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(Inc)   Complain about shrinking airline seats but one airline knows exactly what the problem is and is now weighing passengers   ( inc.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Weight, customer service agent, spare tires, nice airline agent, Airline, Finnair, distinctively dubious pleasure, example corporate travelers  
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2246 clicks; posted to Business » on 03 Nov 2017 at 7:27 AM (2 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



55 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2017-11-03 07:10:13 AM  
When you are charging people to defy gravity, you should charge by the pound.

They just now figured this out??
 
2017-11-03 07:32:31 AM  
Most lot of airline seats are narrower than my actual skeleton - my shoulders are past the armrests on both sides when I sit in the middle seat. Additionally, my knees are almost touching the seat in front of me when I'm all the way back in my seat. I get aisle or window seats because it's easier to sit slightly sideways to fit.

No, my extra weight isn't causing my skeleton to expand.
 
2017-11-03 07:44:26 AM  
If they charge bigger people more money, which Finnair is not doing at this point, then they should provide more space as well.
 
2017-11-03 08:11:50 AM  
If this ever comes to the states, they'll need to buy larger capacity scales.
 
2017-11-03 08:20:35 AM  
My daughter is almost 6 feet tall and only about 140 pounds.  Even she has space issues on planes at times, and it's not leg room she complains about.
 
2017-11-03 08:29:58 AM  
If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.
 
2017-11-03 08:30:52 AM  
vignette.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2017-11-03 08:31:35 AM  
I've flown through a small airport in Acosta Rica that weighs you at check in.  The numbers are visible to all, and it's hilarious.
 
2017-11-03 08:41:32 AM  
Leon frowns upon these shenanigans.
 
2017-11-03 08:53:24 AM  
do they also factor in my height and let me have more leg room, cause i'd be fine with that
 
2017-11-03 08:59:48 AM  

AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.


A 737-800 has something like 37 rows and seats 154 people.

Taking one out is less than a 4% change in capacity.
 
2017-11-03 09:06:26 AM  
My ass fits in the seat just fine. My legs and shoulders do not, regardless of weight.
 
2017-11-03 09:13:21 AM  
I'm 6'1" and 165, skinny say some, very average says the ol' BMI. Either way, my hips just fit in the seat with a bit of room but my shoulders touch strangers' with no effort. Just widen the planes a bit.
 
2017-11-03 09:24:06 AM  
Go fly fat somewhere else?
 
2017-11-03 09:36:09 AM  
This is standard procedure on smaller Pacific island routes. If you're on a Solomons Twin Otter to Suvanao, they weigh you and your bags so they know how to balance the plane... and how may cases of SolBrew destined for Kia they can add.
 
2017-11-03 09:58:39 AM  

This text is now purple: AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.

A 737-800 has something like 37 rows and seats 154 people.

Taking one out is less than a 4% change in capacity.


Problem is, that with the airline leveraged to the hilt that 4% change in capacity might mean a 50% reduction in profit.  Note I said might, not would.  It all depends on the condition of the airline and other factors, like how competitive is that particular route.  On a non-competitive route where they are able to charge $50 more per seat and everyone on the plane is just happy they fly to this podunk city... yeah that lost capacity means nothing.  On the O'Hare - Dulles flying bus route, might be the difference between making and not making money on that route.
 
2017-11-03 10:21:29 AM  

MadHatter500: This text is now purple: AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.

A 737-800 has something like 37 rows and seats 154 people.

Taking one out is less than a 4% change in capacity.

Problem is, that with the airline leveraged to the hilt that 4% change in capacity might mean a 50% reduction in profit.  Note I said might, not would.  It all depends on the condition of the airline and other factors, like how competitive is that particular route.  On a non-competitive route where they are able to charge $50 more per seat and everyone on the plane is just happy they fly to this podunk city... yeah that lost capacity means nothing.  On the O'Hare - Dulles flying bus route, might be the difference between making and not making money on that route.


On the other hand, American Airlines CEO Doug Parker said that the airlines were permanently profitable:

https://skift.com/2016/06/14/american​-​airlines-ceo-says-industry-may-never-a​gain-lose-money/
 
2017-11-03 11:18:02 AM  
It doesn't help they have reduced the width of seats from 18 to 16 inches wide and reduced the seat pitch from 35 to 31 inches to fit in that extra row of seating. Now you have to pay lots extra to seat in premium economy to get the same sort of size, and those seats are limited in availability. With my height, if someone leaves their chair just back a little bit in economy and there is an emergency evacuation from fire, I and everyone else trapped by me is going to end up burning to death because there is no way out.
 
2017-11-03 11:25:59 AM  
"Does the airline fear that people are getting larger and its planes may not cope?"

No silly reporter...

And Leon's getting larger!
Youtube -cJmpwkUx4s


But I would pay good money to see an airline in the US start doing this.
 
2017-11-03 11:51:50 AM  

vudukungfu: When you are charging people to defy gravity, you should charge by the pound.

They just now figured this out??


Weigh the person AND their luggage/carry-on all at the same time.  Total weight helps calculate the cost.  If you want to fly cheaper, lose weight and/or pack less shiat.  If you weigh 300 pounds it doesn't matter if it's all fat or all muscle---the airplane doesn't care.
 
kab
2017-11-03 11:57:14 AM  
Data collection to justify price increases.   They aren't going to actually alter seating capacity or space based on their findings... people know that, right?

Then again, I don't use this industry unless there's absolutely no other option, so there's that.
 
2017-11-03 11:59:16 AM  
Back in my younger, skinnier days I still was moved around occasionally after seating in puddle jumpers.  Of course those were the days that a 6'5" guy could be easily moved to the exit row (leg room plus having a big guy open the door.  Win-win).
/still probably not as wide as the average American, but leg room is somewhat an issue (thankfully they haven't taken my headroom.  I'm all torso).
//barely overweight by BMI (yes, I know how broken square/linear is.  Doesn't make me less fat)
///those last 10lbs are killer
 
2017-11-03 12:03:11 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: vudukungfu: When you are charging people to defy gravity, you should charge by the pound.

They just now figured this out??

Weigh the person AND their luggage/carry-on all at the same time.  Total weight helps calculate the cost.  If you want to fly cheaper, lose weight and/or pack less shiat.  If you weigh 300 pounds it doesn't matter if it's all fat or all muscle---the airplane doesn't care.


I'd be fine with this. They could have a base price for the passenger and luggage, which covers a very generous base weight, say 250lbs. Charge per pound over that.
 
2017-11-03 01:01:33 PM  

This text is now purple: AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.

A 737-800 has something like 37 rows and seats 154 people.

Taking one out is less than a 4% change in capacity.


And it would take less fuel to get off the ground, also saving money.
 
2017-11-03 01:02:35 PM  

cirby: Most lot of airline seats are narrower than my actual skeleton - my shoulders are past the armrests on both sides when I sit in the middle seat. Additionally, my knees are almost touching the seat in front of me when I'm all the way back in my seat. I get aisle or window seats because it's easier to sit slightly sideways to fit.

No, my extra weight isn't causing my skeleton to expand.


Well if you arms don't hang straight down from the socket then yes your extra weight is causing your skeleton to take up more volume.  I mean, you also could be 2 sigma above the median dimensionally which would put you in a bad place.

Though I also note the people who "Don't fit" on planes and trains also tend to have horrific posture.  Lots of slouching to push those knees out.
 
2017-11-03 01:03:11 PM  

This text is now purple: AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.

A 737-800 has something like 37 rows and seats 154 people.

Taking one out is less than a 4% change in capacity.


Sorry. I said rows which covers length and give more leg room.
I was thinking more columns since the main issue is people's weight, i.e. width.
 
2017-11-03 01:09:58 PM  
It would be great if that fat guy ate that crying baby.
 
2017-11-03 01:34:28 PM  
Still no cure for this guy:

img.fark.net
 
2017-11-03 02:03:49 PM  

Splinthar: cirby: Most lot of airline seats are narrower than my actual skeleton - my shoulders are past the armrests on both sides when I sit in the middle seat. Additionally, my knees are almost touching the seat in front of me when I'm all the way back in my seat. I get aisle or window seats because it's easier to sit slightly sideways to fit.

No, my extra weight isn't causing my skeleton to expand.

Well if you arms don't hang straight down from the socket then yes your extra weight is causing your skeleton to take up more volume.  I mean, you also could be 2 sigma above the median dimensionally which would put you in a bad place.

Though I also note the people who "Don't fit" on planes and trains also tend to have horrific posture.  Lots of slouching to push those knees out.


Sorry, but using terms like "2 sigma" doesn't make you right. I'm certainly not in the top two percent of the bell curve for height or weight.

My shoulders stick out over the seat arms. Period. No, I'm not taking up extra space with my arms. I'm also not a not a giant, and while I'm overweight, it's mostly in my stomach and leg thickness (which doesn't affect my seating comfort).

I also have good posture, and my spine is usually all the way back against the seat back.

On the other hand, skinny, weak, short people seem to have no problems with airline seats. Which explains some of the comments here.
 
2017-11-03 02:12:45 PM  
To determine what a reasonable seat size is, The top officers of the airline should spend 1 day (8 hours) in a middle, economy seat (with the seat in front of it reclined and people seated next to them on both sides), every couple months. It needn't be wasted time. They can bring a laptop and phone and try (lol) to get some work done.

Whenever an airline changes the seat size, they should be required to do evacuation testing (which they haven't done in decades). They should also be required to use random people off the street and not employees who know the drill. Changing seat size changes the dynamics of evacuation and a study should be required so it's not done trivially.

Between these two things I believe seat size would stabilize to something reasonable.
 
2017-11-03 02:25:37 PM  

TheYeti: I've flown through a small airport in Acosta Rica that weighs you at check in.  The numbers are visible to all, and it's hilarious.


Yay for fat shaming! It is an incredibly effective way to make people lose weight!
/not
//effective at making shamers feel smug though
 
hej [TotalFark]
2017-11-03 02:45:58 PM  

AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.


Your saying airplanes only have between 5 to 7 rows of seats.
 
hej [TotalFark]
2017-11-03 02:47:19 PM  

hej: AlanMooresBeard: If an airline took out an entire row of seats to allow the rest to be bigger, there is a decrease # of seats by 15%-20% and they charged that much more to offset the costs.
A competitor still had the cramped seats at the original price.
I think we all know how well that would play out.

Your saying airplanes only have between 5 to 7 rows of seats.


"you're", dammit.
 
2017-11-03 03:11:01 PM  
Hawaiian Airlines weighs passengers on the HNL>PPG route.

Samoans are HUGE!
 
2017-11-03 03:23:33 PM  

Wave Of Anal Fury: My daughter is almost 6 feet tall and only about 140 pounds.  Even she has space issues on planes at times, and it's not leg room she complains about.


...

i.pinimg.com
 
2017-11-03 03:26:14 PM  

Wave Of Anal Fury: My daughter is almost 6 feet tall and only about 140 pounds.  Even she has space issues on planes at times, and it's not leg room she complains about.


I'm as near as makes no difference 6'6".  I'd pay extra to ride laying down in the baggage hold with the critters.
 
2017-11-03 03:27:07 PM  

vudukungfu: When you are charging people to defy gravity, you should charge by the pound.

They just now figured this out??


The cargo airlines figured this out decades ago. They measure volume too, Mr. Sweaty McSpillsoverthearmresterson.
 
2017-11-03 03:29:08 PM  

cirby: Splinthar: cirby: Most lot of airline seats are narrower than my actual skeleton - my shoulders are past the armrests on both sides when I sit in the middle seat. Additionally, my knees are almost touching the seat in front of me when I'm all the way back in my seat. I get aisle or window seats because it's easier to sit slightly sideways to fit.

No, my extra weight isn't causing my skeleton to expand.

Well if you arms don't hang straight down from the socket then yes your extra weight is causing your skeleton to take up more volume.  I mean, you also could be 2 sigma above the median dimensionally which would put you in a bad place.

Though I also note the people who "Don't fit" on planes and trains also tend to have horrific posture.  Lots of slouching to push those knees out.

Sorry, but using terms like "2 sigma" doesn't make you right. I'm certainly not in the top two percent of the bell curve for height or weight.

My shoulders stick out over the seat arms. Period. No, I'm not taking up extra space with my arms. I'm also not a not a giant, and while I'm overweight, it's mostly in my stomach and leg thickness (which doesn't affect my seating comfort).

I also have good posture, and my spine is usually all the way back against the seat back.

On the other hand, skinny, weak, short people seem to have no problems with airline seats. Which explains some of the comments here.


Calm down fatty... but you just said alot to say that you can't sit in a standard human seated position with arms hanging at the side and legs parallel and perpendicular to your chest plane.  So its both you and the seats being less wide.

See shared responsibility, but lets not pretend you "carry your extra weight in a way that doesn't impact seating" that's as much bullshiat as "big-boned" You have extra mass, its the lower density of human tissues so your overall soft tissue volume is more than someone who isn't overweight.

That's just facts, and personally you can take it out on internet people or you can write your congress person about airline deregulation.

The first we can go back and forth with you calling me small and weak and me pointing out that you are a higher volume person.  The second takes effort to write a physical letter.

Both do nothing but one may end up making you feel better.
 
2017-11-03 03:30:03 PM  

mrmopar5287: Hawaiian Airlines weighs passengers on the HNL>PPG route.

Samoans are HUGE!


img.fark.netdont accept any offers for a foot massage
 
2017-11-03 04:20:28 PM  
I have long since decided Airlines are not going to bring back bigger seats to the lowest class sections of planes unless forced to by law.

Bring back airline regulations.  They never should have deregulated it to start with.
 
2017-11-03 05:29:12 PM  
Having just stepped off a 15 hour amtrak ride, in the sleeper car, as opposed to a 6 hour flight I am getting a kick, etc. Also relaxed and rested
 
2017-11-03 05:41:00 PM  
They're not just one problem, there's two. Homo sapiens are in general becoming larger, and yes, that's a factor. The other factor is airlines know this but insist on cramming more seats on planes anyway.
 
2017-11-03 05:58:26 PM  
GO BE FAT ON ANOTHER AIRLINE!!!
 
2017-11-03 06:48:56 PM  

cirby: Most lot of airline seats are narrower than my actual skeleton - my shoulders are past the armrests on both sides when I sit in the middle seat. Additionally, my knees are almost touching the seat in front of me when I'm all the way back in my seat. I get aisle or window seats because it's easier to sit slightly sideways to fit.

No, my extra weight isn't causing my skeleton to expand.


I used to think that was the case for me too.  Then I lost weight.  Now I fit fine.  Turns out that excess fat expands you in all directions.
 
2017-11-03 08:11:55 PM  

gunther_bumpass: Wave Of Anal Fury: My daughter is almost 6 feet tall and only about 140 pounds.  Even she has space issues on planes at times, and it's not leg room she complains about.

...

[i.pinimg.com image 600x315]


5'11" is not freakishly large for a woman.
 
2017-11-03 09:17:03 PM  

itcamefromschenectady: gunther_bumpass: Wave Of Anal Fury: My daughter is almost 6 feet tall and only about 140 pounds.  Even she has space issues on planes at times, and it's not leg room she complains about.

...

[i.pinimg.com image 600x315]

5'11" is not freakishly large for a woman.


-whoosh-


(Let's talk about your big but, Simone. )
 
2017-11-03 09:41:22 PM  

chitownmike: Having just stepped off a 15 hour amtrak ride, in the sleeper car, as opposed to a 6 hour flight I am getting a kick, etc. Also relaxed and rested


Route comparison? I'm sure the 6 hour flight involved a layover and flight change, because I'd be shocked to see there are two start/end points both connected by Amtrak and airlines that have those time differences.
 
2017-11-03 09:51:03 PM  

Cynicism101: TheYeti: I've flown through a small airport in Acosta Rica that weighs you at check in.  The numbers are visible to all, and it's hilarious.

Yay for fat shaming! It is an incredibly effective way to make people lose weight!
/not
//effective at making shamers feel smug though


It worked for smokers
 
2017-11-03 10:12:58 PM  

seriously.though: Cynicism101: TheYeti: I've flown through a small airport in Acosta Rica that weighs you at check in.  The numbers are visible to all, and it's hilarious.

Yay for fat shaming! It is an incredibly effective way to make people lose weight!
/not
//effective at making shamers feel smug though

It worked for smokers


img.fark.net
 
kab
2017-11-04 01:49:01 AM  

Polartank13: seriously.though: Cynicism101: TheYeti: I've flown through a small airport in Acosta Rica that weighs you at check in.  The numbers are visible to all, and it's hilarious.

Yay for fat shaming! It is an incredibly effective way to make people lose weight!
/not
//effective at making shamers feel smug though

It worked for smokers

[img.fark.net image 187x269]


There are people dumb enough to honestly believe that if obesity were 100% eradicated, health insurance rates and airline tickets prices would drop.
 
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