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(The Hill)   White House official calls for ending Social Security .............. numbers as a means of identification   ( thehill.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Social Security numbers, Security, Franklin D. Roosevelt, Computer security, President of the United States, Joyce, Washington, D.C., United States  
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1336 clicks; posted to Politics » on 03 Oct 2017 at 3:32 PM (15 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-10-03 10:36:55 AM  
harlee actually agrees with this. harlee has one of the "old school" cards issued, if he recalls correctly, when harlee got his first job at 15. His original issue card still exists because he had it (illegally) encased in clear mylar at some time or other. harlee has had fun in the past refusing to allow his Social Security card to be used as ID, as it says right on the card:

"FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"


harlee has also had fun arguing with clueless Millennials who insist that this cannot be an actual SS card. There was also once a job crisis, as harlee was to do some work as a management consultant for Robert Half and they needed two forms of ID. harlee gave them his DL and SS card, and the sharp gal doing the paperwork saw that message and said she could not use it. Since harlee didn't have a passport, they eventually kicked the issue upstairs to corporate and let me work in the interim.
 
2017-10-03 10:40:20 AM  
Maybe I have a special SS card, and it is kind of old, but mine says right on it "Not to be used for identification"

/It bothers me that it is
 
2017-10-03 10:57:12 AM  
LOL y'all are old.

Also I'm curious what this means for people trying to procure IDs to travel, vote, etc.
 
2017-10-03 11:06:09 AM  
*checks sky suspiciously for aerial pigs* Hmm, none. But, I agree with something coming out of this White House.

/glitch in the matrix?
 
2017-10-03 12:52:48 PM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Maybe I have a special SS card, and it is kind of old, but mine says right on it "Not to be used for identification"

/It bothers me that it is


Yep

I have one of the old paper ones.
 
2017-10-03 01:22:21 PM  
Comcast believe it or not is already doing this, sign up for new service, prepay the install fee, sign up for automatic payments, no credit check, no deposit, no SSN needed.
 
2017-10-03 01:38:39 PM  
At least they're changing Medicare card numbers to not be folk's SS numbers.

Identify theft has gotten so out of hand that local law enforcement doesn't/can't work on those cases. I know.
 
WGJ [TotalFark]
2017-10-03 01:43:52 PM  
Well, Social Security was a Democrat idea...
 
2017-10-03 01:54:26 PM  

Harlee: harlee actually agrees with this.


img.fark.netView Full Size


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-10-03 02:40:56 PM  
Give them a mark on the back of their hand or their forehead and watch the evangelicals head explode faster than a Scanners gif.
 
2017-10-03 03:18:26 PM  
Here's the prototype of the new one
img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2017-10-03 03:34:10 PM  

Harlee: harlee actually agrees with this. harlee has one of the "old school" cards issued, if he recalls correctly, when harlee got his first job at 15. His original issue card still exists because he had it (illegally) encased in clear mylar at some time or other. harlee has had fun in the past refusing to allow his Social Security card to be used as ID, as it says right on the card:

"FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"
harlee has also had fun arguing with clueless Millennials who insist that this cannot be an actual SS card. There was also once a job crisis, as harlee was to do some work as a management consultant for Robert Half and they needed two forms of ID. harlee gave them his DL and SS card, and the sharp gal doing the paperwork saw that message and said she could not use it. Since harlee didn't have a passport, they eventually kicked the issue upstairs to corporate and let me work in the interim.


I read that whole post in my best Slingblade voice.
 
2017-10-03 03:35:06 PM  
Good.
 
2017-10-03 03:35:11 PM  
Joyce also said the Trump administration had begun to change path on developing international rules for cyber diplomacy.

They aren't even competent with traditional diplomacy yet.
 
2017-10-03 03:37:02 PM  
To be immediately replaced, I can only assume, with some other uniquely identifying number?  Which would  either not be used in conjunction with Social Security accounts or perhaps would not be able to be used to steal an identity?
 
2017-10-03 03:39:08 PM  
I'll have a barcode and implant chip please
 
2017-10-03 03:41:32 PM  

Harlee: harlee actually agrees with this. harlee has one of the "old school" cards issued, if he recalls correctly, when harlee got his first job at 15. His original issue card still exists because he had it (illegally) encased in clear mylar at some time or other. harlee has had fun in the past refusing to allow his Social Security card to be used as ID, as it says right on the card:

"FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"
harlee has also had fun arguing with clueless Millennials who insist that this cannot be an actual SS card. There was also once a job crisis, as harlee was to do some work as a management consultant for Robert Half and they needed two forms of ID. harlee gave them his DL and SS card, and the sharp gal doing the paperwork saw that message and said she could not use it. Since harlee didn't have a passport, they eventually kicked the issue upstairs to corporate and let me work in the interim.


My mother, born in 1931, agrees with you and has been saying  this for years.
 
2017-10-03 03:41:46 PM  

Tom_Slick: Comcast believe it or not is already doing this, sign up for new service, prepay the install fee, sign up for automatic payments, no credit check, no deposit, no SSN needed.


I've never understood why cable companies/electric/water/gas needed to know my social security number.  All they should care about is "Did the check to hook him up clear" and "Is he current on his bill?".

Maybe, at most, some kind of common sense thing like "If it's the middle of winter give the guy an extra week and send an email to remind him if he falls behind on the gas bill".

Netflix didn't need my SSN, and it seems to have worked out just fine with them.
 
2017-10-03 03:43:03 PM  
How about we take a good serious look at why we as a country love to show a shiny ID or give out our SSNs whenever a 17 year old behind a counter requests it?  IDs don't prevent kids getting booze.  IDs doesn't make traveling by airplane safer.  IDs don't lower vote fraud.
 
2017-10-03 03:43:50 PM  

abb3w: Harlee: harlee actually agrees with this.

[img.fark.net image 780x226]

[img.fark.net image 780x226]


Schlock Mercenary is the best.  Can't wait until the new Kickstarter unlocks and I can order all the back issues in glorious paper.

Also, Harlee will warn the rest of us when Harlee comes into possession of hyperspace cannon?  YesYes?
 
2017-10-03 03:46:22 PM  
I don't summarily dismiss this idea, however I would prefer it be implemented by a government that has a better understanding of what makes a United States citizen than we currently have. Preferably one that doesn't need cliff's notes in their desk for the US Constitution.
 
2017-10-03 03:47:02 PM  
An actual good idea??????

What's in it for Donald?
 
2017-10-03 03:49:00 PM  
So...

This means we're going to rollout national ID then?

I'm sure his base will love that idea.
 
2017-10-03 03:49:39 PM  
Maybe we could tattoo a number. On the arm. With some colorful yellow stars. >.>
 
2017-10-03 03:49:46 PM  

gingerjet: How about we take a good serious look at why we as a country love to show a shiny ID or give out our SSNs whenever a 17 year old behind a counter requests it?  IDs don't prevent kids getting booze.  IDs doesn't make traveling by airplane safer.  IDs don't lower vote fraud.


It's not about voter fraud. It's about stopping those various demographics that have the sheer unmitigated gall to vote for Democrats.
 
2017-10-03 03:50:51 PM  
Social security numbers haven't been confidential for decades.  Everyone under the sun uses them for identity confirmation, from utility companies, to banks and credit cards, to healthcare providers, to employers (and if job hunting dozens of POTENTIAL employers), etc.  The idea of the number being a secret was laughable even pre-hack.
 
2017-10-03 03:51:10 PM  

Karac: I've never understood why cable companies/electric/water/gas needed to know my social security number. All they should care about is "Did the check to hook him up clear" and "Is he current on his bill?".


probably so they can sell your debt to collections & notify credit agencies
 
2017-10-03 03:52:42 PM  

Harlee: harlee actually agrees with this. harlee has one of the "old school" cards issued, if he recalls correctly, when harlee got his first job at 15. His original issue card still exists because he had it (illegally) encased in clear mylar at some time or other. harlee has had fun in the past refusing to allow his Social Security card to be used as ID, as it says right on the card:

"FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"
harlee has also had fun arguing with clueless Millennials who insist that this cannot be an actual SS card. There was also once a job crisis, as harlee was to do some work as a management consultant for Robert Half and they needed two forms of ID. harlee gave them his DL and SS card, and the sharp gal doing the paperwork saw that message and said she could not use it. Since harlee didn't have a passport, they eventually kicked the issue upstairs to corporate and let me work in the interim.


What does the "new" SS look like? You've pretty much described mine.
 
2017-10-03 03:54:31 PM  

Harlee: Since harlee didn't have a passport, they eventually kicked the issue upstairs to corporate and let me him work in the interim.


You were sooo close. My salutes to Harlee for the effort.
 
2017-10-03 03:54:48 PM  
Not a bad idea, but presumably an individual would still need a single, unique ID number for any financial-related transactions (banking activity, credit checks, etc.) and that would still be vulnerable to theft.

All this idea would do is somewhat compartmentalize the multiple ID numbers we'd need to replace a single SSN, so that, say, the Equifax breach might not allow someone to get SS or Medicare benefits in your name. At least it's nice to see them suggest an idea to prevent benefit fraud that doesn't involve shutting down the program entirely.

I'd still rather see some logic applied to the problem. People should be able to freeze and unfreeze their credit at will, for free, and you should be able to get a one-time code you can give to a creditor to run a single credit check. The IRS should start caring that a doctor in California is suddenly also working at a 7-Eleven in Florida and flag it as a misused SSN and send someone to arrest the identity thief. Changing from one number to two isn't going to solve much.
 
2017-10-03 03:54:49 PM  

Lee Jackson Beauregard: gingerjet: How about we take a good serious look at why we as a country love to show a shiny ID or give out our SSNs whenever a 17 year old behind a counter requests it?  IDs don't prevent kids getting booze.  IDs doesn't make traveling by airplane safer.  IDs don't lower vote fraud.

It's not about voter fraud. It's about stopping those various demographics that have the sheer unmitigated gall to vote for Democrats.


They think the wrong thing! They CAN'T be citizens!
 
2017-10-03 03:54:59 PM  

Gubbo: *checks sky suspiciously for aerial pigs* Hmm, none. But, I agree with something coming out of this White House.

/glitch in the matrix?


Mattis or Kelly must have thought of it.
 
2017-10-03 03:55:16 PM  
Make it a Social Security/Credit/Debit card all in one.
img.fark.netView Full Size

Something classy, like this.
 
2017-10-03 03:55:45 PM  

Bathia_Mapes: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Maybe I have a special SS card, and it is kind of old, but mine says right on it "Not to be used for identification"

/It bothers me that it is

Yep

I have one of the old paper ones.


As do I, but my understanding is that the "Not to be used for identification" message refers to the paper card itself, not to the number.
 
2017-10-03 03:57:57 PM  

Karac: To be immediately replaced, I can only assume, with some other uniquely identifying number?  Which would  either not be used in conjunction with Social Security accounts or perhaps would not be able to be used to steal an identity?


I have a passport card.  The number on the card is *not* my passport book number; it's specifically for the card.  There's a database somewhere that links that card number (and my book number) to my other numbers, but nothing on the card itself (or in its RFID signal) can supply that information.  If I lose the card, they just break the link between that card number and my info and give me a new one.

Now, of course, the passport card has other information on it that someone could use, but almost all of that is available somewhere publicly anyway.  Breaking the link to an identifying number is the critical aspect.

Similarly: my credit cards offer the ability to have "virtual credit card numbers", complete with their own expiration dates and security codes, that I can link to my real credit account and use for various online transactions.  I can either set hard limits on them or not, but if I have a unique number for, say, Amazon, and that number gets used for anything else, I know Amazon was hacked.  I can cancel that number and not worry about having to change anything else.

This is how modern identification should work as a whole.  The notion of a single, permanent identifying number is out of date.
 
2017-10-03 03:59:53 PM  
Many states used to use your SS# as your driver's license number.
 
2017-10-03 04:00:27 PM  
how about supplementing the social security number with a secondary number, much like two-factor authentication.
 
2017-10-03 04:00:31 PM  

Bathia_Mapes: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Maybe I have a special SS card, and it is kind of old, but mine says right on it "Not to be used for identification"

/It bothers me that it is

Yep

I have one of the old paper ones.


There are other kinds?
 
2017-10-03 04:00:45 PM  
There's an old myth that the SSN middle digit is odd for whites and even for minorities, to make sure minorities can be easily discriminated against.  I was asked about this when I was working at an HBCU.  I had access to all the student and employee data, so I said, "let's find out".  And tallied all the middle digits and racial IDs, and the distribution was three to one, opposite from the myth.  She was relieved to see that.  I then said, "I'm white and my middle digit is even, so we didn't have to go through all that to prove it wrong."
 
2017-10-03 04:02:59 PM  
Even a blind monkey throwing darts at a board is liable to hit it once in a while, I guess.
 
2017-10-03 04:04:29 PM  
And here CGP Grey explains why Social Security is used as an ID, why we don't have a national ID card, and why the SS card as ID is awful.

Social Security Cards Explained
Youtube Erp8IAUouus
 
2017-10-03 04:04:50 PM  

Harlee: harlee actually agrees with this. harlee has one of the "old school" cards issued, if he recalls correctly, when harlee got his first job at 15. His original issue card still exists because he had it (illegally) encased in clear mylar at some time or other. harlee has had fun in the past refusing to allow his Social Security card to be used as ID, as it says right on the card:

"FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"
harlee has also had fun arguing with clueless Millennials who insist that this cannot be an actual SS card. There was also once a job crisis, as harlee was to do some work as a management consultant for Robert Half and they needed two forms of ID. harlee gave them his DL and SS card, and the sharp gal doing the paperwork saw that message and said she could not use it. Since harlee didn't have a passport, they eventually kicked the issue upstairs to corporate and let me work in the interim.


The old ones could be legally laminated, and had the "not for identification" line.  Newer ones have the prohibition against lamination and do not have the "not for identification" line.  I used to have the old one, but lost it before I even started working (my parents were forward thinking and got me one when I was a baby; when the IRS said you had to have one to be claimed by your parents on their taxes, I was literally the only kid in my class who's parents were not running around like dead chickens that year).  But I losted it, and the new one gave me a sad, since it could not be laminated like my old one.

Karac: To be immediately replaced, I can only assume, with some other uniquely identifying number?  Which would  either not be used in conjunction with Social Security accounts or perhaps would not be able to be used to steal an identity?


We can hope.  The US is the only major democracy not to have some sort of national ID card.  It is one reason we use the SSN card so much, since there is no other national form of personhood.  Of course the SSN card has something like -15 security features, so it's a shiat substitute.
 
2017-10-03 04:05:48 PM  

Bathia_Mapes: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Maybe I have a special SS card, and it is kind of old, but mine says right on it "Not to be used for identification"

/It bothers me that it is

Yep

I have one of the old paper ones.


There are other kinds?
 
2017-10-03 04:08:44 PM  

muck1969: how about supplementing the social security number with a secondary number, much like two-factor authentication.


So much this.

Have a primary value, secret and unknown to anyone including the citizen. Use it to create encrypted one use tokens used for ID. The tokens are passed back to the feds server, which gives a yes or no on authentication.
 
2017-10-03 04:09:00 PM  

Mr_Smartypants: Karac: I've never understood why cable companies/electric/water/gas needed to know my social security number. All they should care about is "Did the check to hook him up clear" and "Is he current on his bill?".

probably so they can sell your debt to collections & notify credit agencies


But like I said: Netflix doesn't need that.  Blue Apron doesn't need that.  Comic Bento doesn't need that.  If I'm late on the water bill, shut off the taps and I'll figure out what happened fairly quickly.
 
2017-10-03 04:10:29 PM  

phalamir: Karac: To be immediately replaced, I can only assume, with some other uniquely identifying number?  Which would  either not be used in conjunction with Social Security accounts or perhaps would not be able to be used to steal an identity?


We can hope.  The US is the only major democracy not to have some sort of national ID card.  It is one reason we use the SSN card so much, since there is no other national form of personhood.  Of course the SSN card has something like -15 security features, so it's a shiat substitute.


Well that'll happen never.  Remember when the idea was floated to standardize state driver's licenses and Republicans threw a shiatfit about how government was trying to brand them with the Mark of the Beast?
 
2017-10-03 04:10:31 PM  
It would be a biatch if they somehow used this change to destroy the social security safety net.
 
2017-10-03 04:11:50 PM  

Karac: phalamir: Karac: To be immediately replaced, I can only assume, with some other uniquely identifying number?  Which would  either not be used in conjunction with Social Security accounts or perhaps would not be able to be used to steal an identity?


We can hope.  The US is the only major democracy not to have some sort of national ID card.  It is one reason we use the SSN card so much, since there is no other national form of personhood.  Of course the SSN card has something like -15 security features, so it's a shiat substitute.

Well that'll happen never.  Remember when the idea was floated to standardize state driver's licenses and Republicans threw a shiatfit about how government was trying to brand them with the Mark of the Beast?


Yeah, but that will change for Stigginit.
 
2017-10-03 04:11:58 PM  

Karac: I've never understood why cable companies/electric/water/gas needed to know my social security number.  All they should care about is "Did the check to hook him up clear" and "Is he current on his bill?".


Mostly so they have some document that says "you" are "you".  "I'm Cater Bunkybump, I want some water" is all fine and good until Carter decides to skip town.  Seven Carter Bunkybumps running around playing silly buggers will play merry hob with the actual Carter's ability to be trusted.  Unfortunately, the closest thing to a trans-state ID we have is the SSN, so companies use it as a ersatz form of national ID (which it is hilariously unqualified to act as).  If you want to blame anyone, blame the Number-of-the-Beast-spouting farknuggets that infest far too much of this country; because the instant someone suggests a national ID, they crawl out of the woodwork and caterwaul like a bunch of queen in heat that the Debil is coming to suck off their precious bodily fluids.
 
2017-10-03 04:12:54 PM  
But it's not, at least by the government.  It was used for Medicare but that is being changed with new cards being issued next year.  Private industry uses your SSN but the government can't dictate their policies.  The government position is that a business can require you to supply your SSN for non-employment or non-tax purposes and you have the right to refuse, but then they can deny  you whatever service they were offering.
 
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