolving the issue quicker, but that isn't what justice means and it looks like she was pursuaded (hopefully).


There is a very thin and faded line separating justice and revenge.
 
2017-11-23 02:33:07 AM  
Can I just say that not all sexism is bad? Women wanted equality but now they are dealing with the problems that come with it.
 
2017-11-23 02:36:03 AM  

Grungehamster: She's had the decency to delete that hot take since then.


Her twitter feed is now set to private. I'm guessing there's going to be a lot of fallout for her over it.
 
2017-11-23 02:42:14 AM  

Naido: Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: hobbes0022: Lena Dunham is an idiot

Because she has a history of speaking out for women, she thinks that she's this "woke" activist and any criticism of her must be misogyny rearing it's ugly head. This blinds her to the absolutely enormous privilege she's enjoyed in her life and makes her unable to understand any issue that doesn't personally affect her, e.g., race or someone being assaulted by someone *she* likes.

So, yes, she's an idiot.

Yes.  For all the talk of privilege, the greatest privilege of all still comes from having money.  Virtually no one living on a median family income of 50K/yr or less gives a damn how many angels can dance on the head of this pin


Eight if they're skinny, four if they're fat.
 
2017-11-23 02:42:27 AM  

BlueDWarrior: Grungehamster: kab: Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

[img.fark.net image 565x399]

She's had the decency to delete that hot take since then. She tried arguing that innocent women have had to suffer from unjust results so having the pendulum swing back somewhat for a little while is worth resolving the issue quicker, but that isn't what justice means and it looks like she was pursuaded (hopefully).

There is a very thin and faded line separating justice and revenge.


Yes, something we need to watch.  Also agree with pretty much everything you've said.  And, FWIW, I feel like the left doesn't spend enough time on classism.  The women I see on MSNBC and read in The Atlantic often seem exclusively concerned/knowledgeable about issues at the professional level
 
2017-11-23 02:46:47 AM  
I thought White Women were why we have Trump.  Are White Women now the thing that's going to save us?.. because I'm not really thinking that's gonna happen.  White Women are just as stupid as the rest of us, probably stupider.
 
2017-11-23 02:54:22 AM  
Women have it tough. Do you adopt a rigorously professional demeanor at work, avoid mixing or even discussing your private life at the office? Avoid being too friendly less someone confuse it for being flirtatious? Or do you work relationships just like men do with each other, building networks and often benefiting from that? If you choose the second, how hard do you have to work at making sure people don't mistake socially friendly for something more? And how do you deal with women who compete with who are less restrained than you, or even outright flirtatious or more?

If women who live it more dangerously and aggressively than you get assaulted, you may not think they were asking for it, or that they deserved it, but they risked that more than you and that gave them a competitive advantage over you. You're going to feel how your going to feel whether or not the rules say you must support them.

It's all very messy. Not that it should be messy. Men should bloody well ought to behave themselves. But there's that gulf between is and ought. Here in the world of _is_ women have it tough.
 
2017-11-23 02:54:48 AM  
Um... Lena Dunham is pretty well known for being one of the abusive asshole harassers that everyone is complaining about.  Why is it particularly surprising or meaningful that she'd going all "well, actually" like every other Weinstein wannabe around?
 
2017-11-23 02:57:32 AM  

spamdog: Mmmm, brown women


what a "brown" woman might look like, i guess
gotceleb.comView Full Size
 
2017-11-23 03:19:00 AM  

wademh: Women have it tough. Do you adopt a rigorously professional demeanor at work, avoid mixing or even discussing your private life at the office? Avoid being too friendly less someone confuse it for being flirtatious? Or do you work relationships just like men do with each other, building networks and often benefiting from that? If you choose the second, how hard do you have to work at making sure people don't mistake socially friendly for something more? And how do you deal with women who compete with who are less restrained than you, or even outright flirtatious or more?

If women who live it more dangerously and aggressively than you get assaulted, you may not think they were asking for it, or that they deserved it, but they risked that more than you and that gave them a competitive advantage over you. You're going to feel how your going to feel whether or not the rules say you must support them.

It's all very messy. Not that it should be messy. Men should bloody well ought to behave themselves. But there's that gulf between is and ought. Here in the world of _is_ women have it tough.


Here's how it works for me: I do what I do. I draw lines early and reinforce them often. I don't flirt at work. If a man or woman crosses my line, I say so, first politely and privately. I let everyone know that I do not tolerate illegal behavior in my presence, by anyone towards anyone. And I don't waste time thinking of what "ought" to be, or how it will be "someday when". Now is what it is and how it is.

Now, I've had a few incidents, because who hasn't, but few & far between; and never has it affected my pay, my job ratings, how I'm treated by my coworkers, all those things people seem to fear if they stand up for themselves. The one time I had to get the EEOC involved was over my disability, not my gender.

I can say that, based on my 25 years in male-dominated industries, if a woman behaves as if she IS an equal and doesn't wait for things to be made palatable for her to ask if she can be an equal, please, then she gets treated as such. I could be wrong. But I don't have any issues with being groped, harassed, or leered at, either.
 
2017-11-23 03:29:07 AM  

Sailing Starflower: spamdog: Mmmm, brown women

what a "brown" woman might look like, i guess
[gotceleb.com image 662x993][View Full Size image _x_]


Did a creepy uncle take that pic?
 
2017-11-23 03:29:14 AM  

Gyrfalcon: I can say that, based on my 25 years in male-dominated industries, if a woman behaves as if she IS an equal and doesn't wait for things to be made palatable for her to ask if she can be an equal, please, then she gets treated as such. I could be wrong. But I don't have any issues with being groped, harassed, or leered at, either.


"So basically, it's their own fault for getting harassed at work".
 
2017-11-23 03:31:03 AM  
Devo - Bread and Butter
Youtube jfq1LqyGsE8
 
2017-11-23 03:45:59 AM  
In other words, the Left will eat itself. Women of color hate on white feminists, Bernie supporters hate on Clinton supporters, trans activists hate on women who mention vaginas, etc. etc.

Trump will probably win in 2020.
 
2017-11-23 03:47:58 AM  

Sailing Starflower: spamdog: Mmmm, brown women

what a "brown" woman might look like, i guess
[gotceleb.com image 662x993][View Full Size image _x_]


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-11-23 03:49:34 AM  

Gyrfalcon: if a woman behaves as if she IS an equal and doesn't wait for things to be made palatable for her to ask if she can be an equal, please, then she gets treated as such


The same is true of men in those same situations.

Timidity is not a virtue in many fields.
 
2017-11-23 04:20:11 AM  

Elegy: BlazeTrailer: BlueDWarrior: The hardest thing to be in this country, I honestly believe, is a Black woman. My Sisters out there doing work and most people not only wouldn't care, but seem to be waiting for them to screw something up.

This article also goes back to something a lot of black writers and pundits remark on, that the left is not immune to race-blindness (and in a few cases, outright racism).

While this is undoubtedly true I'm not of the opinion Dunham's moronic response would have been any different should you alter the race of the accuser. This seems to be textbook not wanting the cause to be applicable to someone close so they deny it in contrast to their usual stance on said issue. This reads as opportunism for another social talking point, albeit one that would generally be true.

Hey, my wife and I were talking about Franken tonight and I was defending him.

Then he went out and grabbed two more butts.

Goddammit.


Ghost butts.  Although one is alleging that Franken grabbed her butt at a feminist event, which makes him an unlikely Conservative hero.  Sadly, I'm hearing exactly what I would expect to hear from bullshiat artists.  No one is just saying that Franken grabbed their butts, but rather they are editorializing.

How uncanny.  When someone claims that Franken grabbed their bottom as they were kidnapping the Lindberg baby, then I'll give this hogwash some credence.
 
2017-11-23 04:20:12 AM  

Lenny_da_Hog: Sailing Starflower: spamdog: Mmmm, brown women

what a "brown" woman might look like, i guess
[gotceleb.com image 662x993][View Full Size image _x_]

[img.fark.net image 633x508][View Full Size image _x_]


I've always thought it was funny that the three actors who played the main trio in Harry Potter went on to have the kind of careers you would expect their characters to have if they were actors.
 
2017-11-23 04:20:30 AM  

Sailing Starflower: spamdog: Mmmm, brown women

what a "brown" woman might look like, i guess
[gotceleb.com image 662x993]


Met a girl at a bar, we got along like crossed fingers. Talked a few hours, and when we were outside under the streetlight, she made a joke about brown people from a brown persons perspective. I was like lolwut, I looked at her and sure nuff she was brown. The dim lights inside made me just assume she was white like me.

Was a great night. Wound up jetting without leaving my number. Hoping and praying I get to go back and meet up at the same joint again really soon. Only women I've ever met who was undoubtably smarter than myself.

/miss her every day since and regret how I left
//third hand roofies make you do dumb shiat
 
2017-11-23 04:41:53 AM  

Dark Side Of The Spoon: I've always thought it was funny that the three actors who played the main trio in Harry Potter went on to have the kind of careers you would expect their characters to have if they were actors.


I never expected Swiss Army Man, Equus, or ... well, I don't even know what else he's done from Harry.
 
2017-11-23 05:05:49 AM  

hobbes0022: I'll sum up the article:

Lena Dunham is an idiot


Let me explain: People like to have strong beliefs about things, until their friend gets accused of rape.  Then women lie about rape AND what they are for lunch.


Don't forget that in the past she publicly stated that women NEVER lie about rape.
 
2017-11-23 05:10:33 AM  

Dark Side Of The Spoon: Lenny_da_Hog: Sailing Starflower: spamdog: Mmmm, brown women

what a "brown" woman might look like, i guess
[gotceleb.com image 662x993][View Full Size image _x_]

[img.fark.net image 633x508][View Full Size image _x_]

I've always thought it was funny that the three actors who played the main trio in Harry Potter went on to have the kind of careers you would expect their characters to have if they were actors.


Meanwhile Frodo got into surprisingly kinky stuff.

i.pinimg.comView Full Size
 
2017-11-23 05:10:41 AM  

Grungehamster: kab: Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

[img.fark.net image 565x399]

She's had the decency to delete that hot take since then. She tried arguing that innocent women have had to suffer from unjust results so having the pendulum swing back somewhat for a little while is worth resolving the issue quicker, but that isn't what justice means and it looks like she was pursuaded (hopefully).


I caught a bit of that twitter shiat-storm.  She said a lot more and a lot worse.  Like innocent men might be killed but that was a price she was willing to pay.
 
2017-11-23 05:41:14 AM  

wademh: Women have it tough. Do you adopt a rigorously professional demeanor at work, avoid mixing or even discussing your private life at the office? Avoid being too friendly less someone confuse it for being flirtatious? Or do you work relationships just like men do with each other, building networks and often benefiting from that? If you choose the second, how hard do you have to work at making sure people don't mistake socially friendly for something more? And how do you deal with women who compete with who are less restrained than you, or even outright flirtatious or more?

If women who live it more dangerously and aggressively than you get assaulted, you may not think they were asking for it, or that they deserved it, but they risked that more than you and that gave them a competitive advantage over you. You're going to feel how your going to feel whether or not the rules say you must support them.

It's all very messy. Not that it should be messy. Men should bloody well ought to behave themselves. But there's that gulf between is and ought. Here in the world of _is_ women have it tough.


Hate to break it to you. But your own worst enemy is women. The women who lie about rape and sexual misconduct. It happens so often The minority of liars  detract from the majority of truth tellers. Clean your own back yard.
 
2017-11-23 05:51:54 AM  

Serious Post on Serious Thread: wademh: Women have it tough. Do you adopt a rigorously professional demeanor at work, avoid mixing or even discussing your private life at the office? Avoid being too friendly less someone confuse it for being flirtatious? Or do you work relationships just like men do with each other, building networks and often benefiting from that? If you choose the second, how hard do you have to work at making sure people don't mistake socially friendly for something more? And how do you deal with women who compete with who are less restrained than you, or even outright flirtatious or more?

If women who live it more dangerously and aggressively than you get assaulted, you may not think they were asking for it, or that they deserved it, but they risked that more than you and that gave them a competitive advantage over you. You're going to feel how your going to feel whether or not the rules say you must support them.

It's all very messy. Not that it should be messy. Men should bloody well ought to behave themselves. But there's that gulf between is and ought. Here in the world of _is_ women have it tough.

Hate to break it to you. But your own worst enemy is women. The women who lie about rape and sexual misconduct. It happens so often The minority of liars  detract from the majority of truth tellers. Clean your own back yard.


Narrator: He said, dog whistling loudly while taking to task a whole class of people for something that a few do and thus cementing his position as a sexist.
 
2017-11-23 05:59:00 AM  

IcedTorch: Serious Post on Serious Thread: wademh: Women have it tough. Do you adopt a rigorously professional demeanor at work, avoid mixing or even discussing your private life at the office? Avoid being too friendly less someone confuse it for being flirtatious? Or do you work relationships just like men do with each other, building networks and often benefiting from that? If you choose the second, how hard do you have to work at making sure people don't mistake socially friendly for something more? And how do you deal with women who compete with who are less restrained than you, or even outright flirtatious or more?

If women who live it more dangerously and aggressively than you get assaulted, you may not think they were asking for it, or that they deserved it, but they risked that more than you and that gave them a competitive advantage over you. You're going to feel how your going to feel whether or not the rules say you must support them.

It's all very messy. Not that it should be messy. Men should bloody well ought to behave themselves. But there's that gulf between is and ought. Here in the world of _is_ women have it tough.

Hate to break it to you. But your own worst enemy is women. The women who lie about rape and sexual misconduct. It happens so often The minority of liars  detract from the majority of truth tellers. Clean your own back yard.

Narrator: He said, dog whistling loudly while taking to task a whole class of people for something that a few do and thus cementing his position as a sexist.


Sure reality is sexist. Just like it's racist when pointing out Willie Horton stigma is a thing.

/deal with it
 
2017-11-23 05:59:15 AM  

kab: Don't worry.  For everyone out there questioning allegations (and being bashed for it), there's someone enthusiastically nodding in agreement to this:

[img.fark.net image 565x399][View Full Size image _x_]


That's unnerving.

Social media has accelerated both the rate at which people become radicalized and the magnitude of their radicalization.   The end result is zealots who seek purity over compromise.  This makes building political coalitions with them virtually impossible and insures that, even when their goals are laudable, they'll have difficulty getting to a position of political power that allows them to pass legislation that promotes them.   This political impotence only serves to frustrate them further and make them more fanatical.  It happened with the Teaparty on the right and it's happening to the social justice movement on the left.  The end result is, at best, a complete inability of the government to function or, at worst, civil war.

When you factor in the fact that social media is obscenely easy to manipulate and the fact that there's no shortage of entities willing and able to manipulate it, we are truly farked unless people can learn some restraint, exercise healthy skepticism, stop thinking in all-or-nothing terms, and act strategically rather than reflexively.

tl;dr We're farked.
 
2017-11-23 06:10:26 AM  

Christian Bale: In other words, the Left will eat itself. Women of color hate on white feminists, Bernie supporters hate on Clinton supporters, trans activists hate on women who mention vaginas, etc. etc.

Trump will probably win in 2020.


Aye, if people are unable to engage in strategic compromise the left will be unable to form a politically effective coalition and we'll be further marginalized.  I think that it was this dynamic cost us the 2016 election.
 
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